Mango Cold Damage

swrancherJanuary 12, 2010

How do you spot cold damage on Mango trees? How long does damage take to show itself? Is there anything you can do to minimize damage effects once its done? Should you water or not water the tree when it warms up? How about about miscolored leaves? leave them or take them off? My only uncovered tree, a large VP has some slightly brownish green leaves on some outer and bottom facing foliage and I'm wondering if I should just ignore and see what happens? The tree looks pretty good otherwise. My smaller Pickering tree has a few tan areas on some top facing newer growth leaves that were touching the blanket that covered it, should I clip them? All my other trees seem fine so far and I'm wondering how long before I can assume they are ok.

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bluepalm

Damage shows up pretty quickly. Young tender growth (from the previous season...growth that is green and not "woody") will often look wrinkled and dessicated. Leaves may be spotted and will turn brownish. In severe cases the entire tops of limbs will be torched brown. I personally would leave the tree alone and prune in the springtime. A 25' tall Glenn on the street over from me lost about 20-25% of its growth to the cold this year (and also lost about 20% due to cold last year). It is torched brown. I plan on taking a picture and posting it when I have a chance. Your trees sound like they did just fine...that's great!

Bluepalm

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 2:48PM
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hmhausman(FL 10B)

Tony:

My general advice would be to let them start to recover before doing any pruning. Some people advocate spraying with fungicide to prevent fungal infection where the tree has suffered damage. Mangos are pretty resilient. As long as they have water and some dirt to grow in....they'll be fine. I am watering only my smaller, newly planted trees. The larger ones have their roots in the water table and get all the moisture they need. I think after a 2 week period, you'll have a better assesment of any damage sustained.

Harry

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 4:27PM
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floridays(9B)

I concur, all pruning should be held off unil March 15.

First, you don't want to encourage new growth yet (by pruning) and secondly the damaged leaves act as a buffer and "sacrificial" structure around the still intact growth.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 4:51PM
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swrancher

A picture tells a thousand words so heres a few thousand.

My Valencia Pride Mango tree that had no cold protection or covering due to its large size. Ended up with some brownish leaves on outer and lower limbs. Hopefully its ok, my favorite, largest and first planted Mango tree.

Closeup of the VP's leaves.

My Pickering Mango tree, seemed to get some leaf damage where the newer leaves touched the blanket protecting it otherwise seems ok.

The coldest part of my yard as marked by the path of cold blasted brown grass, which was green just a few day earlier.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 5:52PM
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jsvand5

Those don't look bad at all. I doubt you see anything more than a few leaves drop.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 6:00PM
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bluepalm

Congrats...your trees like fine. : )

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 6:50PM
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mango_kush

that banana tree looks like it seen better days but those are good for resurrecting themselves.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 6:59PM
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andrew78(6)

SWrancher,
Congats! I am very happy for you. I hope everyone else has the good luck you do! Your VP mango looks great considering what it went thru. Bananas I know will sprout from the root system, and if it were me, I would rather have dead bananas then dead mango, especially that huge VP! I would have cried if that were my tree and it died!!
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 8:06PM
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floridays(9B)

Here's some cold damage...an uncovered Valencia Pride on the back of the property. (we have been below freezing for 9 days with 23.7 being the lowest)

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 8:25PM
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floridays(9B)

Experiment...closeup of same VP - lights but no cover. Not sure if it would have done this without the lights. Interesting line of live/dead
By the way this tree is about 10' tall

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 8:38PM
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swrancher

Thanks everyone for the positive words.

Andrew - I would have been crying if I lost my VP tree, I'm still hoping to get lots of fruit from it this year.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 9:15PM
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bluepalm

One thing I've noticed is that the die-back on the 25' Glenn on the street next to me pruned the tree back to a manageable size last year...and the tree got a good "pruning" this year from the cold. So there is SOME benefit to the limb-dieback on larger trees!

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 10:17PM
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andrew78(6)

Swrancher,
How would you rate the fruits for the Valenicia Pride? I have heard a lot of positive feedback on this fruit. I really would like one more and since I have had very few issues with the care of the three that I have, I have been considering one more mango but it has to be the last mango tree for me or I will get my you know what kicked! I also am considering a lychee. That will bring my grand total to around 12 fruit trees. I don't even live in a house! I am workin on that. I just don't know if i can picture myself living in NY state for the rest of my life!
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 11:00PM
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mango_kush

i know youre all about the pruning Andrew but Valencia Pride is a pretty large tree, you probably know.

ive seen a full grown in the ground at Spykes nursery. i wouldnt do it.

stick with the condos, thats what they were cultivated for. everyone tells me Pickering tastes like coconut, i want to try one this season.

    Bookmark   January 12, 2010 at 11:10PM
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andrew78(6)

Is pickering a condo type??

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 12:45AM
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hmhausman(FL 10B)

Pickering would be a good choice, both because of its size and also its flavor.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 5:55AM
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bluepalm

Here's a picture of the two mango trees on the street next to mine (zip 32780). The one in the back is a Glenn, the one in front is a Glenn seedling. This house is 600 ft. from the Indian River (east of it), and the street is basically wide-open (no large oaks and other trees to provide a canopy). We had a week of temps 27-30 and one night a low of 25.7. MK is right...the Valencia Pride is a BIG mango tree (I'll take a picture of a big one near me when I have a chance and will post it). It's a better-than-average tasting mango in my opinion, but not a top-tier one. If I had a lot of property and room for 15-20 trees, I would probably grow it though.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 10:43AM
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bluepalm

sorry, this house is WEST of the Indian River

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 10:49AM
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bluepalm

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 11:02AM
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mango_kush

i would rate Valencia Pride a 4 out of 5, similar to Haden (i think its a seedling). there are definitely better mangos. nice trees, the fruit get large and get a nice blush with sun.

Glenn is a better choice.

Andrew:
Pickering is what many would consider a top tier condo mango. fairchild is also an excellent condo as well as Mallika which has an Indian mango flavor. there are so many excellent distinct condo varieties; why would you want to grow a more vigorous type in an container

IMO the best attribute of many Haden seedlings is their tree stature. your Lancetilla can hold up to any of them as far as fruit quality.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 4:18PM
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bluepalm

I unwrapped my trees today. The mangos that received moderate cold damage (in descending order of damage) are: Nam Doc Mai (no tree canopy over it, south side of house), Keitt (no tree canopy over it, south side of house), Rosigold (partial oak canopy, NW side of house), Glenn (no tree canopy NE side of house), Alphonso (no tree canopy, NE side of house). My Mallika, Edward, Dot and Southern Blush did very well. I was really surprised at how damaged my Nam Doc Mai got. It is 20' from my house and was wrapped well.
All of my longans are fine (even the small 3-4' ones). I don't see any cold damage on them at all. My lychees are fine (Sweetheart has a touch of cold damage evident in the veins of some leaves turning red), and my white sapote (Redlands) did fine. In fact, it had tender new growth on it before the freeze and this growth is unfazed. All of my bananas were torched and my pineapples sustained 20%+ freeze damage. My Carpentaria acuminata palms are really damaged (chainsaw time this spring I think) and one of my favorite plants, my beautiful and elegant 50' black bamboo (Gigantochloa atroviolacea) is torched from top to bottom. I hope it is not dead and doubt that it is. All in all, I'm happy that my tropicals lived. With how cold it was here I'm pleased with my results. I hope everyone else fared o.k. too.

Bluepalm

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 5:03PM
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stanofh

I think you might have to wait to see how those young Mangos future will be. 23F seems to me,should have killed them outright,let alone followed by the rest of the cold spell. Here in norcal a 32 will defoliate Manila mangos that otherwise do well in cool frost free winters. I have a potted Bailey but,cant say exactly how much cold it can take-I moved it into the garage for two nights of 32-33~ here in December...otherwise its in full leaf with a red flush still holding.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 6:03PM
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mango_kush

the browning of my anonas is starting, surprised the leaves are still on.
my malay apple looks toasted but still alive . i didnt protect anything.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 6:44PM
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andrew78(6)

Hello Bluepalm,
I am happy you sustained minimal damage. I was wondering if you have any large water areas like a lake or a river that might have offered some protection to your smaller mangoes.
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 7:13PM
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bluepalm

I live 500 ft. from the Indian River (on the mainland), but I am pretty sure it gave me no protection. The oak canopy on my property however does wonders. The reason why I think the proximity to the river does not offer any protection is my neighbor lives on the river and he has Areca palms that are literally 5' from the water and they are absolutely torched. My Arecas (same size, under oaks) suffered much less damage. I would have thought that being on the river would help but I guess the NW wind blows all the heat away towards the east.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 7:58PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Congrats Swrancher, Floridays and Bluepalm! For the extreme low temps and the long duration of the cold we had, its really wonderful news...Congrats Again. Very happy for you guys. Great sigh of relief.

Thanks for posting all those great pictures! A picture is definitely worth a thousand words!

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 8:48PM
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bluepalm

Puglvry1,
I hope your lychees make it. You had one of the prettiest, bushiest, glossiest, happiest lychee trees I've ever seen...that would be a shame if it died.

    Bookmark   January 13, 2010 at 9:56PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Thanks Bluepalm...it looks really pitiful now. the trees sustained "Severe" damages. I am really very upset I trusted FP to work. I guess only time will tell if the tree lives?

    Bookmark   January 14, 2010 at 7:33AM
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jb_fla(9a)

pug-

i'd start scratching the bark to see if you see any green...

    Bookmark   January 14, 2010 at 8:25AM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Just checked the lychee trees...I'm starting to see bark splitting, limbs and branches are def. dead. The whole tree looks like someone used a blow torch on it. I will have to prune one of them down to about 2 1/2 or so to see if it will recover. I won't do this till the 1st or 2nd week of March when the threat of frost is done. The trunk doesn't look dead (yet)...whether it will show up much later only time will tell.

My mangoes did better...some better than others. My Cogshall did the best, followed by Glenn, Keitt, lancetilla. My Carrie and Haden suffered the most. The leaves aren't fried but very stressed and deformed looking.

    Bookmark   January 14, 2010 at 1:56PM
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bluepalm

...ouch.

    Bookmark   January 14, 2010 at 8:20PM
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pepperot(FL)

Hey pug,
I had a new lychee airlayer completely cold burned last year (unprotected) but it came back with completely new growth by summertime. I wish I took pics but the growth started to come back from the bottom trunk close to the ground. So you've got to keep hope alive :)

    Bookmark   January 14, 2010 at 9:11PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Thanks for giving me hope pepperot! Hope is all I have right now,lol...Appreciate it, keeping fingers crossed. Very glad to hear yours came back. How long ago did you plant it before it got burned?

    Bookmark   January 15, 2010 at 7:12PM
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jsvand5

Pug, How many years did you have your lychees in the ground before these last two rough ones? Did they make it through the winters undamaged before?

    Bookmark   January 15, 2010 at 8:39PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Jsvand, I planted them in April and May 07...three years this May. Last year, one of them had some damage...but not to this extent. I covered them last year with some light underneath as they were much smaller. This year I put my complete trust in Freeze Pruf because the tree is pretty tall and I did not have a cover large enough. Since FP claimed to give up to 9 degrees of protection, I thought I had it covered. The initial damage was done when it was only 28° or 29°. So I was really very upset that it didn't work at all!!

    Bookmark   January 15, 2010 at 9:13PM
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bluepalm

After a week of below freezing temps at night, the last night of cold (25.7) really put the "whack" on my trees. My incompetent weathermen (local, NOAA, Wunderground, and Weather.com) had forecast my low to be 31 that night, so I didn't take the usual measures I normally take to put heat sources under my trees (which I had done for 2 of the previous coldest nights). I am floored by how "off" the weather forecasters were for my area, night after night. Anyway, I'm in zipcode 32780, zone 9b, and here are some cold damage pics about 5 days later. All of my trees were covered except my Black Sapote (trunk was wrapped), and my Strawberry Tree (had a thick blanket thrown on the top...it didn't cover the entire canopy). My lychees (which were covered) have almost no cold damage and my longans (which were covered) are basically unscathed.
Alphonso mango (with a Glenn mango in the background):

Black Sapote (looked great during and immediately after the cold...now it is shedding almost all of its glossy leaves):

Small (3') Fairchild mango:

9-10' Glenn mango:

Pineapples:

Rosigold mango:

Nam Doc Mai mango with a smaller Southern Blush mango in the background:

Aechmea blanchetiana (bromeliad) damage. This plant is usually pinkish-yellow/green:

    Bookmark   January 17, 2010 at 3:47PM
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andrew78(6)

Dear Bluepalm,
I offer my sincere condolences to your tropicals. Those small manoges look so bad. Even the larger ones that you would think would be hardier look pretty beaten up. Do you think any of your tropical fruit trees will be a total loss? I can't imagine having trees that far along and then having to cut them back so far. I hope that you still have some mango trees that will bear fruit. The glenn looks like half of it that is still okay, or is that another tree. It was hard for me to see in that picture. I am surprised the pineapple didn't suffer so much but I suppose the heat is closer to the ground then the trees. Good luck with saving your tropicals.
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 17, 2010 at 4:46PM
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bluepalm

Andrew, c'est la vie. No tears here. I'm pretty sure that almost all of my stuff is still alive. Just a temporary set-back. The small Fairchild is actually o.k....the limbs are not black from the cold. They were black before the snap. I'm not sure if it is anthracnose or what...that was just how they looked. The two mango trees that I have that got it really bad are the Rosigold and the Nam Doc Mai. The Glenn looks worse than it really is. The 1/2 of the Glenn tree is green (I tied that branch up to make it fit in the frost cloth). This cold snap nuked a bunch of stuff in my yard; large bamboo, a lot of bromeliads, a lot of palms, other bushes, etc. After how horrible this cold snap was, I'm happy that my stuff is even alive! I hope the best for my fellow GW members too.

Best regards,
Bluepalm

    Bookmark   January 17, 2010 at 5:56PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Hi Bluepalm, I think your trees will be just fine. I'm sorry that it will set us back a little...but that is part of the challenge we have growing tropical trees in zones where they are not recommended. Andrew, unfortunately, these are the risks we take when we grow these wonderful and delicious fruits. We know that the risks are great but we do what we can to protect them. It doesn't always work out...but we keep trying anyway. Some of mine are more damaged than Bluepalm...and can only hope for the best. I've always been a zone pusher and right now they are really pushing back very hard. I will probably not replace the ones I will lose. I might try them in pots instead.

Good luck on your trees and to all of us...we need it!

    Bookmark   January 17, 2010 at 6:42PM
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andrew78(6)

Bluepalm,
Im glad to here the Rosigold is fine along with tho other tropicals. It looks like you have an awe4some fruit garden. I would love to see it when it is flourishing. I only wish I could have that backyard.
Pug,
So what do you think will be your total losses? I hope none of the mangoes are on that list!! Now I know that certain tropicals are still considered too tender for parts of FL, but what are your zone pushers? I was also wondering what part of central FL do you live in. I know from the maps that there are sevral large lakes in the center of the state but it doesn't sound like they provided anyone with much protection. I heard a lot of people say that the cold winds were a big part of the problem. Hmmmmmm....guess in some ways it is good to have your tropicals in pots even though I won't have the gorgeous specimens that most people have (or had:() in Florida. I also wonder if this will become a pattern for everyone. Looking at your pic of your mangoes from last year and then the freezes this year. We definetly need to take better care of the enviroment. Things are just getting crazy! Pug, don't give up with the tropicals pots or not I am sure you will be rewarded!
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 18, 2010 at 3:56AM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Hi Andrew, I live in Central fl...two hours south of Orlando in Highlands County. There is a lake a couple of miles away, so it does absolutely nothing to help me,lol...I am def. pushing my zone limits by growing Mango and Lychee trees. They are not recommended here because we do get a few days of freezes(except this year) was def. an exception.

As far as my losses...its really way too early to tell. Last year the picture above that I posted(inground) Glenn tree...it took almost 5 months to look like a tree again. I've sustained a lot of damage on that tree(branches that are severely burned) hidden underneath the new branches. I probably won't know till at least the end of March early April to see how much damage and see what survives. I will prune the dead branches mid March and see "if" new growth appears and go from there. Pots is def. an alternative for me if I decide not to replace the ones I lose that were in the ground.

    Bookmark   January 18, 2010 at 1:36PM
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andrew78(6)

Pug,
I will be staying pretty close to you when I go back this summer. I am staying with family in Brandon. i like this part of Florida. Seems like a good central location to all things I like whenI go down there. Where do you like going for your tropicals. The only place that Ican think of that is close is Nipa, but is there anything closer? I hope your Glenn pulls thru. BTW I think I am going to buy a Glenn and pot it up like yours. I just hope I can make it look as nice as yours!
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 18, 2010 at 4:02PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

Hey Andrew, I usually buy my trees locally. Some of the local nurseries and some I've gotten at Lowe's and WM. My DH bought me one from Jene's tropicals for my birthday almost 3 years ago. I've never been there, but he had a meeting in St Pete, and asked me what I wanted for my b-day, so I told I wanted a Cogshall mango tree from Jene's,lol...I'm sure your Glenn will do just great if you decide to get one. Thanks for the well wishes!

    Bookmark   January 18, 2010 at 7:40PM
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andrew78(6)

Pug,
I was searching for tropicals in the Brandon area. Maybe the time I was ther they were all out of mangoes and other tropicals. The only thing I could find was citrus, avocado, and bananas. I found some cool tropical herbs but that was it. I am hoping when I go in August this year, I will have better luck. I wonder if it is a season issue. Maybe tropical fruits are not planted this late in the year. When I went to another tropical fruit nursery they only had Nam Doc Mai, and Cogshell. Then again it is better for me to buy locally. I have a hard time seeing all those tropicals and not bring any home with me. I am going to have to hurry up and buy some lights for the basement and get them ready. I have a feeling I am going to almost doublw what I have all ready. I am completly obsessed. I need help. I wonder if there are support groups for people like me!
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 18, 2010 at 7:54PM
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puglvr1(9b central FL)

You could be right about it being a seasonal thing. I know that most of mine I've purchased in the Spring. They seem to have the best/most selection then. I guess if you were to plant it in the ground, March/April would be the best time of the year to do so. That way it would have almost 9 months in the ground before our first possible freeze. At least that's what I would do. Good luck finding some when you make it to Brandon.

I think we need to form a TFAA Group(Tropical Fruits Addiction Anonymous),lol...of course this place is very bad as there are so many enablers here,lol...

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 2:36PM
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andrew78(6)

I am going to this nursery in Erie sometime in the next week or so. The new tropicals should be in by then and I am hoping that the owner brought back some mango trees. I will just buy them there instead of settling for something because it is all they have. Let me know about that TFAA, I nominate myself for president. I was up till 3:00 am pouring thru old posts on growing mango trees. I have a headache from being up late and getting up early.
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 4:11PM
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jb_fla(9a)

Andrew-

THE nursery in the Brandon area is Kerby's Nursery. I googled their address for you:

2311 South Parsons Avenue
Seffner, FL 33584

They carry almost everything that PIN sells (they buy wholesale from PIN). They usually have all of the mangos on PIN's website. The problem with them is price. They sell 3g mango's for $50. But if your looking for lychee's or anything else PIN sells they have it, just expensive.

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 5:23PM
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andrew78(6)

JB,
Thanks for the address but I all ready had it. I went there last year. They have a nice selection of tropical fruit trees there. I will stop by there when I go down this summer, but if i can make to Miami I am going to stop at Excalibur near the Palm Beach area. I know it will be out of my way to go but I really want to check it out.
Andrew

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 6:37PM
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franktank232(z5 WI)

Isn't it possible, cheaper to grow out mango seedlings from seed (store bought?) and then top work them with other varieties? That is what i'm doing with apples.

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 6:41PM
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hmhausman(FL 10B)

Cheaper, yes, more difficult, yes, longer to gratification (fruiting), unfortuantely yes.

    Bookmark   January 19, 2010 at 10:24PM
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