posters who derail threads

youngquinn_gwMay 23, 2013

we are all familiar with the scenario. A topic is posted and opinions are being exchanged sometimes heatedly but manageable...then from out of left field a poster throws in an inflammatory , often carefully worded statement.

The thread then becomes about
"that post" rather than the original topic.

I can only conjecture about the motivation.

Yes, we all ar epersonally responsible for choosing to respond to thread derailing comments and I have OFTEN been guilty of responding myself.

In recent times I have found that this sort of behaviour leads to a less than satisfactory experience for myself on HT's.

Are we heading down the line of behaving like rival "gangs" in the High School arena?

The only way to stop this destructive behaviour is to refuse to respond to it.

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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

I'm refusing to respond!

Just scroll over the passive aggressives etc. and read those that might have something to say of interest.

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 9:53PM
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Elly_NJ(NJ z6)

Not just from left field. From right field too.

: )

Joking!!!!!

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 10:46PM
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pnbrown

I like substantive segues. The cat fighting is crap, I don't look at it much.

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 10:59PM
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marshallz10(z9-10 CA)

I'm skipping most threads these day. Just too tired to play games with trollish types.

    Bookmark   May 23, 2013 at 11:59PM
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jmc01

Don't forget the threads that get derailed when one posts their life story when it's irrelevant to the topic at hand.

This additional reason combined with what you've mentioned, yq, results in my skipping HT entirely.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 2:41AM
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tobr24u(z6 RI)

I try to maintain the highest of standards at all times but sometimes I fail and I beg your forgiveness...

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 6:05AM
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PRO
Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

Don't forget the threads that get derailed when one posts their life story when it's irrelevant to the topic at hand.

Sympathy reach.

Not to derail, but.....

I guess this isn't the right place to discuss Ford leaving Australia. :)

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 6:49AM
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labrea_gw

The bore wars of the expert opinions (usually without reference to anything other than I THINK & quite often not even an I think)

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 7:37AM
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momj47(7A)

Has anyone pointed out that this derailing is all President Obama's fault, because of the attack in Benghazi?

Here is a link that might be useful: Link

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 7:46AM
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esh_ga

The only way to stop this destructive behaviour is to refuse to respond to it.

But not everyone perceives it the same way (as derailing) so one person responds while others hold back and it goes on from there.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 7:51AM
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Pidge

You're right, ssh, but most posters know a derailment when they see one. I am all too often caught up in the derailment even though I know that I'm failling into the trap. I have removed my own posts when they seemed to stray too far from the OP. It's easy to lose focus when the (metaphorical) sound is turned up.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 8:46AM
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marshallz10(z9-10 CA)

In real life I have been accused of rambling off and on a subject under discussion. Stream-of-consciousness in a mind prone to flights of fancy, I guess. Some of it is ego driving to the forefront. Sometimes, just boredom seeking relief from a tedious discussion.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 9:16AM
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haydayhayday

It takes two to tango.

Wanta dance?

Hay

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 9:29AM
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mrskjun(9)

Can you do the Cajun Two Step?

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 9:52AM
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haydayhayday

"Can you do the Cajun Two Step?"

I've adapted a version of it that I'll be doing tonight at the Country Western dance.

Quick, quick slow, that's all. The Cajun version of polka or salsa. It's all the same.

Tonight, I hope all of you have as much fun as I do with your dances.

Hay

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 10:47AM
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jodik_gw

I simply scroll on by many responses, myself... though I will say that some of us only have personal experience to draw from when adding to some threads, and I find this an interesting part of many of them.

The segues into other areas, too, are often interesting... especially when a thread has seemingly died out of lack of interest... I find it sometimes refreshing to see some things revived from the depths.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 10:58AM
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woodnymph2_gw

Jodik, I agree with you in finding personal sharings add to the interest of these threads. Not all revelations from posters derail threads; sometimes the stories add depth and are on point.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 11:06AM
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momj47(7A)

That's what the preview and editing features are for. You can always stop yourself from posting. Sometimes it's just satisfying to write an angry rant and NOT POST IT. Gets it out of your system.

Carefully re-reading also allows you to tone down the rhetoric, if you are so inclined.

We all edit our emails, don't we? Both personal and business?

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 11:52AM
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october17(5chgo)

More than derailments, I think the personal attacks are awful. Now that I have been a target of them, I understand why the stuff keeps going on and on.

Disagreeing with someone is ok. Personal attacks, not ok. I understand there are people who just pop in to start up something. I only post when I have a real interest in the thread - maybe not the original topic, but my intent is never just to get someone's goat.

    Bookmark   May 24, 2013 at 12:05PM
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fouquieria(10b)

It's the greedy thug unions, err I mean Benghazi, yeah that's it IRS...whatever...isn't he a Kenyan?

-Ron-

    Bookmark   May 25, 2013 at 1:08PM
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patriciae_gw(07)

It does seem that some posters have favorite hobby horses that get interjected into what ever conversation is going on. While I could think that at least some of the time the deflection is purposeful I am inclined to think that most of the time the person is simply unable to stay on subject.

    Bookmark   May 25, 2013 at 2:16PM
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jodik_gw

I totally admit to being very opinionated, and I've never in my life been afraid to say what's on my mind, or take a stand for what's right and decent.

Certain things mean a lot to me, like honesty, integrity, ethics in business, and in personal dealings... and I can't deal with liars, thieves, rats, or cheats.

I think what bothers me the most are those who don't read using context as a guide, or feel that every post is directed right at them on a personal level, when the contents have nothing to do with anyone in particular, nor are posters addressed by their names... regardless, some seem to perceive offense or slights in every general response.

The very basis for this forum is to debate what are sometimes controversial issues, and it states right at the top of the page that this is usually more for the articulate person with strong opinions. So, we know right off the bat that some of the threads might a little hot to the touch.

If I were easily offended, I would never even read this forum, and I'd certainly not post in it. If I had a nickel for every time someone posted an underhanded remark, I'd be wealthy beyond belief... but since I can't deal with tattlers, I'd never be one.

Yes, Mom... the Preview option is a wonderful thing... one can write and rewrite, make all the changes necessary, and as many times as one wishes before actually submitting. It's a great way to correct spelling or grammatical errors, reword something for better definition, or insert words forgotten in the haste of typing out something before one forgets the thought or idea.

Again, if I had a nickel for every Preview, I'd be quite well off!

I think if everyone adhered too strictly to the issues up for discussion, this would be a very boring forum to read. Inserting one's unique writing style and personality, or adding personal anecdotes to stress a point makes it much more enjoyable to read and respond in.

I also think that every message board and forum has its ups an downs, its own set of unique characters, and among them I think you'll always find a troublemaker or two... I think this is just the nature of forums and message boards. And we can either ignore those characters we don't care to read responses from, or respond with an opposing opinion or facts that set misinformation straight.

Think what it would be like reading a forum in which everyone was of like mind, held the same opinions, and no one ever disagreed...

    Bookmark   May 25, 2013 at 2:29PM
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youngquinn_gw

Im not fussed if people give their life story (if it relevant to the issue.)
from Jodik"I think if everyone adhered too strictly to the issues up for discussion, this would be a very boring forum to read"

I dont see why this would be so, as there is always space to take a different discussion that ensues , to another thread.

I dont have a problem with opinions as long as they are well reasoned and clearly stated to be just that.

Its the trollish behaviour that I find bothersome...someone who will enter a thread with no intention of adding to a discussion....just wanting to cause chaos for their own amusement

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 12:06AM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

I enjoy the stories that are told, even if wandering from the topic happens. How people are not the same is interesting to me and I've learned so much.
What is very frustrating is when an honest discourse is taking place and someone & their accomlices will knowingly obstruct. (I'm not talking about disagreement)One has to wonder if the topic is threatening to those that don't agree with where the discussion is leaning, or what. It is very recognizable.

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 4:52AM
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Campanula UK Z8

oh dear - mea culpa.

can i be excused because of being both english and flighty?

In truth, I am afraid I have the attention span of a gnat and have usually forgotten the OP seconds after reading it.

Apols.

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 5:12AM
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pnbrown

Too much manja, Camp?

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 6:24AM
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Elly_NJ(NJ z6)

I don't find personal disclosures a distraction, because it humanizes a communication that is often if not almost always based on anonymity. One of he reasons verbal poison spews is because the writer is not dealing with the humanity of his/her target.

That said, there are people who derail threads because they seek the attention. They are narcissistic and egotistical and "need" even negative attention. That annoys me because it ends valuable communication between others. I try not to feed the troll.

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 7:15AM
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rob333

Ditto elly!

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 7:58AM
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youngquinn_gw

campanula you are not a troll!! its only the people who derail threads because they seek the attention , to knowingly obstruct because of their narcissism is the only issue I am on about here.
it gets old and it is manipulative.

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 8:08AM
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Campanula UK Z8

mmmmm, manja - a sort of hybridised ganja/marijuana. Must steal that term.

Cheers, YQ (although my family would disagree about my trollish qualities).

But yeah, I do know what you mean - when we get onto the who said, you said, we said and you didn't kinda thing, I whizz down the screen

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 10:24AM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

>when we get onto the who said, you said, we said and you didn't kinda thing, I whizz down the screenI usually do that in the bathroom. But it's true some comments can be pretty upsetting.

    Bookmark   May 29, 2013 at 11:26PM
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duluthinbloomz4

I never looked to HT largely for its entertainment value - unlike many public forums, there was/is some good information dispensed, some points of view I hadn't considered, links I wouldn't have run across.

I don't have a dog in this fight so am tiptoeing into uncharted territory, but now we get a few who seem to enjoy derailments on virtually any and all topics. The constant cutting and pasting of posters' entire remarks over and over to rebut - do some of you not understand the fine art of abstracting a salient point? The right fighting is really wearisome and scrolling on by will likely wear out my up and down navigation bar.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 12:02AM
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Pidge

yq, just take a look at the Rick Perry thread for an example of a thread that's been derailed into absurdity. What a yawn.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 7:52AM
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Elly_NJ(NJ z6)

I am derailing this thread right now: I just found out that Bill was banned and I'm very disturbed about it. Bill was a vital member of this forum for as long as I can remember. Why would you get him banned? Who did this?

He didn't derail threads.

His views were diametrically opposed to mine, and so I earned a lot about the people's thoughts behind opposing views.

Why would you do this? Am I going to get reported for this and get banned too?

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:02AM
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youngquinn_gw

"why would you do this"

as this is my thread is this question directed at me?

Let me state CATEGORICALLY that I had NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with bill being banned . I certainly did not report him.
I notiecd that he was missing but simply assumed that he was off tiling so if he is telling people that I had him banned I SUGGEST THAT HE STOP!!!!!

I do know that he returned under a new name and was outed by quite a few people when a pic he posted was found to link to his real name if you hovered the mouse over it.

Once again, nothing to do with me.

Bill and I had many arguments, but I am the sort of person who would rather argue it out !

but I do have to say , if you wanted to talk about this you should have started your own thread.
I will accept your apology , should you have the grace to offer it.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:09AM
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jerzeegirl(9)

It has been awhile since Bill got banned. I wrote to the powers that be to ask them to reinstate Bill but I didn't even get a response. He is a very valuable member of Gardenweb and it's very upsetting that he got banned (for what, I can't even imagine!). I didn't agree with him on many things, but that didn't mean we couldn't be friends.

I am still fuming about this, which is why I haven't been around much lately.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:12AM
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youngquinn_gw

elly I just re read your post and saw your comment "who did this" so maybe I owe you an apology for assuming you were accusing me. if so I apologise.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:12AM
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youngquinn_gw

I still want to know what happened to incognito!! (talking about people who are missed)

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:15AM
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Pidge

It may be that Bill was banned for his own comments, not because anyone reported him. But then I think that would need a thread of its own--about what constitutes grounds for banishment.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:16AM
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mrskjun(9)

I didn't get that elly's statement was directed at you yq. It was a general statement to all posters. I can think of at least one that would have loved the opportunity to have bill banned. You and he had some heated discussions but were never as nasty as some others were. I too thought that bill just happened to be away on a job. Hopefully, he'll return soon. I think the outing thing sucks as well. I saw that happen to pete as well.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:16AM
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jodik_gw

"I don't find personal disclosures a distraction, because it humanizes a communication that is often if not almost always based on anonymity."

That's pretty much what I was getting at, too.

I'm not all that happy either, Jerzee, I must admit... too many decent posters have been disappeared lately... in what looks to be a rather unfair fashion. But that's just my opinion.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:30AM
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mrskjun(9)

It's pretty clear pidge on the front page of the forum, what it takes to get you banned. The moderators don't have time to sit here and read all these threads, but when someone reports an incident that breaks the rules of the forum, they do take action. Sometimes you will see personal insults fly, and no one gets banned. That is because no one reports it. Personally I like the rules. I have been searching for something on the net and ended up on forums where they call each other the vilest of names and use language that is beyond the pale. It can get pretty nasty here at times, but nothing compared to other forums.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:43AM
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rob333

What?! Bill was banned? Another one. Makes me really angry. And not because i agreed with him. Although I did on many things. I said it on the Cooking forum and I'll say it again. This banning of long term posters crap is watering things down. I don't care if you like/don't like someone, skip over them if you must, but don't report them. I'm not interested in people getting run off by abusive, personal attacks (the other extreme), but neither am I interested in boring watered down discussions. It's HOT topics. Can't stand the heat...

MISS YOU BILL! and ink, and many others. sheesh!

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:44AM
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ohiomom

None of us has a "halo" when it comes to behaving badly, myself included. Sometimes I read something that totally sets me off and I fire off a rapid response that, in most cases, I do not hit "submit".

My family knows that I am opinionated (yes I know you are all shocked :) and tend to be blunt ... does not make me a bad person but one who is passionate about what I believe in. I mean what I say and say what I mean not always with finesse.

When talking to my children I usually take some time to form my words/response less they immediately go into defense mode.

We could all use a little patience when dealing with others ... having said that I need to practice what I preach (^_^)

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:52AM
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stephf(5a)

The stuff that really bothers me here is what I like to refer to as "playground antics".

There's the infamous "I know you are but what am I?" technique that is employed quite often. This is when someone will start a thread called, for example, "Look what the big bad Republican did!" and the second post in the thread will say "Oh yeah, so! Look what this big bad Democrat did!". What the Democrat did has nothing to do with what the Republican did, so start your own damn thread. If you are conservative and don't want to read about that the Republican did and what people are saying about it, don't open the thread, and vice versa.

The other one that drives me up the wall is "Teacher! Teacher! All the kids are picking on me!!" Self-explanatory. I don't think I even need to provide an example of this one.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 9:37AM
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Pidge

Thanks, mrsk, I do know the rules. I also know that moderators give many warnings before taking the drastic step of banning someone. The thing is that once the moderator has her/his eye on you, you get more scrutiny than those who just clip along.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 11:06AM
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jodik_gw

Personally, Ohiomom, I like blunt and honest, and in fact, prefer it over these incessant words games played. If I look fat in a new dress, don't coddle me with lies and tell me I look okay... tell me I look like a pig from hell! I'll exchange the dress, and appreciate the honesty. That's how WE roll, here.

I dunno what's gotten into me.. I guess the day of sun yesterday made me a little sassy. ;-)

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 11:14AM
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silversword(9A)

Jodi, I just had that conversation with DD yesterday about white lies and hurting people.

IMO It's rude to tell someone they look terrible unless you have a pre-established relationship with them and they know you love them (like you do with your family, obviously). But what else can you do?

Blunt and honest are not necessary synonymous. I tell DD that if someone says "Look at my new dress, what do you think?" you can find ONE thing, SOMETHING you like and comment on that. Like, "I'm glad you got a new dress, how exciting!" or "that length is really great for you" or "the color is amazing". You don't have to lie, and you don't have to hurt feelings. I sincerely doubt many people want to hear the truth, most want to be reassured that they are ok.

I'm sorry Bill got banned. He had a lot to contribute. But he was pretty nasty a few times too, in ways that kind of shocked me considering he considered himself a Christian. When called out on it, his response was akin to "I know I was nasty, that's what I come back with when others are nasty first".

Not that I wouldn't have had the same instinct, and not that I blame him. It's just a pity someone was hurt enough to call the teacher instead of trying to work it out like an adult. Bill's old enough to be my dad, as are many of you, and smart/talented/aware enough to be my dad too (my dad's pretty old, and great, in case you were wondering :) and if this is the way it is in HT the rest of the world doesn't stand a chance.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 3:13PM
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lily316(z5PA)

I didn't have much in common with Bill's philosophy, but I respected him, and we had fun "talk" about our dogs. Some snitch reported him evidently. Never liked snitches when I was in the the first grade and still don't. I have NEVER gone to the moderator and never would, but I suspect someone did for me ,because many months ago I got a warning.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 3:23PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

Im upset by Ink and Bill's sudden disappearance also, both contributed heavily to the forum in ways of value. I have never reported a person or a thread.
I am not bothered by people who are outed if they have been banned and sneak back in under another name. The sneaking back in under the guise of another name really bothers me. This forum does not belong to us, we dont make the rules.
If the owners / moderators choose, for whatever reasons, to have someone leave the forum, it is dishonest and a slap in the owners/ moderators face to very deliberately and with intent to deceive, break the rules by sneaking back in under another guise.
If I am ever banned without being told why, I will easily be able to figure out why and I will accept it. This is not my forum to do with as I please, I am a guest of this forum, nothing more.
That said, I hope that those who are banned will be given another chance to come back. Of course if they deliberately break rules again, that would be too bad. But I hope that rather that a total ban, it would be more of a "restriction" for a known period of time and then they could come back, if they chose to - which I would hope they would. Of course I suspect then there would not be a lot of wriggle room of bad behavior which would be tolerated.

Few have behaved absolutely well at all times, although actually a few names do come to mind who have IMO behaved well always.
And this is hot topics, after all, where discussions might get as heated as the name.
I did get my hand slapped once by moderators and I deserved it, it was nobodys fault but my own that I behaved badly and I can think of two other times where my hand should have been slapped but wasnt, again my bad behavior was no ones fault but my own. It never is, when all is said and done.

But, I miss Bill...and Ink and facto ( yes, I really do miss facto) and kingturtle and marquest, whos contributions are rare these days and too many others to count.
I REFUSE to miss Marshall because he CHOOSES not to participate these days ( though I cant blame him) and because I miss the frequent input he used to contribute but WON't so much these days, he can just bite me!
;)

I miss DanWaxsomething... cant remember the full name, of course more liberal, *very* outspoken. ......which is probably why I'm missing him haha
Miss lots including many I didnt always agree with. Agreeing with someone isnt all that important to me. I like it more when someone I disagree with makes a point which makes me pause and think. Those are my favorite hot topic moments, why I stay.

I cant bring myself to miss a few who seemed to me to be here for shock value, those never last all that long but the pot sure does get stirred to overflow while here.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 3:28PM
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rob333

WxDano. I too wondered where he went? I more than disagreed with him. I don't miss him. And even then, I didn't report him. Or the one who came around at the same time, facto, something. It's possible not to care for or how something is said without reporting a poster. If I can avoid it, hot-head that i am, I'm just sure you can too. Yep, I agree not everyone is good all the time. I also don't think anyone is bad all the time.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 4:13PM
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duluthinbloomz4

I never knew (and still don't know) what happened to either Bill or Inkognito - unless a thread or threads degenerated into bouts of name calling. Bill was passionate about the things he was passionate about, and with Ink sometimes it was "hard to tell" ... but he's missed on the Landscape forum, too.

Hard to think of running to the moderator as little more than a childish whine or some kind of misplaced power trip.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 4:36PM
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epiphyticlvr

So does anyone know for certain that the reason that posters are banned is due to being reported by someone or is this just an assumption?

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:03PM
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Pidge

epi, it is an assumption. Moderators are more engaged than many posters think. I've been on GardenWeb since 1996, back when Spike ran the show, and I have talked to moderators since then. I'm not ready to either blame a snitch or skirt around veiled criticism of the moderators.

As I said, posters get repeated warnings if they break the rules, and moderators --at least the ones I've dealt with--have been willing to negotiate.

This post was edited by pidge on Thu, May 30, 13 at 17:17

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:16PM
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duluthinbloomz4

I admit to making an assumption since I simply don't know. It just seems unlikely the moderator is routinely scanning forums - which seem to be fairly well self-regulated - looking for infractions.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:18PM
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jillinnj

That is a good question, epi. I've often wondered the same thing.

I've had my hand slapped a couple of times by the moderator and I've wondered if they were just reading, or someone complained.

I am also sad Bill was banned. Definitely did not agree with him on much of anything. And I didn't like the way he called people names. I assumed it was the name calling that got him banned, but I am not sure. But, I appreciated his honest answers, and he was more than generous with his tile knowledge. I'm sure those on the kitchen/bathroom forums miss him more than we do.

It's possible I missed the post that got Bill banned, but I never saw anything he wrote as bad as that big papi person. And big papi was not banned after the most disgusting and threatening post I'd ever seen. The post was removed, but he was still around. So, I don't understand why Bill was banned, even with the occasional name calling.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:20PM
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lily316(z5PA)

I didn't know WXdano was missing from here. I have no clue what Bill said, but then some said he came back under another name as others have done and are still posting. I think I've been here since 2000 or 2001 and always under lily.

Like mylab, I'll admit to getting riled up at times, but the remark I was reprimanded for was my reply to Corn . Remember him? My offensive remark was "What? Are you nine?" That's why I think I was snitched.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:29PM
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chase_gw

i know for CERTAIN that people are reported by others and subsequently banned , it has happened here.

Generally the moderator just gives a small slap on the wrist but when the complaints are repeated the moderator looses patience and that's it!

Which is not to say the complaint is valid...nor is to say it is not valid.

The moderator does not read every thread and every post looking for trouble...if they did most of us would have been in Disney a long time ago......

For my part I will fight my battles myself, I would never "tattle" on anyone. Generally nasty people hang themselves when given enough rope.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:49PM
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mrskjun(9)

Having received a slap on the wrist myself, the offending post was enclosed in the email from GW. It does make it easy to know who reported you. It is what it is.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:57PM
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jillinnj

Bill was back briefly under a new name. It was pretty obvious it was him. But, I suspect he was banned again under that name too because that name hasn't posted either.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 5:59PM
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epiphyticlvr

Thanks Pidge and Chase. I actually agree with both of you. I am sure people are reported but I am not sure that is the only reason people get banned.

Like Pidge said, I can't imagine that the moderators don't take notice of some of the more contentious threads and / or notice the posters who are here seemingly just to start trouble and snipe at other posters. They are responsible for this board and I would think they are not blind to some who post here and how they do so,

Personally, I think it is silly to report people although I admit to wanting to do so with a very few individuals who don't add a thing to the discussions and are seemingly here only to provoke other posters and snipe. But I haven't since it seems that many who do eventually self-destruct. Sometimes it happens later rather than sooner but it seems to eventually happen.

I too miss some of the posters who no longer post both by choice and otherwise.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 6:15PM
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jodik_gw

Oh, I definitely agree, Silver, that there are times and situations where if one doesn't have anything good to say, it's best not to say anything... and I think our youth are pretty good at knowing when to say what... at least we were while growing up! ;-)

But I find that as I've aged, and as I've grown next to this man I call my partner, I've become a lot more open and confident, a lot more certain of who I am as an individual, more comfortable in my own skin, and a lot more open to honesty, blunt though it may be. In fact, within our family, that sort of bluntness is expected. We simply don't stand on ceremony, and we're more likely to make fun of one another as we are to say something nice! It's great, really, though, to have that sort of relationship, where one doesn't need fear being oneself, and one can totally relax and have fun, basking in the love of family. The laughter is genuine and deep, and it's always therapeutic to gather and spend time together. I don't really know how else to put it. :-)

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 6:43PM
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elvis

IMO Bill didn't get banned; he got fed up with HT. I reckon he'll be back. I hope so.

As for factotem and wxdano, like Rob, I don't miss 'em. I doubt they got banned either; I think they were temps.

As far as ratting someone out, I haven't done it, though I did have a post removed because the poster put personal info about me out there; stuff I didn't divulge myself and wished to keep private. In other words, the poster stalked me, then posted the items. But that's not tattling.

Heri threatened to report me a day or two ago; on the "teaching ethics in school? thread. Apparently either she didn't do it, or the moderator didn't find the statement aggregious enough.

As to the OP: boy, is this thread derailed or what.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 7:27PM
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Elly_NJ(NJ z6)

Someone reported him. Don't know why or who.

I can't stand the whining. I am sorry I derailed this thread but I really was annoyed and afraid if I started a separate thread I'd get banned.

I more and more sob the threads here, and often don't even open the ones by members who bait or troll.

Youngquinn: ??? Why did you think I was talking to you? Happily you worked it out.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 7:35PM
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jerzeegirl(9)

IMO Bill didn't get banned; he got fed up with HT. I reckon he'll be back. I hope so.

You are wrong about this. I know for a fact that he was banned.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 7:44PM
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silversword(9A)

I've gotten a warning, and attached was the post in question. I agree that it was easy to see, in my case, who reported my poor behavior.

I'm surprised more people haven't been kicked off, but then again, I can't imagine sending an email to Tamara kvetching about my imaginary virtual friends being mean.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:04PM
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youngquinn_gw

Elvis , yes his thread has been derailed...but not for the rreason IMO that gets my goat namely.." its only the people who derail threads because they seek the attention , to knowingly obstruct because of their narcissism is the only issue I am on about here.
it gets old and it is manipulative."

Elly I thought you were talking to me because you said
"Why would you do that" and it was my thread.
simple as that

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:08PM
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pnbrown

Bill entirely deserved banning, IMO. Debates are better without participants who have anger issues.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:12PM
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lily316(z5PA)

I too know for a fact that Bill was banned. I miss him and Dano and Facto. It was over the gazillion gun threads, I think ,that Bill got banned but don't know the actual thread or post.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:39PM
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epiphyticlvr

How does one "stalk" anyone to find out personal information? Unless one is in the security industry or a real shark at the internet I don't think it is something that the average poster has the capabilities of doing. Besides, why would anyone take the time to do so? That makes no sense.

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 8:57PM
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elvis

"Elly I thought you were talking to me because you said
"Why would you do that" and it was my thread.
simple as that."

And I took it to mean that Elly was talking to "whoever you are out there."

____

"Besides, why would anyone take the time to do so? That makes no sense."

You're right; it totally creeped me out. :-(

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 11:03PM
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TxanGoddess

posted by mom47:
"You can always stop yourself from posting."

Word to this.

All over the web, people seem to have such a problem with this, way back to my aol days in the early 90s:

... saying you are going to ignore someone ...
... saying they are going to force you to ignore them ...
... advising others to ignore them ...
... pointing out to others not to "feed the troll"
... any variant on the above four (SOB is another big one here) ...
... making posts about ignoring "certain" posters ...
... making threads about ignoring people ...
... or the worst is long descriptions about how bad the psychology of the poster you are about to ignore is because they need negative attention so badly, and how savvy you are to their need, which is why you just have to let them know you are about to ignore them as soon as this one post is finished ...

Man, am I the only one whose computer has an off switch? Turn it off, and they disappear!

And admittedly, I just broke my "ignoring the ignoring" rule for once myself to point any of this out, but I promise you'll never see me do it again.

No one compels you to respond to them, folks. If you know a poster isn't worth responding to, and you still respond to them, the not worth it person just made you into a sucker.

Is that really what you want to be? Is the last word really worth letting them pwn you like that?

    Bookmark   May 30, 2013 at 11:28PM
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lily316(z5PA)

I just spent 30 minutes reading the Rick Perry thread for the first time. As I scrolled by I noticed it had reached 150 so it piqued my curiosity . Wow, it was the Demi dog and pony show.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:23AM
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Pidge

pnbrown, I am surprised that Bill lasted as long as he did. So many posters were treated with derision, yelling, insults--who needs that? Surely we can speak to each other with mutual respect.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 7:00AM
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jodik_gw

Well, you'd think so, Pidge, wouldn't you? But often... it does get a little hard to hold the tongue when the same people keep throwing darts, consistently.

I think it's just best to scroll by most of it, and let the true attackers be known by whatever tact it is they typically use. They, too, will eventually meet the fate deserved, I suppose.

If polled, I'd say I have complete and utter respect for about 98% of my fellow posters, given the many forums and peoples I've read and responded to over the course of my membership. That has to be fairly decent, considering how large, and how many people use this site.

It's the nature of such places, though... all message boards and forums have their issues... and I'd bet money, similar types of posters.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 7:35AM
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Pidge

Jodi, I know you are right and there are posters I just stay away from. I never responded to Big Papi, for instance, and there are others I dealt with in the same way. But I also don't miss some of the more uncivil posters.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:00AM
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mrskjun(9)

pidge you are always most respectful in your discussions. And though we disagree on many things, or look at them from a different perspective. It is always a pleasure to have discussions with you. And sometimes the good should be pointed out, so thank you for your respectful discourse.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:12AM
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Pidge

Thanks, mrsk, that's very generous of you and I appreciate your kindness. I'll try to pay it forward.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:15AM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by lily316 z5PA (My Page) on
Fri, May 31, 13 at 1:23

I just spent 30 minutes reading the Rick Perry thread for the first time. As I scrolled by I noticed it had reached 150 so it piqued my curiosity . Wow, it was the Demi dog and pony show.

*

Oh, excuse me Lily, for not knowing my place and just staying quiet when posters insult me and taunt me.

If I just knew my place and ignored those nasty comments, there wouldn't be a dog and pony show, would there? All those posts about me made by other posters and it's ALL MY FAULT because I don't quietly sit back and let the insults and mischaracterizations stand! Who do I think I am?

I refer to you TXanGoddess' last post, which gave my first chuckle this morning.

Boy did she nail it.

Just in case anyone missed it--thanks, TXanGoddess:

". saying you are going to ignore someone ...
... saying they are going to force you to ignore them ...
... advising others to ignore them ...
... pointing out to others not to "feed the troll"
... any variant on the above four (SOB is another big one here) ...
... making posts about ignoring "certain" posters ...
... making threads about ignoring people ...
... or the worst is long descriptions about how bad the psychology of the poster you are about to ignore is because they need negative attention so badly, and how savvy you are to their need, which is why you just have to let them know you are about to ignore them as soon as this one post is finished ..."

*
And whenever anyone does these things, you know you are living rent free in their minds.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:25AM
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youngquinn_gw

and there Ladies and gentlemen is the admission.

no need to try to continue this ...game is up

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:34AM
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mrskjun(9)

LOL TXanGoddess, that is priceless....wish we could post that at the top of the first page.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:45AM
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youngquinn_gw

pidge and pnbrown, I am with you regarding bill.I wont be a hypocrite and say I am sorry he is gone. it is wonderful to not have to put up with being called a "moron" (and worse) every other day,

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:53AM
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mrskjun(9)

Made you feel like a conservative huh? You could have been a member of the moron demographic, a wingnut, reptilian, ignorant, stupid, liar...etc. etc. etc. Ah well, it's all perspective.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:58AM
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jodik_gw

Outright insults or directly personal hits should not be tolerated. On that, I would agree. Neither should constant baiting and trolling.

But posting the truth in factual form, preferably with link, to dispute the item up for debate, or posting one's opinion, cannot be considered a personal attack just because someone wants it to be. And I think that's what half the problem is.

It's in the interpretation. This is why reading with comprehension and keeping context in mind is so very important. Again, typical tactics are seen applied at every message board and forum on the internet. Interior problems or issues are not unique to this board.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:04AM
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youngquinn_gw

I think it was lilly who mentioned facto...I always thought he/she was good value and I hope facto will revisit us. dano also.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:10AM
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jerzeegirl(9)

Gather round kiddies - here is a message direct from Bill, who asked me to post it. Words to live by, imo.

Hey everyone-- We all have our views, and we're all entitled to them. Just like the rest of you, I used to get caught up in the emotion of the moment, especially when it came to things I strongly believe in. Now that I've had a chance to sit back from it, I've seen, every once in a while when I come into lurk, the insanity that goes on in here and passes for "debate", and can't believe that I was a part of it. As I told JG, I still get my fill of arguing with liberals-- they're all good friends, though, on my facebook page, and it's all good natured poking at each other.

Have fun, folks! Debate to your hearts' contents, but don't get carried away. Nothing anyone says here is going to change or affect public policy, and you HAVE to know by now, you're not going to change anyone's mind. All you'll do is give yourself an ulcer.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:28AM
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mylab123(z5NW)

I dont do facebook so cant try to tell him myself but please give him my best wishes.

Wise words, indeed.
For those who (understandably, I believe) dont miss him, it sounds like he finds himself better off without us, also.
I suppose there is a certain symmetry to it all.

I wish Bill every good thing, along with some good fishing, too!

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:55AM
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jodik_gw

Thanks, Jerzee... though we disagreed at times, I always admired Bill for being Bill, for speaking his mind, and for doing much as I do... sticking to his guns, no pun intended.

I miss people like Bill and others... you don't spend X years interacting with the same people without developing a liking and a respect for most of those people, whomever they may be.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:55AM
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mrskjun(9)

I miss bill as well. Other than guns and religion which he was passionate about, he far more often agreed with liberals than most conservatives. A unique position on this forum.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 9:58AM
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woodnymph2_gw

Glad to hear from Bill. We often disagreed, but he had the civility to apologize to me when he realized he had come on too strong on certain issues. I thought his presence made our forum more varied and interesting. I still miss incognito and wonder what happened. His unique commentary was inimitable.

In so far as ratting on offensive posters here, I never would. I'm too busy for such pettiness.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:04AM
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jodik_gw

That's how I feel, Woodnymph... I mean, what, are we 4? We have to run and tell the playground attendant every time someone is "mean" to us? lol! I just can't comprehend that bit... I mean, why, really?

I would agree that Bill's words are wise... and he most assuredly is/was a big enough person to apologize. I liked that about him.

Yes, a lot of posters have either left these shores or drowned in the riptide, and some absolutely added most positively to the forum. It's a shame...

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:17AM
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youngquinn_gw

does anyone have any contact with incognito? He was one of my favourite posters.
or does anyone know why he was banned? (I believe he was banned)

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:30AM
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mrskjun(9)

Everyone seems to think ink was banned, but no one seems to know why.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:36AM
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ohiomom

Well if it is true, and I have no reason to doubt y'all, apparently someone ran to mommy and reported Ink also .... and that person may also be banned now .... you can tell which posters battle with each other on a personal level all the time here, not like the rest of us don't know who is going "toe to toe" on a regular basis.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:47AM
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lily316(z5PA)

Ink has been gone for quite awhile now , I think. I liked him and miss his posts. As I said I like Bill too although I am sooooo against the two of his strongest beliefs,...abortion and guns. No two people could have such opposing views. Big Papi is one I'd never miss and hope he doesn't return. He just threw out crap and hoped it'd stick. I did notice the gun fanatics are gone. I knew they were plants from the NRA whose goal was to get their members on all forums on the internet. .

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 10:57AM
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jodik_gw

I'm still here, Lily... no plant from anywhere, and no affiliation with any organizations.
;-)

I think we can agree to disagree many times... because we won't always feel the same on certain issues. There are many things I believe in or have done in my life which absolutely are abhorrent to others... and I can understand that. I think a lot of the perspective comes from the life lived, you know?

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 11:17AM
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marquest(z5 PA)

Bill is right. There is no way you can change anyone's mind.

I have found I have to take a break and go to my happy place. I will read the post but not respond. I made a promise that there was a poster I would not respond I did not care if they addressed me directly. Everyone knows who that is because I have stated that on the board. I will not play the game if someone has a problem. They can play alone.

You can ignore ignorance it is a lot more effective to watch someone fight with themselves. If someone is to stupid to read if it is Marquest or lily they are to stupid to understand the answer. You do not spit on it if it is on fire. It just derails a thread. You let them burn.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 11:48AM
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jodik_gw

I never have a problem understanding anyone who posts here... even Joe, and I say that tongue in cheek! ;-) It actually took me a little while to catch his unique writing style.

But I think Marquest and Lily are both perfectly understandable. I never find meanings that aren't there. In fact, I feel that Marquest and Lily are both very straightforward. Much respect to both.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 11:58AM
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ninamarie(4Ont.)

I think it is quite obvious why some posters derail threads. The subject matter and the opinions expressed make them uncomfortable.
Anything that does not corroborate their world view frightens them.
Mostly, other ideas frighten them.
However, it makes the forums very unpleasant.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:02PM
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jodik_gw

I admit to seemingly derailing threads, I guess you could call it... I often just spit out what comes to mind when I read a thread or post... no ill intention is meant, though.

I guess you might say I converse here just as I would if we were all sitting in the same room.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:14PM
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lily316(z5PA)

Jodi, you were the furthest person on my mind in my post saying the NRA plants are gone. You've been here a long time, and I respect your views and agree with you on everything but guns. I'm talking about persons who showed up, never seen here before , recently registered, posted on one subject only, and then abruptly left. That's trolling.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:26PM
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rob333

I have to say, I never see anyone posting to "derail threads". I think they're doing what jodik is claiming--conversing. At least, I know I am! So maybe I just see it that way. I see some very passionate and forthright people, who will not sit back and take anything, not that they're narcissistic or frightened. It's what I am doing now. Stating my opinion. What is unpleasant is the name calling. Even if it isn't directed at an individual. But what do I know; and it's only my opinion. We can't read minds or hearts, so cut some slack and try to think good thoughts towards one and all. We seem to be like a really big, very diverse family. With all personality types. Except we all speak our minds. That part isn't the same as our real world families.

:)

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:29PM
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jodik_gw

I know, Lily... it was said humorously. ;-)

I would agree with Robin on the first part... and disagree on the second, only because brutal honesty is expected within my family.

I could never blurt out some of the reality of how I would word things if we were all parked around a campfire, I can tell you that! I can imagine the intake of a collective breath, and the thought traveling around that fire that "Jodi curses like a sailor!" LOL! But it means nothing.. just a way to highlight or punctuate a thought. You know... verbs, adverbs, adjectives... ;-)

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:44PM
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pnbrown

I never noted an apology from the Billster. Bullying, yes.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:55PM
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patriciae_gw(07)

There are so many posters from the past who are gone. I miss Bill posting but I cant say I am surprised he is gone. I have noticed that men tend to get a little more lattitude around here-I suppose because there are fewer of them.
If I were to hit post on a lot of stuff I type I would be long gone too.
I have always enjoyed seeing what to me are the looney ideas of the far right(remember Dan the fig man) spelled out. It doesnt bother me that my ideas appear looney to most people. Since there isnt a soul in my local area to whom I could express my views without fisticuffs breaking out it is nice to be able to say what I really think once in a while.

I love that this thread has become a perfect example of the OP. What not to do....

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 1:55PM
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steve2416

My posts often deviate from the path. Not intentional, but I may get caught up in the story or discussion.
When I was very young, I embarrassed my mother with a comment about a "fat" woman who overheard me.
Mom quickly removed me and said "If you can't say something nice about a person, don't say anything at all." That made an impression and has stayed with me over the years (I'm 64).
I may vehemently disagree with a poster, but I try to make it impersonal when I question their views or source of information.
What is great about this forum is I can learn so much by the diversity of others and the amazing links they post. Responding is always optional.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 2:18PM
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chase_gw

I'm OK with ramblings that take us somewhere other than where we may have started. However the habit of trying to make an argument where none exists or lobbing a totally irrelevant "bomb" into the mix gets tired real quick.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 2:23PM
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Pidge

pnb, he never apologized to me, either, though he was quick to bash me. BTW, I'm on Facebook, and I don't want to friend Bill.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 2:43PM
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lily316(z5PA)

Pidge, I'm on FB too and think friending Bill would probably raise my BP, since there are no moderators around to restrain.

I know I can be a rambler too if I relate to the subject matter.

Steve, my mother said the exact same thing to me. About the same subject... fat. At a church function ,I said to my mother that we would have won the relay race if we weren't stuck with the fat boy. Of course his mother was standing beside us.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 2:52PM
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Campanula UK Z8

I am also happy with rambling on because I do sort of think of this forum as a long distance conversation with all the tangential offshoots which naturally occur.
Bill told me I was 'lower than a snake's belly' once - had to give him points for a colourful turn of phrase (and I expect I probably deserved it)- if you ever mooched around some of the sites I sometimes frequent, you would have to agree that GW is genteel, polite and generally quite respectful in tone. For myself though, I rather enjoy contention and am usually happy to get right in there with a few pokes and digs.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 3:00PM
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jodik_gw

Bill was more of an "apology in private" kind of guy, I think... I once received an email from him, apologizing for something I didn't even take offense at... mostly because I'm probably hard to offend. If anything, I come off as brash, sometimes, I know... but I did heartily appreciate his thinking of me. It showed him as a stand up guy, in my eyes, anyway.

I know, right, Patriciae? :-)

"What is great about this forum is I can learn so much by the diversity of others and the amazing links they post. Responding is always optional."

Well said, Steve, and I concur.

Campanula, I have to say... I like you more and more as time goes by... we could be "sisters from another mother" across the ocean! I don't mind a little verbal fisticuffs, either... and would agree with your assessment of GW. :-)

I most heartily enjoy people who are not afraid to show their true colors.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 3:16PM
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Pidge

Jodi, I agree about folks showing their true colors, but I think that can be done without calling others names or yelling at them. I read your posts and note that you don't call names or yell at people while still making very clear where you stand on a vast array of issues. You don't fight with people or try to make them look foolish or insist that they they agree with you. I guess I'm saying you are a model!

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 5:18PM
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jerzeegirl(9)

If someone says something that is ridiculous or offensive, I really have a hard time not speaking up. Also, when someone posts "facts" that are patently false. It just really rubs me the wrong way. I try to be as neutral as possible but sometimes I can't help responding in an abrupt way. There is so much good information out there and it's so much easier than it used to be to do research that, to me, there is no excuse for spreading false information (except to sow discord).

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 6:35PM
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youngquinn_gw

just remember jerzee that that outrageous comment is often the "hook" to letting that poster .....live rent free in your mind.
so your angry response is often a source of amusement for them.

if the offensive comment is a deliberate one , that is.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 7:03PM
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pnbrown

People who come on here pretending they like debate but really who want to disgorge some pretty unpleasant stuff while not being able to tolerate disagreement should get banned. So when they are banned - even very belatedly - that is good for the forum.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 7:19PM
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Pidge

pnb, you are so subtle. Love that.

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 7:42PM
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demifloyd(8)

Great people talk about ideas.
Average people talk about things.
Small people talk about other people.

...author unknown

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:49PM
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youngquinn_gw

"pnb, you are so subtle. Love that." yes me too pidge!

nothing wrong with speaking your mind, without game playing .

    Bookmark   May 31, 2013 at 8:52PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

I agree with both Pidge and Jerzee's last remarks. I am slowly learning the value of a non response. Sometimes it is difficult and sometimes I have to bite my fingers - but I also find it surprisingly easier to do as I give it practice. I find what petty things I dont remark upon much easier to let go of, too, if left unremarked upon.

It shocks me that so many consider HT so mild, I must not get around enough, I find it so combative and have shocked myself with my own combativeness.

I DO know that gawd-awful places exist because I have fallen across them but I thought I had wandered into something exceptional in the realm of disgusting. I fell into one in the few days after the bombing in Boston and I realized the insular life I must lead because I have never heard anyone with such outrageous ideas and statements as what I discovered in that 2 minutes worth of reading.
Nor the extraordinarily combative nature of replies if anyone at all disagreed with anyone at all. To think that the internet is filled with trash talking and thinking people like that is depressing. Racist, bigoted, nasty and proud.

That site is why Im careful about where I wander on the internet. I dont want to see that filth and I dont want to suddenly have my junk box filled with any more unwanted trash than I already delete on a daily basis simply because I was moving around.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 7:24AM
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Pidge

mylab, I wouldn't even know to search out the kind of sites you mention. Talk about me living in la-la land! But I am better off not finding them, I think--it would be so dispiriting to read what some people have to say. Bad enough some of the stuff that turns up on Facebook.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 8:00AM
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mylab123(z5NW)

Oftentimes, it is simply by following links. Usually Im pretty good about not doing that or doing it with great care, but I was trying to figure out a rumors surrounding the ideas about the bombing, and there ya go - there I was! ;)

There's some very scary people out there IMO.

I dont "do" Facebook, so I have not been exposed to it's 'horror section' either *LOL*

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 8:15AM
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Pidge

Facebook is pretty tame, actually. I sell jewelry through it and stay in touch with old and new friends on it. But once in a while someone will post something and a crazy comes out of the woodwork. I just "hide" the post and it's poof! gone from my timeline/newsfeed.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 8:31AM
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Pidge

Speaking of derailing threads, which I am obviously doing, this is for mylab to explain the kind of goofy stuff I most often get on Facebook.

Here is a link that might be useful: Just loves to sing

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 8:37AM
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jodik_gw

Thanks, Pidge... a huge compliment, though I hardly deserve it... I have a tendency to use sarcasm quite heavily, though it's most often directed at the subject of our discussions... some of which I find so outdated as to be insulting, and not to me but to humankind in general. Subjects such as equality, trying to pass opinions as facts, and that sort of thing.

Sometimes it's best to just use that mouse heavily, rolling on by those responses one already knows will be filled with vitriol or projection, passive aggressive behavior, victimization or bait setup... or whatever the case may be. It's not worth the effort to go there... unless the subject is worth defending, and we stick with the subject matter and debunk using facts and experiences as a narrative. But these are all typical to message boards... the nature of the beast.

I don't know... it was sometimes fun to engage years ago... but I don't have time to play head or word games these days.

Yes, I would say this is a thousand times tamer than some places, but that's why we set permissions on who can access what, or who we choose to friend at social network sites, I suppose. To some folks, kitchens are hot places... and if one can't take the heat, as the saying goes, one probably shouldn't enter. ;-)

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 8:45AM
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Pidge

I never object to sarcasm, just to yelling IN CAPS, calling people names, and whining about being put upon. Oh and those word games! Blech.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:23AM
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jodik_gw

Right on, Pidge!

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:26AM
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Bothell

Since this thread is derailed & several posters have mentioned her, I am putting in my 2 cents on Facto. I have a suspicion that she was writing a paper or thesis and used her postings as research for it. I enjoyed her postings and she was always civil even while calling out posters who couldn't/wouldn't back up their wilder assertions.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:35AM
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elvis

"I have a suspicion that she was writing a paper or thesis and used her postings as research for it."

Same thought crossed my mind. She was very clinical.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:38AM
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Pidge

She was clearly an academic. I liked her a lot, sorry she left. She was a good critical thinker.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:49AM
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Pidge

She was clearly an academic. I liked her a lot, sorry she left. She was a good critical thinker.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 10:50AM
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lily316(z5PA)

I didn't know Facto was a "she". For some reason I thought Facto was male. Maybe you're right about the thesis, but I wish he/she would return. Very analytical posts. Of course, she was progressive, so that might be the reason I liked her.

Re: FB. I've been there for five or more years and found college roommates and other people I lost touch with over the years. Love the links to cute videos, and yes political stuff as well. But I have gotten a few Teabagger links which I unfortunately scrolled down. The nastiness, vitriol, and outrageous theories literally make me sick. The remarks are usually interspersed with biblical verses and the F bomb. Theories like the Boston bombing and Sandy Hook were all made up.

I f you lead a sheltered life as I apparently do, it boggles your mind and makes you sick to know these people are out there.

That's why HT is still a place where I like to drop in because it's always very civil by comparison.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 12:12PM
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jodik_gw

I would tend to agree, Lily.

The F-bombs don't bother me... it's the far right idiocracy... and that's easy enough to remove from your FB lineup. Simply report as spam, or discontinue them.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 12:35PM
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marquest(z5 PA)

I thought he/she was a GW employee. For four reasons.....

-The handle Facto
-Did not get banned and we know it was tried by the ones that did not like the questions.
-Time that he/she started posting. It was during a very nastier than usual postings time IMO.
-The type of questions and the way the questions were asked. Bill asked a couple times if he/she was an attorney. Because the questions came off as Interrogation not info gathering.

I can just see it now.... On 3/14/2013 Facto questioned xxxx about comment made on xxxx date and the response was xxxx.

I would imagine GW has a liability if someone screams bully or someone is threatened physically and not investigating the charges they could be held liable. We were talking about guns and pictures of gun collections were posted. It was not done by one but by a group of people.

That allegation of bully was thrown around a lot. I do not think people realize how serious that allegation is now. They also do not know the repercussion of falsely accusing someone of a crime.

My Disclaimer LOL
This is all my take and I have no proof of the statements above. It is my Audit training of how I look at situations that gave me the impression of how I saw the poster's objective and purpose.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 12:55PM
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jodik_gw

Quite honestly, I look at everyone here as an equal, regardless of education, social status, or whatever the case may be... we're all playing on the same field, so none of that should matter.

I guess I don't pay that close of attention to what people "seem" to be, and more to how they come off as human beings. I already know that there are several college degrees floating about, if not more, but that's not what sets people apart for me. So, I really don't pay attention to how analytic certain posters are... like Facto, for example.

Just my personal view...

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 1:15PM
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Pidge

If what you say is true, Marquest, then it would seem that the monitors really are paying attention to these threads. This happened not long after Newtown and it may be that gun threads were being looked at for problems or issues.

A lot of people were making comments that might have been construed as threatening in some way.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 1:21PM
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pnbrown

Bullying, in cyber-space, is when because someone sharply disagrees, the perp gets increasingly nasty until - unless the disagreeing party withdraws from the thread - some very vile personal attack disgorges, whether explicit or implicit.

Participants who do that more than once or twice should be permanently banned. Let's not forget we are talking about cyberspace here, no allegations about real life should be made, because how would we know?

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 1:24PM
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jodik_gw

That's just it, PNBrown... we can't know, so we can't assume. Unless we have actual knowledge, or have walked in those shoes... it's impossible to know.

But I would automatically think that this would be the closest monitored forum simply because of its content... though, I have seen some nasty stuff in gardening threads, too. Amazingly enough.

Who knows?

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 1:47PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

Inkognito got mad and left I think at least twice before that I know of - maybe his announcements of such are still around, on old threads - on Google if nowhere else. Anyway, I assume that all that happened the last time was he finally stopped coming back afterward, the third time apparently being the charm.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 4:47PM
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lily316(z5PA)

Jodi... the F bomb flows freely from MY lips around the house when the hose kinks or other irritants, but I cringe when I see it along with bible verses. And I never use it in public or on the internet.

There is one person on my FB which I have one thing in common , but I guess I'll have to unfriend or block her. I just saw a chimp and Michelle Obama side by side and the horrible almost illiterate comments made were unbelievable and so disgusting.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 4:49PM
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marquest(z5 PA)

If what you say is true, Marquest, then it would seem that the monitors really are paying attention to these threads.

I do not think this forum was monitored any closer but that IVillage might have felt a need to monitor because of whining of threats, bullying etc. But I think what happens is when you point a finger there are 4 fingers pointing back at the finger pointer. Hence the Interrogation style questions.

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 5:25PM
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duluthinbloomz4

I recall a couple of instances, too, bboy - but it seems the grand exits were on the Landscape forum.

There was a period when the more professional posters - those who made their living at it - were getting annoyed providing their advice for free to the frequent "drive by" and "help me, help me" posts. Would have been so simple to not "self-obligate" and quite a few of the regular posters took that route; just drifted away without any fanfare.

But on the occasions I do remember Ink getting called out by other posters (not the GW moderators) for his tone being a bit sharp and dismissive, he announced he was taking his leave; and it took the usual boatload of ego stroking posts to bring him back.

Least-wise, that's my recollection. This time seems to be different - was it one of his drone threads?

    Bookmark   June 1, 2013 at 5:43PM
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bboy(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

All I noticed at the end was no more posts from him. He and I had similar political ideas but I am amused by your above characterizations, which definitely fit. Although I think he did later direct some charming warmth my way there was a period where he apparently decided he didn't like my jokes and started popping up right after my posts, here and there, to denigrate them. I even ended up accusing him of stalking, and also pointed out that he was given to the witticisms himself. And particularly during the later stages of his participation I wasn't always sure I knew what he was talking about - what his point was.

In short, smart guy, probably a lot more intelligent than me, but anger erases everything - you always have to deal with what other people have in their heads, no matter how much you wish it wasn't there.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 12:28AM
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heri_cles

Regarding the post containing a message to the effect that nothing we say here matters and will never help to change anything:

That is the wrong message to send to any American let alone to posters here at HT. We should be sending just the opposite message to the young people in this country - what you say does matter and you can help to change things for the better if you try.

This post was edited by heri_cles on Sun, Jun 2, 13 at 3:50

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 2:02AM
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pnbrown

I agree Heri, we should think before we write as well as speak.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 6:39AM
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Pidge

This has been a great thread, like a conversation wending its way through a group and morphing along the way. Thanks for starting it, yq. You've done this forum a great service.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 8:27AM
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youngquinn_gw

Thanks Pidge. I know I have gained a lot of insights along the path of this thread which will help to govern my reactions in the future. I think it is always interesting to examine our own behaviour

But heri , If I can be permitted a gentle reminder that even tho the bulk of the threads concern America, this is not actually an American forum ....
your post refers..
"That is the wrong message to send to any American let alone to posters here at HT. We should be sending just the opposite message to the young people in this country -"

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 9:04AM
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jodik_gw

"...the F bomb flows freely from MY lips around the house when the hose kinks or other irritants, but I cringe when I see it along with bible verses."

Lily, this is one of those things that continues to baffle me, too... and I usually delete those who go from religious to rude, crude and lewd in 0 point 5 seconds! In my book, you are either one or the other... not both. Not like that. It's rather disturbing to see so much of it, actually.

But back to the thread...

I would agree... an interesting and insightful look at our own behaviors...

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 11:04AM
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marquest(z5 PA)

Heri your post made me stop and think and I agree. We have seen people come on and say they do not post but do read.

There are many old and young that are not committed to a stand on a R or D win and say anything without fact just for a win. There are some really looking for answers. Those looking for answers we have some great posters that "bring it". You and David and many others are ones that I admire.

I think the lurkers are the ones we make a difference more than the regular HT posters.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 11:10AM
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jodik_gw

"I think the lurkers are the ones we make a difference more than the regular HT posters."

I would agree, Marquest. I think those of us here are fairly well set in our political leanings.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 11:47AM
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don_socal

There was a thread for lurkers...

Lurkers this is your thread.

and one asking about bans...

Curious ... do posters get banned here @ HT?

I mentioned then that I was on late and witnessed what happened with ink. He posted a profanity in response to a personal attack. Did not have edit then.

" Posted by don_socal socal (My Page) on
Tue, Dec 18, 12 at 8:09

I mentioned before that ink posted something in response to another poster that had gotten under his skin. It was late at night for me and not immediately after the other post. according to the time stamp it had just been posted and I refreshed to see if there were more posts and his had disappeared. I have not seen a post from him since. Apparently a moderator saw it and that was that, unless there was a lurker that reported him within two minutes."

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 11:59AM
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marshallz10(z9-10 CA)

I agree that (finally opening and reading through the thread) this has been a valuable discussion. Ink was quick to take issue with implied or understood criticism; he hated to be challenged and surely never to be make light of by the likes of me.

Mylab, thank you for the kind words about my postings. I'm still around but haven't much time for posting. What time I have is conserved by passing over most threads.

When I was last banned, I admitted to my failings and was reinstated. A complaint was lodged against me for picking on a poster, a crime I had been warned about some years back. Can't seem to teach old dogs new tricks sometimes.

    Bookmark   June 2, 2013 at 12:11PM
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