Questions for the herbalists

tressa(SECA)May 18, 2012

Can you discuss Meniere's syndrome/disease?

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theherbalist2012

tressa:

Before getting into that, I have a friend from Temecula. I believe they grew avocadoes (?). Does that sound right?

theherbalist
Charlie

    Bookmark   May 18, 2012 at 6:59PM
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tressa(SECA)

Yes, lots of avocado groves out here.....also vineyards, citrus and olive trees.

So, tell me what you think is the cause and treatment from a herbalists standpoint.

Tressa

    Bookmark   May 19, 2012 at 3:22PM
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theherbalist2012

OK. Here's where I start losing people . .

I only know about the term "Meniere's Syndrome" from what I read about on the internet or my Taber's Medical Dictionary. It's a twenty dollar word for a symptom. Everything anyone ever wanted to know about this symptom can be found here:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0001721/

I'm assuming you want to know about Meniere's from a different, herbalists' view.

I follow the Chinese principles of herbology and use mostly western herbs and many Chinese herbs. I make the extracts from scratch and customize the liquids.

Therefore, we view that particular symptom (Meniere's) is caused from a condition that rises from the liver and possibly from other problem areas in conjunction with the liver. Following the whole individual symptomology is important in order to get a handle on what major condition needs attention the most.

Actually, by giving most of your health symptoms, this would create a composite picture to the practitioner as to exactly what's going on in your body. You have the answers as to the source of the problem; the herbal practitioner can interpret your answers.

Sorry if I complicated things. By the way, I'm in Prescott, Arizona.

theherbalist
charlie

    Bookmark   May 19, 2012 at 3:49PM
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rusty_blackhaw(6a)

The cause of Meniere's disease is not well understood, but it's thought to involve abnormal volume or composition of inner ear fluid (not anything remotely related to the liver).

Once the diagnosis has been established through proper testing and potential causes ruled out, there are various treatments, including diet and lifestyle changes. Possibly some type of herbal diuretic therapy might help, but attempting to do this on your own could be risky for a number of reasons, including potential electrolyte imbalances.

    Bookmark   May 19, 2012 at 4:45PM
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theherbalist2012

Eric:

You say that the inner ear fluid is "not anything remotely related to the liver." Yet, you're suggesting using the classification of herbs that are related to the kidneys? That's contradictory.

Also, why are you making suggestions if you don't understand the cause of Meniere's disease ("The cause of Meniere's disease is not well understood.)

With all my years in clinical herbology, I can assure everyone reading this that the liver, in many ways, has more affect on the distribution of internal fluids and fluid pressures than was ever thought by the modern medical communities to be possible. I know this from experience. In fact, the liver is one of my areas of expertise.

Now, poor Tressa has to listen to us. (Tressa, meet, Eric. He's our resident allopath.)

theherbalist

    Bookmark   May 19, 2012 at 8:01PM
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tressa(SECA)

I used to visit this forum quite regularly because I enjoyed exchanging ideas with people who had an interest in herbs. But, I found there was always a contradition and an argument by someone in particular who always felt the need to defend western medicine....my reason for asking for "Herbalists" opinions. So, here it goes again. Thank you for your info Charlie - I guess this discussion can continue without me.

    Bookmark   May 19, 2012 at 9:24PM
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theherbalist2012

Sorry, Tressa.

charlie
theherbalist

    Bookmark   May 20, 2012 at 1:18AM
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rusty_blackhaw(6a)

I'm not sure how I'm supposedly "defending Western medicine" in the above comments, or how encouraging accurate diagnosis and suggesting a possible role for herbal therapy is objectionable. (Herbs have been used in Western medicine for a long time; there is nothing exclusively Eastern or Asian about them).
This is still an open forum, and comments can be made (or ignored) as one wishes.

Charlie said: "You say that the inner ear fluid is "not anything remotely related to the liver." Yet, you're suggesting using the classification of herbs that are related to the kidneys? That's contradictory."

I have not referred to any such classification of herbs. And while evidence-based medicine has not fully elucidated the mechanism behind Meniere's disease, it is a disorder related to inner ear function and there is no indication whatsoever that it is related to the liver.

Charlie, you've implicated the liver in a number of different disorders on this forum. Does this have anything to do with the liver tonic you reportedly sell?

    Bookmark   May 20, 2012 at 1:18PM
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theherbalist2012

Here he goes again.

    Bookmark   May 20, 2012 at 3:27PM
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kaliaman

I am also a student of Chinese herbalism and indeed the liver is considered one possible cause of Meniere's. It is also associated with blood and qi vacuity, phlegm, the Chinese concept of the Kidney, etc. In other words, there is more than one cause and the cause responsible would and does vary with the person afflicted.

I am new to this forum but can already see from reading through many threads there is a LOT of ego based condescension going on from a couple of regulars here. It's unfortunately common to find that in public forums. I like the 'Native Plants" and "Plant Identification' forums better since they are sans such nonsense, heading there now.

Respectfully,
Kali

    Bookmark   June 25, 2012 at 6:13PM
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rusty_blackhaw(6a)

Stick around, Kali, and you can educate us not only on how the liver is connected to the inner ear in Chinese herbalism, but also show us how to elevate our "tone" (hint: doing so without recourse to insults is helpful).

    Bookmark   June 26, 2012 at 11:51AM
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