Where to buy Pinus Cembra

reads_n_writes(5)February 9, 2008

Hi, I've been doing a little research into pine trees with edible nuts that might grow in my area. The one that sounded the most likely was Pinus Cembra, Swiss Stone Pine. I found that and lots of other pines with edible nuts for sale in Canada at Rhora's Nut Farm but for the life of me I can't find any similar place to buy that's based in the USA. Does anyone have any suggestions on where to look for these trees or other edible pine nut trees that I might grow? Or has anyone had any experience with importing trees from Canada?

Thanks!

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affliction-acs

Try Gee Farms (Michigan), Girards (Ohio), Rich's Foxwillow Pines Woodstock, Illinois for starters. All have websites.

I hope you have some patience. Cembras take a fairly long time to cone. Pinus koreansis nuts are also edible and hardy where you are.

Darren

    Bookmark   February 9, 2008 at 12:43PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Yes, I was also thinking the Korean pine might work better for you.

    Bookmark   February 9, 2008 at 3:22PM
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reads_n_writes(5)

Thanks for your feedback and the list of nurseries to try. :) I'll definitely check them out.

It's interesting that you mention Pinus koraiensis (that's the way it's spelled on Rhora's nut farm page and other places where I looked it up--same thing, right?) as an alternative. One the Rhora's nut farm page (which is where I found the best descriptions of the different species that provide edible pine nuts) it says that Korean Pines like sandy soil which we definitely don't have at our house. We lean more towards clay around here (as well as fairly alkaline soil) and Cembra was the only one that seemed to do okay with clay. Do you still think the Korean pine is way to go under those circumstances?

Also, Rhora's sells "inoculants" for each variety of pine they sell and says they're supposed to help them grow and produce faster. Does anyone know anything about that? I don't mind if it takes a long time for the trees to bear nuts (though it would be nice to have them faster). I'm hoping to be in this house forever if I can!

Thanks again!

    Bookmark   February 9, 2008 at 6:07PM
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treelover3

RnR,
Forest Farm also sells Pinus cembra. FF has great plants at very reasonable prices. I have an order from Forest Farm being delivered in May. I have linked their listing for Pinus cembra below.
Mike

Here is a link that might be useful: Pinus cembra listing at Forest Farm

    Bookmark   February 9, 2008 at 7:22PM
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treelover3

Oops... sorry RnW, I hit the R twice in your name above.

    Bookmark   February 10, 2008 at 8:58AM
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conifers

You'll be good to go with Pinus koraiensis. Those three nurseries listed by acs affliction are specialty nurseries selling cultivars which you don't need. You need species trees.

If you want bulk, I'd recommend very highly Heritage Seedlings.

Dax

    Bookmark   February 10, 2008 at 9:19AM
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reads_n_writes(5)

Thanks for the link, Treelover, looks like a good resource. :) No worries about the typo!

Dax, I looked at Heritage seedlings and I was wondering about their ordering policy. It says that the orders must be $350 or 100 trees of a certain size. I'm not sure I could really fit 100 trees since they eventually get so big, but I could perhaps give some away as gifts for that price.

But the total for 100 trees, even the largest size of the Pinus koraiensis will be just over $100. Do you know if they allow that?

Also, why do you think I need the species rather than the cultivar? Just because they're less expensive? Do they do better under my stated conditions if they're species trees and not cultivar? Just curious.

And one last question. Do you know anything about inculations of pine trees (I mentioned this in my last post)?

Thanks!

    Bookmark   February 10, 2008 at 11:26AM
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conifers

reads and writes,

100 trees is an order. Then you also have the option to purchase anything else in groups of 25. 100 must all be the same, no combining.

As to cultivars and non-cultivars, there's no reason for you to mess with cultivars unless you want aestetic. I assumed this for you, politely.

The rest to me is dig hole, plant or put in pot. innuculations are for pea plants or to me are there to produce more fixed nitrogen near a root area. I don't know much more than that.

Dax

    Bookmark   February 10, 2008 at 2:28PM
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dirtslinger2(6)

P. cembra is SO SLOW it's unreal. Something to plant for nuts for your grand children, not for sooner.

    Bookmark   February 10, 2008 at 10:32PM
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tsugajunkie z5 SE WI

Pinus koraiensis, from what I hear, will take about 15-20 years to cone as well. You may want to give Pinus parviflora a try. I haven't eaten any but hear they are good and cone earlier than either koraiensis or cembra. Based on what I've read in this forum, there may be an advantage of a grafted cultivar (other than a broom, that is) in that they tend to cone earlier.

tj

    Bookmark   February 11, 2008 at 6:55PM
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rich12572(Z5b New York)

Dear All,

I have a 30" P. Koraiensis 'Morris Blue', which had it's first, beautiful cone last summer. I highly recommend this beautiful silver-blue tree.

    Bookmark   February 11, 2008 at 9:37PM
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treelover3

I have a Pinus cembra 'Glauca Compacta' or 'Compacta Glauca' (label is buried in the snow right now) that had a cone a couple of years after being planted. This is quite common with plants that are grafted since the scion material may already be mature and start to cone much earlier than a seedling plant would. The tree produced another cone last year, and I'm sure it will be many years before I could collect cones from the tree. The tree is about 4' tall.
Mike

    Bookmark   February 12, 2008 at 6:08PM
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conifers

Oh yah, a cultivar would be useful.

Give Pinus koraiensis 'Silveray' a try. Fast to grow and to cone.

Dax

    Bookmark   February 13, 2008 at 4:22PM
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pineresin

Remember conifers are outcrossing - you will need several trees of different genetic stock to enable cross-pollination. A group of all the same cultivar (e.g. that 'Silveray') won't produce much if any good seed.

Resin

    Bookmark   February 13, 2008 at 4:50PM
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tsugajunkie z5 SE WI

Are there species that can cross pollinate either P. koraiensis or P. Cembra to produce edible seed?

tj

    Bookmark   February 13, 2008 at 5:54PM
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pineresin

Possibly each other; also Pinus sibirica with P. cembra. But not other white pines.

Resin

    Bookmark   February 13, 2008 at 6:09PM
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tsugajunkie z5 SE WI

Thanks Resin. I was hoping for P. parviflora or at least P. strobus or even P. flexilis as these are among the older five needled pines in or near my yard. I don't have room for two koraiensis, but I do have a cembra. Maybe...in time. In the mean time, I'll have to talk to my neighbor about that bare spot in his yard...;-)

tj

    Bookmark   February 13, 2008 at 7:18PM
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reads_n_writes(5)

Thanks everyone for your help!

Hmmm, another monkey wrench, though. I had just about decided to place an order for 100 korean pines from Heritage seedlings. But if I need another variety in order to cross pollinate with it then I can use even less of those trees than I thought.

Will they cross pollinate with white pines? I have five of those fully grown at the opposite end of my property. If not, what types of pine trees do you recommend for cross pollination, Pineresin? Would any very small trees or shrub type pines work?

Another question I have is if I do order the Korean pines can I pot up any extra bare-root trees in order to trade them in a plant swap?

Alina

    Bookmark   February 16, 2008 at 9:37PM
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kman04(z6 KS)

If these are seedlings, then they will all be genetically distinct enough to successfully cross pollinate each other. It's only if they are all cutting grown from the same parent tree or are all one particular cultivar (which would be all genetically identical clones) that you would have a problem with pollination.

Also, I've potted up plenty of bare root seedlings to grow on to a larger size before I planted out. I don't see any reason why you couldn't do the same. The hardest thing might be winter storage because you need to keep them cold enough to satisfy their cold requirements, but not too cold that you cause root damage or death(they are much more sensitive to cold in pots than they are when planted in the ground).

    Bookmark   February 17, 2008 at 1:29PM
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reads_n_writes(5)

Thanks, kman04. :) So I guess if I go with the large order from Heritage of the species pine I'd be okay then. That's good! Maybe I'll try to pick up one "Silveray", too at some point to get seeds faster.

My plan was to pot up the extras in large styrofoam cups or something like that. Would that work? Do I just pot them up in potting soil? Any other potting tips? And as for keeping them through the winter, would an unheated barn or garage work? Or would a sreened porch be better so they still get some light?

Thanks again so much for all of your help!

Alina

    Bookmark   February 17, 2008 at 5:31PM
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timbit

Hi!

Very interesting about edible nut pines. A few years back
I purchase some Korean pine and Swiss stone pine Pinus cembra
from a nursery - believe it was Rhora. He had many varieties
listed on his website. Anyway I purchased a few, and by 4 years produced their first cones. At 6 years - half a bushel.
He recommended using an inoculant as the trees were not native to here. Seems to have done the trick. The trees are very ornamental in appearance. They were on their own roots as he said they filled the nuts better than grafted trees. He offered very good discount prices for small lots too. Anyway thought I would write and give my experince. By the way believe he was in Canada.

    Bookmark   February 23, 2008 at 1:40PM
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johniesgarden

The Oregon Association of Nurseries has a website that can help. There are nurseries in Oregon that grow species and cultivars

    Bookmark   March 28, 2014 at 12:25AM
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