Injured fantail question

ketel1(Denver)March 10, 2006

I just moved my fantails in to a new tank that is not completely set up yet. This morning, I found my smallest fantail sucked up to a temporary small pump I have in the tank.

I shook him loose, he swam to the bottom and just lay there a while. He has hemorrhage marks on his side and a small dark red protrusion from his anus. I placed some food in the tank, which he eagerly swam to eat. He then swam back to the bottom.

Is he doomed? I have no idea how long he was like that. It could have been hours overnight.


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Not necessarily doomed, but it is now extremely critical you keep that water super clean. Add some salt to help out with electrolytes. How big a tank?

    Bookmark   March 10, 2006 at 12:36PM
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The tank is big, a hexagon on a floor stand (maybe 50 gallons?), and we have only 2 fantails in it. We just set it up last weekend and they have only been in it 2 days. I have no gravel in yet, only a fake plant. We will add the required salt...the water temp is only at about 70, is that okay? We have 2 small heaters in it (too small for the tank) and we put the small pump in to circulate the water to keep it warmer.

Thanks for the advice.

    Bookmark   March 10, 2006 at 1:41PM
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Are these ryukins? They prefer slightly higher temps.

Usually with injuries like this, clean water, a little salt, and a prayer. 'Bout the best you can do!! Goldfish are really pretty hardy - hopefully what you're seeing is just a small bruise that should heal with the clean water and salt. Keep an eye out for extra mucous being exuded. Sometimes this will happen with an injury.

    Bookmark   March 10, 2006 at 3:46PM
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Well, sadly, this little fighter died. His injuries from being sucked up to the pump went away, but he never regained his balance. He and his tankmate then showed signs of external bacterial infection (red splotches on their underside and on their tails). I treated them and added a little more salt and the splotches were gone in 4 days. He died on the 4th day. All but one of his tankmates died over the last 2 years from dropsy-like symptoms.

New question- I have one fantail left now, out of 7. He is in a new tank. When/how can I add another for company? I hate having him alone, and would entertain an algae eater, too.

I am very concerned about why this new tank seemed to cause some serious issues? I am sad that I caught on to my poor water quality issues so late that I lost all my fish but one.


    Bookmark   March 23, 2006 at 4:52PM
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melle_sacto(Z9/Sunset 14 CA)

Since you asked for thoughts :-)

Have you cycled your tank (aknowledging that the cycle is more comlex than just the basic builing up of bacteria to break down ammonia to nitrite, then to nitrate)? If not, I encourage you to cycle the tank before adding any new fish. If you search the forum for cycle you will find a lot of information.

Filtration: I didn't see you mention any filtration. Your tank should have some sort of filtration, this is essential to cycling the tank. Goldfish require high levels of filtration because they are relatively large fish; 10x tank volume per hour, or better, is ideal for goldfish.

Goldfish are cold-water fish and shouldn't need a heater. Water that is too warm can be stressful for them and have lower levels of dissolved oxygen. You might consider not using the heater.

Algae eater: avoid Chinese algae eaters and common Plecostamus.


    Bookmark   March 24, 2006 at 1:56AM
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Fancy goldfish require higher temps. Shubunkin,Comets, Koi, and run of the mill goldfish are cold-water. Not sure if the fantail goldfish is referring to a ryunkin, an oranda, a black moor, lionhead or simply a comet - which can have a fan-like tail!

And I'd stay away from chinese algae eaters as well - they get pretty aggressive when they get bigger. I have one that used to be in a tropical tank, until I realized he was harassing badly one of my angels (which eventually died) - I wound up dumping him into the african cichlid tank where he's doing just fine (and has to hide more than half the time). But for slow moving fish like fancy goldfish, or certain tropicals, I'd never keep them together. Besides which, as they grow older, they don't really work on the algae anymore.

    Bookmark   March 24, 2006 at 6:51AM
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We do have a filter system (the two in previous tank were undergravel, which I am convinced killed everyone off, and a hang on tank one with biofilter wheel). We have the hang on filter in the new tank. My lone fantail (might be a big comet) is more active with warmer temps, and right now the water temp is 72. He seems happy with that. I will read up on cycling and do what I need to in order for this tank to be successful. Thanks!

    Bookmark   March 24, 2006 at 9:17AM
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Koi and comets and shubunkin do become more active with warmer waters - but don't do well in really warm water. 72 degrees is a good temp if it's a comet.

I love comets. Is it a red and white? You do realize they can get fairly large? (I have comets in my pond that are at about 8 inches long - not including the tail)

Comets really will stir up the bottom gravel. Seems like it's their nature to explore and move things around looking for food. So I'm glad you don't have an undergravel filter system anymore.

I have cories in my fancy goldfish tank. I think they're Corydoras ehrhardti and then also a couple of panda cories. They're doing fine in that tank.

    Bookmark   March 24, 2006 at 10:39AM
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melle_sacto(Z9/Sunset 14 CA)

I'm glad you are running a filter; some people think goldfish don't require filtration.

Re the warmer water temps and fancier goldfish: I am not an expert (so I won't disagree with skygee) but I don't heat the water in my goldie tank. When I kept tropicals I always ran a heater but I've always heard it's unnecessary with the goldies.

I currently have a 35 gallon hex tank with two large black moores (I bought them as babies and I think they're about seven inches now--that does include the tail) and two dojo loaches; the moores are about 3 1/2 years old, the dojos I've had a year. We keep our house at 68 (F) during the day in winter (55 at night) and 78-80 during the day in summer so the water temp probably fluctuates somewhere between those extremes. My fish have never shown any problems, have grown well, and appear to be content.

I have a canister filter and the tank does not have a layer of gravel, just a few small piles that move around as the moores and dojos fool around. I grow low-light plants on the bottom (java ferns attached to pieces of wood and large rocks) and float anacharis at the top since it wants higher light. The plants also appear to be doing really well, I have noticed that the anacharis starts looking bad if I don't feed my fish for a few days so I know they munch it. I also run an air pump because hex tanks do not have large surface areas and the canister filter doesn't agitate the surface--your biowheel should be sufficient for surface agitation but you can always add an air pump to increase agitation if you think your fish isn't getting enough oxygen.

Algae: I have some relatively useless ramshorn snails that hitched in when I introduced the anacharis, I think the dojos do a good job of keeping the population of snails to a minimum; I currently have two larger snails that go around and scrape some algae. I generally don't get too much algae, I wipe the sides monthly and that seems to be sufficient. Consequently I don't have an algae eater in this tank. Live plants can work to outcompete algae, you could consider trying some of the tougher plants (success with also depend on the munchiness level of your fish).

Good luck!

    Bookmark   March 24, 2006 at 11:23AM
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Funny, we do have an airpump going to move the water. I have begun the cycling process. Lone survivor is doing great-he's a strong, hardy one. Thanks to all for your suggestions. I will take a little advice from all of you and will soon start looking for 2 friends for him-another comet and maybe another something. Thanks!

    Bookmark   April 2, 2006 at 11:19AM
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Kete, I recomend that you don't get anymore goldfish. Fancies need at least 10 gallons each and commons/comets need at leas 20 each. Fancies get to be over 8" and the commons/comets should be over 15" full grown. They also produce ALOT of waste O.O If you can, try and get a bigger tank. Avoid hexagons and go for the longer tanks because they allow more O2 diffusion.

If you weren't overstocked, I'd recomend a brittlenose or rubberlip pleco. They do a good job with aglea, don't get to big or vicious toward the goldies (like SAEs and common plecs), and aren't too small to get eaten (like otos). Be careful with the cories please. If your goldfish aren't already big enough, they will grow and eat or try to eat them. Cories (and otos) have spikey dorsals, and if eaterm they will most likely lodge themselves in the goldfish's throat.

    Bookmark   April 9, 2006 at 8:09PM
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I have two fantail oranda's one red cap and the other brown in colour. They both have white spots on their heads i dont think it is white spot as my other fish a black moore and a Calico fantail that are kept in the same tank do not have them. Are my oranda's ill ? if so is it seriouse as they have had them for some time and what can i use to cure it.
thank you

    Bookmark   April 11, 2006 at 2:07PM
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triple_b(BC 5b)

Those Chinese Algae Eaters are Satan with gills.
I would think if the tank is in a main part of the house that room temp would be just fine. Actually in the summer unless you have air conditioning or a generally cool house it could get too warm; another reason why filtration is SO important. The water movement created by the filter also puts oxyen into their environment, which can be lacking in warm water as a previous poster said. We lost one of our black moores like that over the summer.

    Bookmark   November 20, 2007 at 2:52PM
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