Scottfsmith - Spinosad and Surround for bagged apple question.

2010champsbcsMay 9, 2014

Scott. I currently have a small window of opportunity to bag my fruit to prevent curculio damage to my pears and apples. Will Spinosad and or Surround organically protect my fruit for a few weeks so I will have more time to get the fruit bagged? Everyone�s comments are welcome. Thanks, Bill

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bart1(6/7 Northern VA)

I'm surprised no one has answered this yet.

Surround is basically mud that covers the fruit and forms a barrier to the bugs. If you apply it today and it rains hard tomorrow, it could/will all wash away. On the other hand, if you apply it today and it's bone dry for 2 weeks, it will probably still protect the fruit. I imagine that a week of heavy dew would weaken it too. (having said all that, I've never used it, I've just read about it so take it with a grain of salt!)

Pretty much the same goes for the Spinosad. If you apply it and we get a long, hard rain, it will probably wash away. Check the bottle to see how long they recommend between sprays for an idea of how long it will last in ideal conditions.

But judging from your message, it looks like you don't have much choice. Use whatever you have and pray for dry skies!

    Bookmark   May 9, 2014 at 5:54PM
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2010champsbcs

Thanks Bart. I was able to bag all my fruit immediately after blooming this year. As the number of fruits need to be bagged going forward increases I need a bigger window of time to complete the bagging. This may my organic solution. Thanks again, Bill

    Bookmark   May 9, 2014 at 10:55PM
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Scott F Smith(6B/7A MD)

Bill, I used to bag fruits but it is a huge amount of work and at some point I decided to go the spray only route. It depends how many trees you have. Re: using Surround/spinosad to temporarily hold back the pests while you bag, thats a good idea.

Bart is right about a long, hard rain, it will wash most of it off. The good news is there are not many long hard rains and you can usually be looking at the weather and timing sprays to be right after those hard rain periods. I did my first spray of Surround ten days ago and most of it is still on, I did it right after a huge rainy period. I need to get it on my apples now but since there is chances of rain all I did was do a quick targeted spray at clusters a few days ago. I plan on doing a major Surround/spinosad tomorrow after the thunderstorms of tonight pass through. I haven't used spinosad yet since the moths start to show up at apple petal fall / peach shuck split. Oh, that reminds me, I gotta get my mating disruption out NOW! I am always doing it too late because theres always a lot going on in the orchard around now. Disruption needs to be out a bit before apple petal fall to be on the safe side.

Scott

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 7:43AM
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mamuang_gw

Scott,

Do you add sticker like Nufilm 17 to Surround spray? Can or should it be done?Thanks.

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 8:20AM
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Scott F Smith(6B/7A MD)

Mamuang, a sticker can make the Surround less likely to come off on the bugs and they strongly recommend against it. I sometimes use it on a first coat to make a base, but not on the top coat.

Scott

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 8:48AM
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2010champsbcs

Scott. Thanks to everyone for posting. I do have some additional follow up questions. Am I assuming correctly that you are just using surround throughout the season to protect your fruit from insect damage? Do you get good results from this method? What do you use for the mating disruption? Sorry about all the additional questions but I just want to get it right. Advice from someone that has already been there is awesome. I do only have a few trees but it still takes a long time to bag. Thanks again, Bill

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 12:37PM
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mamuang_gw

Thanks, Scott, I'll do it without sticker this year and see how it goes.

My peaches will be at shuck split in a few days. Forecast says it'll rain from Tuesday for the next 8 days. Bummer!!!

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 5:07PM
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Scott F Smith(6B/7A MD)

Bill, I usually do Surround only through curculio season. It helps to keep it going but its a lot of work to keep coverage for a long period. May is basically Surround month for me but thats it. I rely on mating disruption and spinosad, Bt, codling moth granulosis (virosoft or cyd-x) to control the moths. Also for peaches I regularly prune the flagging tips which contain live OFM. And any fruits I see with moth signs are immediately removed.

Mamuang, sorry to hear about that forecast. I have rain til 2AM tonight so tomorrow early I spray Surround on everything. We then have a few dry days.

Scott

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 7:08PM
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2010champsbcs

Thanks again Scott

    Bookmark   May 10, 2014 at 11:29PM
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