The species Papilio is a diploid,and as such,is self infertile.If both plants are from the same clone"same single original bulb"the pollen will not take on the female.If they are different clones,then the pollenation should take,from one to the other,both ways.If if either bulb is self fertile there is a very high probability that chromosomes have been doubled or that the bulb is a hybrid of Papilio,rather than a true species.
Del

HAHAHA Donna-I am sitting here sipping the last bit of my merlot from dinner(Den made a fab filet mignon w/bernaise!!!) any way drinking my wine, reading and looking over my shoulder wondering if you are spying on me! lol Rereading to make sure I am hearing what you are saying being the busy little BEE. Your Paps are both wonderful and your efforts sound like they would be smashing!! Can't wait to see a couple/few yrs from now what will happen!! Cheers!!

Del, two of my H. papilio are self fertile and two aren't, I wonder if there is a ploidy difference?

Donna, you are very impressive with all those pap flowers. Some folks have difficulty growing them and having them rebloom. I'm sure those folks would like details of what you do ;-) Anyway, I think cross pollinating them is the trick. Good move on the Misty pollination too.

Cindee, sounds like a lovely Sunday dinner!

Alana

Both Papilios presented above, look like the "common" clone that is traded worldwide. This clone is self sterile. I readily accepts the pollen from obviously any other DIP, that this will include H.papilio also, provided that it is another clone though.
While DIPs are often self sterile, this does not apply generally so. Elsewhere I read that generally, H.papilio IS self fertile.
It could be considered, that an extraordinarily beautiful but self sterile clone of an ornamental becomes calculatedly marketed, with the idea in mind, to prevent future mass production of copies. But I would not go sooo far as to claim THIS, bcz you might rightfully consider it a "conspiracy frenzy" LOL!

Well, my Papilio #4 is blooming currently, one that I just picked up at a local nursery this year...I was so lucky to get a scape and 2 flowers! I'm thinking that this flower may be a different clone, the flower is a bit smaller and I think it is generally more curvaceous..I am just posting some pictures of it so they will be all together.. #1..#2..and now # 4. I will put the pollen from #1 or #2, or maybe I will mix the pollens of #1 and #2 and put it on #4. Hopefully if I get some seeds, some of you out there would help me out and take a few. This wasn't labeled Papilio Improved, I don't have one of those yet...Also, I have already put # 1 on # 2 and it's early, but the pod is still growing. I had put Lemon Sorbet on # 1 and it shriveled last week. I was surprised, as I just assumed that Lemon Sorbet was a diploid. Was I wrong? Should I bother to try Lemon Sorbet again on # 4? I really liked the idea of the light yellow... I have 5 pots of Papilios now and know don't really need any more, but I just can't seem to stop myself!! I think I need help...my husband knows I need help....

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Donna

Donna, I bought a papillo bulb last year from Glasshouse works, it was very tiny. It never did bloom, but the bulb is much larger this year, but not as large as the bulbs I got from Lowes. It has so many off shoots, at first I though there were 8, but went back a week later, and it looks like there is at least 8 more. I will check again if I go back next week. How old do the off shoots need to be before you can break them off the mother plant? Will she bloom with the off shoots still attached? I am really excited that I will get all the new plants, with my $15 investment. I have not gotten off shoots from my Red Lions, new plants are from self seeding. The papillo is planted in full sun, and the red lion are planted under hugh live oak trees. I will plant all my new bulbs next to where I have the papillo planted. Hoping they will be as happy. Barbra

Hi Honeybunny,

If you have a papilio with offshoots, I would leave them alone..I think papilio resents being divided and I wouldn't do it unless your pot was chock full of large bulbs. There is nothing prettier than a pot full of papilios, 3 or 4 or whatever fits in your pot. I do think they like to be crowded, so I would let them multiply and wait for flowers before I even thought about separating them. My very first papilio.. purchased on Ebay last year had 2 bulbs, one good sized (with bud) and the other tiny..I just cut the plastic pot off and replanted in a much larger terra-cotta pot and didn't disturb the roots,.. just plunked it in the larger pot and filled the soil in around it. I also left the bulblet right were it was, attached. This year I have 3 bulbs growing in this pot and I had 2 scapes that bloomed from the larger bulb. I will not separate any of these bulbs,for some time.. I will just keep going up a pot size every few years.. or until my husband gets tired of lugging around huge pots;-) I'm assuming your papilio is in a pot, if it's planted in the ground, then I would just let it form a huge clump and leave it alone. Should be breathtaking when they bloom...I'm hardly an expert on growing papilios, I've just had beginners luck with them big-time. I even got seeds last year!!

As far a your Red Lion, I always let any bulblets grow to the size of a golf ball at least before I separate them and at that size they always have a good root system of their own..and actually if there is only one or two bulblets on a bulb, I tend to let them stay attached as long as the mother bulb still looks healthy. Most times they will detach themselves from the mother bulb and just continue to grow along side of the mother bulb and the more the merrier! Again, I am no expert, I have just been growing these plants for a couple of years, and have lots more to learn.. there are many people of this forum who have lots more experience than I have...

I actually had an Orange Sovereign that had 6 or 7 bulblets 3 or them grow to orange size bulbs and the rest were all golf ball size they all stayed in the same pot for many (3 or 4) years and I finally had to divide them since I wanted to find homes for most of them. The mother bulb was just fine, and only this year the NFB got into her but I think I caught it in time, and I had kept 2 of the smaller bulblets, just in case. I've heard that eventually the mother bulb will be smothered or killed somehow when surrounded by so many bulblets, and maybe it take more years than I gave it, but the mother bulb was just fine...I guess that's enough rambling....

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Donna, thanks for the information. The last picture you posted is exactly what my Lowes Minervia bulb has produced with 4 blooms. I am very happy with it, since I really wanted Orange Sovereign. I can't wait until my bulbs look like yours in the picture above. I have my bulbs planted in the ground, I am zone 9b. Barbra