Shade salvias

warddaMarch 16, 2008

I'm trying to put together a list of New World salvias to grow on a shady deck for a nature center. The spot doesn't get morning sun and from mid day on it recieves roughly 50% sun because there is a lath roof. Three I currently have are miniata, chiapensis, and buchananii. The first should do OK in large pots, it does at home. But what about the latter two, is this likely to be too much shade? And are there others I should be considering? That is a lot of questions, but I want a display of thriving plants, not struggling experiments.

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robinmi_gw

All three should be fine in partial shade.

You could also try blepharophylla, cacaliaefolia, corrugata, discolor, roemeriana, sagittata, and all forms of splendens. Guaranitica also performs well in part-shade, as do patens and amarissima. The greggii/microphylla types also seem to flower better when not on full sun.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 10:34AM
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wardda

Thanks Robin, that is a big help. I possess cacaliaefolia so that is an easy choice. It seems to work pretty well cascading over the edge of pots. Maybe it is time to return to growing blepharophylla, I think I'll order one. Sagittata hates our weather here dieing when it gets really hot and humid. Splendens, maybe a couple the Van Houttii types would work since they seem to appreciate a bit of shade around here. I hadn't considered greggii/microphylla types, maybe I'll pick one of the ones here and give it a go.

I assume SL411 who's seeds are just sprouting needs more sun.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 11:39AM
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rich_dufresne(z7 NC)

From its foliage, and in comparison to Robin's oppositiflora and the now reclassified tubiflors (from oppositiflora), I think SL411 will like some shade. Tubiflora has thick, sticky leaves like chaparral plants, and it is from the hills near the Atacama desert on the west side of the Andean peaks. True oppositiflora on Robin's site looks a lot smoother and thinner of leaf, and should be closer to SL411, which I assume is from the eastern side of the Andean peaks.

My three huge SL411 stock plants are just breaking dormancy and are already trying to bloom. Because of the heat and drought, I did not get any seeds last year. Ward, was it a good seed producer?

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 1:02PM
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wardda

I recieved seeds from someone in Minnisota who I believe got them from Robin. He said his plants didn't put out much seed and what seed was produced tended to drop very quickly. It is not particularly good news.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 2:21PM
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robinmi_gw

SL 411 sets quite a few seeds here, BUT you have to look for them every day, as they ripen and fall very quickly. This is a beautiful Salvia, and as still quite new, have not decided whether it prefers full sun, or part-shade, suspect the latter. It will not tolerate any frost at all, in my experience, and I have had little success keeping cuttings alive in the glasshouse in winter...very susceptible to mould. But, seeds germinate well, and flowers will appear by July. So I treat it as an annual, as it grows very fast.

We will hopefully have a real name for this Salvia soon, if the botanists at Mainz university, in Germany, will pull their fingers out, and describe it....and name it!!! Apparently it is not considered to be "high priority!" WHY???

Currently, I can't decide whether to label it as Salvia 'Tallulah Bankhead' or 'Bette Davis'! (Only joking!)

R.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 3:07PM
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annette68_gw

Salvia sl411 does brilliantly here, 10 ft tall and flowers all year round, it has got to be climate.

Salvia Dorisiana should do alright on your deck as well.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 5:40PM
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wardda

Well, if the seedlings go OK we'll find out what it will do here - 10 feet? That would be one tall carrot-top. Whatever we call it, it better be with respect. Robin, I'd go for Tallulah because I'm not venturing into any garden with 10 foot Bette Davises about - too scary.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 6:41PM
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robinmi_gw

SL411 has only grown to 4 ft. in England. But it is fab!

Off-topic again, I did meet Bette Davis about 30 years ago when she was en route to Egypt to film "Death on the Nile". She was completely charming, and I still have her autograph! Never met Tallulah, before my time, but I did name my first cat after her!

Another good shade-tolerant Salvia would be S. stolonifera...which Richard may be able to supply before long.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 7:14PM
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rich_dufresne(z7 NC)

I'm nursing a single seedling of it, with the first pair of true leaves just now peeking out. The seedling itself was distinct from all the other sage seedlings, so I am hoping it will prove as distinct.

James Compton compared it to S. darcyi when he described the latter. This is one I've lusted after for over 30 years, having seen a type sheet at the Harvard Herbarium.

    Bookmark   March 16, 2008 at 9:59PM
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gerris2

I can't imagine a 10 foot tall sage...that would be taller than any of my Brugmansias!

    Bookmark   March 27, 2008 at 12:08PM
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castro_gardener

I don't know where you live, but in my yard, near San Antonio, I grow salvia involucrata which does wonderfully under my mesquite trees.

Good luck with your project.

patty

    Bookmark   March 30, 2008 at 12:33PM
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annebert(6b/7a MD)

Dang - they have to be new world? S koyame is a lovely sage for shade.

    Bookmark   April 4, 2008 at 9:00PM
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laurabs(7b)

If you're a writer, you should be aware that the word "latter" has a very strict meaning and refers to the second of two, and it is not correct to use this word to mean the last two in a list. I wouldn't point this out except it sounds like you might be a writer.

    Bookmark   April 5, 2008 at 2:19PM
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ccroulet(z9 CA Sunset 18)

James Compton compared "it," which is Salvia stolonifera, to Salvia darcyi when he described "the latter," which is S. darcyi. There are two plants: S. stolonifera and S. darcyi. "Latter" refers to the second one.

    Bookmark   April 6, 2008 at 12:59AM
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wardda

You are right laurabs, my error. Left to my own devices I make lots of mistakes and I'm always in need an editor or even a keeper.

It would be nice to say I have total control of what I grow, but every spring reminds me that this is not the case. The day this question was posted six cuttings of chiapensis went onto the hot bed and a couple of days ago six rooted chiapensis came back out and into small pots. So chiapensis it is. They will provide center pieces on the picnic tables on the deck. Maybe if they are in heavy clay pots they will stay in place for the season?

    Bookmark   April 6, 2008 at 6:18PM
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