Has anyone tried growing kudzu vine in the north approx. zone5. Do you treat it like an annual or can it grow as a perennial if mulched well? Thanks for any experiences with kudzu in the north.
No experience with kudzu in zone 5 but here in zone 8 it is a monster.
Here in zone 6 it is trying to take over, It grows to the top of trees and kills them. SMOTHERS them, it has covered hills and valleys, smothering everything is its path.
Sounds more aggressive as one goes south. Maybe I'll try and grow it and see if it makes it in the winter. And if not, it would be a fast-growing annual.
I have a friend who grows it up the west-facing side of his garage and it does very well. It blooms and smells great. I am in NW Missouri.
Many years ago a lady stopped and asked my grandfather if she could have a cutting from the kudzu vines along the roadside... he replied that she could have all she liked if she promised to never return them.
I wonder if gardeners are paying enough attention to the problems some of these introduced plants are causing...there are many pretty vines that could be grown in place of kudzu.
It's easy to check the noxious invasive lists per state...kudzu is a huge burden on taxpayer dollars when removal becomes necessary. It's illegal to buy, sell, or grow it in several northern states too, Washington, Oregon, Illinois for example...Also Missouri.
Here is a link that might be useful: Missouri noxious list
That's why I'm getting kudzu before its illegal in my state. Most plants are a burden because of feral acres being left intended. I live on 180 acres and don't have any nuisance plant. If people would get more in touch with nature and work in the outdoors most plants wouldn't be a problem. I've read much information about this kudzu vine. Yes, its crazy down south, but I have a winter. Last time I checked plants don't grow when its below freezing. I'm not looking exactly for a pretty vine. I'm looking for plants with growth rates that exceed typical ones and plants that grow faster the harder they are pushed. They say oxygen doesn't come cheap, but I differ on that opinion.
That's an interesting point of view, but how do you hope to restrain any birds eating seeds to your own 180 acres, then planting them where they can establish. If you had more information, you'd see when well established, freezing does not kill the roots of this plant, otherwise it could not have begun to receive attention in Illinois.
I'm not the plant police, and truly don't want to come off as questioning your sense of responsibilty. Many of us have stopped growing things that could concievably cause problems for a neighbor though, i.e. hybrid loosestrife, english ivy, impatiens glandulifera...the most recently added to the list in Oregon is butterfly bush. The normal course of events would have Washington following and adding buddleia before long. Plants native to your area might fill your requirements for a fast growing cover, naturally support local wildlife, and might be something to consider....
I moved on 2 acres a year ago that had previously been pasture land with a fencerow at the back of the property. It took me months to clear out all the blackberry brambles and multiflora roses, all the while being eaten up by poison oak. Then I came upon a horrible vine that was strangling every sapling in its way. That was my first close-up view of Kudzu. It doesn't matter how cold it gets in the winter; it WILL come back and with a vengence. This past winter we had several 0 degree nights, with the temps running in the 20s for long periods. I skipped one week earlier this month not going to the back to tend the vines and they had covered 20, yes 20!, feet in that time, crawling to the tops of all the young red maple saplings. It took me hours just to clean this new mess up. DON'T EVER PLANT KUDZU if you don't already have it! I think it's one of the worst plants God ever put on this earth! Just my opinion, but you will regret it. It is a total menace here in southwest Virginia.
Before you make your decision, take a look at this site
This would be enough to change my mind!!!!!!!!!
I would grow kudzu if I could, but its totally illegal here in New Zealand. Funny thing is, it was introduced in the 1940's folowing on from its 'success' in southern USA, but on most sites it failed completely. There are a few sites were it grew ok, but 60 years later there is no kudzu menace, and it never became a problem. I think our climate is perfect for it; totally or nearly frost free winters and low heat summers, keeping it growing slowly all year without becoming invasive. And providing a good quantity of natural fertility and quality stock food in the process, as well as improving every soil it grows on. Still sounds like the perfect plant to me :-)
it's not nearly the problem in Japan, where it's harvested and put to use...
but I hear people saying the same thing about mint, it's a monster, it's an invader, it's impossible to live with...and here I don't even like the taste of it, but mine is controlled quite nicely by shearing it ever week for the people at my office who DO like mint in their tea!
kudzu is on the no-no-list just about everwhere for the same reason most forms of hemp are- it's been demonized by the press, and is the plant that everyone knows is 'bad'.
it DOES survive winters in PA by reseeding-and it DOES smell good in season. and you CAN harvest the flowers to make jelly with. and it DOES appeal to bees, who are having a harder and harder time surviving around here.
it will also lift the vinyl siding and infiltrate your insullation, it does harbor critters on the same level as english ivy.
so it's like having a car. or a trumpet creeper vine... it is a s beneficial, or as dangerous, as you allow it to be.
Kudzu is a fine plant, and when there are only about a half dozen species growing everywhere, one of them will be kudzu. Those who would rush to the defense of kudzu need not worry, it is here to stay. As pointed out, it strangles trees and invades the 180 acres of those who don't want it. To those who think it can be handled like mint, come on, mint grows a couple of feet tall, and is not the problem of Kudzu, like most any small plant. Those who think it may help bees, NOT! The scarcity of the introduced Apis mellifera has to do with the Varroa mite. These mites also are present on other bees, which pollinate Kudzu more than the Honeybee. So by planting Kudzu, you propagate Japanese Beetles (but rest assured that they respect property lines), Carpenter Bees (whose tongue is long enough to reach the bottom of the flowers and things like Curcullios and other beetles.
For those who think that hundreds of acres means that you can opt out of responsible stewardship, I ask the following: Assuming that you are not immortal, how can you think it is ok to leave to those who come after us a swath of land overgrown with a noxious weed? What if the people before you had thought kindly of planting brambles and multiflora rose. Would your slice of paradise be open enough for you to plant your weeds? And what if the neighbor's fences came down and his cows got into your crops, doesn't the thought of his invasives mean that you should also respect your neighbors activities by not letting your invaders wander where they want? Not planting a plant that has shown the aggressiveness that Kudzu has is a small price to live in peace with your neighbors.
When Don moved in across the road, he planted some Tatarian Honeysuckle. I told him that I could not tell him what to plant, but at the same time I hoped he would understand if I let the Poison Ivy climb the locust out front. I am not bothered by that plant, sorry if the birds ate the seeds and he had to constantly eliminate them from his flower beds.
Now, we have neither Poison nor Lonicera tatarica, which suits us both. He was of the mind at first that he would keep his plant and I could watch the vine turn red in the fall. After I showed him the poison seedlings, he was at a loss of what to do. He really liked the flowers on his shrub, and didn't understand how I could equate something as beautiful as his blooming Lonicera with the scourge of Poison Ivy. It was a teachable moment you could say.
Estimated plantings for 2005:
soybeans: 73.9 million acres
corn : 81.4 million acres
Cotton : 23.8 million acres
Wheat : 58.6 million acres
Sorghum : 7.4 million acres
Hay : 62.9 million acres
It is estimated that there is 817 million acres in rangeland and 427 million acres in cropland production in the United States. Kudzu occupies only estimated 7 million acres which could, if wanted to, be in production raising meat goats. Kudzu really isn't a problem when you look at the big picture of things. Sorry to get technical, but some of these posts are an utter disapointment.
But those 7 million acres of kudzu are NOT presently reclaimable, by any means. No matter who owns them, or what measures they take. Not even GOATS will eat kudzu!!!
This was exactly the type of posts I was talking about. Evidently, Judithw goes by her opinion or what the media says. There are actual Facts that support the claim that goats eat kudzu because they actually see them eating the vine.
Here is a link that might be useful: Maybe opinions should be discarded for this story.
lkz5ia, if you wish to avoid opinions, as you say, then there are facts more important than whether or not goats will eat it. And you say "only 7 million acres" like it was a trivial figure. And I confess to being confused to your addition of the "facts" about acreages of crops etc. in this country. This has nothing to do with planting kudzu. I could quote you the price of goat meat in Jordan, or the number of trips it takes for a bee to make a gram of honey, but that, like your facts, neither supports nor detracts from your opinions.
It is your opinion that all kudzu infested acreage is suitable for goat production. How about the acreage bordering the interstates? The acreage next to vegetable production areas? Maybe you think goats can be pastured in the national forests where they would strip it clean? It may be your opinion that goats can be used to clean up the mess, but the facts don't match.
The fact that the production of cereal grains and oilseed takes up so many acres cannot be equated with kudzu taking 7 million acres. One hundred acres of corn benefits more people than one million acres of kudzu. That is a fact. Each acre of kudzu bears some of the costs of control, so each acre is a net debit.
It may be your opinion that an acre of kudzu is equal to an acre of diodiversity, but there are no facts to back that up. After the kudzu arrives, many species are out-competed for life and disappear. The insects that eat those plants also leave, etc.
I don't understand why you say some of the posts are utter disappointments. If you want to see what kudzu really means, there are literally millions of pages describing the drawbacks of this vine, and less than 1/10 that many touting any benefit, yet you choose to claim the informed view, and point out that goats will eat it. Great. Goats will eat almost anything, and they have proven themselves to be a disaster all their own in a lot of places. To claim that everybody else is a dupe of the media and that you alone possess the truth is a bit far fetched.
Oh, yeah. I forgot to mention lawns with foreign grass in them. Thanks Pistol Pete for mentioning about useless things. You know and I know the acreage of lawns in the United STates is so massive that kudzu looks like an ant. Lawns in the U.S. are wastelands filled with irrigated water, pesticides, and fertilizers that pollute even more acres than they occupy. Does kudzu do that? No. Kudzu being superior; without diseases or insects to affect it is a valuable resource rather than a scourge.
The reason I mentioned the average acres that were to be planted in certain crops for 2005 was to show the vast quantity of land being torn up for pete's sake. kudzu is estimated to occupy less land than acreage planted in your yummy sorghum syrup. Syrup feed the hungry? Most corn is fed to cattle, not humans. Very wreckless use of resources.
Opinions are fine, but "Not even GOATS will eat kudzu!!!" is absolutely blasphemy. The only reason I stated the facts that goats do indeed eat it is because of Judith's weird sentence that said they don't eat it. I wasn't saying that goats could be eating kudzu along the interstate. You and I know better than that. I hope that was in jest or that would be the utter and some of the disapointment I was speaking of. I hear little talk about invasives the majority is thought to like and hear much about what invasives are taught to hate. bye-bye.
A couple of years ago I read of this eldery couple that had kudzu fields that they managed. They harvested the vine for feeding their animals, made jelly from the fruit and literally used all of the vine. I would love to experiment with a field of it but never would for fear of bringing in an uncontrolable pest for future generations. Lowes here was selling the cats claw vine that I was interested in buying until I did research on it and found it was highly invasive so I marked it off my list. I control what I grow in my gardens and on my land but not everyone does the same.
I can't control the rosa multiflora planted by some reckless previous owner on 15 acres because of seeding, etc. How do you think you can control kudzu on 180? It's tempting to just think you will pay the price for your own foolishness, but the reality is all of your neighbors and future property owners will pay that price as well. Try thinking about what your actions do to others. Try being genuinely neighborly.
The multiflora rose is not a beast that many presume it to be. It is easy to control where you don't want it to be by digging it out. It grew in many places on my farm and created nice wildlife habitat. I would've also thought about making living fences out of it because of its beauty and stature. But RRD came and most of them have been dismissed from life on earth. If you have trouble spading them out or cutting them down because of your age or disability, maybe releasing RRD is the right choice in your area.
Count me in with the group that feels it's utterly irresponsible to introduce an extremely destructive and invasive plant into an ecosystem. The fact that the roots can go as deep as 9 feet, pretty much secures it's survival in the north.
Too many native plants have been decimated by imports. South Florida is a good example, I grew up in Lauderdale in the 50's and loved to go swamp trompin in the everglades. You could find some beautiful orchids in the hammocks. Not anymore. I don't think there is a native plant left down there and the everglades is disappearing at an alarming rate because of melaleuca trees that were brought in almost 100 years ago to drain the swamps.
But you go ahead lkz5ia. You plant your kudzu. Who know's, you may be the one who produces kudzu that can withstand freezing temperatures. Ain't natural selection great? Once you have it under control, please contact virtually every University in the South and tell them to stop their research and development because you know how to control kudzu. They will be utterly grateful for your invaluable insight into a problem they have been trying to solve for decades and who knows, they may be willing to give you a reward for saving the millions of dollars spent to iradicate this weed. And please dear lkz5ia.
On the other hand .. I hope you enjoy your infamy when it is discovered that you are the reason your state is now on the list of kudzu invaded states.
This map is where kudzu is invasive (red). As you can see, it survives in the north.
My name is Robin Pruisner. I am the State Entomologist & Bureau Chief of Entomology and Plant Science for the Iowa Department of Agriculture and Land Stewardship. I am recognized by the USDA as the State Plant Regulatory Official. The State Weed Commissioner answers to me.
While kudzu is not listed as a primary or secondary noxious weed in the state of Iowa, we do actively look for kudzu on an annual basis. The Iowa Weed Law can only be modified by an act of our legislature. However, we are working to change this, so that the list of noxious weed would be placed in departmental rule, thus allowing the department to change the list without waiting for the legislature to do it during the annual winter/spring legislative sessions. We plan to add kudzu to the list as soon as possible. Once on the list, all kudzu would be illegal whether it was ÂestablishedÂ prior to the listing, or after.
However, the state of Iowa does not need to wait until there is a law change to be able to take action on kudzu. Via Iowa Code chapter 317.17, the Iowa Secretary of Agriculture can declare additional weeds as ÂnoxiousÂ, thus falling under the requirements of the Iowa Weed Law.
At this point in time, kudzu is not known to be able to survive the average Iowa winter. However, it is theorized that if we had an unusually warm winter that it may be possible for kudzu to survive if foliage was protected. It has survived in Illinois Â and that state is working diligently to eradicate it now.
Each year I receive at least one report of a suspect kudzu patch. Each report is taken seriously and thoroughly checked out. So far, no reports have actually turned up kudzu in Iowa Â since 1925. If I find kudzu, I will order it destroyed.
Why destroy kudzu? Well, actually thereÂs more than one reason. First, as plants evolve, it is possible for them to build up a cold tolerance. If this is happens, we want to stop it dead in its tracks before it can ramp up and be a menace in Iowa like it is in the South Â killing/overtaking all other vegetation and native plants. Second, Iowa is this nationÂs largest producer of soybeans. A new disease is threatening the nationÂs soybean crop Â Asian soybean rust (ASR). ASR can also reproduce on kudzu. Kudzu patches can harbor the disease, allowing more and more disease spores to be produced, released, and find their way to soybean fields. Right now, there are no resistant lines of soybeans to ASR and it will not be economically feasible Â nor environmentally sustainable - to control ASR with fungicides if the infestation is heavy. Thus, controlling alternative hosts for ASR, such as kudzu, is very important.
I hope you think long and hard before trying to introduce a non-native, invasive plant into Iowa. And, if you decide to do it anyway, weÂll likely meet in the future.
I am an avid gardener. I love nurturing plants as much as the next personÂ But, I also oversee a program that spends most of its time and resources battling invasive, noninative plants, insects and diseases - such as kudzu, emerald ash borer, gypsy moth, Asian longhorn beetle, sudden oak death, Asian soybean rust, giant hogweed, multiflora rose, etc., etc.
If you have any questions, concerns or general comments, please feel free to contact me.
Robin, thank you for taking the time to give us your input; most of do appreciate your advice! Kudzu has been found growing here in Washington State near the Oregon border - it's my understanding the 4 small areas where the vine was removed need to be montitored for 10 years before it's considered truly eradicated.
I would rather my tax dollars were spent on something more worthwhile than cleaning up someones uneducated choice in plant materials :)
I shall die by the sword then. :)
Excuse my ignorance, but what is RRD?
Rose Rosette Disease. RRD is a biological weapon of sorts to eradicate these roses.
Rosa multiflora Thunb. (Rosaceae), an invasive plant, reduces the value of land for grazing or recreational purposes because dense patches of the plant are impassable and are not fed upon by most livestock.
That's why goats are being integrated into cattle pastures so that cows eat grass and goats clean up the brush.
I was trying to be a mannerly lurker and not react to your position on kudzu. I thought maybe you were knowledgeable and I should give you a break.
However, your suggestion that someone should spread RRD proves you don't know what you are talking about. RRD is an incurable disease which kills all roses. It is spread by a tiny mite that travels on air currents. It can travel great distances in the wind. No insecticide can kill the mite. Once established in an area, all cultivated roses are doomed. Although some agricultural agents did suggest this method to control rosa multiflora, the practice is being suspended in most areas.
Harry from the Rose Forum
RRD would kill gottagarden's mulfiflora roses. So actually I did know what I was talking about. I didn't say it would or wouldn't kill all roses in general.
"Although some agricultural agents did suggest this method to control rosa multiflora, the practice is being suspended in most areas." Exactly. That's where the information came from. Sue your local government for putting out such nonsense, but don't site me for not knowing what I was talking about.
No one wants diseases or insect pests that are uncontrollable, but to put plants in the same category of these is quite an argument in its self.
My point is that you should not have made such a suggestion if you were not aware of all the future consequences. We all have to be cognizant of the fact that many folks lurking here are learning and may take any suggestion as gospel. I am looking for a vine right now. Based on your posts, I might have chosen kudzu. Fortunately, some of the good souls on this Forum gave me the full story.
It may have been in the gospel, but my point was more of a parable. Also, I highly doubt a learner would be getting their hands on biocontrol agents so freely. Most of those are available only by governmental and black market means. People shouldn't be so highly critical of the kudzu vine. More than one article has mentioned that in the great depression the south would have lost more soil than it did, but because of the kudzu erosion control properties it didn't. All I asked for was some respect for your elders. Though few people commented on my original question(thanks people!), most just ranted on the same hysteria. Thanks alot everyone for treating kudzu like your parents you threw in the nursing home. The end of storing time, until next time-bye,bye.
Sorry, but you must have no idea how ridiculous you sound - at least in print. I'm really tired (8 family members from Europe visiting all month), but I'm laughing out loud over my keyboard right now...
When did 'honor thy father and mother' become replaced with 'honor thy kudzu vine'.....
MorZ8, Haven't you heard of the saying "if you have nothing good to say then don't say it at all"? Every message you have had on this thread has been with a negative overtone. My question was directly linked to people in the north with kudzu experience and growing. If you have a stake in the herbicide industry I understand why you have put your propaganda on here. Otherwise I have not a clue why you joined in this discussion.
Ikz- I have been trying to figure out if you are actually serious about planting zudzu or just creating a lively thread here on the forum. I do hope that you consider the problems this vine will cause in the future if you plant it. You can not contol kudzu.
If you want kudzu, then you should plant kudzu, and then stand back and watch your car, house, dog house, shed, barn, trees, garden, fields, and everything else in your little patch of earth being smothered by kudzu...if you have any affection for those particular things, realize you may never see them again.
I have seen kudzu, and what it does is NOT pretty!!
But hey, it's your stuff...some people only learn not to touch a hot stove by TOUCHING it.
I can hear your gentle nature Mary, but I have to disagree. "You do not inherit the land from your fathers, you borrow it from your children."
Actually, goats WILL eat kudzu---but only after everything else is DEAD...
That's the nature of kudzu. It kills everything, therefore; there is only one thing to eat for the goats. KUdzu. I thought that was self-explanatory in previous posts.
You do realize that RRD is indiscriminate in killing any rose. It's spread by mites and will destroy roses many miles away. This includes garden roses. I can only assume that since you detest lawns, you also feel we should not grow any flowers or shrubs on our lots.
Yeah, concrete your whole yard. Isn't that what the government is telling you these days.
Perhaps you are just trying to get an inflammatory post going, or you simply cannot understand the problem. People have been giving you advice on the problems with this vine, and it is a well-known problem.
I have seen places where literally mountains have been reduced to bulges of kudzu. I have seen huge amounts of acreage where *no* plant species can coexist, native or otherwise. Controlling this vine once established is for all practical purposes impossible. I've seen this vine grow out of control in Zone 5b (north of Indianapolis, IN).
You almost sound like the feedback given to you in good faith on this post is some sort of conspiracy against your desire to plant this vine. Then why are you here soliciting advice, when it seems quite apparent that you have little interest in listening?
OK, I'll be perfectly honest. Yes, kudzu will grow in Zone 5. And yes, you will regret it within a few years, and everyone around your property will suffer because of it. And you could almost not damage the environment more, even if you *did* pave over your property.
goats can eat it but it doesnt provide good control, and doesnt kill the vine because goats cant reach the foliage above them.
Unless they could hover like a hummingbird.
Maybe mountain goats could climb 60+ foot trees. I've seen trees that high completely covered to the point where hardly a leaf can see light.
It almost makes me cry seeing a magnificent, titanic, couple-hundred year old white oak or hickory being killed by that verminous vine within a few seasons. Incredible beauty and wildlife habitat turned into a near-biological wasteland.
Kudzu is like something out of a B-rated horror movie....
to answer your question, ikz, I can't tell if it's a perennial or an aggressively self-seeding annual around here in pennsylvania zone 6.
but I do know that the market for goat meat is pretty small, and it's not to most people's tastes, so if you're proposing growing it for your own use, I hope you like goat.
the problem is this- it's not just your 180 acres that's involved. and while I think it's fine clambering over an otherwise abandoned lot in the city (actually, in several spots, particualrly clever homeless cats have trained it over their camp sites, hiding them from the cops, and neutralizing the 'eyesore' factor that is all most people seem to care about their taking up residence) I also have parkland that I need to consider before I plant things.
I spend 20 hours a season pulling purple loostrife out of the delaware canal, where it's trying its danmdest to take over- through no malice of its own, but it simple doesn't belong here.
if you want to plant something, why not check out aramanth, or any of the other beneficial plants? or be daring- the old fashioned hemp plant is far more attractive, and is actually good for the soil in the long term.
yes, there is a certain amount of hysteria...but can you blame them, when you walk in here, and blithely announce your intentions without any apparant concern for your neighbors?
Lkz5ia you have lost your mind!
Here in Maryland kudzu is invasive and covers everything in its path. It is so bad along the Kensington Parkway where I live that my community has an active volunteer group who do nothing but pull this offensive weed and they can't even make a dent. It is ruining the beauty of the park and it is extremely upsetting to read your defense of this nasty foreign vine.
And don't get me started about Rose Rosette Disease. You deserve to have every member of the Rose and Antique Rose Forum come over here and chew you out. That disease is a very real problem for rosarians. To even suggest that it be intentionally spread is enough to make my blood boil.
There I said it.
About Rose Rosette Disease and multifloral rose, studies of the effect on multifloral rose shows that while it does indeed kill the plants infected, seedlings already existing from advance reproduction under the canopy of the killed plant will rush to take its place, and they need only live long enough to set seed again for the process to continue, and thus a thicket can presist that way with only a bit of thinning done to it.
chinacat_sunflower, actually goat meat is one of the most consumed meats in the world. I eat it about everyday of the year. But lets leave the goat talk off this discussion. The only reason I mentioned it was because of judith. Also, with my first post of this, I was researching how kudzu grows in zone 5. I didn't say what my intentions were.
Molineux, I don't know why I should be intentionally chewed out about RRD and the conclusions you have made about what I have said.
You SHOULD be chewed a new one because you imply that it's 'okay' to plant nasty, well-known-to-be-invasive garden thugs JUST BECAUSE you happen to own 180 acres and 'think' you're immortal and your land will never suffer after you're gone, nor will your present neighbors suffer because of your irresponsible land management.
If you aren't intelligent/well-educated enough to understand WHY folks on this thread are dissing your ideas, then--I truly feel sorry for you. Go research 'invasive plants', then come back here when you DO understand what we're all talking about.
Eat some goat while you're doing your research.
I apologize for the harshness of my last post. When I reread what was written I cringe. That was uncalled for and I'm sincerely sorry.
That said my opinions about Kudzu aren't changed. It is a terribly invasive vine. Given that you are only one zone removed for mine it is highly likely that you will not be able to control its phenomenal growth. Birds will spread the seeds all over your county. Just don't do it. This stuff is ugly. It covers everything in a uniform shade of green and destroys the beauty of the natural landscape.
As for Rose Rosette Disease (RRD) you hit a nerve with that one. In several posts back you did suggest that it be used to control Rosa multiflora. It is just that kind of action by my state government that resulted in a bio-disaster and a perfect example of mismanagement of natural resources.
RRD does not limit itself just to multiflora. It effects A-L-L roses and is 100% fatale. Once that contagin spreads throughout a rose's system the plant is done for. Given that the rose is the national flower of the United States it is a very popular garden shrub. Many gardeners rely on roses to provide season long color in the landscape.
What does RRD mean to me? Well I have 4 beautiful climbing pink roses growing on a trellis against the west side of my house. Next year I'm taking them down because I can't risk them getting exposed to RRD and then raining down the disease on the English Roses I have growing nearby. Those plants represent a significant investment. Loosing them to RRD would be also be heartbreaking.
All this wouldn't have even started if Americans had not introduced R. multiflora in the first place. Like Kudzu it is not native and is very invasive. In some places the roots are so well established that they can't simply be dug out by hand.
Judith, I didn't say I owned 180 acres. Just keeping the talk straight.
"That's why I'm getting kudzu before its illegal in my state. Most plants are a burden because of feral acres being left intended. I live on 180 acres and don't have any nuisance plant. If people would get more in touch with nature and work in the outdoors most plants wouldn't be a problem. I've read much information about this kudzu vine."
Quoted from YOUR post, dated June 9, this year.
Okay, maybe you DIDN'T say you OWNED 180 acres---but it's even WORSE if you plan on introducing this PEST on land you DON'T own.
I hope your landlord evicts you---SOON!!!
Landlords don't evict people on the assumption that they might plant a plant that's not illegal.
in the same token, inflicting the plant on those who dont want id on that land is totaly unfair to them. I if it was YOUR land that would be a fifferent story. i wouldnt like it if a neibor planted blindweed in my yard because she thought it looked pretty (she did, and ive been fighting with it ever since)
I checked the date on this original post several times to make sure this was in fact a new post. It's a very familiar script.
It seems like every 18 months or so, someone on some forum will start a similar thread about kudzu. When they get jumped on, they innocently respond they were just asking for information. Then will prolong the discussion with a casual remark suggesting unleashing some spore, diesease, or biological agent to get rid of other problem plants.
What the heck; it's amusing if somewhat predictable!
Sounds like some people can think alike. Interesting observation Alison.
A MONUMENT TO AN INSECT! A cairn probably still exists to honor the Cactobastis cactorum for its role in the control of the prickly pear cactus in Australia. I dislike Govt. control as much as anyone but many years ago I had to study the saga of this insect and this plant and I am uneasy with unregulated propagation of plants and animals.
"No cats, no honey" was another example but the details elude me. There are many, many instances of well intentioned introductions that produced horrible consequences. The water hyacinth (Eichornia crassipes) is a good and current example.
I CANT GET IT TO GROW AT ALL- I KNOW WHERE THERES LOTS BUT HAVE TRIED A DOZEN TIMES ALL SUMMER TO TRANSPLANT SOME AND IT NEVER WORKS- I MAJORED IN HORT AND THE STUFF DIES NO MATTER WHAT I DO. IF YOU HAVE A SURE FIRE WAY TO GET IT TO GROW LET ME KNOW....I KNOW I KNOW THE VINE THAT ATE THE SOUTH. BLA BLA BLA
First, if you majored in Hort, you know it's illegal for you to grow this.
Second, when you post in all caps, it indicates shouting and no one wants to hear you shout.
If you read, any questions you still may have after your hort background have been answered above.
I would like to venerate that particular bunch of plants, as they were so thoughtful as to commmit suicide for the sake of ecology and society.
Uf. I can't lighten this up; time to start frequenting a more pleasant forum-site...
Freud would have a hayday in here.
Everyone go out and say "Hello," and "You look handsome today" to a cat or something. Have a cup of tea and get your hands dirty.
The rudeness and discourtesy under the banner of dissemintaion of gardening information (A happy hobby?) has finally reached critical mass for me, goodbye all.
Best idea for this subject in any of it's repeated forms.
Ignore the post, forever. end of subject. It's not worth the time, energy and effort to respond to such requests for info or attempts at growth. Is the original poster serious or what? Who knows, who should care?
Just ignore it and it will go away because no one has responded.
People could we PLEASE let this thread die already?!!
Oh my gosh!!! Kudzu is rampid here in North Carolina. If you are smart you will NOT start it at your house!!!
My word!!!!!!!!.....at the risk of re-opening this discussion I must ask my question, so "fledgeling" I appologize now.
I was in AR last summer and I noticed a homeowner with an embankment just like mine in OK. VERY steep, full of very tall weeds and trumpet vine, a fire hazard, and impossible to keep looking nice. I finally made some calls last night, to some people I know and they all told me that it was Kudzu. I headed to the forums to see what others thought and I surely found out.
I loved what I saw......complete coverage, NO weeds, and until now, I figured no maintainance. Hmmmmm now what? I want something to cover fast, thick, and ideally, in my lifetime. It seems to me that any substitute for Kudzu would cause all the problems mentioned in this forum.
I don't want to re-open this discussion as it seems to strike a nerve here. If someone can tell me something to plant, just please email me and it should leave this forum closed. If so many warn against Kudzu, I should certainly reconsider. And I thought politics and religion were the only discussions to avoid. Now, I find there is another to be added.
So, "fledgeling", again I am sorry, but until now, I thought my problem with my steep embankment was solved. I also liked what Pennsylvania_Pete remarked, "You do not inherit the land from your fathers, you borrow it from your children." I had not heard that before. I like it.
I forgot to mention that english ivy and vinca vine would be pretty. Email me with any questions or sources for those vines I mentioned.
I haven't checked out the vines forum for awhile and didn't know this thread has been resurrected. Plants don't grow in the winter in zone 5, so any plant can be controlled when they are dormant. Regarding my above inquiry, I will know soon enough.
Whats the lesser of two evils here?
WHITHOUT LIMIT, we seem to feel we have the right to cut, chop, stomp, burn, harvest, blow up, build dams, hunt whales, over harvest fish populations, CLEARCUT, use nuclear plants, pesticides, nuclear bombs, and pollute.
But when something gets out of control without our permission like kudzu we hypocritically flip out and it gets as big as Elvis. Why? Because we like power and control. Small potatoes compared to what weve done.
according to lkz5ia, It invaded 7 million acres. How many acres have we destroyed beyond repair?
Kudzu is a PLANT even if its invasive.
Pick one, 7 million more acres of cement or kudzu? Ill have to pick kudzu over city thank you very much.
Who cares anyway, its all going to be a town or city in 20 years anyway, if Dubya doesnt get us blown up that is.
RobinP, you must be proud of yourself. Your like a horse with blinders on.
QUOTE by RobinP, "Via Iowa Code chapter 317.17, the Iowa Secretary of Agriculture can declare additional weeds as noxious, thus falling under the requirements of the Iowa Weed Law." END QUOTE
Urban sprawl and ignorant people are NOXIOUS
Lkz5ia, you have a good head on your shoulders. :)
I've been called a lot of things - but never 'a horse with blinders on'.
I'm not chiming in to argue urban sprawl, war, or other blood-pressure-inducing topics.
I'm writing in to simply explain that we will not tolerate the release of an invasive plant in Iowa that will greatly reduce diversity (thus setting off a chain reaction of environmental issues) nor one that can harbor a pathogen that is devastating to a major commodity crop - soybean (historically Iowa is the perennial winner, or close runner up, for #1 soybean production state in the nation).
Can kudzu live in Iowa? For the last two years weve been closely monitoring one kudzu plant on private land in southern Iowa. How did it get there we dont know. We are not allowing the vine to spread nor will we but we are watching it very closely to determine if a good, harsh winter will really do it in or if kudzu has now conquered winter.
You argue that humans have altered land past the point of no return. But, does propagating an invasive plant one that will stamp out the native fauna solve that problem or make it even worse? I vote worse.
Its all great until it goes out of control. Then, everyone expects the government to step in and fix it. Magically fix it. And of course, everyone wants this fix to occur at no cost incurred to them.
When was soybeans native fauna? There are nearly 10 million acres of soybeans in Iowa and 7 million acres of kudzu nationwide. And considering how unproductive soybeans are, what a waste.
aha, we've found the secret weapon against kudzu
bottle him and spray him all over the South.
my dad (in Georgia) tried for years to get rid of kudzu... he burned it... he plowed it ... he sprayed it... and it came back stronger than before. That was one rather large field that did nothing to feed the family
I thought I had escaped until I started noticing these huge humps of green here in Maryland... yep, it's kudzu. C'mon over RACN35 and work your deadly magic
"Posted by lkz5ia z5 west iowa (My Page) on Sat, Mar 31, 07 at 23:26
When was soybeans native fauna? There are nearly 10 million acres of soybeans in Iowa and 7 million acres of kudzu nationwide. And considering how unproductive soybeans are, what a waste."
Okay, this one I had to respond to. Here is a partial list of the uses of soybeans...
Adhesives, Analytical Reagents, Asphalt Emulsions, Binders - Wood/Resin, Cleansing Materials, Cosmetics, Fermentation Aids/Nutrients, Films for Packaging, Inks, Leather Substitutes, Paints, Particle Boards, Plastics, Polyesters, Pharmaceuticals, Pesticides/Fungicides, Textiles, Baby Food, Bakery Ingredients, Beer & Ale, Candy Products, Cereals, Diet Food Products, Grits, Hypo-Allergenic Milk, Meat Products, Noodles, Sausage Casings, Yeast, Bee Foods, Calf Milk Replacers, Cattle Feeds, Fish Food, Pet Foods, Poultry Feeds, Protein Concentrates, Swine Feeds
Yeah, Kudzu is WAY better - after all, apparently goats eat it.
Goats eat soybeans, too. Most plants have alot of uses. Industry crops have money driven behind them that creates the many uses we see today. And as I stated before, soybeans are unproductive. Look at the yield compared to other crops and potential crops.
I can't believe this post is back again. Enough already, just let it die. If it is for real, then lkz5ia is going to plant the kudzu vine. If this is just one of those trolling posts then if we ignore it, it will die. Either way the discussion is mute because lkz5ia is not listening to any of us and is going to do whatever she wants.
Let the post die, please
I wasn't asking for permission to plant or not plant it. I was seeing if others in northern zones were using the plant and succeeding with it. So littleone, if you have no experience with the plant and don't like this topic, Then STAY AWAY!
just out of curiousity lkz5ia, between the first post in this thread (2005) and the last post above in 2007, did you plant any kudzu?
In the interest of offering a few laughs, take a look at this site
maybe it'll give you an idea of what you can do now if you DID plant kudzu
Grew it in '05, but died in 05-06 winter season. Annual here, but I'll try again.
I guess some people just enjoy "playing with fire", creating havoc with the environment and attempting to destroy land both near and far to where they live.
Just so you Know Ikz5ia, you may find the kudzu you grew to be an annual where you live, but don't count on it remaining that way and the seeds that where produced by your vine where eaten by birds and traveled near and far before being dropped by the birds.
Who knows where those seeds are growing now, but you can be sure it is growing somewhere and shouldn't be growing anywhere at all.
We are all responsible for the environment, what we do, what we grow and what harm we can do with any and all plants that we grow. That includes you too.
Your an idiot littleone. Kudzu, as an annual doesn't produce flowers; therefore, it doesn't produce SEED!!!!!!!!!!! Why don't look in the mirror and stop trying to create hysteria, and quit driving your car and washing your clothes while your at it- you very bad Amerikan.
lkz5ia, you may think I'm an "idiot" but at least I have the intelligence to not plant something that is such a noxious weed, banned in many states and don't make such ignorant statements as you do. ie. "look in the mirror and stop trying to create hysteria, and quite driving your car and wahsing your clothes while your at it-you very bad Amerikan."
By the way, I can spell correctly as well.
As for kudzu not producing flowers in zone 5, don't count on it as our global temps are changing and you have to worry about getting all of the roots removed which is all but impossible.
Sad that someone thinks they way you do.
Littleone, don't feed the troll. Eventually it will go back under it's bridge.
Amerikan is a derogatory term for American. It was fitting for a fanatic such as yourself. You should of copied and pasted my quote, because you misspelled washing-its not wahsing.
""""Just so you Know Ikz5ia, you may find the kudzu you grew to be an annual where you live, but don't count on it remaining that way""""
This is what you said littleone. And annual doesn't come back. I think you need to look up your definitions. My kudzu plants didn't magically reappear after they died. So a dead plant doesn't flower.
I'm not sure why Americans are scared of plants. I guess its a control issue. All the plants are of this Earth. You will realize alot of plants were once native to North America, so what time period are we shooting for. I'm not going to fall for anyone's propaganda. Many of you have your own hidden agendas.
Morning glories are "annual" vines as well but I have quite a few of those sprouting up all over the yard in places I didn't plant them.
Living in Iowa, I'm appalled that someone cares so very little about the enviroment, the economy and fellow people. I hope and pray Kudzu never makes it to my garden. I'll have to look up our OP and have a little chat with him, in person and present a bill for my damages.
I am in a northern area now but grew up in the south. I don't and would never introduce anything like kudzu into this area or any area whether it is annual or not. We have enough noxious, invasive plants as it is. I have a neighbot that lets any and everything grow that sprouts. Consequently, I spend three fourths of my time digging pulling, burning and destroying invasive trees, shrubs, and vines that initially came from his property. I have had to pull out miles of invasive vines out of the shrubs they were are strangling. I have had to deal with poison ivy because he won't do anything about it on his propety . You obviously have little regard for anyone or anything but your own misguided agenda. I also find it appalling that someone would be so rude to another person by calling them names. Why don't you try gorwing native plants to help restore the natural environment instead of destroying it. I just don't understand the reasoning behind your actions.
kudzu lover, please go away and take the blasted vine (and this thread) with you!!!!
Old thread, but must put my 2 cents worth in....I had an area behind my property (and the adjoining neighbors properties as well) that I had hoped to use for a garden or planting area....I have had it professionally demo'd digging down 4 feet with a cat tractor, 2 times so far this year....the kudzu is still there, and still comes back up...when I attempt to dig it up yet AGAIN....I find that it's several feet deep branches off every which way....and has been bigger around than a garden hose in it's girth, like some of the pieces I was able to actually get up...after hours of digging and laboring, were sometimes 2 times the girth of a garden hose...it's like PIPE..what possibly could penetrate this root system?...this plant is indestructible and a menace...I sure do hope that with the 80 odd warnings from posters here that you opted for a nice little peaceful vine to grow...maybe like a jasmine?
Kudzu questions or kokudzu.com will help manage kudzu.
It would be great if people read these places. Black plastic will cook kudzu, and then there is no need for poisons.
During the Great Leap Forward, kudzu saved many lives in China. It is not genetically modified.
The only reason I am posting (re-opening this thread) is that charfair beat me to it.
Kudzu is a VERY USEFUL plant - it is edible for both animals and humans, it is a nitrogen fixer, and it would be an AWESOME feedstock for cellulosic ethanol.
The problem is that the AG industry is against it, therefore the proper harvesting equipment has not been invested in. Just like electric cars - the auto industry killed them.
Personally, in the North, if I was to raise sheep or goats I would plant it as a cheap fodder source.
HOWEVER, I must agree with the INVASIVE argument in this sense: White Mulberry trees are EXTREMELY INVASIVE here - you CANNOT KILL THEM!!! They take over everything!!!
We had one that was planted by a bird. I left it there for years, but it never bore fruit. Then, when digging up a girdled Littleleaf Linden, I noticed all these vigorous orange roots in the planting hole - they were from the White Mulberry tree about 20 feet away. So, I cut down the mulberry - it came back as a giant super-fast growing shrub! Then I did research and was warned that you cannot kill them - the roots will not die; cut branches will sprout. Yeah, right, I thought. Well, I cut down the shrubby trunks, drilled holes into them and poured in poison and then topped it off with tar. The mulberry died - or so I thought! Now I have GAZILLIONS of baby mulberry trees growing throughout my entire yard. They grow from the teeniest, tiniest piece of root.
I had a bag of leaves that I was saving for leaf mould, and when I opened it in the spring it was FULL of fresh, thriving, orange mulberry roots! I had to throw it out. The ONLY way to kill it is to burn it.
The White Mulberry is an invasive species from Asia (also called "Russian Mulberry"); it has almost wiped out our native Red Mulberry trees.
I bought a native Red Mulberry seedling and a European Black Mulberry (not invasive) to counteract this "Devil Tree." Finally this year I gave in to the realization that the only way to deal with the White Mulnerry is to control it by going around and pulling up the tiny babies as they first get leaves in the spring - BEFORE they are hidden under all the flowers, because they grow super-fast and then the roots get left in the ground and then they come back even stronger.
So, there are legitimate arguments on both sides of the Kudzu issue - it is a very useful plant, but it must be properly maintained and controlled, not simply maligned because the interests of Big AG have prevented it's commercial use.
I simply argue Kudzu is beyond your ability to control.
Anyone who says goats don't eat kudzu, doesn't know goats. Goat LOVE kudzu. Kudzu is like goat cotton candy. Goats dream about kudzu at night.
My grandfather actually planted kudzu years ago in his field for his herd of goats. The goats ate it all down to the ground. Then they pawed at the ground and ate on the roots as well. They killed it. I've brought it home to my goats before and they eat it in about 3 seconds.
Goats KILL kudzu and they do a good job of it as well. If you tried to grow kudzu for goats, you would have to PROTECT it from the goats or they will kill it. Kudzu may be able to grow a foot a day, but goats can eat whole vines in a day.
Whether goats eat kudzo or not is not much of an issue, sothergurl.
The facts remain that kudzu vine is a horrible invasive species of plant that has taken over many areas of the south and created havoc everywhere it grows.
If you have goats to eat this horrible invasive, all the better for you and those around you.
Problem is, the majority in not just about all the people don't have goats, don't live on farms to have goats and have no way of getting rid of this thug.
For anyone to suggest that it can be controlled or that the AG is preventing it's use is crazy.
Just look at the areas in the south where this invasive thug has taken hold, and no one in their right mind would suggest that kudzu is useful.
Anything that can grow a foot a day, is far from useful, it's dangerous and a disaster to anyone that has it around them.
"Anything that can grow a foot a day, is far from useful, it's dangerous and a disaster to anyone that has it around them."
Another blind blanket statement.
I'm not saying it's awesome or that people should go out and plant it, but maybe if people started looking at it as a beneficial source instead of a bane, something could be done. It does have good benefits to it. It is safe for both animal and human consumption. It seems to have cancer fighting properties as well. It may also help with alcoholism. Goats love it and will eat it. Goats in turn produce meat, milk, cheese and other products. There are kudzu vine baskets, kudzu paper and countless recipes for cooking kudzu. It has excellent nutritional value. But the screams of "evil", "disaster", "dangerous" and "bad" have made opening up minds to putting this plant to good use very difficult. All things have a reason for being. Kudzu too.
To paraphrase an old adage, it's time people quit complaining about the kudzu and learned to make kudzu jelly.
I live in the south. I'd love to put kudzu to a better use. But given all the sprays and pesticides and poisons thrown on kudzu, I'd be leery of getting any for use that I wasn't sure was pesticide-free. That is why I'd like to have some potted inside my house. But I don't want to break any laws either.
DO NOT PLANT KUDZU
can you Bump & Lock? OMG the people that plant invasive plants without thinking of Nature and/or future generations. This stuff is Nasty & useless! For every leaf you see above ground there is 12 feet (you read it right) underground! Winter does not kill it. It grows under houses, into house, up and over houses. Imagine 60 years of wild growth that I deal with as a neighbor planted it decades ago and died a few back.
I'm sorry.. Well... not really. I cannot believe someone would be so SELFISH to plant kudzu.
That's what it boils down to.... SELFISH. Who cares what happens to anyone else, right?
We drove from Oklahoma to North Carolina in 2011 to escape the heat. We were blessed with a greener countryside the further we traveled Eastward. It was gorgeous compared to our dull flat, brown and boring landscape.
Then came the areas completely covered with this plant I knew not what. It was everywhere. It devoured the BEAUTIFUL landscape for MILES AND MILES. So sad.
And another note: Some have the idea that planting kudzu is GOOD because it's away to get REVENGE AT MANKIND.
I tire of humans with a humanity-hating spirit. Not all is bad. If it is... fulfill the goodness of prophetic calling and go off yourself. If you're REALLY serious about providing for the planet to fight off industrialization then study and start permaculture. Unfortunately, you would need to WORK and SACRIFICE YOURSELF instead of rely on invasive species in a foreign environment.
As for me, I'll consider the plight of the planet, of the animals AND MY NEIGHBORS AND THOSE HUMANS TO FOLLOW.
But thank you for this post. I was considering it for indoors. I'm not so stupid to think I can contain it indoors. It WILL follow with seed .. SOMEHOW outside.
Ask any gardener who has had their residential plants follow them all the way to their church's garden.
DO NOT PLANT KUDZU
DO NOT PLANT KUDZU
I know this thread is old. But I need some advice. I live in zone 8. I plan to plant Kudzu in large pots. Thinking 50-100 litres. I've ordered loads of seeds from abroad.
I am interested in this plant for several reasons. Firstly that almost all of it can be eaten apart from seeds so makes a great survival food. I've read that its good to feed to chickens. Also I plan to eat the shoots and leaves myself, but no idea what they taste like. I read they are healthy.
I am a bit scarred about the fast growth rate, so decided to keep it in pots.
Do they grow fine in partial shade?
Thanks in advance for advice.