tea roses rule!

jerijen(Zone 10)November 17, 2011

'Le Pactole'

Nov. 17, '11

Jeri

Coastal Ventura County

SoCal

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seil zone 6b MI

Even though I can't grow them here I do agree with you, Jeri! They have my favorite kind of form. I love that big, loose, sort of crumpled look they get. Like old hat roses. Lovely!

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 1:23PM
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Glenburn(z8/z9 Mudgee, NSW Aust)

Jeri and others, have you got a favorite tea(original) that holds it's head up and does not "nod", Regards David.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 1:41PM
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hartwood

Tea roses DO rule! My garden is nearly shut down for the winter, but there are still flowers on many of my teas ... and they have been putting on quite a show all fall until now. Mme. Lombard, Angel's Camp Tea, Second Street Tea, Mrs. B. R. Cant, Georgetown Tea ... love 'em all!

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 2:02PM
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jacqueline9CA

Glenburn - I just went out and looked, and neither my rosa DeLizy nor my Duchesse de Brabant (both of which are blooming a lot and are gorgeous) have any nodding flowers. However, I think one of the delights of tea roses is that most of them DO have nodding blooms. The bushes get so large that if the blooms did not nod, you would not be able to see them! These plants in general are not 2-3 ft hight bushes - they are 7-10 ft high, with gloriously elegant, nodding blooms. Tea roses do rule!

Jackie

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 2:40PM
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rosefolly

Actually my favorite old roses are the hybrid perpetuals and the once blooming old garden roses. I have been dismayed by the many teas which get really bad powdery mildew in my area. Also I cannot smell their fragrance, so part of their charm is lost to me. However, the number of found roses in California which turn out to be teas has me opening my eyes and my horizons. They have to be the mildew-resistant varieties if I am to grow them. I spray only once a year and don't have the inclination to fuss over unhealthy plants.

So for me, teas do not rule. But they do get a vote.

Rosefolly

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 3:47PM
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floridarosez9

Glenburn, R. Delizy doesn't nod, but the blooms are small. Mrs. Dudley Cross doesn't nod. Maman Cochet doesn't nod. At the moment, that's all I can think of, but I'm sure there are more.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 4:16PM
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bellegallica_zone9(9)

Those are pretty!

I grew teas when I had more room. Jackie is right. They tend to become BIG plants. At the moment, I just don't have the space for them.

I'm also a fragrance freak, and I found that their scents are just not strong enough for me. Duchesse de Brabant was nice, though, and I'll probably get that one again when I move to a bigger place. And Baronne Henriette de Snoy. I always liked the look of that one, but didn't have a chance to try it.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2011 at 11:59PM
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Campanula UK Z8

well.....in California maybe but here in East Anglia, there is no beating the hybrid musks and species.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2011 at 5:04AM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

Non-nodders in my garden: Duchesse de Brabant, Mme. Joseph Schwartz (a sport of DdB), Miss Atwood, Souvenir d'un Ami, William R. Smith, Rosette Delizy, Westside Road Cream Tea, Alexander Hill Gray, Mrs. B.R. Cant

    Bookmark   November 18, 2011 at 11:01AM
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floridarosez9

That's interesting, Ingrid. Here Mrs. B.R. Cant nods. She's still lovely in the vase and smells heavenly. The buds, however, don't nod so I frequently include them in arrangements.

Belinda's Dream, while not an OGR, has the look and a wonderful scent. She's excellent in the vase also. Right now in this cool weather, the blooms are almost as big as my hand. I have a hedge of B's Dream and Louis Phillipe (or maybe Cramoisi Superior) that I was weeding in yesterday. There was a light breeze and I almost swooned from the comined scent of those two.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2011 at 6:25PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

One thing I suggest about Tea Roses (and others, really) and Mildew ... Some will mildew annoyingly until they are mature. Or, maybe, until they have built up a congenial environment for themselves, or whatever. In any case, it can take easily 4 years for this to happen in my conditions, and with own-root Tea Roses.

Not ALL Tea Roses -- BUT SOME.

Others, such as Duchesse de Brabant, will mildew here forever. There's no hope.

And I'm with Jackie on the nodding thing.
The Teas that don't nod are things like Rosette Delizy, which are edging into HT territory. The gentle, Older Tea Roses -- NOD. That's what they do. But they are big roses, and I am under 5 ft. tall, so I do not regard this as a problem. :-)

For me, in MY environment, in my conditions -- TEA ROSES RULE.
Your Mileage May Vary. :-)

Jeri

    Bookmark   November 18, 2011 at 9:18PM
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floridarosez9

They rule here also, Jeri. The teas and the Chinas are my best and loveliest roses except for Belinda's Dream. Here, mildew is not a problem but blackspot occasionally if we have wet, overcast weather for several days. It amazes me how some of the teas, Bon Silene for instance, get over my head in a matter of months after planting, while others seem to take years to build.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 8:27AM
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Mendocino_Rose(z8 N CA.)

Le Pactole certainly does. Mine grew from a tiny plant bought at the Sacramento Cemetery into a huge, care free, free blooming, wonderful shrub.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 10:35AM
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seil zone 6b MI

I don't know what's the problem with nodding? I think it's part of a lot of roses charm!

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 3:53PM
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sadie_pnw

Here's an example of a nodding neck, from Marie Van Houtte, a tea from 1871.

I think the story goes that the nodding necks of teas are at least part of the reason for the development of the hybrid teas, or the crossing of tea roses with hybrid perpetuals. Breeders during the Victorian era were looking for roses that would exhibit on straight, stiff necks.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 4:30PM
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sadie_pnw

I always like to think that teas have those long, flexible necks so they can turn their faces to the sun if they get a little chilly.

But that's probably just whimsical. And I too am one of those who think teas rule, too. But not up here, unfortunately.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 4:38PM
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jaspermplants

I agree, tea roses are my absolute favorite rose. I love that they nod, to me that is a big part of their charm. My favorite is Mme Joseph Schwartz. To me, she is the ultimate in charm and my favorite scent.

I love them all (at least the ones I grow).

    Bookmark   November 19, 2011 at 8:26PM
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melissa_thefarm(NItaly)

I adore them too, but they've suffered from the last two chilly wet winters in very heavy soil. At least this year we're paying some attention to amendment. We're slow, but eventually we get it. Also I think they'll be happier with lots of companion planting.

Melissa

    Bookmark   November 21, 2011 at 5:29AM
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petaloid(SoCal 10a/24)

Those Le Pactole blooms are so sweet!

Safrano is an old favorite of mine, and I love Rosette Delizy, which was mentioned.

If teas nod, that seems normal to me. Not a problem.

    Bookmark   November 24, 2011 at 9:45PM
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sherryocala

I have a bunch of teas and the only one that REALLY nods is La Sylphide. And she's short so all I see is her pretty butt. Once she had a flower that stood straight up, and I almost fell over. I thought she was maturing, but alas, she's even more mature this year and still nodding. I guess that standing bloom was a once-in-a-blue-moon thing.

And yes, TEAS RULE in Florida.

Sherry

Here is a link that might be useful: If only sweat were irrigation...

    Bookmark   November 24, 2011 at 10:23PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Sherry -- You probably need 'Le Pactole.' :-)

Jeri

    Bookmark   November 24, 2011 at 10:54PM
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jaspermplants

I planted Le Pactole a couple years ago and it has grown verrry slowly. It is finally blooming some and I love the blooms.

I agree: tea roses rule! I'm glad I'm in a climate I can grow them and I grow as many as I have room for (probably more!)

    Bookmark   November 25, 2011 at 1:43PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Don't worry, when it gets its roots really well-established, it will take off like a rocket. :-)

Jeri

    Bookmark   November 28, 2011 at 11:51AM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

My Le Pactole arrived as an extremely iffy band in that the bottom third was black, and the remainder sported about three leaves. I planted it anyway and there it sat, emanating a strong death wish, until we had a good rain, and then some new leaflets sprang up. However, more than a third of the bottom is still almost black. Is there hope for this little one?

Ingrid

    Bookmark   November 28, 2011 at 3:00PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

If it were MY plant, I would pot it up, assuring that the pot drained well, and let the roots get some heat.

BUT I would also have notified the vendor that it did not arrive in good condition.

Jeri

    Bookmark   November 28, 2011 at 3:45PM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

Jeri, since said vendor is already engaged in a losing struggle to survive, I decided not to exacerbate his worries. On the bright side, if it doesn't make it I'll have a sorely needed spot for one of the French imports I'll be getting in 2013. To have two tea roses that are new here is really quite exciting.

Ingrid

    Bookmark   November 29, 2011 at 1:52PM
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cemeteryrose(USDA 9/Sunset 14)

Oh, I'm considering ordering a couple of French imports. Crazy thoughts, really, but I may do it. Climbing Duchesse de Brabant is just too tempting - let's hope that its flowers nod at least a bit because I love the climbing teas for just that reason.

Mons Tillier holds its flower pretty upright. Sometimes, so does Mme Lambard (although this rose mildews quite a bit in spring and fall).

I usually just enjoy my flowers in the garden, but I learned from Carolyn Parker that if you cut big stems, the nodding flowers are incredibly graceful in the vase. Little stems with nodding flowers just look wimpy, although you can use them to trail out of the bottom of an arrangement.
Anita

    Bookmark   December 4, 2011 at 6:30AM
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titian1 10b

Tea roses rule in my garden. Ms Tillier doesn't nod at all. D de B does a little, but charmingly, Anna Olivier ditto and Marie van Houtte. Also Jean Ducher (G Nabonnand). Mrs Dudley Cross does a u-turn. General Gallieni, Rosette Delizy and Hugo Roller all balled and burnt here sadly.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2014 at 3:34AM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

Almost three years after this discussion began, I confidently repeat what I said in 2011 about Teas and Mildew. In my garden, most of them grow out of mildew with maturity. (Some few do not, and they don't stay).

'Mme. Lambard' is one that is known to mildew. (And, yes, she nods, some.) Now that she's been here in the ground for 6.5-7 years, she rarely mildews -- and she blooms and blooms.

Yesterday morning, hot, dry east winds began to blow. I went out and picked all of the buds she was starting to open, and brought them in, in a vase.

This is last evening. (She's more open, this morning.)

    Bookmark   November 17, 2014 at 12:07PM
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Kippy(SoCal zone 10. Sunset Zone 24)

Very nice

I remind myself that all are babies and mildew now does not mean mildew forever

And boy do I want Le Pactole

    Bookmark   November 17, 2014 at 12:52PM
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roseseek

There are MANY HTs which hang their heads, too. Many of Charlotte Armstrong's offspring do, as does she, to mention only one of many lines. Charlotte is a very "Tea-like" HT, all the way down to the mildew. Kim

    Bookmark   November 17, 2014 at 4:17PM
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jerijen(Zone 10)

As others have said -- Nodding blooms don't bother me in the least, and they CAN be an asset.

Years ago -- my DH said he didn't LIKE roses ... that they were "ugly plants with bare bottoms" and "all look like they went to military school."

Well, we don't grow roses like THAT. :-)

We grow roses that, for the most part, arch, or climb, and/or nod . . . and we both like them very much. But it is a fortunate thing that roses take so many different forms. There's more or less "something for everyone."

Sort of like dogs . . . From Irish Wolfhound to Chihuahua ... there's something there for everyone. :-)

Me -- I enjoy China andTea Roses, and Long-Haired Dalmatians. YMMV. :-)

    Bookmark   November 17, 2014 at 4:42PM
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