A petty Post

labrea_gwNovember 16, 2012

I'll be petty! No say you oh yes I can be terribly petty!

The American Family Association (you know how much I love them) has posted their annual Holiday/Christmas crap list they call it the naught or nice list for businesses that won't or don't use the words Christmas!

Look who is missing from that list so far!

Maybe they are giving them a chance to repent unlike. the naughty!

Banana Republic

Barnes & Noble

Family Dollar

Foot Locker

Gap Stores

L.L. Bean

Limited Brands

Maurice's

Office Depot

Old Navy

Radio Shack

Staples

Supervalu

Victoria's Secret

Here is a link that might be useful: read it and weep

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momj47(7A)

I'm very pleased with the "red" list. I'll support them. It's much better than getting bombed with Christmas sh*t starting in October, like Walmart does. I just ordered stuff this week from L.L. Bean and Old Navy.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 12:59PM
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rob333

I see that every year and I think I am just now deciding they say holiday so they can milk it as much as possible. From Halloween to New Year's Day.

Or maybe it is about avoiding saying Christmas, or Kwanza, or Christmas, for fear of limiting themselves. Or they just don't want to offend those who celebrate Chanukah or Kwanza. Don't they see out of their little ol' box? It doesn't bother me someone tells me to have a Happy Chanukah! I've never had anyone wish me an enjoyable Kwanza, but that wouldn't bother me either. I wish others were less sensitive about saying christmas sssshh! I didn't say that word.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:03PM
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jodik_gw

Well... based upon our beliefs, we now know who to give the business to.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:06PM
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ohiomom

That's right "tis the season" for the outrage posts about the "war on Christmas".

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:07PM
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rob333

I'm not outraged. So why can't people say "Merry Christmas"? Why do the holidays have to lack that religion, when others get to celebrate theirs during this time? Why can't they all just be who they are? I can see it be all of them, including Happy Holidays for those who want to remain unaffiliate? But, why can't those who want it be Merry Christmas, be allowed to say and enjoy it just as it is? Hardly seems right to have to stiffle. Or, why aren't you upset to see and hear Chanukah stuff?

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:18PM
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labrea_gw

This Years war on Xmas has been brought to you by that new Holiday Fragrance "ANNOYING"
Catchy advertisng slogan. Be Remembered Be... ANNOYING at fine discount Strip Malls everyhwere!
Nothing says home for the holidays like ANNOYING!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:25PM
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ohiomom

Thank you for proving my point ... I say Merry Christmas and funny thing is I have never been berated, scorned or thrown out of a store or anywhere else for saying so. But then I don't think anyone is waging a war on my beliefs, regardless of what certain politicians/media jacks say. For me it is just another "talking point" that some use.

And so it starts....

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:26PM
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blfenton

rob333 I completely agree.

This political correctness garbage has gone too far. I have to be "sensitive" to the feelings,religions, etc of others so why can't they be sensitive to my feelings and my religious celebrations.

Beginning the first week of December I say Merry Christmas to everyone in the stores. I have noticed that over the years more and more people who work in the retail stores are saying Merry Christmas.

It used to be they would never say Merry Christmas, then they would say it if you said it first, the last couple of years many of them are initiating the sentiment. If we're not allowed to celebrate Christmas then as far as I'm concerned all religious holidays and celebrations should be cancelled.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:27PM
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chase_gw

I usually say Merry Christmas unless I know the person I am saying it to does not celebrate Christmas. Then I say Happy Holidays.

It's really no big deal and I don't understand why some want to spoil the season by making it one.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:31PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

So why can't people say "Merry Christmas"? Why do the holidays have to lack that religion, when others get to celebrate theirs during this time?

I honestly don't know what you're talking about because no one is forbidden from saying "Merry Christmas." If retailers have made a marketing decision to use "Happy Holidays," that is their right. If it generates more sales, good for them; more sales tax and income tax paid, good for us. I still have my right to say "Merry Christmas, and a Blessed Feast of the Circumcision."

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:34PM
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lily316(z5PA)

I guess I'll be supporting my heathen stores even more...LLBean, Gap ,Banana Republic, B&N, Limited..all favs of mine.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:46PM
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rob333

blfenton is saying what I am thinking. Why does political correctness not ever go the other direction? Why just for some? No one gets up in arms and says to boycott jewish clothiers and restaurants for not saying anything about Christmas or having Chanukah decorations. Right? I don't find it a war, but I find it irritating that people can't leave Christmas in the mix.

Nancy, I said the same thing. I think they are trying to make everyone happy. There are those who try to read in more, but that doesn't make it so.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:48PM
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labrea_gw

No one Celebrates the Annunciation anymore except my friend Diane a 74 year old ex nun! It gets her all excited shes funny & sweet & often risque! She alwaswy tells us when we are out at coffee which St's Day it is!
Her other favorite is in Septmeber the Feast of The Archangels I think at least one of them wen't harking for the Holidays!

Now that I brought up the annual Hiliday Rant.
MERRY CHRISTMAS to all who keep ih holy & the rest of you many happy regiftings!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:56PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

Why does political correctness not ever go the other direction?

For you it may seem like "political correctness" but I see freedom of speech being practiced. Perhaps I live in a more culturally diverse area than you, so I understand the consideration that some may wish to practice. I don't wish someone "Merry Christmas" unless I know that they are Christian, or am responding to someone who has wished me the same.

but I find it irritating that people can't leave Christmas in the mix.

We each have the right to chose how we present ourselves during the holidays. I'm sorry that it irritates you that not everyone shares your opinion on how to properly celebrate the season.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 1:59PM
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soupgirl(z5NE)

If someone says "Happy Holidays" to me, I respond with "Merry Christmas" because it's a force of habit and it would take considerable effort on my part not to automatically blurt out the words "Merry Christmas." But having said this, I am not the least bit offended if someone says something other than "Merry Christmas" to me and I have not encountered a single person who was offended because I said "Merry Christmas." If the words "Happy Holidays" or "Happy Chanukah" or "Happy Kwanza" is someone's way of expressing holiday joy to me, then I am grateful for it and not inclined to criticize the message or the messenger and would hope for the same when I say "Merry Christmas."

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:02PM
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rob333

I'm not telling someone else how to celebrate it Nancy? You're confusing me. I'm talking about how I want to celebrate it. The word Christmas is a dirty word to some. I'm not saying you. I am happy to hear Happy Holidays. Sure. I take it to the extreme. I often wish the Europeans I know a Happy Christmas.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:08PM
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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

I'm talking about how I want to celebrate it.

Your comments about other people: I don't find it a war, but I find it irritating that people can't leave Christmas in the mix.

If you don't see the implications of what you wrote, I don't think it's possible to have a discussion. Good day.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:14PM
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hamiltongardener(CAN 6a)

Looks like the first shots in the annual "war on Christmas" have been fired.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:19PM
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Circus Peanut

But, why can't those who want it be Merry Christmas, be allowed to say and enjoy it just as it is? Hardly seems right to have to stiffle.

You're confusing me too. Who is not allowing companies to say Merry Christmas? Who is being stifled and by whom?

The OP is about an organization that calls for a consumer boycott of those companies that DON'T use Christmas in their marketing. Which I find amazingly bigoted.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:41PM
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momj47(7A)

Goodness, I say Merry Christmas all the time, to people who celebrate Christmas, but not to my Jewish ex-in-laws, of course. And if I don't know what's appropriate, I don't say anything, or just wish them a Happy New Year.

I hate being surrounded by tacky Christmas decorations and music starting in October. That's the real war against Christmas.

What's so hard about this.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:44PM
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labrea_gw

It's an insane consumer festival in the US tha many church historians don't even find on early church calendars in fact ther was a bit of smug very that suggested only sinners celebrated their birthday! Roman emperors birthdays were holidays! The Alexandrian patriarch's believed it to be in May!
The actual word is from the middle ages about athousand years or so after the big event!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:54PM
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marquest(z5 PA)

I wish everyone a Happy Holiday. My family get Merry Christmas. My business life was that it was the proper respectful greeting during the holidays. Nothing to do with politics it was Etiquette and respect of other.

I guess I'll be supporting my heathen stores even more...LLBean, Gap ,Banana Republic, B&N, Limited..all favs of mine.

Agree lily, I knew there was a reason they are some of my favorites.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:55PM
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rob333

Good day. I said "Good Day"
-Fez, That 70s Show

You made me laugh!

Here is a link that might be useful: Fez Good Daying it

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 2:55PM
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fouquieria(10b)

We only celebrate Kwanza in this household. It starts in mid-October and ends in mid-January. The colors we use are Orange, Black, Red, Green, White, Blue, Purple, Turquoise, and Mauve with an Ochre tint.

-Ron-

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:03PM
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david52_gw

If some body doesn't say "Merry Christmas" to me, I shove 'em really hard and scream in their faces that they should be celebrating the birth of the Prince of Peace.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:10PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

I love Christmas and will wish a good one to everyone I see during the silly season - , even Wal Mart employees who have to say "Happy Holidays!" ...but who seem to delight in my specific Christmas wish! :)

No skin off my nose who says what. As long as peace and Christian as well as non-christian charity are behind the work of the season, it's all good for me.

Those Christmas-specific kind, good wishes otherwise rare, but so freely extended during the season -along with a turkey, box of stuffing and a can of green beans - tends to be the best part of the year that the helpless, homeless and poverty stricken can expect and are always so grateful to receive.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:16PM
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labrea_gw

I'm just enjoying that it looks like they gave Chik Fil-A a pass no where in that ad up top is dah woid Christmas!

Now the Qur an says that when the pains of childbirth started, Mary went to a palm tree in a deserted area. Jesus was born there. In the moments of her anguish and grieve, angel spoke to her. By a miracle, a water stream came out around her and fresh ripe dates fell close to her. ( no Joseph in the Islamic version)

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:27PM
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jillinnj

The word Christmas is a dirty word to some.

No, it's not. Where do you get that from?

As far as I remember, it was Bill O'Reilly and his like that started this nonsense.

Stores and people can say whatever they want. Some stores decided it was more inclusive to say "Happy Holidays" to acknowledge that not everyone in America celebrates Christmas. Then the O'Reillys of the world went balistic. Because heaven forbid anyone try to be more inclusive in this country!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:28PM
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rob333

I'm trying to think of how to say it, but I can't put my finger on it. It's subtle, but for one to say they'll shop at heathen stores or red stores, simply because of some list--it's almost like they're to get across how much they disagree with... stores who are saying/showing Merry Christmas? Or not. I haven't hit on it yet in my mind. It's the disdain behind anything "Christmas", that is unpleasant. An attack? No. A war? No. But it's a looking down the nose feeling, or an uppity sneer towards how I choose to celebrate? Something like that. Disdain is closer to right.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:31PM
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david52_gw

The 47% are the same ones that say Happy Holidays.

With their hands out for all of Obamas' gifts.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:32PM
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rob333

no Jill. It's something I've personally experienced. Nobody started it. No one tells me how to feel. I can recognize it when I see it. Like porn. You know it when you see it, but to point it out, it's a little more subtle.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 3:33PM
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ENMc

"Last Ounce of Courage" is the latest in a sub-subgenre of movies expressly aimed at conservative viewers. Dinesh D�Souza�s documentary "2016: Obama�s America" is the highest-profile example. Last year�s "October Baby," about abortion, is another.

I've been waiting for this little gem to get dragged back out for re release.

On the upside..I guess you can start Christmas too early ;)

E

Here is a link that might be useful: Merry, merry

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 4:07PM
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ENMc

"Last Ounce of Courage" is the latest in a sub-subgenre of movies expressly aimed at conservative viewers. Dinesh D�Souza�s documentary "2016: Obama�s America" is the highest-profile example. Last year�s "October Baby," about abortion, is another.

I've been waiting for this little gem to get dragged back out for re release.

On the upside..I guess you can start Christmas too early ;)

E

Here is a link that might be useful: Merry, merry

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 4:08PM
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duluthinbloomz4

And it's never too early to start planning the hors d'oeuvers menu for the uncoming non-denominational, inter-faith, peace and justice extravaganza.

Guess that about covers it! :-)

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 4:35PM
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rob333

Happy Merry ChanukahKwanzaChristmas Holiday!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 4:39PM
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vgkg(Z-7)

The picture below says it all about who really started the War on Xmas.
These Godless Heathens and their Satanic Hollywood Propaganda!!

Here is a link that might be useful:

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 4:47PM
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jillinnj

Rob - I can only speak from personal experience. I'm not christian and don't celebrate Christmas. The only time I am offended is when someone that knows me well continues to wish me a "Merry Christmas" knowing full well that I don't celebrate it. They claim it's an American holiday and I should get over it. I claim it's a religous holiday. A religion I don't celebrate. And they should get over trying to enforce their beliefs on me.

So, if you've felt some disdain, perhaps you're not being sensitive to others that do not celebrate the same holiday as you.

I certainly wouldn't boycott a store that said "Merry Christmas" to me but I do appreciate stores that try to be inclusive of everyone and not everyone celebrates Christmas.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 5:04PM
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labrea_gw

I heard anti semetic screeds about Christless Christmas since I was a kid from at least more than. 1 priest
My parent thought it do modern & American to have Santa & presents & a tree.
Every year the same litany about an apple & an orange a cup of tea a piece of raisin cake & Mass that's what they had I'm Ireland & that Americans were all crazy!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 5:06PM
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don_socal

Have a nice day off work if you get it. Just another day to me at this point.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 5:44PM
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jillinnj

We always go out for Chinese food. Tradition!

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 6:34PM
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jodik_gw

I have to agree with Circuspeanut and Nancy...

"The OP is about an organization that calls for a consumer boycott of those companies that DON'T use Christmas in their marketing. Which I find amazingly bigoted."

Not everyone celebrates Christmas specifically, or another form of such a holiday. Some celebrate it quite differently, not at all, or for different reasons.

While I do often think the "politically correct" aspect of some things has gotten a bit out of hand, I certainly wouldn't want to force an idea on anyone, especially something largely religious in nature.

We're not about the materialism and consumerism of the season, though... nor are we about any religious aspect... we feel that the season is largely a tradition for kids, and a time for our family to gather in one place to enjoy each other's company and be grateful for another year together.

I don't let vocalized greetings bother me one way or another. I respond in kind, and go on my way.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 7:06PM
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kimka(Zone 6B)

Why do some people have such a hard time seeing stores saying Happy holidays is about welcoming all customers. As a non-Christian, if I see a store that only has big Merry Christmas advertising, I figure they aren't very interested in my money and I shop elsewhere.

No one is forcing stores to say Happy Holidays. It is simple freedom of speech and about atracting as many customers as possible.

There is no war on Christmas. But I am pretty tired of my tax money going to pay for Christmas decorations from local community to federal, even if they are using the term Pagent of Peace. Ive had several people tell me that Christmas trees are not religious, they are just seasonal. I keep asking which part of Christmas and Christ in Christmas tree are they missing?

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 7:31PM
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labrea_gw

Ah ... got the irony the organization the AFA is listed as a hate group by the SPLC they consider themselves gooooood Christians fighting the KULTCHA wars and the gave a pass it looks like to Cki Fil-A a corporation they endorsed heartily months ago.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 9:09PM
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Elly_NJ(NJ z6)

I say Merry Christmas or Happy Hanukkah depending on the person.

The people that insist on stores focusing on Christmas are bent on imposing their religion on people that don't share their religion.

Kind of like the Christian version of Sharia Law.

Anyway, the stores just want to make money. Nothing wrong with that, but they couldn't care less about what holiday they push. Valentine's day, 4th of July. Whatever sells.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 9:16PM
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jillinnj

Ive had several people tell me that Christmas trees are not religious, they are just seasonal.

Oh, yes, kinka, I've heard that one too. It just shows how clueless they are to anything other than their own religion and traditions.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 10:47PM
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jillinnj

Sorry, that's kimka.

    Bookmark   November 16, 2012 at 11:33PM
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don_socal

"Many people suffer from the misconception that Christmas is a Christian holiday. The earliest history of Christmas is composed of "pagan" (non-Christian) fertility rites and practices which predate Jesus by centuries. The truth is, in short, the real history of Christmas has nothing to do with Christianity. Many of the traditions which we hold dear, such as decorating Christmas trees, singing Christmas carols, and giving Christmas gifts, are rooted in the traditions of non-Christian religions.

We do not observe Christmas on December 25th because it was the date in history when Jesus was born. Nobody knows exactly what that date was, but references in the Bible show it most likely did not take place in winter. Rather it is because this was the date that the Romans historically celebrated the winter solstice. This celebration was about dies natalis solis invicti: the day of the birth of the unconquerable sun, which took place on December 22nd. The winter solstice held the promise of the return of springtime and earthly renewal. In Roman history, this was the time of Saturnalia, honoring the God of Agriculture, for the week before the solstice, and Juvenalia, a feast in honor of the children of Rome, around the same time. On the 25th of the month they celebrated the birth of the sun-god Mithra. Masters and servants traded places temporarily, and everybody had a rollicking good time. It was during Saturnalia that the tradition of exchanging gifts was established. They gave one another Stenae or fruits which were intended to bring good luck. The Romans placed an enormous amount of pressure on the early Christians to rejoice along with them, and around the time of the fourth century, they began to celebrate Christmas around the same time. It was inevitable that Christians should make a connection between the rebirth of the sun and the birth of the Son."

More at link...

Here is a link that might be useful: The History of Christmas and Its Pagan Origins

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 1:28AM
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sylviatexas1

"Happy Merry ChanukahKwanzaChristmas Holiday!"

& a Joyous Winter Solstice to us all!

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 9:34AM
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david52_gw

I wuz gonna say - the best seasonal parties around here are the bonfire solstice bashes, where people save up dead sage brush to throw on the flames - spectacular bursts of fire - along with cavorting pagans casting shadows, all with a hint of the potential debauchery to come.

Waaaaay better than sitting around sipping egg nog and looking at LED-lit plastic trees.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 10:54AM
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woodnymph2_gw

Don, thanks for posting that on the pagan roots of Christmas. I rather like celebrating the Sol Invictus and Winter Solstice, myself.

I don't let either greeting get to me. I figure, whatever, it was meant sincerely, with no malice. I cut the greeter plenty of slack, as I figure it is the spirit in which it was said that matters. No resentment nor anger here....

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 10:55AM
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jillinnj

I don't let either greeting get to me. I figure, whatever, it was meant sincerely, with no malice. I cut the greeter plenty of slack, as I figure it is the spirit in which it was said that matters. No resentment nor anger here....

I completely agree when it was meant sincerely with no malice. Unfortunately, that's not always the case. It was certainly not the case of the right wing media that started the whole "war on Christmas" nonsense. For them and their followers, it is a this is a christian country and if you don't like it leave scenario.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 11:47AM
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jodik_gw

Joe, I can't help but feel that a majority of religion and the organization of it is akin to a toxic mold creeping insidiously around the globe, called by various names in different languages along the way. It's very dangerous, and once infected, difficult to find a cure. It is at the root of more issues, problems, evils, and wrongs... and is responsible for much hate, division, murder and war, bigotry, confusion, guilt, fear, and so much more...

If it is ever discovered that such an entity as a god is a real, tangible thing, that god would be shocked and dismayed that the original message sent has been so distorted as to be the exact thing it was never intended to be.

And that's my opinion, and a good reason why I stay far away from it in real life.

    Bookmark   November 17, 2012 at 12:15PM
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elvis

Jodi: "If it is ever discovered that such an entity as a god is a real, tangible thing, that god would be shocked and dismayed that the original message sent has been so distorted as to be the exact thing it was never intended to be."

"Original message sent"? What message, sent by whom? Seriously, what does that mean?

    Bookmark   November 18, 2012 at 8:58PM
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labrea_gw

It's a valid theological question thats not scorn is it?

Hmm could it be "love one another like I have loved you"
or before that "I Am that I Am" or
" I am against you,' says the Lord ... , and will lift up your skirts over your face; I will show the nations your nakedness and kingdoms your shame.". (some of those messages must be a bad connection!
or the original tsimtsum or tzimtzum!
For the Universe & we all to be manifest the Ineffable Limitless No thing had to sacrifice it's original condition and become many things or manifest.
It get's so confusing there are so many tellers of the tales
But still it's good to know the tales!
This is after all a petty post!

Since it's about holiday messages I would thing the obvious
Christmas celebrates the "Word Made Flesh" or another shift in this seemingly changeable mutable entity.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2012 at 10:53PM
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elvis

Mutable in its immutability. Immutable in its mutability. Yes; I like that. Because we're both.

Goodnight to this thread.

    Bookmark   November 18, 2012 at 11:27PM
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jodik_gw

"Hmm could it be "love one another like I have loved you""

That's pretty much what I was getting at, Joe... the most basic of messages... the idea that we should treat others as we want to be treated... and not divvy up into groups based upon levels of differences and hatred, and then commence ingraining.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 5:37AM
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ohiomom

Yes Jodik that is the message :)

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 7:36AM
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rob333

I feel disdain Jill because there are plenty of people looking down their noses. I don't get the same leeway to enjoy it in my way. I am happy for those who want to enjoy pagan rituals, to fully enjoy it. I won't say they are wrong or how dare they! Or even say "Those dolts! who do they presume to be, shoving their ways down my throat!!!"

Leave my celebration alone without inserting disdain towards me and "the likes of me" (not all Christians are the same), and you'll not hear a peep outta me!

There is disgusting disdain towards Christians right here in this very thread. It's pretty much what I was addressing.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 8:26AM
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jillinnj

Sorry, Rob, I don't understand.

I don't get the same leeway to enjoy it in my way.

Why? Who or what is stopping you from enjoying Christmas your way?

Why do you feel disdain? Because stores choose to say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas"?

I'm sorry, I'm not following you.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 9:44AM
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labrea_gw

Remember druing this winter celeration boycott our select list of businesses!

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 9:48AM
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kimka(Zone 6B)

What jillinnj said.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 9:51AM
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rob333

I don't call being spat upon as being to enjoy it. But that's just me, and what do I know? I mean, it'wouldn't be very nice for me to visit New York, stand in their midst, and say, ew I hate New Yorkers!, and someone would be offended. Don't blame them! Why is anything similiar ok? For instance. Yes, I don't have to go to New York, but boy, NYC think they're the middle of the universe (wink, wink). They're just reveling in who they are. Good thing I actually LOVE New Yorkers!

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:05AM
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jillinnj

What? Who is spating (is that a word?) on you? What are you talking about?

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:08AM
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rob333

EW Christians! Some outright. Some subtle. I'm not mad, just pointing out how many don't practice what they preach. (psst, spat is past tense of spit, guess either one would work. Well, I can see both being used)

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:15AM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

Rob, you cannot reasonably ask for a Hot Topics poster to censor his/her opinions on a Hot Topics Forum, can you? Non-believers are as entitled to their opinions as you are to yours. And you have not been forced to suppress your opinion on this forum, so don't ask the non-believers to suppress their opinions either.

Fair is fair.

Kate

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:25AM
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labrea_gw

The original post is a about a politicized quasi religious group posting their annual list of don't shop here for your special purchases that honor "our saviors birth"
That alone is bizarre to me and has nothing to do with spirituality, religion the nativity & everything to do with commerce & politics including absenting one of their pets Chik Fil A from the list whose ad states the same message they find offensive.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:31AM
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ohiomom

I don't feel spat on and when those who do not believe as I do say so it is not offensive to me ... but I tend to be a little more tolerant and accepting of others.

Unless it comes to processed vs. real food :)

Rob I really do not feel there is a war on my beliefs, I just accept that not everyone feels/believes the same way I do and that is their right.

Merry Christmas from OhioMom :)

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:34AM
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rob333

Freedom of speech means you can. Decorum means you don't. Be tacky, it's your right.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:35AM
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jillinnj

EW Christians! Some outright. Some subtle.

I guess I'm just dense this morning...but I still don't get it. Where is anyone saying 'ew Christians'?

As Joe pointed out, the point of his OP is the list of stores one should NOT shop at because they don't say "Christmas" and the hypocrisy of Chick Fil-A not being on that list.

The fact that some appreciate that stores try to be more inclusive is not saying 'ew Christians' or 'ew Christmas' or anything else.

Sorry, don't want to drag this boring conversation out anymore. We can agree to disagree. I just wish I understood your point.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 10:44AM
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jodik_gw

Don't worry, Jill, you're not alone... I'm not really understanding where Robin is coming from on this one, either... but I do think that Ohiomom said it very well. Thanks, Ohiomom.

And, I agree re: processed vs. real food! :-)

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 12:38PM
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dublinbay z6 (KS)

And I'm so glad I found out the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America is "tacky."

Kate

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 12:49PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

I was once a practicing Catholic, am now an atheist and despite the lack of a God Belief, still can't understand why anyone not Christian or a non-believer would take offense at being wished a Merry Christmas, even if that person knows that the atheist doesn't believe or celebrate the day in any way.
Unless a person has specifically informed everyone they know that being wished a merry Christmas will be considered insulting or insinsitive, why in the world would anyone sense any intent other than a positive one at being wished a merry Christmas?
Even if the wisher knows the person is not Christian- if the wisher hasn't been informed NOT to hand them any merry Christmas's, there is nothing I can find, for the life of me, that would be a veiled insult or personally directed insensitivity behind that wish.
Especially considering that the wish can mean many things, but all those things are positive as far as I can see.

I am atheist, but love the season. Love it. I spend time with people who are in need and this is the part of they year where they benefit even from those who look down on them, as a group, with suspicion and distain all the rest of the year.

*From the week of Thanksgiving until December 30th*,

this is the time when it tends to be that those in need will NOT be questioned about WHY it is they are in need, (why did you decide to be poor?) will not be looked upon with suspicion or distain or with the assumption that they would rather take (steal) my taxpaying dime, or revulsion that -along with a handshake - the full bellied person might walk away with lice.
This is the very tiny but, to me, treasured time of year when caring most frequently tends to come with some speck of caring and the fabled Christian-like charity. The donation which will supply that turkey meal is done with a glad heart by those who, so often during the rest of the year, deeply resent every crumb of cornbread stuffing put on that plate of the shiftless and lazy.

I have told several times by those in need that it is more the very LACK of the air of animosity and suspicion that is so treasured. I suspect it is treasured even more so than the very meal itself.

What I appreciate, personally, about this season is that it seems to inspire those who are SO very suspicious of the general population of needy - the needy will more often be treated with a kindness which implies that the person in need is actually *worthy* of a kind word or look. That the person does exist and is worthy of existence
Instead of being stared through as if the needy person does not exist, those who usually stare through them will, instead, look at them and often even speak to them as of they are deserving of dignity - and without that "look" I've come to know so well. The "look" is primarily of distain, but also with assumptions - assumptions which are so continuously so well covered in this forum in great detail. That look filled with judgemental assumptions about a general group of people whom they have never met or have any specifics about - about an entire group of human beings who are "other" than themselves.

So, for this atheist, I really love this season and I don't care what it's called - I'll take it with a glad heart because it benefits so very many in more ways than food and perhaps a thing to be touched. I can watch the real meaning of 'good will' be displayed - displayed with a kind heart.
We must treasure it because it promptly vanishes when the tree comes down, the bright lights dim and the first christmas shopping bill comes due, if not sooner.
I consider Merry Christmas to be a statement of good will as a given, but it is also a general statement of various wishes depending upon the wisher: of peace, of charity, of embracement, of inclusion.

In today's very complex world of complex people, the great thing about being wished a merry Christmas is, the wish can mean any nice thought the wisher wishes to give, and it can mean whatever nice thought the receiver decides to take.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 1:00PM
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ohiomom

I consider Merry Christmas to be a statement of good will as a given, but it is also a general statement of various wishes depending upon the wisher: of peace, of charity, of embracement, of inclusion.

...well as I said early on this thread, I wish people a Merry Christmas and I have yet to be attacked and/or thrown out of a store. If anyone/s chases me down the street with pitchforks and torches, I will let y'all know.

Meanwhile ... Merry Christmas to all and to all a season of peace and love with family and friends.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 1:08PM
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steve2416

I love this season, although I despise any weather that requires more than a Tarzan loincloth to be comfortable. Family seems to have more time for get-togethers.

I would never spend my money at a place that isn't inclusive of all races, religious beliefs, or sexual preferences.
When shopping for gifts, I don't care if the storefront displays Merry Christmas, Xmas, or Happy Holidays. I'm in and out within 10 minutes (if I'm lucky).

I lost any faith I had in Vietnam when I saw how cruel the human animal can be. My pastor said killing in war is justified but I can read the Commandments as well as he. Since then my church has been my 1/4 acre garden. I give organic veggies and fruit to family, friends, strangers that show up, and the pastor of the church across the street for his needy. Makes me feel good and the sound of my hoe doesn't disturb their service.
My sisters are very involved with their churches and they drive church buses, do meals-on-wheels, and tutor (free) students that are language challenged. They even got me involved tutoring kids struggling with arithmetic and pre-algebra.
I'm actually an Agnostic, but I believe that what one does means more than the title one assumes.
Merry Christmas, everyone.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 4:07PM
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denninmi(8a)

I much prefer Happy Holidays. I live in a community which is extremely diverse, with people literally from every corner of the globe and every religion or none at all. HH is pretty generic, if nothing else we all celebrate New Years, with the exception of the poor souls who work in retail and are forced to work that day.

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 4:31PM
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ohiomom

"Since then my church has been my 1/4 acre garden"

What better place to find peace then in a garden. I must admit your post brought tears to my eyes, may you enjoy the season with your family/friends Steve.

Merry Christmas

    Bookmark   November 19, 2012 at 5:06PM
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labrea_gw

Steve there is a tremendous scene in the movie Joyeux Noel. The WWI troops stopped fighting for Christmas & didn't wan't to start again the next day in the aftermath a Scottish Priest who played Christmas Carols across the trenches is being sent home & being told he was a disgrace by his Bishop. The Bishop then goes in to speak to the men & starts with "I have come to bring the sword"
A movie that will make anyone ball!

Here is a link that might be useful: ah well

    Bookmark   November 20, 2012 at 7:09PM
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elvis

"A movie that will make anyone ball!"

So this was a porn film then?

    Bookmark   November 20, 2012 at 7:13PM
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mylab123(z5NW)

How very cute and oh, so clever Elvis.

    Bookmark   November 20, 2012 at 9:13PM
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momj47(7A)

The Story of the Christmas Truce

I'm sure all the young men who died in WWI are thrilled to be honored by cheap, tacky Christmas decorations, dogs barking out Christmas music and people bickering about saying "Merry Christmas." And The Prince of Peace must be pleased, too.

It doesn't matter what you say, it's how you live that matters.

    Bookmark   November 20, 2012 at 9:22PM
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labrea_gw

Anyway! I posted these clips last year also!

Here is a link that might be useful: Adeste Fidelis

    Bookmark   November 20, 2012 at 10:41PM
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