Newsweek - Obama can outsmart all

jmc01February 14, 2012

"The right calls him a socialist, the left says he sucks up to Wall Street, and independents think he's a wimp. Andrew Sullivan on how the president may just end up outsmarting them all. "

Newsweek, jan 16, 2012 by Andrew Sullivan

Very good article!

Here is a link that might be useful: A Sullivan and Newsweek

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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Thank you, jmco1, for that link. One of the best summaries of Obama's accomplishments I've read. And written by a conservative! But those first couple pages are going to be tough going for readers like mrsk who has spent the last couple years predicting just the opposite.

Kate

    Bookmark   February 14, 2012 at 10:36PM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

It's all moot.

It doesn't matter who wins. The USA has become ungovernable. The people are too divided, the politicians are too corrupt, the religious leaders are too immoral and the businessmen are shipping off to foreign shores.

Leadership from any quarter will be dysfunctional at best.

    Bookmark   February 14, 2012 at 10:44PM
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labrea_gw

Sounds about right HAM!

    Bookmark   February 14, 2012 at 11:53PM
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heri_cles

It could not matter more at this time in our history.

Would it have mattered if we did not invade and occupy Iraq as Obama recommended?
Would it have mattered if Obama did not stimulate the economy, save the auto industry and prevent a Depression?
Would it have mattered if the gadhafis were still in power after massacring thousands?
Would it have mattered if Obama did not order the raid to get OBL and then order extra back up choppers ?
Would it have mattered to the Gulf States if Obama did not require BP to pony up 25 Billion to helo clean-up and businesses along the Gulf after their big oil spill/
Woul it have mattered if a republican appointed 2 more Scalia types instead of two moderate female justices?
You gdamn right it matters.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:18AM
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marquest(z5 PA)

Thank you, jmco1. I got this impression a year ago. The way President Obama works the Right. It is amazing how he does it with ease and calm. No Drama. At first I thought he was lucky then I realized, "darn he is smart". It is like playing chest. lol

I do feel he will get that second term because there are more thinking people that read current events. They do not listen to Faux News to tell them what to think, I know several people that watch Fake News for laugh of the day. It is like watching and knowing the joke. Their reporters look so serious and you know they know they have people fooled and enjoy fooling those easy people. lol

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:34AM
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dockside_gw

I just saw a clip of Sean Hannity before a group of about 20 to 30 MEN, asking them if the rule re contraception was a war on religion!! Yeah, FAUX News, you really know how to approach the news. Asking men, many of them Catholic priests, about an issue of women's health, without giving any woman an opportunity to put in her 2 cents. Not that FOX would allow any woman to be present who disagreed with these men.
I just hope that FOX and its viewers are jolted awake when they realize that they do not represent the thinking majority in this country.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:52AM
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lily316(z5PA)

I too hope Faux News and the T-partiers wake up and see the country doesn't see things in the narrow minded way they do. Sorry, but I can't watch Faux for a laugh, because it gets my BP up. Same with Rush and Beck. It's been years since I heard a word out of their stupid mouths. When I hear their theme songs, I switch to PBS. I will turn them on the day after election day in November. That's the last time I heard them..in 2008 crying in their beer.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 2:59AM
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jmc01

I hope others check out the attached article because Sullivan steps back to look at the big picture. He comments on both the left and right. It's not an article that has a singular focus.

Apparently, this article has caused a bit of controversy .

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 3:50AM
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Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

Sounds about right HAM!

And since nothing posted here really matters....*wink*

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 7:26AM
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grapeleaves

There was a republican response to it from David Frum

Not going to post the link. I'm sure one of the right wingers on the board will take great delight in posting it.

I saw that clip from Fox on The Daily show about the "war on religions" and it made me want to puke.
I try to listen to Fox from time to time and just can't leave it on long .It all seems to be a big game with those bad actors. Can't really even call them commentators. They're laughing all the way to the bank while conning their watchers.

Hannity strikes me as really dumb. Does anyone else have that reaction ?

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 7:57AM
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maggie2094

I thought we had a thread about this already...Heri posted the article?

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 9:36AM
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maggie2094

...oh and Ham...I think your analisis simply reflects that you spend time on Hot Topics, not in our country.

I work with people of all stripes on our civic including extremely hard right people and we come together to work on many issues that affect our community. The biggest issue right now is the privtiation of our sewer treatment plants and the potential taking of fracking water from upstate. One drop of this water gets into our bays we can kiss them goodbye.

The idea that life is red or blue or that people living their everday lives are so divided is redic.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 9:40AM
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maggie2094

link to previous thread...

Here is a link that might be useful: link

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 9:46AM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

That's all right. Not everyone reads every thread, so this time around it is probably catching some readers missed the first time around.

Besides, the article is good enough that it deserves to be read at least twice, doesn't it? I think so.

Kate

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 9:56AM
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maggie2094

Of course! I didn't mean it as a scolding, not one bit but thought some might like to see previous thread.

Def worth a re-read.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 9:59AM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

...oh and Ham...I think your analisis simply reflects that you spend time on Hot Topics, not in our country.

Quite possibly.

But if that's the case, why ARE the people on Hot Topics (and other places) talking so much about an obstructionist congress which makes it impossible for the government to move forward? Or the possibility that there is enough of a divide to move women's rights or gay rights backwards? Or how difficult it is for workers to find jobs with all the jobs moving offshore? Or the Christian right leaders who wish to dictate morality while not being subject to it themselves?

By the admission of the people who are being governed themselves, the USA has moved into a position of being ungovernable. The leadership is corrupt and are too busy fighting for their share of the pie to worry about what is best for the country. The people are further apart than I have ever seen on how the country should be governed.

Money and power are more important than national wellbeing. I am honestly beginning to believe that many people would rather see the entire country go down in flames than to give in to the other side or give up that money and power.

THAT... is an ungovernable situation.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 10:10AM
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Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

Obama will be George Bush's fourth term.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 10:45AM
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grapeleaves

Ham, you need to know your place :):)

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 10:45AM
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maggie2094

thats fine...your perception is your reality.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 10:48AM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

Ham, you need to know your place

Yeah, I know. I know the comments from outsiders are generally not appreciated, but sometimes I feel that people viewing things from the outside can give a different angle to the people on the inside.

If it were just me, I would reconsider giving my two cents. But there are an awful lot of people outside the USA that are seeing the same thing I am so just maybe I'm not so far off.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 10:52AM
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Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

HG,

You speak the right things, but all is well and couldn't be better for those who choose to ignore the consequences of our corrupt, self-serving government, including the White House participants.

They pretend to be against big money and corporate governance, yet they stand by their man who appoints the very men who participated in bringing America down. They speak against the PAC, until their man accepts the PAC, then they become silent. They blame the last two years on the Republicans without asking what happened during the first two years of power.

Because we are a divided country, we are voices and votes without power. Their plan is working!

There isn't a presidential candidate or incumbent that deserves my vote and they will not get it. Yes, I'll go down with the ship, but I won't participate in bringing it down with a careless and reckless vote for the same type of government. And for those who vote for the lesser of two evils, what a cheap way to escape the obvious truth.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 11:14AM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

There isn't a presidential candidate or incumbent that deserves my vote and they will not get it.

I do know how you feel. In our last election, my party of choice did not have a strong leader. IMO, he was well qualified but he was not charismatic enough to win. I will not place a vote for the Conservative Party, which I view as simply a rebranded Reform Party, and I don't believe the NDP is able to govern although I did love Jack Layton, respected the man a lot.

So now we have two major political parties who are essentially leaderless and drifting, one with a strong leader that I will not vote for, and a couple smaller parties that I don't feel represent me.

What do I do, vote for the Marijuana Party? Or maybe the nudist guy who runs as an independent?

I think I would be in an even worse position if I were there, as there are essentially only two political parties to vote for. I think I might abstain from voting too.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 11:48AM
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maggie2094

I have to say I am loling. People sure do have a funny have of assuming intent and meaning and ignoring the rest if it suits them.

Good luck with that.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 11:56AM
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dockside_gw

brush, you said exactly what I have been thinking the past several years. I didn't vote for Obama because I knew he was a corporatist from his Telecom Immunity Act vote. It was confirmed when he appointed Summers, Geithner, et al.

So, I won't be voting for him again and probably not for my Senator and Rep. Whether I will write in someone is still being considered. I told a person from the DNCC, when she called asking for a donation, that, even with the Dems in control, the US was going down and I wouldn't contribute to them. Just because it would take a bit longer for the country to disintegrate than it would with the Republicans is no reason to support the Dems. They are all corrupt. And, unless we go to campaigns financed by the government only, which there is no hope of happening, IMO, we WILL self-destroy. That's not to say there will no longer be a United States of America. Only that the plutocrats will own everything and make the laws. We will only be serfs without a voice.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:20PM
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grapeleaves

Ham,I hope you know I was kidding. I absolutely don't feel that way.
I appreciate the input from the Canadian posters. Nothing like being on the outside to see things perhaps more clearly.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:22PM
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woodnymph2_gw

brush, "for those who vote for the lesser of the two evils...."

So what do you think we should do? Stay home and not vote at all? How would that benefit our nation?

dockside and ham, your posts were powerful and I hate to admit I fear you are both correct....

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:29PM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

Ham,I hope you know I was kidding. I absolutely don't feel that way.
I appreciate the input from the Canadian posters. Nothing like being on the outside to see things perhaps more clearly.

Oh, I know Chloe. Sorry, I may have worded things to look like I misunderstood when really it was just elaborating.

But I do understand why some posters might get upset at outside opinions that are critical. In truth, it's NOT my country and really I have no say on how things should be run in the USA. If your politicians made a law that everyone is required to walk on their hands, it is truly none of my concern and I know that I have no right to be critical.

One of the places I get into the most trouble for this is the issue of healthcare. I am a strong supporter of universal healthcare but I also understand that it is the right of Americans to determine which healthcare system is best for them and NOT a Canadian concern. But I have problems keeping my opinions to myself.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 12:49PM
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Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

nymph,

How would it benefit your nation?

Not voting is also a way to express your dissatisfaction with the status quo. Do you as you please, but don't try to convince me that your motive is to improve the US with your vote. It isn't working.

I'm not the only person here who believes that our votes are powerless.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 1:06PM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

I'm not the only person here who believes that our votes are powerless.

Brush,

Do you think a third (or more) party would help bring a voice back to the people?

Or do you think it would be just another arm of the current governing aristocracy? I've seen someone refer to it as the Republicrat Party.

Different party, same corporate masters.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 1:50PM
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marshallz10(z9-10 CA)

I come back again (as I do about every 4 years) about the need for another ballot option: NONE OF THE ABOVE, a phrase given equal prominance on the ballot. I also recommend a requirement that the winner do so with a majority, not a plurality, of votes cast. Even with a majority of the actual votes, these votes nearly always represent but a percentage of registered voters who have chosen not to vote. Then there are the significant number of eligible citizens who don't bother to registered or are blocked by reasons of criminal records or other legal factors.

    Bookmark   February 15, 2012 at 2:29PM
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sweeby

So what, exactly, would the result of a 'none of the above' win be?
That the status quo remain in place?
That we have no government at all?

    Bookmark   February 16, 2012 at 10:26AM
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