Looking for suggestions on a smaller climbing plant

faeglenn(8)September 14, 2012

I have a small (4ft tall by 3ft wide) metal arch trellis that I just cleared off and I'm hoping to put something in the ground to cover it that won't entirely pull it down (it's metal, but could easily be pulled down by something too heavy). There is already a small rose plant nearby and I have a lot of experience maintaining rose gardens, so I was thinking something like a Zephirine Drouhin or other climbing rose would be nice, as the trellis is just against a low fence and gets full sun a majority of the day, but I wasn't sure if the thinner metal would be enough to support it, or what varieties would be best in a North Seattle suburban climate. I've tried growing jasmine here before and, man, did that not work. Would I be better off getting as hardy a Bougainvillea I can find, or is there something comparable? I swear I know how to garden, I've just never had to put in a climbing plant and I don't want to choose something ridiculously ill-equipped. Any tips on establishing would be great, too! Thanks!

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gardengal48

That is a very small trellis, so you need to look for an equally small vine. Zepherine Drouhin will easily engulf it in no time, as will pretty much any other climbing rose I can think of. No bougainvillea will be hardy in this climate plus they all also grow huge. Even hardy jasmine (and there are several species that are fully hardy here) will rapidly exceed that support.

I'd look for one of the semi-climbing clematis. These are usually integrifolia hybrids that sprawl rather than climb - 'Harlow Carr', 'Rooguchi' and 'Arabella' are all possibilities. You could also hunt down some of the Evison
"patio" clematis - these are all very compact and free-blooming, almost dwarf clematis....seldoming reaching more than 5-6'. Some annual vines could work also but you would beed to replant each year.

btw, north Seattle is zone 8 :-)

    Bookmark   September 14, 2012 at 4:25PM
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faeglenn(8)

I will look for those! I thought that most of the climbing plants I was thinking of would be too large, but I didn't think of the smaller clematis varieties (most of the ones I have dealt with have been huge and vicious climbers). I know clematis dies back pretty dramatically during winter; is there anything that would keep at least a small amount of green growth on it? Does something like the blue potato vine overwinter with some greenery here? Or is that way too much to hope for?

And yeah, another book that I looked at designated the area as zone 7, so I was unsure which to go with. Thanks for your help!

    Bookmark   September 14, 2012 at 7:18PM
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oliveoyl3

Euonymous fortunei or wintercreeper will climb and is evergreen. It's so slow growing you'll probably want to start with several of the gallon size plants if you want it filled in at the base then trained upward. It tolerates sun or shade & prefers average to moist soil rather than dry especially in the sun.

Here is a link that might be useful: wintercreeper

    Bookmark   September 15, 2012 at 12:40AM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Any part of Seattle will be USDA 8. The 0-10F for Zone 7 and the 10-20F for Zone 8 are the average low temperatures.

    Bookmark   September 15, 2012 at 12:34PM
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bejoy2(8)

Euonymus fortunei has some very vigorous cultivars that grow into sizeable shrubs, and might not be ideal for a small trellis. However, one cultivar, 'Emerald Gaiety' grows smaller, and has daintier leaves than say, 'Emerald and Gold'. 'Emerald Gaiety' does look better with some shade, so if you need something for full sun, 'Moonshadow', is a little larger than 'Emerald Gaiety', but still small, and it grows very slowly. Euonymus is a scrambler, not a vine. It will often start growing vertically when it hits an obstacle, but it may need to be tied to a trellis to guide it and keep it from falling down. And some of the euonymus cultivars tend to revert, so any branches that are completely green with no variegation should be removed at the junction of the stem it grew out of.

Another evergreen plant for a small trellis is English ivy (Hedera helix) and Canary Island/Algerian/Madeira ivy (H. canariensis). There are several nice cultivars that have better manners than some of the thugs in the family. H. h. 'Needlepoint', H, h. 'Green Ripple', H. h. 'Boskoop' H. h. 'Ivalace' (2011 American Ivy Society Ivy of the Year) are very pretty green cultivars, but there are some cultivars with nice variegation. 'H. h. 'Gold Child', H. h. 'Kolibri', H. c. 'Golden Kolibri', H. h. 'Mint Kolibri (aka 'Minty'), H.c. 'Canary Cream', H.c. 'Variegata', H.h. 'Midas Touch', H. h. 'Glacier', H. h. 'Gold Heart', H. h. 'Gold Ripple', to name a few. Ivy can often be a dual-interest plant, as some of them have juvenile and mature leaves. Usually, the juvenile leaves are the ones that have the typical 'ivy' leaf, and the mature leaves are not lobed. Some of the cultivars are taken from sports on mature branches, so the leaves will never change shape. But if you buy an ivy, and the leaf shape changes, have no fear - it's not diseased or suffering from a nutrient deficiency. You can either remove the leaves and they might be replaced with juvenile leaves, or cut off the entire branch. I've attached a link to the American Ivy Society's website.

Here is a link that might be useful: American Ivy Society

    Bookmark   September 23, 2012 at 4:12PM
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bejoy2(8)

oops, I got some c's and h's mixed up. But you should still be able to Google the cultivar using the Species name, 'Hedera' and the cultivar name alone.

    Bookmark   September 23, 2012 at 4:15PM
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gardengal48

I would avoid planting any cultivar of English ivy in the ground. Any of the so-called "fancy leaved" cultivars can revert....and often do once planted in the ground. I am not sure there is any justifiable reason for planting English ivy of any variety in the ground in an area where this plant poses such an ecological threat. English ivy is also not a good climber for a trellis. Since it adheres to surfaces by hold-fasts or suctioned rootlets, it needs a reasonably sized, flat surface to which to adhere.

There is an evergreen clematis available here that doesn't grow to vast sizes :-) Look for one of the cartmanii hybrids.....often sold under the cultivar names of 'Avalanche', 'Early Sensation', 'Joe'. Delicate and rather lacy looking foliage on a vine that usually gets only around 10' (less for some selections). Produces an "avalanche" of starry white flowers in early spring.

    Bookmark   September 23, 2012 at 5:43PM
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bejoy2(8)

English ivy climbs just as as well as Euonymus, and as I said, many (if not most) of the new cultivars are very well-behaved. The prejudice against English ivy is probably based on the aggressive cultivars that invade woods, but in Washington State, only 3 cultivars of English ivy (Hedera helix 'Baltica', Hedera helix 'Pittsburgh', Hedera helix 'Star') and 1 cultivar of Atlantic or Irish ivy (Hedera hibernica 'Hibernica') is on the list of invasive plants, AND they are only Class C. The SPECIES Hedera helix isn't even on the list. This is the same kind of hysteria that surrounds discussions of planting butterfly bush (Buddleia davidii) cultivars, when it is only the SPECIES butterfly bush that is considered invasive - it's a Class B weed, but being considered for downgrade to Class C. There are all sorts of plants used in the home landscape that are capable of becoming invasive - periwinkle (Vinca minor), sweet woodruff (galium odoratum), Bishop's weed (Aegopodium podagraria), even strawberry (Fragraria sp). But they don't evoke the rabid reaction that English ivy does - I think, mainly because they don't climb trees. One plant that does climb trees and can completely cover a 60-foot Douglas-fir is wisteria (both Wisteria sinensis and W. floribunda), and you won't convince people to stop planting it! So, as in ANY planting you undertake in the home landscape, use good judgement, and keep up on the maintenance.

Here is a link that might be useful: WA INvasive Species - Hedera helix

    Bookmark   September 23, 2012 at 8:42PM
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bejoy2(8)

English ivy climbs just as as well as Euonymus, and as I said, many (if not most) of the new cultivars are very well-behaved. The prejudice against English ivy is probably based on the aggressive cultivars that invade woods, but in Washington State, only 3 cultivars of English ivy (Hedera helix 'Baltica', Hedera helix 'Pittsburgh', Hedera helix 'Star') and 1 cultivar of Atlantic or Irish ivy (Hedera hibernica 'Hibernica') is on the list of invasive plants, AND they are only Class C. The SPECIES Hedera helix isn't even on the list. This is the same kind of hysteria that surrounds discussions of planting butterfly bush (Buddleia davidii) cultivars, when it is only the SPECIES butterfly bush that is considered invasive - it's a Class B weed, but being considered for downgrade to Class C. There are all sorts of plants used in the home landscape that are capable of becoming invasive - periwinkle (Vinca minor), sweet woodruff (galium odoratum), Bishop's weed (Aegopodium podagraria), even strawberry (Fragraria sp). But they don't evoke the rabid reaction that English ivy does - I think, mainly because they don't climb trees. One plant that does climb trees and can completely cover a 60-foot Douglas-fir is wisteria (both Wisteria sinensis and W. floribunda), and you won't convince people to stop planting it! So, as in ANY planting you undertake in the home landscape, use good judgement, and keep up on the maintenance.

Here is a link that might be useful: WA INvasive Species - Hedera helix

    Bookmark   September 23, 2012 at 8:47PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

I've had one of the Buddleja davidii hybrids seed into a parking area.

Ivy is considered the biggest weed problem in Seattle. All you have to do is drive past some of the hillside green belts around town and see how everything except the branch tips of trees becomes covered.

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 1:12AM
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bejoy2(8)

This is what I was saying about the hysteria over English ivy. I would bet money that those ivy vines climbing the trees in the woods are one of the only four cultivars considered invasive in Washington State. One of the largest offenders in planting English ivy, by the way, is the State of Washington. In Olympia and Tumwater, it's planted along the freeway. At the University of Washington, back when Ciscoe Morris was on the Grounds Maintenance Crew, he was battling English Ivy deliberately planted to grow up the buildings (that's where the phrase 'ivy league college' came from, by the way).

And yes, some cultivars of butterfly bush will self-sow, but as far as I know, most are not anywhere as prolific as the species - which I will repeat for those who weren't paying attention the first time I said it, is the only one considered invasive in Washington State. Some of the first cultivars to be bred do have the potential to self-sow heavily, but probably not as heavily as the species, which can produce 40,000 or more seeds per flower spike. So if you only have a few popping up in your parking strip every now and then, I wouldn't classify that as invasive. My Mom has had a Black Knight butterfly bush for nearly ten years, and in that time, she can count on the fingers of one hand the number of seeds that grew. The newer cultivars are likely to be sterile, or nearly so, owing to the fact that they are inter-specific hybrids. Here are a couple of links with information about the sterile hybrids of butterfly bush (Buddleia or Buddleja are both correct):
http://www.oregon.gov/ODA/PLANT/NURSERY/pages/buddleja_process.aspx
http://oregoninvasivespecies.blogspot.com/2011/03/sterile-butterfly-bush-coming-this.html

There are plenty of other plants that self-sow, like poppies, centaurea, rose campion, Johnny jump-ups, violas, violets, alyssum, black-eyed Susan, shasta daisies, columbine, asters, geraniums, cosmos, calendula, forget-me-nots, snapdragon, sweet pea, garden phlox, Jupiter's beard, lady's mantle, borage, chives, chamomile, fennel, parsley, dill, caraway, hyssop, cardinal flower, moss rose, etc., etc., etc.. You don't see anyone getting apoplectic about them!

AS I said, use good judgement when you select your plants, and keep up with the maintenance - and even though I know these posts about butterfly bush have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with your original post, if you do happen to have a butterfly bush in your garden, just deadhead the spent blooms, for God's sake.

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 3:32AM
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PRO
George Three LLC

back on topic...

Billardiera longiflora. I have mine in a decently hot spot, it has stuck to my 3 foot trellis for 3 years. no pruning, just some hand redirection of tendrils. evergreen.

Here is a link that might be useful: apple berry

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 11:23AM
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bejoy2(8)

eeldip, you hit a homerun with that post! Appleberry, or climbing blueberry - I've never seen such a thing! Marvelous! Wherever did you get it, and can I get one, too? I have a wholesale license and business permit, but I'll pay retail.

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 3:01PM
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botann(z8 SEof Seattle)

What is the point of a trellis that small? Wouldn't it just clutter up the landscape design?
Mike

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 3:12PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

I didn't suggest the Billardiera because it's on the edge of its hardiness in USDA 8.

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 4:36PM
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bejoy2(8)

I was looking on the internet for small evergreen vines, and found Lanceleaf Greenbrier (Smilax smallii). It has male and female plants, and the female plants have red berries that turn black, but I can't find a photo of the flowers. It's a native American vine, and is hardy in zones 7 through 9. I was thinking it would make a good companion for a deciduous clematis, and that would expand your choices for flowering plants while still leaving an evergreen plant over the winter. I have several sweet little clematis that I call 'Mailbox' clematis because they don't have the gargantuan flowers that some of the more bodacious clultivars have. They have sweet little, simple clematis flowers. Arabella and Hagley Hybrid are two that I know I have, but I have lost the labels for the others. They are a little bare at the base, and they aren't substantial enough to cover a trellis by themselves, probably not even a small one, which is why I suggested the companion plant. Just a thought.

    Bookmark   September 24, 2012 at 8:48PM
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PRO
George Three LLC

my Billardiera survived the dec 2009 12 degree spell here in portland unprotected. should live long enough for normal human enjoyment.

    Bookmark   September 25, 2012 at 2:04AM
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bejoy2(8)

Because of the reaction to my posting about using ivy, I started looking for a reference I could cite to put peoples' minds at ease. According to the American Ivy Society, the ivy that is so invasive on the west coast is Hedera hibernica, not Hedera helix. However, as I said, in the State of Washington, there are three cultivars of Hedera helix that are considered invasive, so of course you should avoid planting them as well. I've included a link to the AES Journal with an article that discusses the issue. The article is on the publication's page 5 - link below.

Here is a link that might be useful: Hedera helix

    Bookmark   September 25, 2012 at 5:29AM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

If similarities to the weather of the 1950s continue to occur we may see a brutal winter here sometime soon.

A.L. Jacobson made a very thorough survey of plants both native and exotic growing wild in Seattle and put out a guide to them. All species found are accounted for and presented in The Annotated Checklist near the back of the book, with the local occurrence of each being given one of 8 different terms indicating its nature.

Here is a link that might be useful: Wild Plants of Greater Seattle

    Bookmark   September 25, 2012 at 1:53PM
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gardengal48

There is a big difference between an aggressively spreading or thuggish garden plant and a true invasive. Aegopodium or fragaria may be considered by some to be troublesome in their spread but they are not considered as invasives under the accepted horticultural definition of that term. Ditto with self-sowing annuals or perennials, although a number of them are getting very close to being included as noxious weeds

If one reviews the entry for English ivy under the King County Noxious Weed listing it clearly lists 4 cultivars that it considers to be the 'most' invasive, not the only invasive cultivars. And there has always been a lot of taxonomic confusion anyway regarding the various cultivars and since all forms or English ivy are known for their tendency to revert to species, it is better to be safe than sorry. As the species entry states: The King County Noxious Weed Board strongly encourages control of English Ivy where possible and containment of spread if control is not feasible. Also, planting English Ivy is discouraged and it is recommended that non-invasive alternatives be used to reduce further negative impacts of this plant in King County. The same suggestion is provided for Buddleia davidii

This issue has travelled far beyond just a personal opinion and is a matter of good horticultural stewardship. Suggesting plants that are included on any of the three noxious weed listings is just not a responsible thing to do. Not when there are dozens of other less problematic plants that will accomplish the same function.

ps. the term "ivy league college" has nothing to do with English ivy or any plant for that matter - it originated as a sports conference-related term and the ivy that festoons college buildings all over the country is really Boston ivy (or sometimes Virginia creeper) and is a Parthenocissus species not a Hedera or English ivy. Different plant, different characteristics, different issues.

pps. Ciscoe Morris was head groundskeeper at Seattle University, not the UofW.

    Bookmark   September 25, 2012 at 5:07PM
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bejoy2(8)

gardengal48, while I respect your opinion, it is only an opinion, and is at odds with those expressed by several nurseries where I regularly shop. In addition, while I was getting my horticulture degree, I spent a lot of time researching the subject of invasive plants. As part of research for a class, I studied a book by a local author (I don't recall the Author's name or the title of the book, but if I do, I will post it in a new thread). The book was a groundbreaking treatise on predicting the invasive potential of a plant. I've attached a link to an Invasive Species Protocol that mirrors that author's work. I did not make my posting frivolously, and gave my considered, professional opinion on a subject. At any rate, neither your opinion nor mine is the one that matters - the person who made the original posting is the only one whose opinon counts - at least until the plant police come looking for her. And thank you for the clarification on Cisco Morris. By the way, do you happen to know what cultivar of ivy they planted on the buildings? My quip about ivy league colleges was anecdotal and not meant to be taken seriously, but I suppose I should have done my research before posting it, because I certainly should know by now that there are a plethora of self-appointed experts trolling GardenWeb who consider it their purpose in life to put you in your place if you so much as misspell Artemisia.

Here is a link that might be useful: Invasive Species Protocol

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 1:44AM
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bejoy2(8)

ps. The original poster might not even live in King County.

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 1:51AM
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bejoy2(8)

pps. The original poster might not even live in Washington. In Oregon, all cultivars of butterfly bush are striclty regulated. Not sure about English ivy.

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 1:53AM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Self-appointed, or...

...experienced and informed?

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 2:36AM
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gardengal48

Last time I checked, North Seattle was still in King County.

English ivy is even more highly regulated in OR than it is here.

And whatever you may think bejoy2, a plant's invasive status is not a matter of opinion - it either is or isn't according to the authorities that make that determination for that specific area. And anecdotal experience regarding a plant's propensity towards invasiveness is really irrelevant. Whether or not one sees seedlings of the plant in question in their own garden does nothing to discount the ability of wind and wildlife to disperse the seeds over a large distance. And into natural areas.

As to any nurseries that may support your viewpoint, I'd be quite surprised if that was actually the case. The WSNLA (of which most retail nurseries are members) together with the Washington State Noxious Weed Control Board and several other similar agencies have created a cooperative that encourages self-monitoring/limitation of the sale of invasive species as well as creating published lists of non-invasive plants as suggested replacements for these problem plants. Most retail nurseries (and wholesale growers as well) in the area exercise a great deal of responsibility in the choice of plants they choose to grow and sell. The vast majority are very proactive in restricting the sale of any listed invasive species.

I too have done a lot of research on invasive species and actually conduct seminars on the subject for various gardening groups and local nurseries.

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 3:04PM
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bejoy2(8)

While I do agree with gardengal48 that a plant is invasive or it isn't, I disagree that the authorities make that determination, because the plant is what it is regardless of what anyone determines about it. What the authorties determine is whether or not it should be placed on their list. And not all people who have that authority are authorities on plants. In any bureacracy, people sometimes get appointed to jobs overseeing things they have absolutely no experience in or undertanding of. I'm not saying that is the case in King County, or anywhere else, any more - but I do know that has been the case with English ivy in the past, and is why Hedera helix gets the blame for what is mostly (according to the American Ivy Society) H. hederica's bad behavior. The practice by authorities without any plant knowledge who lump all ivies under one heading results in rather benign cultivars being unfairly maligned. As to whether or not nurseries support my views on planting butterfly and English ivy cultivars, decide for yourself. The next time you go to the nursery, look for butterfly bush and English ivy. If you find it there, that is all the validation I need. I know that several large nurseries in Thurston and Pierce Counties sell both, and I do recall seeing some English ivy cultivars at Molbak's in Woodinville, which I believe is in King County, but I don't typically look for butterfly bush, so I can't speak to that. However, I know for a FACT that one of the largest wholesale nurseries in King County, T and L, sells both - and they supply Fred Meyer and many, many retail nurseries all over Puget Sound! But whatever, I'm done participating in the hijacking of this thread. You've certainly given me a good view of your perspective, and I do appreciate point of view, so let's just agree to disagree, get on with our lives, and get over it.

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 10:41PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Much of the weedy ivy in the Seattle arboretum is Baltic ivy. I have seen numerous examples of infestation by ivies other than Atlantic (Irish) ivy elsewhere. A former garden on Vashon Island had various "fancy" types spread out to carpet the ground beneath Douglas fir trees, leading the planter to conclude it wasn't a good idea to be planting any ivy anymore - not just the kinds that became listed.

Really all you have to do is look around in developed areas here, that have been occupied and gardened for some time to see what ivy is all about, whether it comes from a flower shop or a wholesale nursery.

Likewise there is little reason to think that because a butterfly bush is a named form it is harmless. I am wary of all versions containing a significant component of Buddleja davidii, whether they are pure forms or hybrids.

    Bookmark   September 26, 2012 at 11:15PM
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PRO
George Three LLC

i think from a design perspective ivy fails as well. if you live in the NW long enough to see ivy choked parks and vacant lots, you just don't react positively to it.

lots of people don't see "evergreen climber". they see "problem that needs to be removed".

    Bookmark   September 27, 2012 at 3:37PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Pigeons and rodents enjoy it.

Next let's talk about cotoneasters.

    Bookmark   September 27, 2012 at 5:07PM
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gardengal48

Going to call you out on another point bejoy2. The only ivy varieties that T&L grows and sells are a few (5 to be precise) fancy leaf/variegated cultivars (and also Algerian ivy). And fancy leaf or variegated forms are sold and carried by a bunch of other nurseries as well, most with the intention that they are used for container plantings. These types do grow much less rampantly than the straight species and the larger leaf green cultivars and are of somewhat less concern as a result. But they DO revert and rather easily at that so they still remain somewhat problematic. The problem with using ivy for any groundcover or climbing plant purpose is that there is a pressing ongoing need for monitoring and maintenance which is far too often ignored or overlooked. That's one of the reasons the problem is a severe as it is. Plus folks making ill-informed choices or following ill-adised suggestions.

btw, I was a sales rep for T&L and a perennials and groundcover buyer for 2 other local retail nurseries - I do have some relevant history in this area and can address the subject with a fair degree of authority.

    Bookmark   September 28, 2012 at 2:12PM
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bejoy2(8)

You people just won't let it go. Talk about beating a dead horse!

gardengal48, I mentioned that T&L Nursery was selling butterfly bush and English ivy cultivars because YOU said that you'd be 'surprised' if any responsible nusrery in King County sold them. So what if they only sell 5 cultivars of English ivy? YOU were the one that said no responsible nursery would sell ANY. YOU were the one that decided to use local nursery inventory as the litmus test for invasiveness and to prove your point. And since, as YOU said, nurseries in King County work in close partnership with the Weed Control Board, they wouldn't be selling them if they hadn't done their research. And that supports MY postition that there are responsible choices. Maybe you don't know as much as you think you know, or your information is out of date.

Times change, and new cultivars are introduced every day, and unless you have done the research on every single cultivar, you cannot speak with authority on their invasive potential. No responsible horticulturist would make a blanket statement like "English ivy is invasive". In the first place, 'English ivy' is an inaccurate, non-scientific term that lumps all Hedera species, varieties, forms, and cultivars together under one umbrella. Second, a plant's invasive potential is entirely relative, completely dependent upon many intertwined environmental factors as they affect a single plant. One plant may be invasive, but another plant of the same species may not be as invasive because it is not in the same environment. Horticulturists speak of a plant's 'invasive potential'. Bureaucrats make blanket statements that a plant is "invasive". I've had a 'Glacier Ice' cultivar of English ivy in my front flower bed for almost 10 years, and it has never grown more than a few feet in length, nor more than 1 foot around. My Mom, as I said above, has had a Black Knight butterfly bush for almost 20 years, and has had very few seeds grow.

I appreciate that you feel an obligation to inform people about this very real threat to our environment, and I applaud your passion. But your opinion is no better than mine. Just because I have a different opinion than yours doesn't make mine "irresponsible". I have made informed recommendations based upon my research on these plants, and that is the very DEFINITION of responsible. Anyone reading this post is free to make up their own mind and if THEY (not YOU) feel like my suggestions are "ill-advised", they can elect to ignore them. If you are worried about the invasive potential of a plant - ANY plant - don't plant it in your yard. But don't tell me what to plant in mine, and don't criticize me for my choices. If I want to be preached to or condemned for my sins, I will go to church.

    Bookmark   September 30, 2012 at 12:13AM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

English ivy customarily refers to Hedera helix and not any of the other species in the genus

    Bookmark   October 1, 2012 at 1:52PM
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lauramg8

Does hardy nasturtium overwinter in your area? I think its tropaeolum tuberosum or speciosum. Im not sure how big it gets. I bought seeds last year and had them soaking overnight on my deck-something ate all the seeds!

    Bookmark   October 4, 2012 at 7:26PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Both are grown as perennial climbers here.

    Bookmark   October 4, 2012 at 9:10PM
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plantknitter(8)

Tropaeolum tuberosum has been completely herbaceous for me, dying back to the tuber each year, then getting back up to a 7 to 8 foot tall arbor each year, blooming in late Oct to Nov.
T. speciosum has been more deciduous, but maintaining some viable height from which to resume growth the following year. Mine is two stories high growing up into an Irish yew, blooming throughout the summer.

    Bookmark   October 5, 2012 at 1:44AM
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Red Carpet Studios Hummingbird Feeder Spotted - Green - 41193
$18.99 | Hayneedle
Citrus - Satin Red Ovo Table Lamp with Color Finial
Lamps Plus
Anvil Iron Indoor/Outdoor Wall 1-Light
PLFixtures
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