where to find a true Cornus kousa 'Satomi'

plantknitter(8)June 17, 2009

We have been looking for about 3 years and can not seem to find a Satomi with coral colored flowers.

What we see in nurseries are trees labeled 'Satomi' but the flowers are cream colored, fairly small and they just have a slight pink edge.

will these trees have darker flowers as they settle in and grow?

I hate to risk the money and find out they will never get coral flowers.

Where did all the ones we see in landscapes come from?

If anyone knows a nursery that still has any please let me know, thanks.

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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

This one is disease susceptible anyway. Try one of the other, newer ones like 'Hanros'. I'm seeing quite a few of these around now and it is quite vibrant in flower.

    Bookmark   June 17, 2009 at 7:51PM
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hostaguy(USDA 8)

West Seattle Nursery has: Cornus kousa 'Satomi'

    Bookmark   June 17, 2009 at 10:21PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

I have seen multiple specimens of this cultivar with leaf spot and twig blight problems. Since newer ones like 'Hanros' are more pink - and may be resistant - these are what should be tried.

Here is a link that might be useful: CORNUS KOUSA

    Bookmark   June 18, 2009 at 1:41PM
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gweirdo

'Satomi', as well as some of the other pink selections will vary in the intensity of color from year to year. Often, the color you will see is apple blossom pink to a bit more, though I think they tend to color up better when planted in full sun (as they ought to be planted). There is, as Ron has suggested, some tendency for 'Satomi' to be suseptible to spot anthracnose, though many people, myself included, have had no significant problems in this regard, & indeed some of the white colored selections appear to be equally suseptible or more so.
Wells nursery in Mount Vernon, WA has released a pink selection named 'Ruby Slippers', that the personnel there swear is a very healthy selection, & may be worth seeking out, especially if you take advantage of the reduced prices available during their "farm sales".

Here is a link that might be useful: Wells Nursery

    Bookmark   June 18, 2009 at 10:50PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

See comments on that one at page I linked to above.

    Bookmark   June 18, 2009 at 11:17PM
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plantknitter(8)

Thank you for the great links and suggestions for other ( so many!) cultivars. We may try to go see the ones at Wells.

I still have the question of whether the way they are blooming in the nursery is how they will continue to bloom.
Does anyone have any experience seeing these actually become pink in the landscape if they were white with only pick edges in their nursery containers.
thanks

    Bookmark   June 19, 2009 at 12:25PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Yes, 'Satomi' seen here are pink-bracted. As mentioned at the NOS page linked to above some genetic testing was done and it was found out that several "cultivars" on the market had the same DNA as ones being traded as 'Satomi'. Note also the comments at the above web pages about regional variations in bract color. Same could also occur with variations in conditions experienced by individual specimens. You might even find that if the stock you saw was still at the nursery and you looked at it later in the flowering cycle it would be much pinker then.

    Bookmark   June 19, 2009 at 12:37PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

'Hanros' (Radiant Rose TM) was selected by Gary Handy of Handy Nursery, Boring, Oregon, from a seedling batch of pink-bracted seedlings. Compared to 'Miss Satomi', 'Hanros' shows deeper green foliage, dark maroon-red fall color, and in the Pacific Northwest better red bract color. Handy (pers. comm.) also reports this selection to retain better quality foliage in the summer

--Cappiello/Shadow, Dogwoods (Timber Press, Portland)

This is a trademarked Handy Nursery selection and is being grown by a number of wholesale nurseries who find it more appealing and a better overall grower than 'Satomi'

Here is a link that might be useful: Hanros TM Chinese Dogwood

    Bookmark   June 19, 2009 at 4:20PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Wight's in Lynnwood has multiple 'Miss Satomi' in bloom. Bracts vary from all pink to all white on the same specimen, with white dominating. Maybe during another year this stock would be mostly pink. Or maybe it is a different clone from the more pink form I am used to. Someone with past experience in the industry, who posts on the UBC Botanical Garden forums once related that in the early days a 'Satomi White', 'Satomi Pink' and 'Satomi Red' were brought in from Japan.

    Bookmark   June 20, 2009 at 12:34AM
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muddydogs

So Satomi isn't an exact cultivar. Is it grown from seed?

    Bookmark   June 20, 2009 at 11:44PM
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gweirdo

Originally, it was a cultivar selected by Japanese nurseryman Akiri Shibamichi, apparently named for his daughter (or granddaughter). Over the years much confusion has arisen over the exact identity of many of these pink-bracted C. kousas, as more & more named selections appear in the marketplace. Some DNA analysis already conducted suggests that several such named clones may in fact be the same or closely related, though I'm not sure the analysis included source testing material from the originating nurseries in every instance.

It should be noted, too, Cappiello mentions that in some cases, the degree of coloration is related to drought stress - "some other supposedly pink-bracted forms can be kept white as long as the irrigation system doesn't clog."

    Bookmark   June 21, 2009 at 9:46AM
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botann(z8 SEof Seattle)

here's my 'Satomi' last year.

And here it is this year.

Note the Anthracnose and lack of pink. Same plant, no changes in the immediate area from last year. No supplemental water ever. Could the lack of water cause the pale color this year? It is in the shade of a large Snakebark Maple.

    Bookmark   June 23, 2009 at 9:47AM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

I've noticed other established 'Satomi' (my identification) in nearby plantings blooming white with pink edges. So, I think it is something about the weather this year.

Plants I take to be 'Hanros' are pink this year.

Dogwoods says 'Beni Fuji' is one of the best for color.

    Bookmark   June 23, 2009 at 2:55PM
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