What President Obama Has Accomplished

ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)October 14, 2012

I've heard ad nauseam from certain people that President Obama has accomplished nothing, is ineffective, is useless, is worse than President Bush, and other allegations that show their extreme disgust with him and what he has accomplished during his presidency. Rather than state in my own words what he's accomplished, which I've done at least three times, I'd like to provide a link, with documentation for each item, of over 200 things that he has accomplished. This is in addition to four laws that he passed as a junior senator, including six more which have passed the Senate. These are genuine laws vis a vis the two Paul Ryan has passed in 13 years, one being the renaming of a post office and the other lowering the tax on arrows (he's fond of shooting arrows from bows as a sport).

No doubt many of you will not bother to read this. However, any time you make ridiculously vague statements about him, I will refer you to this post.

Here is a link that might be useful: What has Obama done since January of 2009

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marshallz10(z9-10 CA)

Well, to be fair, a lot of these accomplishments are pro-forma/feel-good gestures not requiring input from Congress, or for that matter, other centers of economic and political powers. I'm sure a similar list could have been drawn up for GW Bush's two Presidential terms. No time to prune away these sorts of gestures, leaving a corps of solid accomplishments to applaud. There are such accomplishments, aren't there?

    Bookmark   October 14, 2012 at 9:03PM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

Thanks, marshall; I had to go back and get a little (or a lot) more specific. Here goes again:

1. Passed Health Care Reform
2. Passed the Stimulus Act
3. Passed Wall Street Reform
4. Ended War in Iraq
5. Began Drawdown of War in Afghanistan
6. Eliminated Osama Bin Laden (and assorted other Al-Quaeda terrorists)
7. Turned Around U.S. Auto Industry, which created 100,000 new jobs
8. Recapitalized Banks (at essentially zero cost to government)
9. Repealed "Don't Ask, Don't Tell"

  1. Toppled Moamar Gadaffi, with no American lives lost
  2. Reversed Bush Torture Policies
  3. Boosted Fuel Efficiency Standards
  4. Increased Support for Veterans
  5. Passed Credit Card Reforms

For those who like to call President Obama elitist, or who question what he's done for the ordinary American, or what he's done at all, I would think this should provide some answers.

    Bookmark   October 14, 2012 at 11:03PM
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Why not just refer folks to the Washington Monthly article you lifted that from? Their list provides a lot more detail, and you skipped some good ones; here ya go:

The Washington Monthly

March/ April 2012
Obama�s Top 50 Accomplishments

By Paul Glastris, Ryan Cooper, and Siyu Hu

"1. Passed Health Care Reform: After five presidents over a century failed to create universal health insurance, signed the Affordable Care Act (2010). It will cover 32 million uninsured Americans beginning in 2014 and mandates a suite of experimental measures to cut health care cost growth, the number one cause of America�s long-term fiscal problems.

2. Passed the Stimulus: Signed $787 billion American Recovery and Reinvestment Act in 2009 to spur economic growth amid greatest recession since the Great Depression. Weeks after stimulus went into effect, unemployment claims began to subside. Twelve months later, the private sector began producing more jobs than it was losing, and it has continued to do so for twenty-three straight months, creating a total of nearly 3.7 million new private-sector jobs.

3. Passed Wall Street Reform: Signed the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act (2010) to re-regulate the financial sector after its practices caused the Great Recession. The new law tightens capital requirements on large banks and other financial institutions, requires derivatives to be sold on clearinghouses and exchanges, mandates that large banks provide "living wills" to avoid chaotic bankruptcies, limits their ability to trade with customers� money for their own profit, and creates the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (now headed by Richard Cordray) to crack down on abusive lending products and companies.

4. Ended the War in Iraq: Ordered all U.S. military forces out of the country. Last troops left on December 18, 2011.

5. Began Drawdown of War in Afghanistan: From a peak of 101,000 troops in June 2011, U.S. forces are now down to 91,000, with 23,000 slated to leave by the end of summer 2012. According to Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta, the combat mission there will be over by next year.

6. Eliminated Osama bin laden: In 2011, ordered special forces raid of secret compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, in which the terrorist leader was killed and a trove of al-Qaeda documents was discovered.

7. Turned Around U.S. Auto Industry: In 2009, injected $62 billion in federal money (on top of $13.4 billion in loans from the Bush administration) into ailing GM and Chrysler in return for equity stakes and agreements for massive restructuring. Since bottoming out in 2009, the auto industry has added more than 100,000 jobs. In 2011, the Big Three automakers all gained market share for the first time in two decades. The government expects to lose $16 billion of its investment, less if the price of the GM stock it still owns increases.

8. Recapitalized Banks: In the midst of financial crisis, approved controversial Treasury Department plan to lure private capital into the country�s largest banks via "stress tests" of their balance sheets and a public-private fund to buy their "toxic" assets. Got banks back on their feet at essentially zero cost to the government.

9. Repealed "Don�t Ask, Don�t Tell": Ended 1990s-era restriction and formalized new policy allowing gays and lesbians to serve openly in the military for the first time.

  1. Toppled Moammar Gaddafi: In March 2011, joined a coalition of European and Arab governments in military action, including air power and naval blockade, against Gaddafi regime to defend Libyan civilians and support rebel troops. Gaddafi�s forty-two-year rule ended when the dictator was overthrown and killed by rebels on October 20, 2011. No American lives were lost.

  2. Told Mubarak to Go: On February 1, 2011, publicly called on Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak to accept reform or step down, thus weakening the dictator�s position and putting America on the right side of the Arab Spring. Mubarak ended thirty-year rule when overthrown on February 11.

  3. Reversed Bush Torture Policies: Two days after taking office, nullified Bush-era rulings that had allowed detainees in U.S. custody to undergo certain "enhanced" interrogation techniques considered inhumane under the Geneva Conventions. Also released the secret Bush legal rulings supporting the use of these techniques.

  4. Improved America�s Image Abroad: With new policies, diplomacy, and rhetoric, reversed a sharp decline in world opinion toward the U.S. (and the corresponding loss of "soft power") during the Bush years. From 2008 to 2011, favorable opinion toward the United States rose in ten of fifteen countries surveyed by the Pew Global Attitudes Project, with an average increase of 26 percent.

  5. Kicked Banks Out of Federal Student Loan Program, Expanded Pell Grant Spending: As part of the 2010 health care reform bill, signed measure ending the wasteful decades-old practice of subsidizing banks to provide college loans. Starting July 2010 all students began getting their federal student loans directly from the federal government. Treasury will save $67 billion over ten years, $36 billion of which will go to expanding Pell Grants to lower-income students.

  6. Created Race to the Top: With funds from stimulus, started $4.35 billion program of competitive grants to encourage and reward states for education reform.

  7. Boosted Fuel Efficiency Standards: Released new fuel efficiency standards in 2011 that will nearly double the fuel economy for cars and trucks by 2025.

  8. Coordinated International Response to Financial Crisis: To keep world economy out of recession in 2009 and 2010, helped secure from G-20 nations more than $500 billion for the IMF to provide lines of credit and other support to emerging market countries, which kept them liquid and avoided crises with their currencies.

  9. Passed Mini Stimuli: To help families hurt by the recession and spur the economy as stimulus spending declined, signed series of measures (July 22, 2010; December 17, 2010; December 23, 2011) to extend unemployment insurance and cut payroll taxes.

  10. Began Asia "Pivot": In 2011, reoriented American military and diplomatic priorities and focus from the Middle East and Europe to the Asian-Pacific region. Executed multipronged strategy of positively engaging China while reasserting U.S. leadership in the region by increasing American military presence and crafting new commercial, diplomatic, and military alliances with neighboring countries made uncomfortable by recent Chinese behavior.

  11. Increased Support for Veterans: With so many soldiers coming home from Iraq and Iran with serious physical and mental health problems, yet facing long waits for services, increased 2010 Department of Veterans Affairs budget by 16 percent and 2011 budget by 10 percent. Also signed new GI bill offering $78 billion in tuition assistance over a decade, and provided multiple tax credits to encourage businesses to hire veterans.

  12. Tightened Sanctions on Iran: In effort to deter Iran�s nuclear program, signed Comprehensive Iran Sanctions, Accountability, and Divestment Act (2010) to punish firms and individuals who aid Iran�s petroleum sector. In late 2011 and early 2012, coordinated with other major Western powers to impose sanctions aimed at Iran�s banks and with Japan, South Korea, and China to shift their oil purchases away from Iran.

  13. Created Conditions to Begin Closing Dirtiest Power Plants: New EPA restrictions on mercury and toxic pollution, issued in December 2011, likely to lead to the closing of between sixty-eight and 231 of the nation�s oldest and dirtiest coal-fired power plants. Estimated cost to utilities: at least $11 billion by 2016. Estimated health benefits: $59 billion to $140 billion. Will also significantly reduce carbon emissions and, with other regulations, comprises what�s been called Obama�s "stealth climate policy."

  14. Passed Credit Card Reforms: Signed the Credit Card Accountability, Responsibility, and Disclosure Act (2009), which prohibits credit card companies from raising rates without advance notification, mandates a grace period on interest rate increases, and strictly limits overdraft and other fees.

  15. Eliminated Catch-22 in Pay Equality Laws: Signed Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act in 2009, giving women who are paid less than men for the same work the right to sue their employers after they find out about the discrimination, even if that discrimination happened years ago. Under previous law, as interpreted by the Supreme Court in Ledbetter v. Goodyear Tire & Rubber Co., the statute of limitations on such suits ran out 180 days after the alleged discrimination occurred, even if the victims never knew about it.

  16. Protected Two Liberal Seats on the U.S. Supreme Court: Nominated and obtained confirmation for Sonia Sotomayor, the first Hispanic and third woman to serve, in 2009; and Elena Kagan, the fourth woman to serve, in 2010. They replaced David Souter and John Paul Stevens, respectively.

  17. Improved Food Safety System: In 2011, signed FDA Food Safety Modernization Act, which boosts the Food and Drug Administration�s budget by $1.4 billion and expands its regulatory responsibilities to include increasing number of food inspections, issuing direct food recalls, and reviewing the current food safety practices of countries importing products into America.

  18. Achieved New START Treaty: Signed with Russia (2010) and won ratification in Congress (2011) of treaty that limits each country to 1,550 strategic warheads (down from 2,200) and 700 launchers (down from more than 1,400), and reestablished and strengthened a monitoring and transparency program that had lapsed in 2009, through which each country can monitor the other.

  19. Expanded National Service: Signed Serve America Act in 2009, which authorized a tripling of the size of AmeriCorps. Program grew 13 percent to 85,000 members across the country by 2012, when new House GOP majority refused to appropriate more funds for further expansion.

  20. Expanded Wilderness and Watershed Protection: Signed Omnibus Public Lands Management Act (2009), which designated more than 2 million acres as wilderness, created thousands of miles of recreational and historic trails, and protected more than 1,000 miles of rivers.

  21. Gave the FDA Power to Regulate Tobacco: Signed the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act (2009). Nine years in the making and long resisted by the tobacco industry, the law mandates that tobacco manufacturers disclose all ingredients, obtain FDA approval for new tobacco products, and expand the size and prominence of cigarette warning labels, and bans the sale of misleadingly labeled "light" cigarette brands and tobacco sponsorship of entertainment events.

  22. Pushed Federal Agencies to Be Green Leaders: Issued executive order in 2009 requiring all federal agencies to make plans to soften their environmental impacts by 2020. Goals include 30 percent reduction in fleet gasoline use, 26 percent boost in water efficiency, and sustainability requirements for 95 percent of all federal contracts. Because federal government is the country�s single biggest purchaser of goods and services, likely to have ripple effects throughout the economy for years to come.

  23. Passed Fair Sentencing Act: Signed 2010 legislation that reduces sentencing disparity between crack versus powder cocaine possessionfrom100 to1 to 18 to1.

  24. Trimmed and Reoriented Missile Defense: Cut the Reagan-era "Star Wars" missile defense budget, saving $1.4 billion in 2010, and canceled plans to station antiballistic missile systems in Poland and the Czech Republic in favor of sea-based defense plan focused on Iran and North Korea.

  25. Began Post-Post-9/11 Military Builddown: After winning agreement from congressional Republicans and Democrats in summer 2011 budget deal to reduce projected defense spending by $450 billion, proposed new DoD budget this year with cuts of that size and a new national defense strategy that would shrink ground forces from 570,000 to 490,000 over the next ten years while increasing programs in intelligence gathering and cyberwarfare.

  26. Let Space Shuttle Die and Killed Planned Moon Mission: Allowed the expensive ($1 billion per launch), badly designed, dangerous shuttle program to make its final launch on July 8, 2011. Cut off funding for even more bloated and problem-plagued Bush-era Constellation program to build moon base in favor of support for private-sector low-earth orbit ventures, research on new rocket technologies for long-distance manned flight missions, and unmanned space exploration, including the largest interplanetary rover ever launched, which will investigate Mars�s potential to support life.

  27. Invested Heavily in Renewable Technology: As part of the 2009 stimulus, invested $90 billion, more than any previous administration, in research on smart grids, energy efficiency, electric cars, renewable electricity generation, cleaner coal, and biofuels.

  28. Crafting Next-Generation School Tests: Devoted $330 million in stimulus money to pay two consortia of states and universities to create competing versions of new K-12 student performance tests based on latest psychometric research. New tests could transform the learning environment in vast majority of public school classrooms beginning in 2014.

  29. Cracked Down on Bad For-Profit Colleges: In effort to fight predatory practices of some for-profit colleges, Department of Education issued "gainful employment" regulations in 2011 cutting off commercially focused schools from federal student aid funding if more than 35 percent of former students aren�t paying off their loans and/or if the average former student spends more than 12 percent of his or her total earnings servicing student loans.

  30. Improved School Nutrition: In coordination with Michelle Obama, signed Healthy Hunger-Free Kids Act in 2010 mandating $4.5 billion spending boost and higher nutritional and health standards for school lunches. New rules based on the law, released in January, double the amount of fruits and vegetables and require only whole grains in food served to students.

  31. Expanded Hate Crimes Protections: Signed Hate Crimes Prevention Act (2009), which expands existing hate crime protections to include crimes based on a victim�s sexual orientation, gender, or disability, in addition to race, color, religion, or national origin.

  32. Avoided Scandal: As of November 2011, served longer than any president in decades without a scandal, as measured by the appearance of the word "scandal" (or lack thereof) on the front page of the Washington Post.

  33. Brokered Agreement for Speedy Compensation to Victims of Gulf Oil Spill: Though lacking statutory power to compel British Petroleum to act, used moral authority of his office to convince oil company to agree in 2010 to a $20 billion fund to compensate victims of the Deepwater Horizon oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico; $6.5 billion already paid out without lawsuits. By comparison, it took nearly two decades for plaintiffs in the Exxon Valdez Alaska oil spill case to receive $1.3 billion.

  34. Created Recovery.gov: Web site run by independent board of inspectors general looking for fraud and abuse in stimulus spending, provides public with detailed information on every contract funded by $787 billion American Recovery and Reinvestment Act. Thanks partly to this transparency, board has uncovered very little fraud, and Web site has become national model: "The stimulus has done more to promote transparency at almost all levels of government than any piece of legislation in recent memory," reports Governing magazine.

  35. Pushed Broadband Coverage: Proposed and obtained in 2011 Federal Communications Commission approval for a shift of $8 billion in subsidies away from landlines and toward broadband Internet for lower-income rural families.

  36. Expanded Health Coverage for Children: Signed 2009 Children�s Health Insurance Authorization Act, which allows the Children�s Health Insurance Program (CHIP) to cover health care for 4 million more children, paid for by a tax increase on tobacco products.

  37. Recognized the Dangers of Carbon Dioxide: In 2009, EPA declared carbon dioxide a pollutant, allowing the agency to regulate its production.

  38. Expanded Stem Cell Research: In 2009, eliminated the Bush-era restrictions on embryonic stem cell research, which shows promise in treating spinal injuries, among many other areas.

  39. Provided Payment to Wronged Minority Farmers: In 2009, signed Claims Resolution Act, which provided $4.6 billion in funding for a legal settlement with black and Native American farmers who the government cheated out of loans and natural resource royalties in years past.

  40. Helped South Sudan Declare Independence: Helped South Sudan Declare Independence: Appointed two envoys to Sudan and personally attended a special UN meeting on the area. Through U.S. ambassador to the United Nations Ambassador Susan Rice, helped negotiate a peaceful split in 2011.

  41. Killed the F-22: In 2009, ended further purchases of Lockheed Martin single-seat, twin-engine, fighter aircraft, which cost $358 million apiece. Though the military had 187 built, the plane has never flown a single combat mission. Eliminating it saved $4 billion."

Much easier, no? Might as well give EVERYBODY credit while you're at it...

    Bookmark   October 14, 2012 at 11:44PM
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Ingrid, on number 6 it appears he missed that "assortment" who killed Ambassador Stevens and the others.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 12:15AM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

Well, elvis, I did something along those lines the first time. I was pretty sure no one would think I thought of those myself on the second go-round. Your list has the same flaw as mine did - too long, but still thanks for the effort.

GGM, one person can do only so much. Perhaps you could have done a better job. I applaud your tenacity in bringing up the subject of Ambassador Stevens for the umpteenth time. It does you great credit.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 12:45AM
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ingrid (and elvis),

Those things are subjective and do have their downside. How much and to whom they are downers, should factor in. Not that I don't think they are/aren't accomplishments. But it doesn't make it a "fact", just because someone agrees with (and plenty of others) that they're accomplishments. Some scholars argue creation of credit and welfare were bad ideas. I can't see our society running without them. But the opinion exists, as an example.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 8:14AM
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On the other hand, an Administration doesn't get to begin at square one, from scratch, upon taking office. They don't get to rewrite our basic documents, change every law, or wipe the economic slate clean and begin anew. They're more than a little bound by what history and the last Administration leave behind for them to work with. Taking that into consideration, it's more than a little bit logical to say that President Obama has worked well within the framework the last Administration left behind.

And yes, Bush will receive eternal blame for the messes left behind by his Administration, economic and otherwise. History cannot be rewritten just because it didn't meet certain expectations, is embarrassing to some, or failed in certain ways. History stands.

Ingrid, it's a nice thought, and a wonderful try... and it's appreciated by those of us who think Obama is doing a very fair job as President... but no one can pound facts into holes that are already filled with prejudices and stereotypes. You've tried before, and others have done the same due diligence in attempting to shed light on truth. But when people walk around wearing blinders, or holding their hands over their ears while perpetually repeating "lalalalalala", it's tough for that truth to reach any lucid brain cells.

No President will, or has the singular power, to achieve every little thing each citizen wants, so there will always be things that we don't agree with. But overall, it's safe to say that four more years of Bush-like activities will bring this nation, along with parts of the global community, to certain ruin... in economic terms and otherwise.

If it took 8+ years to bring the US to the economic brink, then it's only rational that it will take at least that long to adequately recover as a nation. Why is that so difficult to grasp for some?

Yes, President Obama has accomplished a lot of positive things... and some things that aren't so positive, that we thought he could do a little better... but the fact remains that we're now moving in a good direction at a good pace as a nation, and we've recovered a bit of the worldly reputation that Bush had tarnished. It's going to take more time to fully recover. There's no way to get around it.

What I find amazing is that Obama and Administration have accomplished so much in the face of such forceful, open opposition. That's the interesting part.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 11:06AM
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Counter balanced with all the dire predictions if he were elected.
Blll Maher did a good job listing some of the crap from Focus on the Family.

"Maher read out some of Focus on the Family's 34 failed predictions, including the end of the Pledge of Allegiance, confiscation of all guns, free abortion, banning of the Boy Scouts and pornography available at all gas stations"

That we'd have a single payer system in the US.

We had one loon on here telling us we would all have chips in our head right now. (lot of gibberish about the anti Christ she doesn't post any longer) I think some ass wipe politicians in Georgia actually spent some time enacting legislation.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 11:07AM
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Wow. With all those "accomplishments" the president should win in a landslide.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 11:24AM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

Thank you jodik. You have a way of clarifying and furthering a discussion that I really admire.

labrea, I hadn't heard of this but really find it amusing. So many crazy things, all of which seem designed to inspire fear and hate in the minds of unquestioning citizens.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 11:40AM
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Well with the economy being number one , and all his great plans to do"something", not sure what, to make it better, Romney should win by a landslide.....but he's not. Its a dead heat which is not exactly the tsunami predicted by the Republicans.

Oh, I know its the 47% that pay no taxes and think they are entitled that are voting for the President and every single tax paying, job creating, responsible person is voting for Romney.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 11:57AM
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These are MAJOR accomplishments. Think where we might be had the Republican Congress focused on the nation -- instead of on eliminating a president who wants to reign in the One Percent.

Obama has had to try to turn around a battleship with a bilge full of GOP 'influence'.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 12:25PM
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Thank you, Ingrid. Words have always been my forte', and a pleasure to work with. :-)

It's that "unquestioning" thing that kind of worries me. How can adults walk through life without using critical thinking and problem solving skills, not to mention any common sense?

Obama and Administration have been paddling against the current... this much is fact. It's amazing that so much has been accomplished even though Republicans and fear and hate mongers have worked against him in earnest.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 12:46PM
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What this list should prove - again - for once and for all is that President Obama simply is not a terrible President - as has been claimed by almost every single conservative on this forum.

Bush and Cheney, however, was. Future history, when reviewing their time in office will never be kind to that team, the team that most conservatives in here voted for - twice.

Ingrid, that list will never change or prove anything to conservatives because that would not fit into their current political agenda. You can print off his list of accomplishes until the cows come home but it will never change a single mind about a single thing nor spur an honest re-appraisal regarding their President's first term in office.
Ever. It has nothing at all to do with his accomplishments. I have begun to believe that it has everything to do with the fact that they lost the last election to who they lost it to, and never got over it.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 1:27PM
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But the list doesn't prove he's a great president, which is the flipside. Don't get me wrong, I love him and voted for/will vote for him. He's "getting by" when he needs to step up his game. Sure, he's not starting wars, but there is certainly tumult in congress, and he needs to rip 'em a new one. I mean, he needs to thumb screw the crazies. Nope still not it. Hm. He, as the leader, should convince, by diplomacy, the "extreme elected" they should listen more to the constituents who hired them. There, that's what he should do. But you know, most of us here could fix all the world's problems if they'd just let us.


    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 2:40PM
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Thank you President Obama for focusing on veterans and the need to offer them good jobs:

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Four of the largest U.S. manufacturers on Monday unveiled plans for a new group committed to train military veterans to work in the manufacturing sector.

General Electric Co, Alcoa Inc, Boeing Co and Lockheed-Martin Corp said they would provide financial support to the "Get Skills to Work Coalition." It will initially aim to train 15,000 veterans, who will be hired by the four companies or matched to other jobs. Open jobs will be listed on LinkedIn.

"I look at this as a catalyst," said GE Chief Executive Jeff Immelt at an event unveiling the group in New York. "We're looking for other manufacturers to join us."

The group will be managed by the Manufacturing Institute, an affiliate of the National Association of Manufacturers trade group. GE will invest an initial $6 million in the program.

The program will get its start in January at Cincinnati State Technical and Community College in Ohio, near a major GE Aviation factory, and be rolled out to nine more U.S. cities over the course of 2013.

It calls for working with community and technical colleges to speed up training; translating military skills into equivalent civilian job functions; helping employers with recruitment and managing workers; and developing on-the-job training programs in major cities.

Here is a link that might be useful: source

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 4:01PM
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It's that "unquestioning" thing that kind of worries me. How can adults walk through life without using critical thinking and problem solving skills, not to mention any common sense?

Jodik, I think that just about every time I read a big
whoopadee-do-da about Obama period.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 4:32PM
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Considering that what I read from the rest of you might be the alternative keep Going Jodik!

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 4:36PM
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Rob, I agree with you to a point.

But, you can't make a horse drink and you can't persuade a congress rep who is beholden to his district's voters to work with Obama when they clearly promised that they wouldn't, and said so publically after his election. And would lose the next election if they do. To me it's less about the rep and what he or she does than it is about the people who vote for those reps and what they want from their reps - as clearly demonstrated by what has gone on since this President won the election three and three quarters of a year ago.

Remember the famous, first year terrible town hall meetings and the abominable behavior that went on in those meetings by conservatives? The decible level of hysteria has dropped but the attitude of hysteria and assumption of being destroyed from within by that scary/bad Obama man had not changed one bit. Reading in here for only a few opened threads proves this to me.

I don't think the President has done all he could do for this country and I dont like who he is beholden to - and said so in several threads that took place since he was sworn into office - clearly -, as have others - several times - beginning when the health care reform act ended up as it did (I called it an abortion of what his supporters had wanted and pled for) but on the other hand, I also know that without all reps working in the best interest of this country which means working WITH the current President - nothing in the best interest of this country will ever be truly accomplished. That's the sad situation we face today. Nobody is willing to work together to solve the problems left to this nation by the last administration.

However, my point really was in my first sentence - President Obama isn't the worst thing that ever hit this country, nor will he leave it trashed and burned with "his own secret agenda" as has so often been stated over and over again by nearly every single conservative in this forum. There is nothing to account for the hysterical hatred, fear, disgust etc. etc, that is aimed at him from the vast majority of conservatives who participate frequently in this forum.

Except for you Rob. Were there only more conservatives (aka republicans pre 2008) and if the GOP reflected conservatives such as yourself, then we would able to look forward to the future, no matter who ended up in power, really. Because it would always be someone who was working for the best for everyone, not for the select percentage of voters who won them the election that year. We would be divided on HOW they were going to address a few select problems and in which order of importance the problems were to be addressed - but it would be in the best interest of everyone.

-I don't find myself optimistic that this optimistic attitude of a fairly united country working fairly together will happen again, certainly not in my lifetime should I live the average span of years. I used to be forever optimistic for our future as a country - not so anymore. It has been eroding since Clinton, when many of the same people here used to decry Clinton as a President and had a good share of hatred for him too. And Hillary wasn't exactly beloved with conservatives either -

Before Clinton won the election (and since then, when mass conservative selective long term memory about their attitude towards both Clintons changed so pubically and DRAMATICALLY) I used to think it issues which had to be addressed and corrected but never the people.

Since then, I find it's the people themselves who must get ahold of themselves and correct themselves before issues will ever have a chance of being addressed in a meaningful and lasting way.

-It's up to people like you to change the course of our country, Rob. You and your so very well raised child, with the approach you take about what is best. I don't care how you vote if your approach is always with best interest of all and never with the unyeilding and mysterious, unwarrented hatred which runs through the veins of so many voters of today towards Obama. If there are enough of you, then there might be hope for the future. If there aren't, then there isn't.

If the same hatred ran equally by the same people regarding Bush/Cheney it would be more understandable that there really was an honorable and understandable point they must have.
But that it doesn't - that the same people never have a conversation about Bush/Cheney with the same vehemence as they do with President Obama? Do they even ever discuss in any meaningful length what happened under Bush/Cheney? Do they ever regret voting for them the second time? do they ever acknowledge the condition this country was left in due to that team? Do they ever acknowledge that the second war was shameful and that it should have never been started nor supported - CERTAINLY not supported by it's second year by ANY honorable American?

No. They don't.
This deadly suspicious hatred, fear, dismissal, outrage, paranoia - aimed toward the current President goes towards something other than politics and I think Ingrid's list proves it. There is nothing in that list or not on that list which could accounts for CW or Elvis, or Mrsk. or Demi's nor any other's unyeilding disgust with how this current President has attempted to do his job in the last three and three quarters years. Especially when you consider that this man is handling all of this and was handling all of this even as Bush/Cheney left office and the destructive, frightening ball that kept on dropping on this country until stabilazation was finally able to take place and slow growth began anew.

Maybe the problem was they weren't frightened enough at what that team they elected into office was leaving behind and have never ttruly grasped the enormity of the dire situation which faced us.

They just wanted somebody in office that would fix it! Quick! In a year or less! Because if they couldn't then they weren't good enough.
Which leads back to where I find the real problem in this country - not elected officials but within the people. We will just get what we tell them we want and we clearly see what conservatives said they wanted.

My point of view.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 8:02PM
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Nice statement from Rob.

From me, remember that "accomplishment" just means that something was done. Good, bad, or indifferent--that's subjective.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 8:51PM
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ingrid_vc(Z10 SoCal)

mylab, what a powerful and thought-provoking statement you've made. Your analysis agrees with what I feel, although I could never have put it so eloquently. Finding out that almost half the popular vote is for Romney is incomprehensible to me and deeply disturbing. This is not the country we used to have. Knowing how many people dismiss evolution and global warming in this country is another daunting discovery. In education and sophistication of thought so many European countries are ahead of us. Sometimes when I read the news and the things people do and say I think we're a nation of hillbillies and that the average American is far less aware and intelligent than the average European. Seeing what goes on in this forum and some that are much worse is depressing and at times makes me feel hopeless. That so many people want to elect a man who as governor spent almost as many days out of his office as in it, that no public elevator even stopped at his floor, and that people were required to stand on a yellow line to speak to him makes me hope that this is some kind of sick joke that's being played on the people, except that half of them don't know it's a joke. Yes, we do need to have the Republicans as we used to know them, and not the crazed and ignorant people whose voices we now hear. I'm reminded of the Romney supporter I saw on TV who called Obama a communist and then had no idea what a communist was.

My only hope is that President Obama is re-elected and is given a chance to continue on the path that he has put us on, which to anyone with eyes to see is pulling us out of the hole that the Bush/Cheney team put us in. I see them as being no better than war profiteers, with the only difference between the two being that the VP was much smarter than the P. What they did is a crime of such major proportions that it boggles the mind that both of them aren't spending the rest of their lives in prison. How does one sleep and live with what they've done? They seem to have no problem. Money, and lots of it, must me a great insulator.

I wish there were a more hopeful outlook, but all we can do is watch as everything unfolds, and try as individuals to be the best we can be, and to do good whenever we can. At least we can be at peace with ourselves and know that we've lived to the best of our ability.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 9:24PM
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"I'm reminded of the Romney supporter I saw on TV who called Obama a communist and then had no idea what a communist was."

He's no communist, nor a socialist either. Everyone knows communism doesn't work and would never fly here, and socialism is relatively harmless (also very ineffective). Guess again.

    Bookmark   October 15, 2012 at 10:49PM
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Did CW actually wonder how people walk thru life without any critical thinking skills? I don't know, CW, why don't you tell us. You are the poster child.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 1:54AM
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Talk about contrary, eh, Joe? It blows my mind, incredulous being descriptive enough for the moment. Real head shakers, though par for the course when all is considered...

Yes, a truly thought provoking evaluation, Mylab, thank you. I would have to concur with your analysis and Ingrid's agreement... and add that only a couple of fundamental reasons exist for the actions and words we've seen set forth since the introduction of Barack Obama to the political scene. Denial is high, but what else can one honestly ponder as root causes?

I'd like to think that a 'sane majority' will find its way to the polls come November, but I'd be lying if I said I had 100% confidence in the general public's ability to think critically beyond the influence of national media and targeted propaganda, or in the system's ability to confront not only the holes in the electronic systems used, but also the corrupt, furtive methodology employed in the arena of elector deception.

Ingrid, it defies logic just how far "education and sophistication of thought" have slipped in this country. I often hope I'm wrong on the enormity of this situation, but evidence points toward a distinct drop in these areas, and others. In too many respects, Europe is way ahead of us. They, and other global areas, understand that humanity must learn from its mistakes, and must make certain corrections for the good of humanity. We, apparently, haven't yet learned that.

We're more like a kid let loose in a toy store, wide and wild eyed, filled with an overwhelming sense of selfishness and greed, forgetting the fundamentals of not being an only child, and not having the proper self discipline to act as the example we could be... the example we should be.

The level of partisan political vehemence shown is far beyond anything normal. It borders on the absurd, though our history gives us reasons for it, as outdated and patriarchal as they may be.

"This deadly suspicious hatred, fear, dismissal, outrage, paranoia - aimed toward the current President goes towards something other than politics..."

This is what has been most notable. And while one would like to think that we're not lagging that far behind in national thinking, and that it's reduced to small pockets of extremism, one still has to account for its level of amplification.

A few rather descriptive things come to mind... shallow, impatient, irrational, and unable to maintain a train of thought beyond self... as though recent events in history never happened or can be so easily dismissed. The priorities within our society appear to have drastically changed... as have our expectations, which seem drastically lowered. It's a very sad day when what were once considered poor morals and behaviors are now accepted as part of everyday business and life, as though it's ok to lie, cheat, and steal if it benefits self in any way, most notably financially, and stepping on the hands and heads of others to get to the top is not only acceptable, it's expected. A sad day, indeed.

We began as a nation with great expectations and ideas, a world leader... and now, we're stagnating under old ideals and perceived fears, and we're bowing under pressures from those few who would see us as nothing more than another apple ripe for picking.

All I know is, if we don't begin to think like "we" once more, we'll reach our expiration date long before we need to. We're letting the self interested powers that be drag us down, and we're so busy fighting amongst ourselves, as those powers have specifically arranged for, that we can't see how the road has dropped out from under us.

We are not a nation of "I's"... we are a collective. It sadly looks as though the 'sane majority' will have to override the extremism if we hope to make it through another century... I don't know what it will take to bring critical thought and problem solving skills back to the mainstream, and relegate propaganda to its proper place. America does need a slap back to reality, though.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 9:10AM
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I love what you've written mylab. I too feel so much of what you've said. Why is there nothing about which to feel optimistic? Where has all the patriotism gone? I noticed it as far back as 9/11. We were unified then and it was the first time I'd felt it in so long. I really miss that feeling. Pride in America is long gone, shot to hel-. I see it in ingrid's statement too. I can't remember another time of feeling so hopeless. Is it gonna be ok? Is it? I too would like to know the root cause. I just don't see it changing and that is truly dismaying.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 9:17AM
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"Did CW actually wonder how people walk thru life without any critical thinking skills? I don't know, CW, why don't you tell us. You are the poster child."

Nope. That was Jodi. You owe CW an apology.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 9:18AM
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Posted by jodik 5 (My Page) on Mon, Oct 15, 12 at 12:46

"Thank you, Ingrid. Words have always been my forte', and a pleasure to work with. :-)
It's that "unquestioning" thing that kind of worries me. How can adults walk through life without using critical thinking and problem solving skills, not to mention any common sense?"


CW's response:

Posted by citywoman2012 none (My Page) on Mon, Oct 15, 12 at 16:32

""It's that "unquestioning" thing that kind of worries me. How can adults walk through life without using critical thinking and problem solving skills, not to mention any common sense?""
"Jodik, I think that just about every time I read a big
whoopadee-do-da about Obama period."


Posted by lily316 z5PA (My Page) on Tue, Oct 16, 12 at 1:54

"Did CW actually wonder how people walk thru life without any critical thinking skills? I don't know, CW, why don't you tell us. You are the poster child."


Yes, lily was wrong. She does owe City an apology.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 11:40AM
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If everybody here had to type an apology for insults to any forum member or to groups of forum members here in Hot Topics, only a couple of members would still be here posting subjects for debate.
CW would not be one of the latter. Nor Elvis, nor Nik nor Demi nor myself. Nor many others.

Lets save all that "demanding apology" outrage for something worthy of such high emotion - like - for instance - perhaps the fact that still, the GOP Presidential/Vice Presidential candidates still so seldom spend quality and quantity speech time on the topic of our soldiers, in the wars they are still fighting, being seriously hurt and dying in, or the wars themselves - because other stuff is so much more powerful currancy for them to politicise in this race.

The subject of the current wars and soldiers fighting still simply don't seem to be as powerful a subject as the exciting possibility of brand new and fresh war in Iran! and the doubling down on funding for DOD when we can already wipe out the entire world, ourselves included, with what we spend.
Lets focus all that outraged outrage on something meaningful and worthy like homeless vets. After all, they weren't all lazy and sucking on the 'entitlement' programs, they went to war willing to work harder than any wealthy or of means persons ever did and still all that hard work didn't bring them the wealth that hard work is supposed to bring. It brought them to their knees. But those homeless vets are decried as being lazy, entitlement sucking bums. Because when people denigrate homeless or those who need financial taxpaying help, there are all kinds of people who fall under that sneering knife and the homeless vet or emotionally destroyed, faceless vet is one of them.
All those flag draped "support our troops!" round robin e-mails didn't seem to support them much. But it sure made the sender feel good!

And - by the way -Thank you President Obama, for never forgetting the soldiers still fighting on foreign soil, as you campaign for the second term. You remembered them during your campaign speeches across the land in almost every single speech, you and Biden highlighted them in the speeches at the national democratic convention -

- and I should also thank the R&R twins for also making them an important subject in their own republican convention speeches...... wait.....

....oh yeah....


The people of this nation needs to hit the re-set button. I'm not looking for that to happen anytime soon.

    Bookmark   October 16, 2012 at 2:06PM
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