Hachiya Persimmon

christie_sw_mo(Z6)October 22, 2010

Just curious about this variety because I found some today at a grocery store and bought a couple. I was surprised how sweet they are, maybe TOO sweet. The seeds inside are very tiny so I'm wondering if it's a hybrid and the seeds are infertile or do persimmons just have really small seeds? These are the size of sesame seeds or smaller.

I briefly searched Gardenweb and found a couple people in zone 6 that grow Hachiya but I'm wondering if it's grafted onto something else to make it hardier.

Can someone tell me more about them?

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girlbug2(z9/10, Sunset zone 24)

I grew up eating Hachiyas, but haven't had much success this year actually growing them :(.

If it had really small seeds, it's because it wasn't pollenized, or so I'm told. The ones that have large dark seeds indicate that there were male flowers nearby. Some people claim that the pollenized fruits are better quality. I haven't made up my mind on that. I do prefer the seedless ones however for eating convenience.

Japanese persimmons are usually grafted onto American persimmon rootstock (diasporos virginiana).

    Bookmark   October 22, 2010 at 7:48PM
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lucky_p

christie,
I've got Hachiya (and a number of other D.kaki selections) growing here, grafted onto D.virginiana rootstock, 70 mi NW of Nashville TN. No fruit, yet, and it's only been through 2 or 3 winters, so the jury is still out on it, for me.

    Bookmark   October 22, 2010 at 8:34PM
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Scott F Smith(6B/7A MD)

I have had a Hachiya make it through eight winters in my zone 6/7 climate. One winter it lost most of its shoots so it is definitely borderline; I am surprised mine has lasted as long as it has in fact. Grafting on a more hardy stock will not make the top any more hardy. Its one of my favorite varieties, both tasty and large, so I have been keeping it around. I don't know of a similar one that is more hardy, the hardy ones tend to be smaller. I have one called Emperador which so far is looking more hardy and is about the same size; I haven't eaten any of them yet and its not a common variety. It also may ripen too late, they are well behind the Hachiyas now.

Overall I would recommend not trying it unless you were putting in several varieties and wanted to add it as an experiment - thats why I planted mine.

Scott

    Bookmark   October 23, 2010 at 10:05AM
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lucky_p

It's not as big as Hachiya, but I've been getting a few really tasty fruits off of my Saijo for the last week or so - they're really ripening rapidly this week. All have had 2 or 3 well-developed seeds, so I'm guessing the Hokkaido, next tree down the row, must have put out some male blossoms this spring.

    Bookmark   October 23, 2010 at 8:30PM
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christie_sw_mo(Z6)

Thanks for your replies.
If I grew some from seed, I assume I would have to graft them onto American persimmon. Not sure I have the patience for that but I don't really want to spend a lot of money on a few trees as an experiment without knowing for sure whether they would do well here.
Maybe I should plant some American Persimmons while I'm thinking about it.

Are grafted Oriental Persimmons short-lived?
The Virginia Tech article below says they have a life span of only about 10 years.

Are you going to plant those seeds Lucky?

Here is a link that might be useful: Persimmon

    Bookmark   October 24, 2010 at 9:39AM
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lucky_p

Christie,
It's probably not worthwhile for you (or me) to grow out seedling kakis, especially in small numbers; theoretically one-half of the seedlings will be non-fruiting males, and when I look at native populations, I think the percentage is skewed way over 50% in favor of males.
You'd be much better off either grafting your own onto D.virginiana rootstock or purchasing a grafted specimen.

I don't know where those folks came up with their 10-yr lifespan information.
I've only got about 10yrs experience growing Asian persimmons, but I know of one, in the backyard of the late dean of the School of Agriculture at Auburn University that he grafted back around 1960, that's still going strong and fruiting well.
Scott can probably comment on the extensive D.kaki plantings J.Russell Smith made at his homestead in VA, back in the 1920s-1930s; a number of those trees, grafted onto D.virginiana rootstock, are still alive today.

    Bookmark   October 24, 2010 at 10:15AM
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olga_6b

One of the grafted Asian persimmons that my sister grows is much older than 10 year and the tree is going strong. The trunk is really wide now. My persimmons are all younger, so can't comment myself.
I grow Hachiya here in 6B, so far so good, but it is a young plant, not too many winters behind the belt.
Olga

    Bookmark   October 24, 2010 at 10:25AM
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Scott F Smith(6B/7A MD)

I don't know the Russell Smith planting but I visited the Wye planting in Maryland a few years ago and a good portion of the trees were still alive 50 years later.

Scott

    Bookmark   October 24, 2010 at 12:34PM
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lucky_p

Yeah, I'd forgotten the Wye planting, though something about MD was rattling around in my head.
Seems like I remember a write-up in POMONA within the past few years, of someone's visit to Smith's planting - largely untended and overgrown for quite some time. Many of those Asian persimmons, grafted nearly 100 years ago, are still going strong, but some have been overtaken by encroaching forest succession.

    Bookmark   October 24, 2010 at 2:51PM
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christie_sw_mo(Z6)

I think you've busted the 10 year myth. Thank you.
I can get inexpensive native persimmons from our conservation department so I'll think about trying grafting.

    Bookmark   October 25, 2010 at 5:52PM
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