Four Americans have been murdered by drones

momj47(7A)May 22, 2013

....since 2009

The Obama administration Wednesday for the first time acknowledged killing four U.S. citizens in âÂÂcounterterrorism operationsâ abroad.

The deaths of three of the Americans - Anwar al-Awlaki, his 16-year-old son Abd al-Rahman Anwar al-Awlaki, and Samir Khan, all of whom were killed in drone strikes in Yemen in 2011 - had been previously reported. The death of the fourth, Jude Kennan Mohammad, a Florida native apparently killed in Pakistan, had not been.

Here is a link that might be useful: Link

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demifloyd(8)

Next will be tea party members.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 5:15PM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

such good Americans they were too!

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 5:18PM
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momj47(7A)

So it's OK to kill "bad" Americans?

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 5:34PM
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pnbrown

These are unabashed executions without trial, without the ability to present or challenge evidence, without judgement by peers. It is entirely contrary to the founding principles.

Those of us who are "good" Americans must challenge such policy.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 6:03PM
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mrskjun(9)

But for the killers at Benghazi, we must gather more evidence and give them trials in federal court. Wow, pictures of them firing RPGs etc. The fact that the Libyan government has identified them isn't even enough to arrest them. But one can make a kill list that even includes American Citizens and zap them with no questions asked.

You are right demi, next is Tea Party members and after that FOX News reporters.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 8:01PM
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demifloyd(8)

You are right demi, next is Tea Party members and after that FOX News reporters.

*

Don't forget parents of FOX news reporters.

The Obama Administration has been reviewing old people's phone records and conversations.

This Administration is filthy from the top down.

The Benghazi Massacre and ensuing, intentional coverup, the IRS targeting political adversaries of Barack Obama, and the targeting of journalists for doing their job is proof.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 8:10PM
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mrskjun(9)

umm and you forgot Fast and Furious. You'd think he would take better care with the press. How else is he going to find out what is happening around him?

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 8:34PM
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jodik_gw

Not this again... the infamous "B" word... how many threads, now, mentioning Benghazi, as though this were the worst catastrophe EVER in the history of catastrophes, but mainly mentioned because Obama was President when it happened?

Did everyone actually read the article, or are we just throwing talking point darts and affronts toward the President in an attempt to sully his name further? After all, he is THAT President, you know...

Good grief.

I'm not always thrilled with what the current Administration is doing... however, I've known from the beginning that the President was slightly right of center in political idealism, was born an American citizen, is not a Socialist, nor a Muslim, and his ethnicity not only DOESN'T bother me, but more closely matches my own.

I'm very glad to know that Gitmo will be phasing out, but I'm very much against drones because it's not an accurate way to take a target. That, I do believe, would be much more efficiently done by a special team or by a sniper team.

And the unfortunate part of our world is, there will sometimes be enemies of the worst kind that think nothing of using children as shields, or of committing mass murder of innocents.

Actually, the article did mention that one of the Americans killed, "Mohammad was indicted in 2009 by a federal grand jury in North Carolina, where he had lived near Raleigh. The indictment said he was believed to have left the United States for Pakistan in 2008 to âÂÂengage in violent jihad.âÂÂ... so, there was some due process going on, there...

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 8:52PM
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esh_ga

Just to clarify, only one of those was "targeted".

In conducting U.S. counterterrorism operations against al-Qaida and its associated forces, the government has targeted and killed one American citizen, Anwar al-Awlaki, and is aware of the killing by U.S. drones of three others, Attorney General Eric Holder said in a letter to Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy.

Al-Awlaki, a radical Muslim cleric, was killed in a drone strike in September 2011 in Yemen. Holder said three other Americans were killed by drones in counterterrorism operations since 2009 but were not targeted.

And sounds like the fact that he was American didn't stop him from being radical. Perhaps he was American in name only ....

Here is a link that might be useful: source of course

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 9:30PM
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PRO
Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

This was known soon after it happened. I guess some loyalists must wait for Obama to admit to the extrajudicial killings.

I wonder if he sought his daughter's advice on the killings.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 9:34PM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

they were enemy combatants, whats hard to understand about that? Take up arms against your country and you lose any rights.

    Bookmark   May 22, 2013 at 10:06PM
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Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

Perhaps the UN investigation prompted the admission.

I can't believe that anybody visiting here didn't already know about the targeted killings and collateral killings. It's been discussed on several threads.

An article from Feb 2013 about UN investigation.

Here is a link that might be useful: UN Investigates Obama Drone War

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 7:09AM
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heri_cles

"According to the white paper, there are three criteria for the legally acceptable extrajudicial killing of a US citizen who is identified as a senior operational leader of al-Qaeda or an associated force.

Firstly, an "informed, high-level official" must conclude that a US citizen poses what it calls an imminent threat of violent attack against the US. Secondly, the government must conclude that capture is not feasible. And finally, the operation should be conducted under the applicable laws of war."

I'm good with that policy.
Now what about the shock and awe Bush invasion of Iraq, a country that did not pose an imminent threat of violent attack on the US?

Here is a link that might be useful: Drones? please....

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 7:33AM
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mrskjun(9)

James Rosen better watch out!!

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 7:40AM
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labrea_gw

The AUMF doesn't extend to Libya but could in a stretch since calling them terrorist attacks.!
Libya could be seen in the Durand vs Holland holland case!

A bottle thrown at an ambassador in Nicaragua in 1860 by a crowd (mob) brought fire from a US ship on the town' A US citizen claiming the loss of property brought a case against the Govt & lost. It gave the President a broad jurisdiction in the US of power without congressional approval.
It was followed later when Lincoln without Congress approval ordered the blockade.

So many had nothing to say on the AUMF post law as it stands & as it is used versus I think & they augghtta!
Pot shots & little else when drivel like this is put forward pressure your congress critters to rescind the AUMF otherwise it's all methane and no one hast the decency to open a window or light a match!

Here is a link that might be useful: 20 More Years

This post was edited by labrea on Thu, May 23, 13 at 8:19

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 7:44AM
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rob333

whoa, pnbrown and I totally agreed. Yes, he's right on. Drones are wrong wrong wrong. And for the reasons he's cited.

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 8:54AM
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labrea_gw

You have 2 published declarations of war by Al Qaeda by association this extends to their associates.
Again ignoring what the Congress authorized the President to do you have cart horse drone & side issue.

Here's an old CNN link cal it as it was then before he attained martyrdom status.

"Oh, America, if you transgress against us, we will transgress against you, and you keep killing our people, we will kill your people,"

He praised Hasan, who is accused of killing 13 people in a rampage at the largest U.S. Army post, and urged other Muslim troops to follow his example.
(flip floppers on hate speech no?)

For those who won't read the link he was serving his role as (what?) for (what/) with (what?) as fugitive from (what?)
Not artistic writing actual day to day operations with gross video after gross video that were beyond propaganda (for who?)

Here is a link that might be useful: Fugitive Warns

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 9:29AM
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david52_gw

And we all know that US Citizen Al-Awlaki's 16 year old son was guilty as well. Because a secret court with secret evidence and all that, and everybody trusts Obama to do the right thing, amirite?

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 10:57AM
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labrea_gw

I'll throw another case in for good measure not that any of you seem to check or respond to precedent.
Brandenburg vs Ohio (free speech does not permit you to advocate for or to incite violence)
This cretin was about nothing if it weren't about his inciting others to kill!
That's if he were just an ordinary citizen belonging to the Klan or one of those fellows but he was'nt one of those fellows now was he?

He had stopped that ages ago!

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 11:01AM
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labrea_gw

Abdulrahman's death is an open mystery for me without any information. There is the possibility of a good case for murder there!

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 12:13PM
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momj47(7A)

I wondered how long it would take for one of our beloved conservatives to bring up Benghazi - 3 hours - I think that may be a new record!! Congratulations, well done.

Of course, it completely misses the point, but that's no surprise.

Apples â Oranges
Drones â Benghazi
9/11 â Iraq

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 12:32PM
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labrea_gw

Apples are apples Drones are weapons & that pesky little authorization will be used till till till!

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 9:33PM
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pnbrown

" Take up arms against your country and you lose any rights."

Says you. These guys were executed because of their words, certainly Awlawki was. Sedition is supposed to be proved in a court of law. A drone is not a judge and jury, it's a kangaroo court.

This is a dangerous business. The unspoken subtext is that it's ok because the people being executed are middle-easterners. There aren't really part of us. Which might be true, but they should be taken and tried to see if it is true. They had OBL in hand and deliberately executed him also, without having to prove a single allegation.

Let's just come out and have the balls to say what is really going on: if a citizen of the US (or any citizen of any country) is of middle-eastern descent and openly supports militant Islam, and we think you can stir up trouble, we are going to kill you no questions asked. We will not observe international law because it does't get the job of killing you done.

My problem is when does this kind of authoritarianism apply to other types of dissent?

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 11:14PM
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labrea_gw

"Says you."
an what is the counter an example of "says I"

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 11:27PM
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pnbrown

He says these executed persons were bearing weapons. How do we know that?

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 8:19AM
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PRO
Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

He says these executed persons were bearing weapons. How do we know that?

Remember the firefight with Osama bin Laden?

"The concern was that Bin Laden would oppose any type of capture operation. Indeed he did. It was a firefight. He, therefore, was killed in that firefight."

When pressed on the nature of Bin Laden's resistance Carney said: "I think resistance does not require a firearm."

This post was edited by brushworks on Sat, May 25, 13 at 9:44

    Bookmark   May 25, 2013 at 9:41AM
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october17(5chgo)

What was their purpose exactly for being over there?

When it comes to terrorism, old rules don't apply. You have to fight dirty with dirty. I feel no mercy for any American over there spewing hatred and advocating murder of any and all from their own country.

Trial?? Don't even let them touch American soil ever again.

demi - and the Bush administration came out smelling like a rose in Iraq? In Afghanistan? Mission accomplished? Please. Bush refused to get bin laden and risk making the arab oil barron gods angry.

    Bookmark   May 27, 2013 at 8:14AM
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jerzeegirl(9)

If using drones could have prevented 9/11, would any of you be against the practice?

    Bookmark   May 27, 2013 at 9:52AM
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demifloyd(8)

demi - and the Bush administration came out smelling like a rose in Iraq? In Afghanistan? Mission accomplished? Please. Bush refused to get bin laden and risk making the arab oil barron gods angry.

*

We were discussing drones and the Obama administration.

    Bookmark   May 27, 2013 at 9:58AM
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october17(5chgo)

demi - ya got me to bite. I was responding to you calling the administration dirty from the top down.

I did respond to the topic too. I am all for the drone strikes. Keeps our pilots safe while getting the job done.

If we could have prevented 9/11 with drones, everyone would have approved. Who knows what was prevented with killing these terrorists. May have saved my life, or yours.

    Bookmark   May 28, 2013 at 7:45AM
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