What would you choose?

sammy zone 7 TulsaApril 14, 2014

I need to invest in more roses. There is so much damage, and I need to have some roses in reserve. These are what I am looking at. Would you let me know if there is anything negative about these roses - especially if they are prone to black spot or do not repeat much?

Marie Daly
Marie Pavie
Beauty of Rosemawr
William R. Smith
Thomas Affleck
Miss Caroline
Sweet Francis
Beaute Inconstante
Madame Antoine Mari


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Mendocino_Rose(z8 N CA.)

My zone is different and my summers are dry so I'm not sure if my advice is right for you. Marie Pavie has never given me any trouble. Here beauty of Rosemawr sometimes has blackspot and sometimes not. It hasn't ever defoliated. I am in love with Beaute Inconstante. It has grown and bloomed wonderfully for me. I hear it is rather tender. I saw such a beautiful Madame Antoine Mari this past weekend. I'd love to grow it.

    Bookmark   April 14, 2014 at 8:55AM
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sammy zone 7 Tulsa

Thank you, Mendocino rose. I once had Beaute Inconstante and Beauty of Rosemauer . One did get black spot, and the other died. i will order Inconstante. I also have grow both Maries, but I grew Marie pavie in the ground around my patio. She was pretty, but I had 5 plants, and they had trouble blooming without pruning. I will try Marie Daly.

I have had considerable loss, and would rather pull out some of my roses, than to hope for a one cane wonder to grow back.


    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 5:25AM
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Mendocino_Rose(z8 N CA.)

I hope your new roses do well Sammy. It's sad to lose things.

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 9:08AM
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To me Madame Antoine Mari is one of the most beautiful roses - both for its lovely flowers and for its pretty new growth and over all form - not so sprawling as some other teas in my garden. This if her fourth year here and she has been very healthy in hot, humid North Carolina.

Good luck in replenishing your bounty - it is sad to lose beloved plants but always exciting to make new rose friends or just replace old familiar ones.

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 11:40AM
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poorbutroserich(Nashville 7a)

All of your choices are great! I can speak to Miss Caroline. Her blooms are a bit raggedy or scraggely or whatever....
cute, pert, informal! Really nice in a mixed border.
Mme. Antoine Mari is lovely. Do you have any Hybrid Musks?

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 12:51PM
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Marie Pavie! Great, wafting fragrance; sweet blush-white blooms; almost no disease; thornless; tolerates shade; everblooming...or nearly. Bulletproof? Very pretty! Carol

    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 7:38PM
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sammy zone 7 Tulsa

Thank you for your very helpful responses.
mendocino, thank you so much.
Lottierose, I agree with what you say. I also love Madame Mari.
Susan, I also think she is very pretty, and I selected her because of the color that I saw. I have another one, but it is more pink. I am thinking that she might look good with my Perle d Or bushes. I have 4 Penelopes, one Bubble Bath, and I think I have lost Nur Mahal. I was looking at Vanity, but I prefer the hybrid musks in a space of their own, except for the three I have together. Were you going to suggest a hybrid musk? I used to have many Ballerinas, but have not grown her for awhile.

Thanks, Carol. I decided to try her. I actually got all of my list except for Marie Pavie, and Madame Marie.

Since I am retiring, I can find room better than to stress over a one caner. That gives me 14 new roses, but I always find room, somehow.

I appreciate your input.

I hope good weather is coming. It dropped to 29 last night, so those of you east of Oklahoma, beware.


    Bookmark   April 15, 2014 at 10:15PM
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alameda/zone 8

I love Thomas Affleck! Have you tried any of the Pioneer Roses from Antique Rose Emporium? I love them - they are offering some new ones this year I cant wait to try. Do you have Mrs. B.R. Cant? An excellent bloomer for me, also Mon. Tillier. Don't hear much about Mme. Berkeley, but I really like this one. I have a Sweet Frances - planted last year. Like it. Marie Daly is a very good rose. Mine is growing well and full of buds. Caldwell Pink is an excellent smaller rose. Got any Buck roses? Lots to like there - Honeysweet is an unusual color. All my Bucks do well and I really like them. Cadenza is a favorite - tough and blooms lots. I have Miss Caroline but still a young rose in a pot and haven't formed an opinion yet. Have fun choosing!

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 1:51AM
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sammy zone 7 Tulsa

Judith, I love Antique Rose Emporium. I think Thomas Affleck is one of the best roses I have grown. This will be the 3rd or 4th year for some of my Pioneer roses.I think I have about 8.

Some of the most beautiful of the Buck roses could not take it when I stopped spraying. My husband's favorite rose was Honeysweet, but I could not control the blackspot. However, now that I have a non spray garden, and have had it for years, I may be able to introduce some roses that had blackspot in the past, and they may be ok. This is a subject I would like to investigate and test. A rose that was spayed for 6 or 7 years, and died when I stopped spraying may be introduced to a no spray garden and survive.

Miss Caroline is beautiful, but in my yard have not grown to be huge like Duchesse de Brabant. I believe it is a sport of Duchesse, but my "Duchesses" are very large.

I hope most of you have more control in your gardens than I do.

Thanks, Judith for your input.


When Mrs. B.R. Cant survived her 3 years, and put on a show, no other rose can compare to her. However, in Tulsa, we are a barely 7A. Mrs. B.R needed more protection than I had time to give her.

I am trying to create a Caldwell Pink bed. I have three already, and two new this year. I have no other rose that is quite her color of pink. It makes me stop and look to see if it is really purple, but it is only the tone that is cast on her.

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 5:19AM
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Kes Z 7a E Tn

I have had a Marie Pavie for about 15 yrs. It grows in partial shade. It does have occasional blackspot for me but bounces back and never fails to bloom. The fragrance wafts. This winter it suffered considerable dieback but appears to be bouncing back from that too. I don't live where you do even though I'm also a 7, so YMMV.

If you might like to consider a Buck rose, Prairie Sunrise has been a great rose for me. It stays a moderate size for me so far and the flowers are lovely and fragrant. It hasn't had blackspot for me but I realize that it might be different for you. It sailed through the last winter with no damage.

    Bookmark   April 16, 2014 at 10:23AM
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I grew 'Marie Pavie' in Dallas and had good luck with it. The hot summers didn't seem to faze it and it bloomed a lot. I bought mine from Antique Rose Emporium, I remember.

I also did grow a found rose 'Katy Road Pink' that I got from ARE too. it was later identified as Dr. Buck's 'Carefree Beauty'. It did so well in the heat and bloomed all summer with no blackspot problems. That might be one that will do well for you.

Good luck with your garden, Sammy. I hope when you have more time to garden this summer and fall you'll post some pictures. Gean

    Bookmark   April 18, 2014 at 12:38AM
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I have Marie Daly, Marie Pave, and M. Antoine Mari--all are gorgeous and trouble free for me here in central Texas. I do no spraying or systemic treatments of any kind. Both the Maries have small blooms, but the fragrance is lovely, and does waft. M Antoine Mari has lovely blooms and a graceful form, but is not smelly for me. I just removed him from a bed where he was happily taking over everyone around him (a poor placement choice by me). Good luck with whatever you choose!


    Bookmark   April 18, 2014 at 10:21AM
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gnabonnand(Zone 8 Texas)

Thomas Affleck is probably the toughest and healthiest rose I've ever grown.
And blooms prolifically.
My neighbors have told me NEVER get rid of that rose.
If there was a popularity vote by them, I'm certain Thomas Affleck would win, hands down.
This rose is a cross between 'Basye's Blueberry' & 'Carefree Beauty' and I think it obtained many of the best traits of both.


    Bookmark   April 20, 2014 at 12:14PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Sammy -- in lieu of Marie Pavie, see if you can get the rose originally called "Faded Pink Monthly," but now in commerce as "Mrs. Keays Noisette."

It isn't a Noisette, but has much the same character as Marie Pavie, on a more robust plant. Last I heard, an East Coast nursery was offering it as MKN. I like it A LOT.


    Bookmark   April 20, 2014 at 6:09PM
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