are there things that you have learned from this forum?

youngquinn_gwSeptember 4, 2012

that have changed your perspective?

I find myself often thinking about something that PNBROWN said a while back.

...Because of Chinas huge population there are more Chinese in the high intellect area of the spectrum than populate America...

and of course with only 22million of us down under...thgere are probably more Chinese geniuses alive than there are Australian citizens.

We cant win!

what has somebody brought to the table that has resonated with you?

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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

what has somebody brought to the table that has resonated with you?

One of the things that has resonated with me is the amount of people who are convinced that if any other country or culture should ever become dominant, then they will invade/take over/make you speak their language.

The latest is the Chinese of course. So many people terrified of what will happen should China move into the military, economic, or technology top spot... none of them ever considered that China has absolutely no interest in invading your country and turning you all into their slaves. ("You" of course being a generic "you")

But, it was that way with Russia back in the good old days.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 11:11AM
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david52 Zone 6

China has absolutely no interest in invading your country and turning you all into their slaves

There are several countries in Africa who have justifiable fears of being essentially re-colonized by the Chinese.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 11:31AM
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jodik_gw

I think I'm more worried about enemies domestic, than enemies foreign...

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 11:39AM
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duluthinbloomz4

Don't know why China should instill any fear. They simply come in, take and/or buy what they need and want and don't care about changing the politics.

My biggest surprise, which is also my biggest lament, is that any ruination here will come from within and not from "outside". Not an original idea from the forum, but certainly amplified here.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 11:41AM
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david52 Zone 6

They simply come in, take and/or buy what they need and want and don't care about changing the politics.

Well, just one example, they lavishly supplied Sudan with all the arms they need to continue the war against Darfur and Southern Sudan, which gets political. In Zambia, they're involved with shooting striking miners at the small, local coal mines they've bought.

They are also out there in the markets selling fried bananas right along side the locals.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 11:48AM
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duluthinbloomz4

I'll bow to your greater knowledge on world conflict, david. From what little I've gleaned - wouldn't China and South Sudan be "naturals" as partners? On one hand, China's got new energy resources; on the other, South Sudan gets a major stream of financial assistance.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 12:24PM
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patriciae_gw(07)

They, they , they---must be because they are Chinese because why else the sudden heartburn about Asians. I suppose what I have learned here is that we are all doomed because the immediate reaction to China crawling out of the mire and joining the rest of the world is fear and dread of being dominated or bested or taken over or what ever. What has China done that we havent done in spades. Monroe Doctrine anyone-can any country do a thing in OUR hemisphere without our say so? Who supplies more arms to the world than anyone else? Pish.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 12:25PM
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jodik_gw

I hope the Chinese aren't the newest bogeyman in the ongoing lineup, let loose upon the ears and tongue of the US... but what can the powerful do when words like Muslim and terrorist fail to instill fear, and bring us back to our reality of problems?

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 12:32PM
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david52 Zone 6

duluthinbloomz4, China does have an interesting dilemma with the Sudan/Southern Sudan, the later having the oil, the former the ports. So they're effectively supplying both sides of that conflict, while trying to tone things down - hey, just leave the wells and pipelines alone - so they get their oil.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2011/01/20111910357773378.html

patriciae - Africa was ripped off by Europeans, they they still haven't gotten over that exploitive relationship, and here come the Chinese to replace the Europeans - in spades. We'll build you a road, hydroelectric power plant, and a bauxite mine as long as we get all the aluminum at the price we determine. Then bring in 25,000 Chinese miners.

China is supplying small arms, not the mega-=million jet fighters we sell.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-murky-business-of-chinas-guns-sales-in-africa/2012/09/03/412ba4fe-f085-11e1-ba17-c7bb037a1d5b_story.html

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 12:36PM
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kwoods(Cold z7 Long Is)

Competing interests means constant, ongoing gaming diplomacy between US and China...

From today's NYTimes

""The United States should stop its role as a sneaky troublemaker sitting behind some nations in the region and pulling strings," a writer specializing in foreign policy said in an article for Xinhua, the state-run news agency. It was a clear reference to recent statements by the State Department criticizing China's establishment of a military garrison on disputed islands in the South China Sea.

Mrs. Clinton's visit is certain to have far less drama than her last one, in May, when a blind Chinese dissident, Chen Guangcheng, escaped house arrest and sought refuge in the American Embassy here, infuriating the Chinese and enmeshing the United States in arduous negotiations that eventually won permission for Mr. Chen to leave China for New York.

Despite the lingering tensions from that case and new ones over China's territorial ambitions, Mrs. Clinton is scheduled over two days to meet with all of the country's senior leaders, including President Hu Jintao and his presumed successor, Xi Jinping, on Wednesday. Officials traveling with her expressed hope that differences over the South China Sea could be overcome in the same way that Mr. Chen's case was.

"We are committed to building a cooperative partnership with China," Mrs. Clinton said here on Tuesday evening. "It is a key aspect of our rebalancing in the Asia-Pacific."

The Obama administration's renewed focus on Asia has been unfavorably interpreted in some quarters here as an effort to contain China. China is as wary of American moves in the region including an increase in military personnel and materiel in Australia and the Philippines as the United States and its allies in the region are of China's territorial ambitions.

"For the United States, the South China Sea is not a matter of territorial disputes," said Wu Xinbo, deputy director of the Center for American Studies at Fudan University in Shanghai. "It's an issue of strategic gaming. The United States is concerned about China's naval growth."

Mrs. Clinton, who is in the middle of a 10-day, 6-nation tour of Asia, has repeatedly said that the United States is not taking a position on the disputed islands in the South China Sea and that it is seeking a peaceful negotiated settlement of the many overlapping claims.

In Indonesia the day before, she expressed support for efforts by the Association of Southeast Asian Nations which includes the Philippines, Brunei and Vietnam, all with competing territorial claims to negotiate a code of conduct that would avert disputes and lay the foundation for long-term settlements.

The Chinese Foreign Ministry has gone out of its way in the past two days to say that only the countries directly involved in South China Sea territorial disputes should participate in their solutions, a clear public rebuff of the United States.

China's recent tactics have raised concerns even among other countries in the region not directly involved, including India, Singapore and Indonesia. In particular, they cite China's blocking of a diplomatic communique at an Asean summit meeting in Cambodia in July that called for a collaborative process, rather than confrontation.

"China's evident pressure on the Association of Southeast Asian Nations has undermined 20 years of Chinese charm diplomacy, " said an Asian diplomat, who spoke on the condition of anonymity in the usual diplomatic practice.

"If Asean is divided," the diplomat said, "this will ultimately rebound against China's interests because it could well catalyze the very thing China fears most: containment by the United States, as anxious smaller countries will naturally cluster around the United States for balance.""

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 1:31PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

>the amount of people who are convinced that if any other country or culture should ever become dominant, then they will invade/take over/make you speak their languageFor a long time this language that has been expected to be spoken all over the world is English.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 4:32PM
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duluthinbloomz4

Googling around: English is spoken as a second language by approx. 950 million people worldwide - add to that the approx. 427 million native speakers.

According to Wiki: Modern English, sometimes described as the first global Lingua Franca is the dominant language or in some instances even the required international language of communications, science, information technology, business, seafaring, aviation, entertainment, radio, and diplomacy.

Linguistic world orders do change - not too many Latin speakers these days.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 4:54PM
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pnbrown

Indeed, it's a fact that whatever culture dominates imposes its language.

How many Lokota or Apache native-speakers are there? How many cultures and languages have been extinguished by a larger society? History says there is every reason to be concerned.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 5:29PM
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vgkg(Z-7)

Sure PN, there are many things I've learned on this forum! Though after a decade posting here I no doubt have forgotten more than I've retained ;)

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 6:02PM
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jodik_gw

If anything, I think this forum has solidified a few ideas I've had about the general public where mindsets and origins are concerned... and has probably added a bit to my cynicism when it comes to world views and the standing of the USA in them.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 6:06PM
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demifloyd(8)

The only thing that comes to mind that I have learned on this forum is that which has come from additional insight into middle east politics.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 6:26PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

I've learned that some people wish to be fooled all the time.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 9:10PM
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blfenton

I'm a recent interloper into this forum - just kind of jumped in and started to comment. I am in the process of learning things mainly about how Americans feel about their country and their politicians and it is all very interesting.

As a side note - my dad and I used to discuss politics all the time, both Canadian, American and anywhere else that was interesting. Sometimes we agreed and sometimes we disagreed. He died 15 years ago and since then I haven't had anybody to discuss politics with or challenge or be challenged. My family isn't all that interested (although I have a BIL who will discuss world economics but I barely got out of Micro and Macro economics so he leaves me in the dust) nor are my friends. And so I am glad I found this forum and despite the bickering, which to me sounds like a big noisy family dinner, I enjoy it.

You will, however, have to excuse my occasional naive comments because I am a rose-coloured glasses kind of person.

    Bookmark   September 4, 2012 at 10:21PM
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Embothrium(USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA)

With pie in the sky for dessert?

    Bookmark   September 5, 2012 at 9:37AM
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woodnymph2_gw

I've especially learned a lot from the Canadians who post here frequently, about their culture, their foods, their values.

As for the rest, like some of you,my native cynicism about my own country and its future has only been reinforced and highlighted.

    Bookmark   September 5, 2012 at 10:16AM
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jodik_gw

I've also learned that, aside from reading some pretty interesting ideas from those with open minds... for the most part, it's a waste of time... the same talking points, prejudices and stereotypes that were alive and parroted over 4 years ago are still alive and being repeated... and much like when names are changed to protect people, the words have just been changed around to protect the criminal acts and skewed ideas.

As they say... the more things change, the more they remain the same.

    Bookmark   September 5, 2012 at 11:08AM
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patty_cakes

That everyone sure speaks what's on their mind???? ;o)

    Bookmark   September 5, 2012 at 11:08AM
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