Hardy White Rose I.D.

Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)July 26, 2014

Please

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wayne

Possibly Morden Snowbeauty, doesn't look like rugosa foliage. How big is it and is it a repeat bloomer.

    Bookmark   July 26, 2014 at 5:31PM
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northspruce(z3a MB CDA)

Photos of stems and leaves and description of smell would help too.

    Bookmark   July 26, 2014 at 5:34PM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thank you all!
We found it it growing on someone's property and they don't
know what it is,..said, they been there forever and is thriving, this bush was about 8 foot tall,...just buzzing with bees and very fragrant.

    Bookmark   July 27, 2014 at 1:30AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

another..

    Bookmark   July 27, 2014 at 1:31AM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

Looks like a spinosissima I've seen at Beaverlodge Research station labelled "Altai Scotch"...does it have ebony colored hips Konrad?

    Bookmark   July 27, 2014 at 8:54AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thanks so much!
Is this a Altai Scotch? A little lighter color in the foliage,..not growing 8 foot tall.

    Bookmark   July 27, 2014 at 11:22AM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

My best guess...here's another photo...and Altai Scotch can get quite tall...there's not many tall spinosissimas that look like that. In a few weeks, post a photo of the hips.

    Bookmark   July 27, 2014 at 11:39AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Here are the hips...can you tell now?

    Bookmark   November 5, 2014 at 7:33PM
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SouthCountryGuy Zone 4b-5 SE BC(Zone 4b-5 SE BC Canada)

Be much easier to identify in person so I'll send you a SASBE :)

SCG

    Bookmark   November 6, 2014 at 11:51AM
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wayne

Spinosissima , I was reading up on them and at one time, 1800's there was many, many cultivars in different colors and some were double's. So nailing down the exact one may be very difficult, by hip shape and color though it puts the variety very close to the species I think. Flower size will get you closer yet.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2014 at 8:55PM
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SouthCountryGuy Zone 4b-5 SE BC(Zone 4b-5 SE BC Canada)

All kidding aside I would be very interested in some hips or even sucker/cuttings next year. SASBE and willing to trade :-)

As wayne61 pointed out back in the 18th and 19 century there were hundreds, if not thousands, of cultivars of R. Spinosissima. It would be interesting to find out if the owners knew anything about the people that had been on the property before them. Many immigrants from EU brought this rose with them and depending on where they descended from the reason could be anything from allegiance to country or religious denomination to being a family heirloom as there were times it was quite possible that only the wealthy had cultivars.

The providence on R. Spinosissima and its cultivars is quite interesting and very alluring.

SCG

    Bookmark   November 8, 2014 at 10:26AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thank you all!

>>Looks like a spinosissimaSomewhat similar but leaves look different and around 8 foot tall.

That's all the hips I've got, [wish I got more] one has only 2 or 3 seeds,..wish me luck growing these, I wanted to grow them around March but wife says now, we might try both method.

I was bagging for some hips from this friend we visited, he knows these people there and grows a orchard in their property.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2014 at 12:28PM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

Hi Konrad

Thanks for posting the photo of those hips...sure looks like Altai Scotch (r.spinosissima) as Wayne has said.

This rose was used by prairie breeders a bit...Skinner, Wright, Erskine et al...but there are only a handful of cultivars ever produced on the Canadian Prairies...strange as it is the most winter hardy category of roses in my area (far north prairie). I suspect that it could be in part the fact that the seeds do not germinate easily...they have such a thick seed coat. I read somewhere that Robert Erskine tried to germinate 2000 Prairie Peace seeds one year...not one grew.

I've used Altai Scotch in breeding a bit...it does seem to throw double flower form from time to time...suspect that is how John Wallace (Beaverlodge) got Kakwa. If you ever have a chance to visit Beaverlodge Agricultural Research Station in June you will see some great r.spinosissima shrubs...maybe at their annual Beekeepers Field Day.

Here is a photo of an Altai Scotch seedling of mine...double flower form...looks just like Kakwa only much taller.

Spinosissimas have a wonderful fragrance...no wonder the bees love them.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2014 at 5:32PM
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braeburn040(2B/3 BC)

Re: your last posting Konrad We have the same rose here in our garden It is doing fine, and has lots of suckers, I could dig one up in the spring and get it to you some how if the seedlings don't work I'm sending a picture if it works.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2014 at 5:57PM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

Nice photo Braeburn

Konrad, you have the prairie rose garden in St Albert that has the classic spinosissimas...for some reason, the Prairie Peace specimen doesn't look that great...maybe give it some more time. It is quite an exquisite collection...well taken care of...thanks to a lot of volunteers, Margit Schowalter, and others. For those of you who haven't seen it, the collection is about 130 cultivars developed by Prairie breeders. In the future you may see some roses that were praire developed ...became extinct here over time...but found elsewhere in the world...to be repatriated...looking forward to that.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2014 at 6:49PM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

WOW Rose,...your seedling looks wonderful!
Thank you for all this information!

>>Spinosissimas have a wonderful fragrance...no wonder the bees love them. It sure did, wife said that she wanted to eat the pedals, ..lol.

braeburn
Your offer is most welcome and appreciated! The height of yours does make me a believer now.

Perhaps we can trade with something,...interested in grafted plums/pears?

    Bookmark   November 9, 2014 at 10:04PM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

For comparison regarding height of Altai Scotch (up to 8 ft) versus Kakwa (3-4ft) ...photo of Kakwa taken at Beaverlodge Agricultural Research Station

Note the double flower form...beautiful rose...saw the most number of honeybees on this one.

    Bookmark   November 10, 2014 at 9:57AM
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rosecavalier(3 AB)

And the breeder of Kakwa...well known far north nurseryman...prolific breeder of other hardy cultivars...John Wallace

    Bookmark   November 10, 2014 at 10:00AM
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SouthCountryGuy Zone 4b-5 SE BC(Zone 4b-5 SE BC Canada)

Nice photos everyone!

While we are on the topic of spinosissima's can anyone tell me where I can acquire them (mail order)? Cornhill lists some but they haven't replied to my emails in the past month.

I don't know from personal experience but from the research I have done it has been noted by a few people that suckers from spinosissima's are best dug and planted in the fall or winter. Even potting the sucker for the winter has been suggested.

SCG

    Bookmark   November 10, 2014 at 10:51AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thank you Rose!

Good to know,..Kakwa rose does look very nice!

    Bookmark   November 10, 2014 at 10:53PM
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