Obamacare Laughingstock

demifloyd(8)November 7, 2013

The most brilliant minds of the Democrat Party and liberals have produced a laughing stock.

They could get him elected with technological finess, they just can't govern with it.

Or produce a simple website.

Or keep their word.

Maybe they should have bid the job--oh wait, that's only when Republicans are in power!

What an opportunity to help people who need it and reform health care squandered.

By Morning

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esh_ga

What an opportunity to help people who need it and reform health care squandered.

And on the other side we have the Republicans that have done ZERO.

Hmm, who to pick ... those who try or those that don't ...?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:31PM
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mrskjun(9)

And on the other side we have the Republicans that have done ZERO.

Talk to Harry Reid about that esh.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:34PM
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chase_gw

No Mrs...it's not Harry Reid it's the GOP who have ZERO plans...oh yeah I forgot the part about selling across State lines...that's take care of preexisting conditions and life time limits,...etc

If you believe there is a plan show it to us.

As far as this opportunity being squandered......time will tell

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:38PM
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jodik_gw

"Hmm, who to pick ... those who try or those that don't ...?"

Precisely, Esh.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:45PM
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mrskjun(9)

There has been all along chase. But it wouldn't have been Obama's albatross...er, I mean plan. The dems had no intentions of letting it go anywhere.

Here is a link that might be useful: link

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:54PM
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esh_ga

If the Republicans have a plan they need to be telling the public about it - loudly. The public knows nothing.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 12:55PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Ah, the new mythology. The Republicans had a well-thought out/ well-developed practical healthcare alternative that would have lowered our taxes and lowered our health care costs--but those dirty Democrats wouldn't let the Republicans even talk about their plan and inform us of their brilliant ideas, much less let the Republicans pass it in the Republican-controlled House so that it could be sent through the Senate, etc.

Yeah, sure.

I hate to tell you, but Obamacare IS the Republican plan. It originated with the Heritage Center--that Republican/Conservative Think Tank --and was originally put forth by the Republicans. Then Republican Romney pushed the Republican plan through the Massachusetts legislature. But when President Obama picked up the Republican Healthcare Plan and tried to get it passed through Congress with the assistance of the Republicans for that Republican plan, all the Republicans started moaning END OF THE WORLD, END OF THE WORLD!

ObamaCare IS the Republican healthcare plan.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:04PM
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jodik_gw

"ObamaCare IS the Republican healthcare plan."

Reminds me of...

"Okay, okay... forget about Obamacare! We'll go with the ACA instead." Heads nod in righteous agreement.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:10PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Exactly, Jodi! LOL

Kate

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:15PM
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chase_gw

Mrs, your article is from 2009.....the GOP have had the House since 2010........please show me where they have introduced health care reform legislation.

Actually show me where they have laid out their plan to the American people....I mean other than the repeal and defund strategy.

They have no plan and that's the facts. It is also what will catch them because the ACA will be so entrenched repealing won't be an option...they need to put a plan together to change and enhance but they won;t becasue they are in total disarray as a party.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:18PM
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mrskjun(9)

chase, go rummaging around on Harry Reids desk. You'll find hundreds of bills there sent up by the republicans that Reid wouldn't even allow to come up for a vote. He is a little weasel. How sweet it will be when republicans take over the senate....oh the hue and cry!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:24PM
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maggie2094

The republicsnd did something! They list 24 billion in the government shutdown. But they would rather talk about a 70 million website. There are other ways to sign up ya know and happy in New York it working great. The website is a tool to shop around in the free market.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:28PM
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lily316(z5PA)

Kate, you are exactly right... Obama Care IS the Republican health plan originated with the Heritage Foundation which of course, being the GOP think tank, now oppose it.

AS I said when it succeeds it will be the ACA, because we don't want Obama's name on anything successful.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:28PM
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chase_gw

Mrs, I will challenge you on this point. If I am wrong I will freely admit it. Can you do the same?

Is it your contention that the GOP have tabled a healthcare bill since gaining control of the House and it sitting on Harry Reid's desk?

Should be easy enough to prove.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:31PM
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jodik_gw

S'cuse me a moment... let me just... hang on... rummaging around Harry's desk... I don't see anything... oh wait! No... false alarm. It was just a napkin from Burger King...

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 1:42PM
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adoptedbyhounds

Snort! Thanks for posting demi. Mocking obamacare is rapidly becoming our national pastime.

Did you catch this? "ObamaCare IS the Republican healthcare plan."

That makes sense! Democrats are desperate for Republicans to take credit for the president's fabulous "signature achievement," passed against the will of their constituents without a single GOP vote.

That must be why Democrat senators who have to run next year met with the president yesterday for two hours!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:15PM
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chase_gw

Laugh all you want...you may be right.... but the facts are the majority of Americans want this to work and when it does.......what's your plan?

National elections are won by the will of the majority not by the losers saying the same old, same old, over and over with no new ideas on what can be done to make things better.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:21PM
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demifloyd(8)

I see that no one wants to take up for this Laughingstock, only blame others.

Barack Obama we are the ones we have been waiting for!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:37PM
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esh_ga

If you think that pointing out that the Republicans have done nothing to help the American people with the issue of healthcare constitutes "blaming" then I guess you misunderstand the meaning of blaming.

Republicans need to own up to their own inaction here.

The government (and I guess it's just the Democrats) need to make this work not for the success of the Administration but because it is the right thing to do for the people. But perhaps conservatives don't understand what it means to do the right thing for the people. I haven't seen them do it for a long time now.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:52PM
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chase_gw

I repeat...

"the facts are the majority of Americans want this to work and when it does we'll see who the laughingstock is.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:57PM
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demifloyd(8)

I do not in fact know any Republicans or conseratives at all that think this debacle of Obamacare is going to work on any level.

So why waste time and energy on what is already a cluster screw up?

OBAMACARE by morning?

Not yet.

The website still showed this morning you can keep your plan if you want to, period.

One would think they might want to amend that with all the lying about the lies and tap dancing going on.

Nah--can't be bothered.
Websites aren't Obama's forte unless it's raking money in to get him elected and reelected.

Obamacare is personification of the Emperor with No Clothes that has been residing in the White House for five years.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 2:59PM
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labrea_gw

Once again those that cant use don't need it making the most noise about it.

This post was edited by labrea on Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 15:04

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:03PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Never mind that polls show that a majority of Americans want the Obamacare to work and be improved. Only about one-third of Americans want it repealed and discarded.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:04PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by labrea 7NYC (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 15:03

Once again those that cant use don't need it making the most noise about it.

*

I guess PAYING FOR IT doesn't allow me to make any noise about it?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:08PM
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Pidge

Another Obamacare thread--wake me up when it's over.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:09PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by dublinbay z6 KS (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 15:04

Never mind that polls show that a majority of Americans want the Obamacare to work and be improved. Only about one-third of Americans want it repealed and discarded.

Kate

*

Who would be surprised?

After FIVE YEARS to get the economy back on track and jobs, very few people can afford health care.

Step right up get in line and get someone else to pay for your healthcare costs.

Freebies and on the dole are a way of life now, for most of the citizens of this country

Isn't it sad that people can't make a living on their own, or won't?

Isn't it sad that people are so eager for someone else to subsidize their existence?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:11PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

I do not in fact know any Republicans or conseratives at all that think this debacle of Obamacare is going to work on any level.

Too small a sample to be statistically relevant.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:11PM
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chase_gw

"Too small a sample to be statistically relevant."

LOL Nancy!!!

That's the funny thing about politics, you need to be the majority to win.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:13PM
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david52_gw

I loved how earlier this year, Eric Cantor suggested as part of an alternative, some help with people with pre-conditions, and was lambasted and shouted down.

Nope, the tpers say let 'em go bankrupt and then use the ER.

USA!! USA!!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:18PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

Phew, what a strong breeze running through HT with all the hand flapping and yelling.

This current anti-ACA rhetoric is so reminiscent of the strident and partisan predictions of President Obama's humiliating loss in the 2012 elections.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:25PM
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demifloyd(8)

No handflapping--no handclapping either, Nancy.

Certainly not at Obama's Legacy.

Can we say much ado about nothing?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:27PM
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esh_ga

Much ado about the "nothing" that Republicans plan to offer for their healthcare plans ....

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 3:35PM
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labrea_gw

The woman, a thin 61-year-old who refused to give her name, citing privacy concerns, had come to the public library here to sign up for health insurance through KentuckyâÂÂs new online exchange. She had a painful lump on the back of her hand and other health problems that worried her deeply, she said, but had been unable to afford insurance as a home health care worker who earns $9 an hour.
Within a minute, the system checked her information and flashed its conclusion on Ms. CauleyâÂÂs laptop: eligible for Medicaid. The woman began to weep with relief. Without insurance, she said as she left, âÂÂitâÂÂs cheaper to die.â [...]

After Samantha Davis helped Deborah and Joseph Willis enroll in Medicaid one morning at a Family Health Centers clinic, Mrs. Willis, 49, told her how she felt some doctors and nurses had treated her unkindly because she lacked insurance. âÂÂMaybe theyâÂÂll look at me a lot different now,â she said.

As the couple prepared to leave the clinic, Mr. Willis, who is 55 and has severe foot and back pain from injuries but has not seen a doctor in years, turned to Ms. Davis and extended his hand.

âÂÂGod bless you,â he said. [...]

Through the exchange, Mr. Elson, 60, who has advanced diabetes and kidney disease, was offered a choice of 24 health plans, with premiums ranging from $92 to $501 a month after the subsidy. But if he felt elation or relief, he was too preoccupied to show it.

Bleeding at the back of his eyes, caused by a complication of diabetes, had blurred his vision. He had run out of insulin the previous week and had not refilled his prescriptions, which cost almost $500 a month, because a recent tax bill had depleted his bank account. He had an appointment with an eye specialist that afternoon, and the possibility of more debt was hanging heavily over him. [...]

âÂÂIâÂÂm hoping once I have insurance that I can sit down and figure out a budget and see if I have to bankrupt,â he said. [...]

âÂÂItâÂÂs not a fact that I want to sponge off of somebody,â he said. âÂÂI want to be able to pay my bills and be able to go through life without feeling I owe somebody.âÂÂ

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:06PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

I repeat: This current anti-ACA rhetoric is so reminiscent of the strident and partisan predictions of President Obama's humiliating loss in the 2012 elections.

Strident sentences and posturing does not change reality, just as it did nothing for reality in September and October of 2012.

Too bad that single-payer reform was never really considered by either the House or Senate.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:08PM
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PRO
Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

The man has no principles. Noam Chomsky.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:26PM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

There is nothing funny about this administration. It is a danger to the future of the country in nearly every way. Obama care is just 1 more example. Forget about Obama and his minions, its time to think of how to prevent future socialists, Clinton??, from coming to power to finish off our freedoms and traditions.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:44PM
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heri_cles

Yes, mocking O'Care really appeals to the country music crowd. I git it. It's Rowan and Martin Hee-Haw humor, y'all.

The man has no principles.

You mean seeking to get millions covered by health insurance who have been left to suffer and die by powerful unprincipled health insurance companies is unprincipled. That is quite a perversion of facts to make your ideological point.

As far as Chomsky, he is intelligent but his comments are often over the top:

"PAXMAN: You famously said that every American president since the Second World War would fail in the judgement as applied at Nuremberg, and therefore effectively should be hanged. Do the same applies...

CHOMSKY: I didn't say hanged, not everybody was hanged at Nuremberg. I said if we believed in the Nuremberg principles, every American president would be subject to them. What the decision would be, we'd have to check. Note this is the Nuremberg principles, not the trials.

PAXMAN: But Obama would fare no better were those principles applied to him?

CHOMSKY: No, he's carrying out a major war in Afghanistan. He's directly involved in aggressive and criminal actions carried out by Israel for example. He's only been in office for two years, so he hasn't had a chance to invade anyone yet, but his record is quite consistent with what's happened before.

========
Yea right Nohm, hang all the Presidents!

Here is a link that might be useful: Noam over the top

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:51PM
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duluthinbloomz4

Time to think seriously about Ted Cruz, eh ff. :-()

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:52PM
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epiphyticlvr

If anyone is wondering where the op comes from it is no surprise. A google search of obamacare + laughingstock gives the answer.

Greta: Will young, healthy pay for ObamaCare laughingstock? : Fox ...
video.foxnews.com/.../greta-will-young-healthy-pay-f...

'Off the Record': How will the Obama administration convince the young, hip, healthy and tech ...

Will the young and healthy pay for the ObamaCare laughingstock?
www.foxnews.com/.../greta-will-young-and-healthy-p...

Greta's 'Off the Record' commentary, How will the Obama administration convince the young, hip ...

Sen. Barrasso: Sebelius now 'laughingstock of America' : Fox News

www.foxnews.com/.../sen-barrasso-sebelius-now-laughing-stock-america...âÂÂ

Shut off Fox News!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 4:53PM
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jillinnj

Some are a laughing stock, but it's not Obama.

OMG some words were not removed from a website as of the morning! WTF? Can the world go on?

Where's that fainting couch?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:05PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by epiphyticlvr 10 (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 16:53

If anyone is wondering where the op comes from it is no surprise. A google search of obamacare + laughingstock gives the answer.

Greta: Will young, healthy pay for ObamaCare laughingstock? : Fox ...
video.foxnews.com/.../greta-will-young-healthy-pay-f...

'Off the Record': How will the Obama administration convince the young, hip, healthy and tech ...

Will the young and healthy pay for the ObamaCare laughingstock?
www.foxnews.com/.../greta-will-young-and-healthy-p...

Greta's 'Off the Record' commentary, How will the Obama administration convince the young, hip ...

Sen. Barrasso: Sebelius now 'laughingstock of America' : Fox News

www.foxnews.com/.../sen-barrasso-sebelius-now-laughing-stock-america...âÂÂ

Shut off Fox News!

*

That's an ouright LIE.

The wording of the OP was entirely from me, and rightfully so, after seeing the ACMA clip and watching the result of the audience.

Haven't watched Greta or Fox News so nothing to shut off.

It's not my fault others agree with me and you post to disparage and lie about the messenger and my OP.

It is obvious that laughingstock comes to mind with more than just me, especially when Obamacare becomes a parody and audiences full of people howl at how pathetic it's roll out has been.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:18PM
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lily316(z5PA)

At the gym every night I see the closed captioned Fox crap running as I watch CNN, and it's ALL about Obama care. Every single night. Relentlessly. They've stopped the year long coverage nightly of Benghazi to jump on the failed website bandwagon.

I admitted I kinda liked Shepard Smith, but he's at another time, I guess ,and I have to see Greta with her failed face lift and her requisite blonde hair. I remember her with long dark brown hair but to work at Fox you have to be a bleached blonde.

You can spin stories anyway you want. MsNBC has heartwarming stories of how people have found coverage which will cost far less, while Fox will only tell so called horror stories.

I know nothing from personal experience. We have top of the line health care, so it doesn't personally affect me or my family, but I like hearing the happy stories.

BTW Demi, if you want to see the definition of laughingstock...look up George W Bush. .

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:37PM
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jillinnj

And it's much more fun to focus on the problems with the rollout. Much more fun to blame Obama. Instead of directing that energy at ideas to fix the problems (with the rollout or the plan itself). You know, so the most people can be helped by the ACA. But, we already know your point of view on this. Get rid of the whole darn thing because you don't want to pay a cent towards it. Everyone having healthcare just promotes laziness and government dependence, in your view. We get it.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:39PM
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demifloyd(8)

BTW Demi, if you want to see the definition of laughingstock...look up George W Bush.

*

Not a great president, but his attempts to "Change America" weren't as pathetic as Obamacare.

NOW Michelle can be ashamed of her country--this inefficient not ready for prime time economy busting laughable sophomoric ego self tribute her husband hath foisted upon the citizens.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:41PM
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epiphyticlvr

No lie on this end. Google it and you will find what I found. It is there in black and white. I guess it is just another of those coincidences. Funny how often it happens.

This post was edited by epiphyticlvr on Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 17:49

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:46PM
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Pidge

I suppose demi might have come up with her own word--that's not a stretch. But it's a stretch to call epi's comment a lie. Here we go again with demi's hyperbole.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 5:59PM
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demifloyd(8)

Epi told me to turn off Fox news and in her words basically accused me of parroting something I never heard or saw.

And there is no "supposing" I came up with the term on my own.

It is a fact.

This post was edited by demifloyd on Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 18:02

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 6:01PM
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chase_gw

One of the reasons I am very sure that the ACA will work and that it will prove to be a great success for the American people is because I have yet to hear one well articulated argument against it.

All I hear is things like

"NOW Michelle can be ashamed of her country--this inefficient not ready for prime time economy busting laughable sophomoric ego self tribute her husband hath foisted upon the citizens."

....and baseless claims that the GOP has a plan on Harry Reid's desk.

...and nonsense about illegal aliens being the beneficiary of the ACA

...and how he LIED!!!

It speaks volumes to me that the right does not seem to be able to put forward a well articulated argument that doesn't include fear mongering and personal attacks against the President...and apparently now the First Lady.

It's going to work...and that scares the heck out of some.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 6:11PM
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jerzeegirl(9)

Social Security went through the same wringer when it was introduced. It has proven to be a godsend to countless senior citizens. The ACA I believe will in time have the same benefit to the citizens of this country.

I once saw a piece on TV about the National Health System in England (I think it may have been on 60 Minutes). They interviewed a doctor who received a salary and he was a happy guy - he had a beautiful apartment, he lacked for nothing. It seemed like an ideal system. In this country sometimes it seems like a competition to make the most money and not really care that much about the patients.

Could it be that it's a different way of looking at patients - US doctors see dollar signs; British doctors see sick people who need help?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 6:22PM
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adoptedbyhounds

"At the gym every night I see the closed captioned Fox crap running as I watch CNN, and it's ALL about Obama care."

Obamacare isn't a national laughingstock because Fox is telling people what's in it.

It's a national laughingstock because it dawned on ordinary Americans that this mess is the administration's "signature achievement."

Here is a link that might be useful: obamacare America's laughing stock

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 6:41PM
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october17(5chgo)

It's the "bad apple" insurance companies that are ruining the whole thing.

Here is a link that might be useful: Obama apologizes, sort of

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 6:48PM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

Without Fox news, there would be no news. At least they report and let you decide!. At least they present 2 sides. at least they do offer opposing views to be presented. All more than the in the tank for Obama pretend news offers. Hate it or love it, Fox does present the news.
Even democrats are looking for ways to delay the fiasco now, they are worried about their jobs and well they should be. Ya gotta pass it to see what's in it, hah!
Its time to just say no to Obama care and all his junk programs. if enuff Americans grow some cahoonies they could stand together and just say NO. HELL NO

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 7:30PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

An honest question, please.

Why do liberals keep responding in any way to these health care reform threads which Nik and other conservatives keep plastering all over the forum.
Please go back and count every thread started regarding this reform bill, go back three pages and count up the threads.

What in the world is left for anyone to say, for petes sake? As long as Nik and other conservatives keeps getting the reward of any liberal response, she and other conservatives will keep throwing up the threads.

If that is ok with you all then please SOB this response and carry on.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 7:32PM
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PRO
Brushworks Spectacular Finishes(5)

Fact checking Obama is something liberals hate to do.

He's got so much spin, it makes their heads spin trying to figure him out.

Always using lawyer speak to spin out of a mess.

Here is a link that might be useful: Fact Check

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 7:35PM
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jillinnj

Without Fox news, there would be no news. At least they report and let you decide!. At least they present 2 sides. at least they do offer opposing views to be presented. All more than the in the tank for Obama pretend news offers. Hate it or love it, Fox does present the news.

Um, wow. Did you actually write that with a straight face?

It's going to work...and that scares the heck out of some.

I agree that they are scared that it will work and there will be no turning back. Terrified actually. Which does explain the thread after thread after thread of hysteria.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 8:04PM
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demifloyd(8)

It speaks volumes to me that the right does not seem to be able to put forward a well articulated argument that doesn't include fear mongering and personal attacks against the President...and apparently now the First Lady.

*

It speaks volumes that using the First Lady's own words applied to her husband's signature legislation are considered a "personal attack."

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 8:07PM
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elvis

esh: "Hmm, who to pick ... those who try or those that don't ...?"

C'mon, esh. That sounds real cute, but just a tad over simplistic, considering the cost. This ACA was all too obviously not well thought out and certainly not well executed. I'm wondering how this mess will be fixed. ''

This is not funny at all.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 8:13PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Actually, I've been ignoring most of the conservative anti-ObamaCare threads--because its quite predictable where they are going.

The anti-Obama poster throws out some outlandish charges or made-up (and high exaggerated) examples, all accompanied by outrageous rhetoric and name-calling.

Liberals object.

Anti-Obama posters then throw out some more outlandish chages, etc.

Liberals object.

Repeat, endlessly.

I already know I don't believe much of anything the anti-Obama posters say about him or his work, so I don't really need to read these endless rituals of denunciation that the anti-Obamites can't resist performing.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 9:21PM
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chase_gw

Still waiting for a well articulated argument that isn't so shallow that when you scratch the surface , you scratch the bottom...

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 9:23PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

Still waiting for a well articulated argument

Noun, verb, Benghazi Obamacare.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 9:27PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

Nancy said the "B" word!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 9:41PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

Bella, bionda, brava!

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 10:11PM
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demifloyd(8)

Bull.

Just like Barack Obama's Legacy of Obamacare.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 10:23PM
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mrskjun(9)

I just saw an interview with a guy with cancer. He had a catastrophic policy which cost him 181.00 a month which was taking care of his cancer treatments. His insurance was cancelled. A new ACA policy would cost him 1500.00 a month. He feels that would put too great a burden on his family so he will suspend treatment and allow nature to take it's course since the treatments are only prolonging the inevitable. Now you can pooh pooh his thinking, but truly, is it fair that he be forced to make this decision?

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 10:47PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by mrskjun 9 (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 22:47

I just saw an interview with a guy with cancer. He had a catastrophic policy which cost him 181.00 a month which was taking care of his cancer treatments. His insurance was cancelled. A new ACA policy would cost him 1500.00 a month. He feels that would put too great a burden on his family so he will suspend treatment and allow nature to take it's course since the treatments are only prolonging the inevitable. Now you can pooh pooh his thinking, but truly, is it fair that he be forced to make this decision?

*

I can't pooh pooh the poor man's predicament because Barack Obama and the Democrats decided to ruin healthcare for people that were "happy" with their doctors and the plans.

Barack Obama, however, is as usual, more interested in how things affect him.

From NBC NEWS November 7 2013:

"âÂÂgiven that IâÂÂve been burned already with a website�"well, more importantly, the American people have been burned by�"a website that has been dysfunctional, what weâÂÂve also been doing is creating a whole other set of tracks.âÂÂ

Oops--as usual he was thinking and talking about himself, and then had to add the American people as an afterthought.

It's all about him. Always has been. Always will be.

I hope the man that is being forced to suspend cancer treatments because of Obama while Barack Obama claims he has been "burned by a website" understands why he's dying and why if Obamacare had not been enacted he could continue his treatments.

I hope someone cares.

Because it's obvious Barack Obama's too mad about the fact that he's been burned.

That is not a laughing matter--that is a travesty that we have a man in the presidency that is so callous and narcissistic.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 10:59PM
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maggie2094

Traits we dislike in others are the traits we hate in ourselves. Projection. Or something.

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 11:17PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by maggie2094 (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 23:17

Traits we dislike in others are the traits we hate in ourselves. Projection. Or something.

*

What?

That's your response to this JOKE of legislation?

An incoherent attempt at an arm chair psychology dig?

Now I know why Obama won.

This post was edited by demifloyd on Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 23:25

    Bookmark   November 7, 2013 at 11:21PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

I can't take that example without some trustworthy evidence to support it. I have seen far too many examples of people who claimed ACA caused them to lose their insurance --which turned out to be untrue (that's the Big Lie the insurance companies are perpetrating to justify their independent decisions to change policies so that they can raise prices) and insisted ACA would cost them far more than their old (cancelled) policy--until a knowledgeable person took them through the entire process, which included getting the subsidies that are available, and in truth the new ACA policy was going to cost half or less of what the old policy did and would also cover quite a bit more than the old policy did.

Why don't you focus sometimes on all the cases where people are MISTAKEN about how they were screwed by ACA and in fact ended up being better off because of ACA.

Because you don't want to know about them--or to admit how many "victims" being paraded on Fox News and other conservatives sources are simply repeating propaganda or in fact are confused and need some help to get things straight?

Or maybe you like sounding increasingly angry and vicious, more convinced everyday that Obama is an evil Avenger out to destroy the universe or something straight out of comic book world. Cuz that is how you increasingly sound.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:12AM
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mylab123(z5NW)

The secret's out!
Maggie won Obama the election!

And here silly ole me thought it was because Obama was up against that group of dumbells who were the in big lineup.

-Like the Romney/Ryan team of embarrassment.
-Or the Texas idiot who watched his state burn down while he begged for enough votes to drop out without excessive embarrassment ( failed)
-Or that pizza guy people in here got excited about - the one with the most engenius, tax funded, on the road book selling tour EVER in the history of authors stumping their latest book. It worked, it became a 999 best seller! Heck, some in here ran out and bought a copy!
-Or that religious nut who so offended my conservative husband because of the support the nut managed to get before Nutso's jets cooled that D.H. voted for Obama in protest against the party of stupid. And never regretted it.
-Or the tea party who set out to impress with those creepy, loud and hysterical town hall meeting scream fests. The ones where no conservatives in hot topics could manage to express a single disapproving word about - not one, though I asked and practically begged them. (I was a newbie and couldnt grasp what a ridiculous idea it was that a forum conservative would do such an unheard of thing - to be critical of the party, no matter how bad the behavior)

(But NOT Huntsman. No, not Mr. coulda, woulda, shoulda! )
It wasnt any of THOSE wack jobs ( borrowing from Lily) who assured Obama ( or any still breathing democrat on the ticket) the presidency.

It was our Maggie! She won Obama the election!!

THANK you Maggie!
From the bottom of my centrist with a hard left listing heart!
And the nation thanks you, too. ;)

(But really - how hard a job could it have even been for you OR our President to win either election?)

This post was edited by mylab123 on Fri, Nov 8, 13 at 0:52

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:41AM
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citywoman2012

As a Dr friend said.......Remember when Nancy Pelosi
said lets go ahead and pass it...then see whats in it.....
thats like a stool sample.

Great way to explain obamacare.
I could care less if liberals like him.........like his one big
poop to fame.......and never admit what a rip off this has
become for the largest marjority of the hard working middle class.

When this was crammed through I knew it was going to be as bad as it is
This is being handled by the govnm for goodness sake!!!!!!!! Did anyone think it was going to work?
The govnm?????? The same yoyo's who pay $500 for a
hammer and $1000 for a small box of latex gloves.

The same people who put him in office are still holding hands and singing Kum ba yah.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 1:17AM
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elvis

"I could care less..."

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think you mean that you couldn't care less, cw.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 1:29AM
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lily316(z5PA)

FF..You do know that polls said people who watch Fox News ( a real oxymoron) are less informed than people who watch no TV. You do know that, right?. Fox NEVER ever gives anything remotely balanced. It's all rightwing propaganda. It's BS. Like Rove's meltdown on election night 2012. I saw the other night he was predicting Coocoo bird in VA would win. Delusional freaks.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 2:41AM
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october17(5chgo)

â¢Posted by heri_cles 10 (My Page) on
Thu, Nov 7, 13 at 16:51

Yes, mocking O'Care really appeals to the country music crowd. I git it. It's Rowan and Martin Hee-Haw humor, y'all."

Perhaps, heri, you would prefer black humor?:

âÂÂI hate partisan anything,â he told The Blaze from Virginia Beach, VA. âÂÂI rant just as much about Republicans as I do Democrats. I rant just as much about the Tea Party as I do liberals.â In fact, he thinks the idea of loyalty to a party is âÂÂretarded.âÂÂ
In fact, he said he supports the president ��" whether George W. Bush or Barack Obama. But he always retains âÂÂthe constitutional right to say, âÂÂthatâÂÂs ridiculous.âÂÂâÂÂ

Here is a link that might be useful: felonious munk video

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 6:08AM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

Chase,
Are you really serious?
Number One (1). It is designed and implemented by the government -- unable to be efficient on every level.

Perhaps your country is different. Is it not-for-profit? Is your gov. efficient? Single-payer and not-for-profit might be the answer (here), but not designed or implemented by our government.

I have a big project today, so I won't be able to read more till late.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 7:58AM
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chase_gw

No I think it has a very could chance of doing what it is intended to do which is to provide viable healthcare insurance choices to Americans.

Our system is a for profit, single payer health care system which means the government acts as the "insurance company" but the doctors are in their own private practices.

Instead of billing a gazillion different insurance providers they bill one, the government. The process is much less complicated and has much less overhead for the doctors offices than does dealing with the vast number of insurance companies.

The health care system is administered at a Provincial level not at the Federal level so it's managed closer to home by smaller governments.

Hope your project goes well today!

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:12AM
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jillinnj

...understands why he's dying...

OK, so now you're blaming Obama for this man dying of cancer. Logic has been completely thrown out the window due to the hatred of the President. So sad.

Bull

Chase - was that the well articulated answer you were looking for? ;-)

Why don't you focus sometimes on all the cases where people are MISTAKEN about how they were screwed by ACA and in fact ended up being better off because of ACA.

Because you don't want to know about them--or to admit how many "victims" being paraded on Fox News and other conservatives sources are simply repeating propaganda or in fact are confused and need some help to get things straight?

Or maybe you like sounding increasingly angry and vicious, more convinced everyday that Obama is an evil Avenger out to destroy the universe or something straight out of comic book world. Cuz that is how you increasingly sound.

Exactly, Kate. Notice not a single word from a single one of them on the many stories that have turned out to be not true. They just keep looking (ie, watching Fox News) for more stories. Which may very well turn out to not be true. It is sounding very much like it was last fall just before election time. Hysteria. It's not pretty.

This post was edited by jillinnj on Fri, Nov 8, 13 at 9:46

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:54AM
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adoptedbyhounds

"Now I know why Obama won."

What took you so long! :)

The victims believed what they were told, and the fawning MSM sat on its rear end for four years, never bothering to question how obamacare could possibly work.

The irony is that the insurance companies have finally exposed the truth, leaving all but the most extreme obamacare supporters shaking their heads and wondering what the Democrats were thinking.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:53AM
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esh_ga

leaving all but the most extreme obamacare supporters shaking their heads and wondering/

Totally your opinion.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:55AM
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demifloyd(8)

The victims believed what they were told, and the fawning MSM sat on its rear end for four years, never bothering to question how obamacare could possibly work.

*

Yep, Nic, and the really astounding thing was that I BELIEVED BARACK OBAMA when he said if you like your insurance you can keep it, PERIOD.

I honestly believed him.

It never occurred to me that he would LIE so many many times unequivocally to the citizens of this country.

Fool us once....well, he fooled us twice.

And you are right, the media went along with it while Republicans warned us what would happen, and the OBAMACARE CHICKENS ARE COMING HOME TO ROOST.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:58AM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

So anyhow; in his 8 years Obama will have ramrodded a bill thru congress which ha been seen as an utter failure. That's his legacy.
now H C_____????accomplished? And then served as sec of state and done what___??? Try and fill in the blanks.
We are in an era of elected officials whos only accomplishments are, being there.
Well Lily, your poll is just plain wrong. end of story.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 10:18AM
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esh_ga

Obamacare is not over yet. There is progress to be made, but I don't think the chickens are roosting just yet.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 10:20AM
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maggie2094

Sad really

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 10:37AM
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jillinnj

OBAMACARE CHICKENS ARE COMING HOME TO ROOST

People are finding out that they actually can get better insurance. If that's what the chickens are coming home to roost means to you, ok. Stop listening to the right wing noise machine. The ACA has a long way to go to get better, but at least it's a start.

Nik - what do you think should happen? Repeal ACA? Single payer? Why won't you answer this simple question?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 10:53AM
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adoptedbyhounds

Mark Twain once said

"Never tell the truth to people who are not worthy of it.âÂÂ

Those who see this philosophy increasingly on display in Washington might want to watch some of the top performers as they lie to their "unworthy" constituents.

Here is a link that might be useful: Democrats address the unworthy

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:02AM
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demifloyd(8)

Thanks for the link, nikoleta.

Who are we going to believe, The Liar Barack Obama, Barack Obama's Lying Minions and Lying Supporters, or our own ears and eyes?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:08AM
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esh_ga

You are the one calling people "unworthy", nik, not the Democrats.

For shame.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:10AM
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frank_il

"Well Lily, your poll is just plain wrong. end of story."

Well played, sir. Well played.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:13PM
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fancifowl(5Pa)

when ya give somebody something they didn't earn, they will follow you anywhere. When more than half the people are takers, well, you can see where that gets us.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:14PM
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frank_il

What are you Fanci? Aren't you on some sort of disability? Are you paying taxes?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:17PM
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jillinnj

Who are we going to believe

Apparently, Fox News. Too bad. There's a lot of good information out there that is making people very happy with their new choices. If only you cared enough to care.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:19PM
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lily316(z5PA)

Not MY poll but a well known one circulated last year.
So hilarious calling the President a liar. Did you call your idols Cheney and Bush liars when they were proven LIARS big time which resulted in 100,000's deaths? Hmmmm ? NO WMDs which was the basis for our war in Iraq.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:22PM
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adoptedbyhounds

Thanks Demi. I thought you might get a kick out of watching our elected liars obey Twain's rule...and so confident they were!

They never expected to be held accountable for abusing their power and their constituents. Oh to be a fly on the wall in those offices today!

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:29PM
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chase_gw

FF seems not too long ago you told us of a time when you needed help. You also said you were going to give your kids all your money and live off the government in your old age......

I would think that you may have more sympathy for those "takers'

We can't seem to get an answer on what the plan would be to replace the ACA but one thing is for sure the government will have to take away millions of health care plans people like.....new plans they got under the ACA.

Of course they will be open and ====================run on an election platform that says we are going to take away the plans you like and give you back the ones you don't...that ought win votes!

Have the detractors given any thought at all on how this would ever be undone?

Facts are the conservatives are being lied to right now and they don't know it. The GOP will never repeal the ACA...never...they only threaten to do it when they know they can't. If their day comes they will NOT repeal it....I'll put money on it.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:48PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by nikoleta (My Page) on
Fri, Nov 8, 13 at 12:29

Thanks Demi. I thought you might get a kick out of watching our elected liars obey Twain's rule...and so confident they were!

They never expected to be held accountable for abusing their power and their constituents. Oh to be a fly on the wall in those offices today!

*

Yea Obama's got his little knickers all twisted because as he said he was "burned by the website."

I'll bet he threw a hissy fit.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:49PM
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jillinnj

Oh to be a fly on the wall in those offices today!

I would find it much more interesting to be a fly on the wall in the congressional GOP offices. Trying to figure out what to do...can't repeal ACA, even though they keep trying...the longer people have to find out what it means to them the worse the GOP will look. And they know it. I bet they're scared right now. More and more stories coming out about how it's helping people. And more and more of those stories about the people whose policies were cancelled finding they can get actual health insurance for about the same money. Oh, to be a fly on the wall to watch them squirm. Now, that would be good entertainment.

The pettiness over the words used or not used by Obama does nothing except make you look petty. And hysterical.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 12:58PM
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david52_gw

What I find absolutely hilarious are the stories about the working poor in the states where the GOP refused to expand Medicaid. Earn a few thousand too much for current Medicaid, and not enough to qualify for the exchanges.

There they are, wondering who to vote for next election - the party which refused to allow them insurance, or the ones who will.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 1:08PM
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adoptedbyhounds

"I'll bet he threw a hissy fit."

One would think he had nothing to do with obamacare!

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 5:34PM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

Chase,
Thanks for answering. So, how is the health care paid for in your country?
continuing ...
Number two (2), On the subject of subsidies -- the subsidy (provided by Uncle Sam) to help pay for an individual's healthcare will end in two years.
I don't know if this fact is made known when a person applies for insurance, but it sure is a consideration !!!

The subsidy paid to a state to cover the cost of expanding Medicaid will also be discontinued in two years. The states that know they cannot afford to pay for people's subsidies have declined to "expand" Medicaid (because they would then be 'on the hook' so-to-speak).
OK, while lots of people think this is just mean, if you are wanting to keep your state solvent, you have to make some hard decisions -- there-you-go.

Just an aside, if you are a health care provider and you participate in serving those with Medicare or Medicaid, you must abide by the fee schedule. If you would consent to see someone for $5., it would be against the law. If found out, you would loose your right to participate in Medicare or Medicaid.
Gotta go watch Greta :)

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 7:23PM
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elvis

â¢Posted by frank_il z5Illinois (My Page) on Fri, Nov 8, 13 at 12:17

"What are you Fanci? Aren't you on some sort of disability? Are you paying taxes?"

That is somewhat intrusive, frank. Be fair; ask if any of the regulars here are "on some sort of disability? And "paying taxes?"

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:07PM
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chase_gw

Brass tacks, each Province funds it in slightly different ways.

In Ontario heath care is paid in two ways. A payroll tax on businesses with over a certain number of employees and a personal fee based on income.

It is important to note that businesses in Ontatio are, for the most part, happy to pay the payroll tax because it is much cheaper for them than providing health insurance as an employee benefit. Ford Motor is on record as saying it is one of the reasons they are expanding in Canada.

The individual premium is very reasonable in my mind. Here is a chart of what our annual premiums are.

Hope the project went well today

Here is a link that might be useful: Ontario health insurance premiums based on income

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:41PM
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jerzeegirl(9)

Brass tacks, you have posted misinformation. If you get your news from Fox, it is not surprising that you are misinformed.

elvis, ff made his own bed, so I guess now he's laying in it.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:56PM
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frank_il

Elvis said, "That is somewhat intrusive, frank. Be fair; ask if any of the regulars here are "on some sort of disability? And "paying taxes?""

FF said, "when ya give somebody something they didn't earn, they will follow you anywhere. When more than half the people are takers, well, you can see where that gets us."

That is not intrusive when someone is constantly stating things about their personal lives. He states things often about being on disability (which I have absolutely no problem with). Do not, however, state things about "over half the people (being) takers" when you are one of those people that your party would define as a "taker."

He then went on to say the other day that he had full intentions of giving his money to his children as he let the govt. pay for his care in his elderly years. Oh no, you are correct. That is not a taker. I believe the correct term for that is fraud.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 8:59PM
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elvis

Very nice, chase. How in the world can this be done? Do you have the percentages of people on public assistance that the US has?

If those were the kind of premiums we were being told to pay here, I doubt there would be too much complaining.

Is it because health care costs are regulated (which BTW is what I have continually said has to happen first)?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:00PM
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esh_ga

Is it because health care costs are regulated (which BTW is what I have continually said has to happen first)?

Regulated? As in more government interference in the ability of for-profit businesses to set and control their own prices?

That doesn't sound like free market capitalism, elvis. They may haul you off to socialism jail if you don't watch out.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:10PM
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chase_gw

Elvis the individual premium is not the only way universal heath care is funded. I mentioned there is a payroll tax too. As well there is a transfer of dollars from federal income taxes to the Provinces .

Certain health care costs are regulated ....for example how much a doctor can charge for an apointment or certain procedures but there is no limit on the care one can receive....ie no limits on doctors visits , or hospital stays or treatments.

For example, my sweetie pie , 29 year old , niece had been diagnosed with stage 4 colon cancer. She has gone as far as she can with traditional oncology treatments. There is a very limited and specific trial that she has been asked to participate in NYC. All of her expenses related to travel and stay in New York will be covered by our health insurance......not cheap.

As much as it pains me to say it this is a bit of a Hail Mary pass...but there has never been one question, one worry, one moment when all the best of care and opportunity for a better tomorrow had not been afforded her.

You folk really could do so much better for each other and to the betterment of your society

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 9:22PM
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demifloyd(8)

MORE Laughingstock Evidence:

From Politico, November 8, 2013:

"Only five people have fully completed the enrollment process in the D.C. insurance exchange, according to information compiled by lawmakers from four of the insurance companies participating in the exchange.

Two people enrolled in CareFirst BlueShield plans during October and three enrolled in Kaiser Permanente plans during the month."

All those po po people in DC with no health insurance.

FIVE have signed up.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:26PM
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Circus Peanut

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:32PM
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frank_il

"All those po po people in DC with no health insurance."

Wow, I am not sure how people can claim that you are racist.

You just can't help yourself, can you?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:35PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by frank_il z5Illinois (My Page) on
Fri, Nov 8, 13 at 23:35

"All those po po people in DC with no health insurance."

Wow, I am not sure how people can claim that you are racist.

You just can't help yourself, can you?

*

What are you talking about?

What does racism have to do with being poor?

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:38PM
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frank_il

I am sorry. If no one else gets what I am saying, I will wholeheartedly apologize.

    Bookmark   November 8, 2013 at 11:54PM
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elvis

How many people have to react the same way to your rude remark before you get that demi's not the disingenuous type, frank?

Demi doesn't even know that "po po" is informal US slang for police. As a southerner, she's saying "po'", as in "poor," which is meant as a joke because it is DC, where the fatcats who wrote the ACA live, presumably.

Boy, are you off-base.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 12:08AM
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frank_il

Nope, not what I meant (not that I expected you of all people to get it).

This post was edited by frank_il on Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 0:14

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 12:11AM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by elvis 4 (My Page) on
Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 0:08

How many people have to react the same way to your rude remark before you get that demi's not the disingenuous type, frank?

Demi doesn't even know that "po po" is informal US slang for police. As a southerner, she's saying "po'", as in "poor," which is meant as a joke because it is DC, where the fatcats who wrote the ACA live, presumably.

Boy, are you off-base.

*

Thank you Elvis.

And of course you are correct.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 12:13AM
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elvis

â¢Posted by frank_il z5Illinois (My Page) on Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 0:11

"Nope, not what I meant (not that I expected you of all people to get it)."

Thank you! I don't ever want to be the sort of person whom you would expect to think along the same lines that you do.

I appreciate that more than I expect you to understand, frank.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 12:30AM
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frank_il

"Thank you! I don't ever want to be the sort of person whom you would expect to think along the same lines that you do.

I appreciate that more than I expect you to understand, frank."

Ouch. That hurts more than you will ever know.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 12:32AM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

Chase,
Thanks for that link about premiums -- and your information is very interesting ! I would like to know more about Canada's health plan, it sounds better than the States'.

This country is in a real fix -- the plan is suppose to be ready for implementation within a short time. It could not be repealed at this point without the Pres. wanting that to happen. If people knew some of the truths about what is in store for them, the intrusion into their life, the power of law not in their best interest -- they would take to the streets. That knowledge will not be known until it is too late.
About your original challenge/question --
Something to consider is that there are so many people that will not sign up for the plan. Not enough money being paid to insurance companies can mean only that the cost of insurance will keep increasing.

Some of those people have good enough incomes that they would not qualify for a subsidy, but still would not be able to afford increased debt without making changes that they don't want or cannot make.

Some do not have that decision to make, even with a good enough income, they simply could not afford any plan -- not with the high prices. So, where does that leave those people -- WITHOUT INSURANCE, that's what.

Just the other day the Pres. made one of his easy-to-misinterpret remarks that maybe there would be some additional help in the form of subsidies for some of those that don't qualify for a subsidy. In-other-words, he would have to make the suggestion to the Congress and cross his fingers that the Congress would consider increasing our debt to help his plan get more subscribers. At a time when the gov. got shut down because of money matters? Not likely -- and the time constraint for that to happen is past.

There are the people that will decide to pay for their health care when those opportunities arrive and believe that they will be saving a bundle of money.

Talk about the young people -- when gov. thinks that the young bloods are going to be the hefty financiers to the insurance companies, well that is such a miscalculation and void of any common sense.
Many young people are not even 'getting by'. This includes the ones well into their 30's. Some have businesses or saving to start their own business, some are still at home, some cannot find a job, deferring their student loans, trying to afford the next semester in school, saving to get married, helping their folks, etc. Some of them would have to be put on Medicaid.

I might as well include those people that will decide to die rather than to see their last dime spent on something that prevents them from having a dime.
I truly am afraid for this country. I should sign off and go take my pooch for his walk. (bless his patience). If you've lasted through this long post -- bless your patience too. Wow!

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 8:07AM
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esh_ga

I would like to know more about Canada's health plan, it sounds better than the States'.

Has the prophecy come true? Is the thought of Obamacare and it's shortcomings (yes, it has them!) become so bad that conservatives are now willing to consider the single payer option?

brass tacks, I never thought it would be you that posed that idea. I agree, it would be so much better.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 8:16AM
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chase_gw

Brass tacks, nothing is perfect our system has warts too but it is definitely more accessible, affordable and much less cumbersome that what you have in the States. I firmly believe single payer, perhaps with a private sector option on top, is the best option.

I'm optimistic that the ACA will bring some relief to the situation in the States but it certainly not the final solution. Too bad the politicians can't get together and work on a solution together. Refusing to cooperate gets the American people nowhere.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 8:33AM
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adoptedbyhounds

Brass,

Chase has much to be thankful for. She has the advantage of living in a country where her politicians protect her interests. Chase pays taxes that contribute to the well being of herself and other Canadians, because in her country, citizens come first.

But what Canadian taxpayers enjoy isn't what Chase promotes on these pages for Americans. Chase wants Americans to feed, clothe, educate, medicate and tolerate a massive imported underclass, while in her own country illegal aliens are not "welcomed" nor allowed to take advantage of the citizenry.

Like Americans, Canadians have laws that protect citizens' interests by deporting illegals. Unlike Canadians, Americans have politicians making careers out of refusing to enforce our laws and protect the American people.

Chase has lots of good information to share on how her system works, but her system rests on politicians who are still loyal to the people who elect them.

Our politicians engage in premeditated betrayal and get away with it all the time. Chase may have heard "sorry," but I'm guessing the tens of millions of Americans betrayed by what politicians knew would happen to them heard "tough luck, sucker!"

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 10:44AM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

Good for you, Nik.

I just knew you could incorporate your favorite punching bag into your anti-ACA screeds. Thanks for renewing my faith in you.

Otherwise, all that's left to say is "HOOT!"

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 10:52AM
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elvis

You're wrong, nancy. Nik's assessment is pretty accurate, IMO. She has acknowledged in her post above the validity and sincerity of chase's pov as chase has espressed it (consistently). Nik added a necessary dose of the reality; USA and Canada have some major differences.

There's a great opportunity for discussion there. Is there a way USA can achieve the sort of health care success Canada currently enjoys (only better!), without compromising our own American ideals to a degree that is intolerable to the citizens of the USA; that's the question IMO.

Your post below is just junk:

â¢Posted by nancy_in_venice_ca SS24 z10 CA (My Page) on Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 10:52

":Good for you, Nik.
I just knew you could incorporate your favorite punching bag into your anti-ACA screeds. Thanks for renewing my faith in you.

Otherwise, all that's left to say is "HOOT!""

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 11:13AM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

elvis, why don't you wait for chase's comments on Nik's characterization aka mind reading of her position.

I have never seen chase endorse what Nik claims.

If you have, I would love to see the source.

As for Nik's screeds against immigrants and Latinos -- legendary in the annals of HT, and often the source of great humor, unintentional of course.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 11:25AM
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elvis

nancy: "elvis, why don't you wait for chase's comments on Nik's characterization aka mind reading of her position."

Point taken; however I'll note that I do feel that you have a problem acknowledging any possibiility of any scintilla of a chance for finding just the tiniest patch of common ground.

You insist on negativity between your pov and all dissenters, at all costs. That's my take. Shrug.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 2:14PM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

esh, I have to chuckle.

Chase IS so fortunate !!! I assume that believing those in leadership positions are looking over us must create some real pride and feelings of security.

About those that are not citizens, I don't voice my opinions because I don't know enough and am torn between feelings of compassion and the math.

There must have been a long discussion to consider how Canada handles their health plan. What ever happened in D.C. with that discussion ??

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 4:08PM
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brass_tacks(8b/GA)

Chase,
Tell me more about your politics -- are you able to make some distinctions between yours and ours? Maybe you have some suggestions?

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 4:20PM
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ann_t

Yes what did happen to that discussion?

The USA should have had the discussion more than 50 years ago. That is how long we have had our universal health care.

It is shameful that your country doesn't provide every citizen with the same health care.

~Ann

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 4:29PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Can we back up a minute? "Po po " is US slang for police? Not in Kansas. Is it everywhere except the south and Kansas? News to me.

(Aside: Frank, I got your earlier point--but I don't care to draw it out and discuss it. : ) )

Kate

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 5:25PM
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demifloyd(8)

Posted by dublinbay z6 KS (My Page) on
Sat, Nov 9, 13 at 17:25

Can we back up a minute? "Po po " is US slang for police? Not in Kansas. Is it everywhere except the south and Kansas? News to me.

(Aside: Frank, I got your earlier point--but I don't care to draw it out and discuss it. : ) )

Kate

*

So what was Frank's point?

I asked and got no answer.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 5:49PM
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elvis

"Can we back up a minute? "Po po " is US slang for police? Not in Kansas. Is it everywhere except the south and Kansas? News to me."

You're not in Kansas anymore, kate.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 6:11PM
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epiphyticlvr

Not in Kansas. Is it everywhere except the south and Kansas? News to me.

Not in NY or anywhere in the NE, actually never heard it used anywhere. News to me too.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 6:17PM
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mrskjun(9)

From the urban dictionary

1. POPO

A Police officer. especially the ones that rides on bikes.

Orgin: California late 80's

police officers that patrols certain beaches on bikes wore a vest that said PO in huge blockletters on each of their chest. which means Police Officer. they usually ride around in group of two's.

when you see them coming by. you see the word "PO" "PO" when they stand next to each other.

Man.. here comes the PoPo to tell us what to do again.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 6:23PM
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elvis

"Not in NY or anywhere in the NE, actually never heard it used anywhere. News to me too."

Well, you two can probably find it right here on this newfangled internet.

    Bookmark   November 9, 2013 at 6:23PM
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esh_ga

She has the advantage of living in a country where her politicians protect her interests. Chase pays taxes that contribute to the well being of herself and other Canadians, because in her country, citizens come first.

Thank for pointing that out, nik.

When it comes to healthcare, Republicans certainly are proving over and over that they don't protect anyone, including and especially their citizens!

They have spent a significant amount of time refusing to entertain ideas on how to improve their citizens' healthcare in the last 4 years. By refusing to work with their colleagues in Congress on a plan, to wasting legislative time on useless votes to repeal a law they knew they could not, to refusing to expand Medicaid in their own states to help low income citizens get health insurance.

All actions and inactions that directly affect their own citizens.

Editing for typo in "proving".

This post was edited by esh_ga on Sun, Nov 10, 13 at 9:20

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 7:42AM
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demifloyd(8)

From the urban dictionary

1. POPO

A Police officer. especially the ones that rides on bikes.

Orgin: California late 80's

police officers that patrols certain beaches on bikes wore a vest that said PO in huge blockletters on each of their chest. which means Police Officer. they usually ride around in group of two's.

when you see them coming by. you see the word "PO" "PO" when they stand next to each other.

Man.. here comes the PoPo to tell us what to do again.

*

Learn something every day mrskjun thanks for the explanation of the origin.

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 8:55AM
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jodik_gw

Hilarious, Circuspeanut! The best laugh yet in this multi-thread debacle!

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 9:37AM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Geez--I ask a simple question, and I get smart-aleck thrown in my face! What's the deal?

Thank you, epi, for answering seriously my question. And I will assume that mrsK's dictionary response was intended to be informative rather than a put-down of the ignoramuses that live in Kansas and the northeast.

Given the dictionary definition, I would guess that is why people in Kansas don't use the word "popo" for the police. We don't have any beach patrols here--gee, I wonder why? And as far as I know, bicycle police are not common either. After all, most people here don't like riding their bikes through the winter snow.

Anyway, thanks to those who took my question for what it was--a real request for enlightenment. It was not snark.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 9:48AM
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chase_gw

I am currently visiting with friends and haven't the time to respond

"But what Canadian taxpayers enjoy isn't what Chase promotes on these pages for Americans. Chase wants Americans to feed, clothe, educate, medicate and tolerate a massive imported underclass, while in her own country illegal aliens are not "welcomed" nor allowed to take advantage of the citizenry."

This comment of Nik's is a total misrepresentation of anything I have ever said with regards to illegal immigrants. Nik's "praise" of Canada is a ploy she uses to get to me.......she made her contempt for our healthcare known long ago.....I just out "facted" her so she changed tactics.

Her statements about Canada are laden with sarcasm......she has no idea if our politicians care about us, nor does she care......nor have I ever said they did...

Anyhow, off to visit with my socialists buddies and commiserate about Rob Ford....one of those stellar politicians of ours.

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 10:03AM
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demifloyd(8)

Well we do know that they are Canadians who if they don't care about us, spend an awful lot of time telling us what we do wrong!

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 10:14AM
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chase_gw

Not sure which Canadians have said they don't care...I care lots!

Given the political, cultural and financial relationships we would be foolish not to care. I especially care now that I spend 25 % of my year in the States.

I try very hard to limit my posts to political and economical issues or social issues that are common to our shared cultures and societies as well as subjects I am knowledgeable about.

I am very careful not to make negative comments about the American people. If I should inadvertently do that I would appreciate someone pointing it out to me so I miay apologize.

....as for those who don't like my input....tough !

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 1:38PM
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jodik_gw

I appreciate the input regarding Canada, because we're connected as nations, and more importantly because I and quite a few other Americans are looking at the Canadian health care system as a possible model for the type of system we'd like to have.

We already know that the ACA isn't perfect, and there will be issues to deal with along the way... anyone who expected it to be perfect right out of the gate is truly not thinking with a logical mind... and forgetting all the Republican objection, blockage, and misinformation.

As citizens, we wanted something better... this is well known... but at the very least, the ACA is a stepping stone toward something better.

What we DO know for certain is that we can't allow the system to go on as is. Bottom line.

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 2:03PM
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jillinnj

Well we do know that they are Canadians who if they don't care about us, spend an awful lot of time telling us what we do wrong!

Can someone please explain to me why regressives are so resistant to listening to anyone that is not American? What is with that? You know, there are very intelligent people in other parts of the world that have good ideas. What is wrong with listening and figuring out if any of those ideas could work here? The close-mindedness of these regressives is mind boggling to me.

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 2:31PM
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demifloyd(8)

We already know that the ACA isn't perfect

*

ROTF, it apparently is perfect enough for people that are accustomed to having many, most or all of their needs met by taxpayers.

Since Obama, Reid and Pelosi and the Democrats are tap dancing as fast as they can to make sure those numbers multiply so they can stay in power, I figure this debacle and laughingstock will be more than perfect for the takers and the redistributors.

This post was edited by demifloyd on Sun, Nov 10, 13 at 22:38

    Bookmark   November 10, 2013 at 10:36PM
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adoptedbyhounds

"Nik's "praise" of Canada is a ploy she uses to get to me.......she made her contempt for our healthcare known long ago.....I just out "facted" her so she changed tactics."

Nope. Your HC system works for you, it's popular with your citizens, and that's all that matters. I've said repeatedly I simply want what you have. I want my electeds to put US citizens first, just as your electeds put Canadians first.

You can clear up any "confusion" by responding to the following. Canada does not force Canadians to "share" their country with illegal aliens, nor feed nor clothe nor educate nor medicate them. What makes American citizens any less deserving of law abiding legal immigrants than you are?

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 12:50PM
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esh_ga

nik, you are implying that the US has federal programs that feed, clothe, educate and medicate illegal immigrants.

On what fact do you base that implication?

Illegal immigrants do not qualify for federal welfare or SNAP programs (food).
Illegal immigrant do not qualify for federal Medicaid or Obamacare (medicates).
Education is provided at the state level; if illegal immigrants are being educated, then please take that up with your state representatives.

Not sure what federal program clothes anyone, illegal or not.

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 1:23PM
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chase_gw

Not sure how you know anything about illegal immigration in Canada and certainly no idea why you think we have such altruistic politicians....

Of course our numbers are smaller but I assure you my tax dollars feed , clothe, educate and provide healthcare to illegal aliens. I'd love to hear your facts to support otherwise.

Edited to add

You also owe me an apology for attributing thoughts and assertions to me that are completey and totally false. I expect you to substantiate your comments or retract them.

This post was edited by chase on Mon, Nov 11, 13 at 13:41

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 1:29PM
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chase_gw

Soon this thread will expire...and likely NIk will have not recanted or apologized.

However all of you will recall this and know that she could not, or would not, defend her baseless accusations with regards to my thoughts on illegal immigration......

From that it follows if one is prepared to lie about one thing they will lie about much......

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 3:25PM
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demifloyd(8)

And the world is laughing, now shaking their head at how the leader of the free world had three years to get a website ready and failed to do it, and how the leader of the free world repeatedly lied for years to the citizens of this country that their healthcare would be left alone "period" if they liked it they could keep it.

If it didn't hurt so many people at the expense of helping just a few--heck it would be easier to ask for donations to the people that did not have insurance--it would be funny.

Instead you have people who are now getting one more aspect of their life paid for by others and the many people that scrimped and saved and made good personal decisions are losing their insurance and being forced to pay more MORE and pay for coverage they do not need and want.

Barack Obama is a bald faced LIAR.
Barack Obama's Health and Human Resources Department and his administration are INCOMPETENT.

Yes, this administration is a laughingstock when graded for honestly and competence.

This post was edited by demifloyd on Mon, Nov 11, 13 at 15:33

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 3:32PM
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epiphyticlvr

And the world is laughing, now shaking their head

So, you know that how? Have you spent time abroad lately to know that or are you just assuming again? I just came back from abroad and found most feel differently then you are claiming. They think it is about time the US did something and are finally trying. Many told me they never understood how a country like the US didn't provide healthcare and finally we have a President who is trying.

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 4:05PM
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esh_ga

The only people laughing are the conservatives ... they are laughing and not lifting one finger to help their constituents.

Ask the residents of Georgia that would qualify for expanded Medicaid but whose legislators refuse to do so. And several other states like Georgia are in the same situation.

Yes, conservatives are laughing ... laughing and not helping one bit. Those are the people I want to re-elect ... NOT.

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 4:22PM
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ann_t

If anyone is a laughingstock it is those that keep harping on about the President lying, on and on and on, like a broken record.

~Ann

    Bookmark   November 11, 2013 at 4:57PM
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