Grafting sask cherries to Evans cherries anybody do it

mattpfSeptember 5, 2013

I've got a Evans not a fan of the cherries IMO they are horrible even left on the tree for a long time. I don't know how much if at all the sask varieties will be but just wondering if any body has grafted the sask to the Evans.

Also apparently there is a sweet cherry that is cold hardy to zone 3 called black duke. It's a seedling of a mazzard cherry which is a common rootstock for sweet cherries.

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don555(3a)

The Sask cherries are definite bushes while the Evans can be a small tree, so I don't know if the grafts would work, but the result sure would look odd. Probably better if space was limited to get one Sask cherry and then graft some of the other Sask cherries to that. The Evans might be fun to try grafting sweet cherries to, maybe that one you mention, black duke.

    Bookmark   September 5, 2013 at 9:43PM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Looks like you're not a sour cherry lover,..all UOS cherries are sour cherries.

I got Juliette on Evans for the second season and has grown good. Think Evans vigorous root stock can be of some benefit for the slower Sask. cherries. I'll be definitely do more testing.

    Bookmark   September 5, 2013 at 11:42PM
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intotheark

do you mean a 'may duke' cherry when you say 'black duke'?

if you're not a fan of evans, you won't be impressed with uofs cherries,
they tend to be smaller and just as tart (or tarter) than evans

the tart cherries are excellent for processing/cooking,
and if you are going that route,
you can't beat evans for size, pitting, cherry flavor and production
for a hardy bush cherry i like 'lutowka',
a large deep purple cherry, with excellent flavor on a prolific producer
and they don't have any propagation restrictions,
so you can propagate an entire orchard

    Bookmark   September 6, 2013 at 12:18PM
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mattpf

I'm just a backyard hobbiest.

Black duke cherry is a seedling of a mazzard cherry both prunus avium The original sweet cherry. They are still better than most new sweet variety and are rate for zone 3b/4 . Mazzard is a very common or was a very common rootstock in Canada and real hardy. I don't know if I'd try them north of here but Konrad gets a few sweet cherries grafted and he's out in the country away from intercity climate ect... You guys trying the sweet cherries I'd give Mazard and black duke cherry a try. That's my project next year. If it doesn't work ill replace the Evans with a plum.

    Bookmark   September 7, 2013 at 1:45AM
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intotheark

thanks for the info
i could not find anything on the black duke,
but i did find some on may duke (which is a dark purple/black fruit),
and rated zone 4ish,
so i thought it might be that variety

    Bookmark   September 7, 2013 at 10:20AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Just remember, ..I know someone who doesn't like sweet cherries. He used to pick sour cherries in BC but now grows Evans himself an just thrilled with these cherries,..seems he can't get enough, he was worried this year and told me that it will be a year of less. I told him that he can pick at my place,..about 3 weeks later I found out that most of my trees failed to set fruit, think frost killed flower buds.

Me, I'm versatile and love both cherries

    Bookmark   September 8, 2013 at 1:09AM
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CLBlakey

I am a sweet cherry girl but so happy to have my evans. It is way better than having no cherries. This is my first fruit year with it and got about 1 1/2 cups of cherries.

Here is some info on the black duke it says it is a sweet cherry but has the acid of a tart.

Here is a link that might be useful: Black Duke Cherry

    Bookmark   September 8, 2013 at 3:55PM
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mattpf

http://www.greenbarnnursery.ca/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=623

Here is a discription of the mazzard cherry the black duke is a seedling of.

Black duke mazza cherries are the original native sweet cherry . For so e reason we bred the hardiness out of them trying to improve the taste but as these guys say the Maza cherries taste sweeter.

I'm going to order some from these guys I think and graft them next summer and hopefully get some neat cherries.
Don't get me wrong I'm not fussy I love the Evans tree it's so neat to get cherries this easily just trying to improve what I've got I guess. With limited space I'd much rather prefer a plum or apricot or better cherry. They probably make a great pie though I ate all mine fresh this year.

    Bookmark   September 8, 2013 at 5:53PM
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don555(3a)

It will be interesting to follow this thread and see how the Duke cherries turn out. I can't find out much information on them apart from the nursery selling them, but I'm stuck on the line about them being sweet cherries but with tartness so they are good in pies too. Some of the U of S cherries are sweeter (have more sugar) than commercial sweet cherries, but have high acidity so definitely fall into the sour cherry class because it is acidity that determines if it is a sweet or sour cherry, not the sugar level. So I'm wondering if Duke is a "real" sweet cherry, or if it is a sour cherry that they are trying to market as a hardy sweet cherry.

    Bookmark   September 9, 2013 at 12:28AM
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don555(3a)

As for the U of S cherries, what are people's thoughts about taste, productivity, etc.? Or are they still too new for backyard growers to have had much experience with? Surely people must have mature Carmine Jewel bushes, since this variety was released about 1996, a decade ahead of the others?

As for my experience, I planted 4 different U of S cherries in May 2011, all dark-coloured varieties because I like the look of a nice dark cherry. They all bloomed that first year but since they were newly planted I didn't expect any to set fruit, and they didn't. In 2012 they all bloomed again, with only the Cupid setting fruit (about half of which was lost to hail, leaving one cup or so of fruit). This year, 2013, they all bloomed again, but fruit set is still stubborn -- I only got one single cherry from the Cupid, and the Carmine Jewel set two cherries low down that the slugs destroyed as they ripened.

The plants themselves are about 5 feet tall now (photo of Romeo (left) and Juliet (right), and mature height is supposed to be 6-8', so I was really expecting a better fruit-set this year. I know it's only been a little over 2 years since I planted them, but I get impatient...

    Bookmark   September 9, 2013 at 1:56AM
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intotheark

that is strange you are having fruiting issues
i planted a new little cherry orchard last year,
and they all fruited this year (~ 40 pints off 17 plants that are 18" tall)

i have some cherries that are 7 year olds (evans, cupid, carmine jewel, romeo, juliet, valentine)

- evans - excellent if you have the climate, biggest fruit and good production
but the flesh is paler than the bush cherries
(i have a little protection for mine and keep it as a loose bush with 4 central leaders in case a cold winter does some damage, hopefully not all of them will die back)

- lutowka ((Prunus cerasus var. austera)
a variety brought over from Poland by Kris Puski in 1990
mine are 4 year olds and produced quite well,
of all the bush cherries this one is the best, big dark purple fruit with a nice cherry taste (the flesh is pigmented a nice healthy dark red)
they are hardy, no die back yet, and seem to have less aphid issues (so far)
i would have forgone some of the other varieties i planted,
and put these in their place had i known
(t&t seeds is carrying these, but they call them 'rose cherry')

- carmine jewel - original breeding work was done by Les Kerr in the 40's
good production with tasty dark red/purple fruit

- romeo - out of the romance series this is the best as far as flavor and production (juliet is a second)

    Bookmark   September 9, 2013 at 12:14PM
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don555(3a)

Intotheark, thanks for all that info. It is curious that my U of S cherries aren't fruiting yet if you are getting good production from 1.5' tall plants... I went out and measured today and my Romeo is 6' tall, the others are about 5'. Hopefully next year...

Lutowka sounds like something I would definitely be interested in. Space is an issue as I've just got a city backyard, but I'm looking for a spot...

I have a young Evans I planted in 2010 that gives a pint or two of berries. But I have also grown it in the past, as well as some other sour cherry like Meteor? before that. I'm not really keen on the Evans fruit, I find it watery and rather bland, but hey, a cherry is a cherry when you are in zone 3! My previous Evans did very well for a number of years, then a hard winter did it serious damage even in the city, so I removed it. But I caught the bug again in 2010 after a few years of no cherries.

    Bookmark   September 10, 2013 at 1:20AM
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intotheark

here is a pic of one of my lutowkas
i have it trained/pruned to about a 5'x5' footprint
so you don't need much room,
and it still gives a good amount of fruit

last year the Michigan sour cherry crop was decimated,
so they substituted lutowkas from Poland

"They're doing so with a slightly different fruit. Wright says the Lutowka tastes similiar to Michigan's Montmorency, but it's darker and has a different texture that doesn't break down as much in pies."

Here is a link that might be useful: Want cherries this summer? Thank Poland

    Bookmark   September 10, 2013 at 12:56PM
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goldenheights

I have Evans ,Cupid and juliette. For production it is hard to beat the evans. The bloom 1 week to 10 days later maybe avoiding frost. As for flavor I like cupid hands down. Much sweeter and richer flavor . My juliettes have not fruited yet ,they are still young. 2 years from seedlings.

    Bookmark   September 11, 2013 at 9:28AM
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goldenheights

I have Evans ,Cupid and juliette. For production it is hard to beat the evans. They bloom 1 week to 10 days later maybe avoiding frost or bloom when pollinators are more active. As for flavor I like cupid hands down. Much sweeter and richer flavor with better texture. My juliettes have not fruited yet ,they are still young. 2 years from seedlings.

    Bookmark   September 11, 2013 at 9:36AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thank you intotheark for letting us know on this Lutowka cherry.
I'd be interested to test it for myself. As the Evans, [my bench mark standard]..can you please tell us the size difference, do you have picture side by side? Also production overall in %.
As you and me said, Evans cant be beat in it's vigor and production, another nice darker flesh cherry, reliable, is nice to have around.

Got this from a friend, ..after all, this cherry didn't originate out of Poland, ..link translated from Polish....

It is very old of unknown origin, possibly French or Dutch

Here is a link that might be useful: Åutówka

    Bookmark   September 12, 2013 at 11:29PM
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intotheark

thanks for the link Konrad

unfortunately i did not take any photos of the lutowka fruit, but i will check the bushes for any missed fruit
the fruit is slightly smaller than evans, but only slightly
this 4rth year was decent production,
but still superior to most of my older uofs bush cherries
and i anticipate an increase of flowers and fruit next season
but a percentage would be a guess of about 75% of an evans

    Bookmark   September 14, 2013 at 10:16AM
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intotheark

after searching i found 2 Lutowka cherries that were missed during harvest
they were smaller than average,
but you get the idea

    Bookmark   September 18, 2013 at 3:56PM
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mattpf

Are they sweet like bc cherries ?

    Bookmark   September 18, 2013 at 4:08PM
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intotheark

they are still a tart/sour cherry

but i find they have the best eating & cooking flavor of any cherry i can grow

the nankings are the sweetest cherry,
but they are a small fruit
i'd go with black nanking for the size and sweetness,
they do finish with a little bit of plum punch though (if allowed to fully ripen this diminishes)
even the regular sandcherry is quite sweet if allowed to ripen,
i have not harvested these yet, the black nankings were harvested about a month ago

    Bookmark   September 19, 2013 at 11:06AM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Thanks for this picture intotheark,..nice and dark flesh!
I'll look for some Evans, when left on for a long time they get pretty dark and allot sweeter, the one's I grafted to pin cherries, [a little smaller] get pretty meaty and darker.

Picture from Aug. 19 last year, [early picking].
Both Evans, on the right a little darker, grafted to pin cherry root stock.

I took a couple of branches of the Evans on pin to the show last weekend, [very left in picture] nobody figured it was Evans amongst some growers.

    Bookmark   September 20, 2013 at 11:00PM
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Konrad___far_north(3..just outside of Edmonton)

Matt,
see if you can let them on for a long time, perhaps use netting or fleece,..they get pretty sweet.
Birds just found the rest of the grafted one's,..still have some others which I haven't picked.

Only found one of the grafted Evans.

    Bookmark   September 23, 2013 at 1:43AM
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