Best fungicide to use ??

readheads(6)March 29, 2010

I'm thinking of using a regular fungicide this year. There are many out there. Some work on fungus and bugs. Some are copper-based. They all seem to require spraying every 7-10 days + after rain. They can also get pricey.

Does anyone have any experience with "Soap-Shield Flowable Liquid Copper Fungicide" from GardensAlive ?

A quart makes 32 gallons and is $23.45

I think that would last the season for 24 plants.

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First of all Copper is not very effective against protecting tomatoes against the usual fungal diseases. Studies in Germany have found that regularly spraying with good manure teas protect better than Copper. Let me post my warning against Copper again.
I think we all know that the outbreak of blight wrecked havoc amongst the population of Northern Europe (no, not only in Ireland but vast regions of Europe were affected). But people noticed that blight was not an issue or contained around copper plants and thus, a remedy against blight was found. Unfortunately, the heavy use of copper or copper salts and soaps had a devastating effect and caused copper poisoning, brain damage and many times early death of vast numbers of Northern Europeans. Copper is the oldest remedy against blight and other fungal diseases and even today it is not strictly regulated by government authorities, which to me is a crime. Commercial organic farmers use copper and needless to say they use a lot. Like lead, copper is a heavy metal and Copper salts will penetrate your brain barrier and accumulate, and will be toxic above certain limits. Almost anyone of my clients who eats so-called "organic produce" suffers from excessive copper accumulation in their bodies.

There will be those who point out that their father and grandfathers used tons of Copper without affecting their health. Please understand that our environment has become much more acidic and these acids form Copper (Lead, Mercury and other heavy metal) salts. The body can not absorb Copper but readily absorbs Copper Salts. Even our tap water has been polluted and U.S. water works recently added chloramines. Combining chlorine and ammonia results in a compound called chloramines, allows the use of much less chlorine while creating a more potent guard against bacteria and bioterrorism. What could be the problem with this? Keep reading.
Chloramines are much more potent than chlorine alone. How much more potent? Chloramines are so potent that they will actually slowly dissolve the metals from your pipes! So in addition to themselves being dangerous to drink, they will raise the metals level of your drinking water. The enormous implications of that statement may not be immediately clear, so let us spell them out.
Many Americans have copper pipes in their homes. Older homes may still have galvanized steel pipes. Newer homes may use PVC or other plastics. All plumbing installed before 1986 may have joints soldered with lead-based solder. Therefore, vast numbers of Americans now are at risk for exposure to higher levels of metals, including lead, as well as plastics due to the corrosive action of chloramines in their pipes. What kinds of problems can this cause?
In the course of our research we came across three big warning signs around chloramines. The biggest came this from a paper presented to a Canadian conference on municipal water. It showed that mice and rats given chloramine-treated water that had flowed through copper pipes all developed Alzheimers disease symptoms! Upon autopsy it was revealed that these animals had very high levels of copper in their brains. Some of the mice and rats were then given purified water and something equally remarkable happened  the mice recovered from their symptoms! Second, there was the case of an environmental scientist who was determined to understand why children in Washington DC were being tested with high lead levels in their bodies. Investigation showed that the chloramines in DC water were leaching out the lead from pre-1986 solder and old lead pipes, which was then consumed by the children. Finally, we are hearing reports of homeowners finding pinhole leaks in their copper pipes, apparently caused by a combination of thin copper and heavy chloramines. The implication of this is that the rest of us may be due for the same pipe problems eventually.
HereÂs the bottom line: if your water has chloramines added to it nearly all water filters you may be inclined to use will be obsolete. This includes standard carbon filters, ceramic filters, and even basic reverse osmosis and distillation purifiers. This certainly includes so-called "ionizers" which never did much to purify water in the first place. None of these systems are designed to both take out serious toxins such as chloramines and fluoride and metals like copper and lead.
Copper binds very well to top soil and does not migrate much to the ground water. Accumulation of Copper in top soil is one reason why Copper will be banned as a fungizide by the European Community nations and European farmers had to drastically reduce their use of Copper as a fungicide.

    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 10:19AM
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What do you mean "my clients" ?

Is your point that either thru ignorance or conspiracy we are poisoning ourselves ?

It reminds me of the Linus Pauling study of Vitamin C and hampsters relative to plaque buildup in the arteries ?

What the heck is a "good manure tea" ?

    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 10:39AM
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rnewste(8b NorCal)


We had a big discussion of Chlorine and Chloramines in our municipal water systems, and much of what you stated is a view shared by informed experts. However, the balance of risks is in the benefit Chloramines to the water consuming Public re: bacterial reduction, etc.

For my vegetable water source this Season, I am installing a filter which the Manufacturer wrote to me and stated that it significantly reduces the amount of Chloramines in tap water:

We shall see how water filtered through it affects plant health and vigor.

Regarding the OP question, I use a combination of Exel LG, Serenade, and Actinovate for my plants.


    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 2:54PM
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anney(Georgia 8)



You ask a reasonable question, and kablooie-blam-bop! you get hit with a lecture on the evils of copper to beat the band!

All the traditional advice suggests that alternating different kinds of fungicides seems to do it best, and copper is one of them. So far, all I use is Garden Disease Control, but I may get some copper, too. I am keeping my fingers crossed that the heavy hay mulch I've lined up will do a lot to alleviate funguses this year.

Good luck!

    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 2:55PM
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rnewste(8b NorCal)


My only (contribution) to the discussion was to suggest the OP evaluate Exel LG, Serenade, and Actinovate, since none of them are copper based. As a non-Scientist, joachim's points are to be considered. Any time I can avoid the ingestion of Heavy Metals, no matter how small a percentage, then I will attempt to do so. I consider joachim's post to be tactful and worthy of some thought by all of us.


    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 3:43PM
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Agri-Fos also called Exel LG which is also systemic worked well for me last year and is bio friendly. Actinovate is another biofungicide that can be used to prevent soil born disease as well as foliar diseases. Alternating the application of both these products makes for potent fungicide/disease control.

    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 3:47PM
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digdirt2(6b-7a No.Cent. AR HZ8 Sun-35)

"Soap-Shield Flowable Liquid Copper Fungicide" from GardensAlive

No personal experience with it although I have been reading quite a bit about it as I'm considering it for this year to alternate with my regular Daconil spraying. The alternative one I'm considering is the Actinovate.

I do agree with the above that copper-based fungicides have proven to have limited effect but they can help depending on the fungus in question. And you are right - none of them are cheap.

What the heck is a "good manure tea" ?

Good question. ;) Good compost tea used as a foliar spray can help with early blight, but manure tea? Nope, sorry, not as a foliar spray - root drench only in my book.


    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 4:08PM
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I use Pro-Mix with biofungacide when starting seedlings and then Serenade, and Actinovate for plants.
I have been at odds to find Agri-Fos or Excel LG - at a reasonable price - can't remeber which one it was I found but it list's for $400.00 approx for a gallon.

Any better prices? Actinivate $99 for 18 oz powder and Serenade $16 32 oz


    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 5:15PM
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rnewste(8b NorCal)


I get the Exel LG on-line at a company in Florida called

Runs me about $20.00 plus shipping for a Quart.

Here is the link:


    Bookmark   March 29, 2010 at 6:42PM
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I was reading on the use of potassium bicarbonate, its used as a fungicide and is ok for organic use, I have not used it but thought I might give it a try and see if it is effective on rustspot on my fig tree and other problems that might show up. 1 lb container for 10.00$ 4 teaspoons per gallon, seems like it isn`t as pricey as some other products, We drink it in sodas and it is used in baking so I am sure its not as harmful as copper based fungicides. Thats my 2cents worth but I haven`t alot of experience. :o) Deanna

    Bookmark   March 30, 2010 at 12:00AM
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I have used a combination of following:
= NEEM OIL (organic)
= daconill (on gourds, winter squash)
= Milk + water + baking soda(sodium bicarbonate ?)

I think the key is TO PREVENT rather than fight.
If you start a treatment programm and stick to it, and don't give
the fungi a friendly environmen to multiply, that is bettet than
waiting and fighting infestation.

    Bookmark   March 30, 2010 at 1:19AM
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Thanks Raybo and Ted (Ami)
I think I have myself mixed up with this other product I used to use.
Is Agri-Fos and Excel LG basically the same product?
I am going to go by the farm supply and recall my memory on the product I used to buy.

    Bookmark   March 30, 2010 at 1:54PM
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yeah cyrus your right prevention is the key / i use 1 tbs baking soda / 5 or 6 drops of diah soap in 1 gallon of water and spray it on the plants and the ground / start spraying early and every couple of weeks or after a rain / seems to work for me / bsides it is cheap hehehe / or is that frugal hehehe

    Bookmark   March 30, 2010 at 2:31PM
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Dennis Agri-Fos and EXEL LG, different names but the same manufacturer. They be identical. Use the source Ray gave. What you are paying their for a quart is about the same they are charging for a pint of Agri-Fos elsewhere. Ami

    Bookmark   March 30, 2010 at 3:03PM
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