Where are you located? Maybe I can lend a strong back if yer willing to share? :-D
Thanks
CJ

send me an email with details ok?

First of all...don't panic.

To eradicate it, without all of the excessive man-hours and the worries, simply cut the culms, ALL of the culms, to below the ground level, AFTER the shooting season is over.

Make sure that NO bamboo remains above the surface that might receive any sunlight.

As any new culms pop up, simply cut them off as before.
Every second day or so for the first couple of weeks, check for new growth, then once a week or so after that. By the end of the growing season, the rhizomes and roots will all be dead.

No need to spend countless hours digging senselessly. I removed a vivax grove this way that was growing along a creek and amongst some trees, which made it impossible to dig up. Vivax is much larger, faster growing, and faster spreading than black bamboo, so it should work more easily with black. I only cut the culms back a total of about 7 or 8 times on the vivax grove, before it died.

Good Luck

Kt

Noooooooooooooo!!! Don't kill it...Not till we get together first!! :-D
CJ

Sorry CJ!! I should have said that, first, advertise it for sale or you dig for free. There are too many people out there who want free bamboo to just kill it outright, without at least giving some bamboo lovers a chance for a little work and some free bamboo.

By the way, I dug and transplanted as many vivax divisions as I could from that creek. I have since found homes for all of them.

Kt

It would be nice if you could include what was used for the barrier. I would have liked to reply to your post before any person considering one of the many species of bamboo got scared off in an Orson Welles sort of way.

The proper information is out there. In fact, one of the people who replied before me, alerted the people of this forum on his failed barrier. (He did mention that it was 40mil thick HDPE material that was penetrated.)

What material did you use, and how thick was it? How deep did you have it in the ground? Did the bamboo go through the barrier, go under or go over? How long was the planting in the ground?

Thanks for answering these questions,
Rick

My barrier failed in less than five years on my 9' X 27' Henon grove. I have yet to dig around the remaining barrier and see all of the actual damage. I will do so when I get my camera back from the shop, so that I can photo the escaping rhizomes. The few that I have dug up were all within the top foot or so of the ground level. None went deep enough to go under the barrier.

I have since found a few strays outside of the barriers around my SYK, P. nigra, and Tonkin Cane, but to a lesser degree, probably due to the smaller size of the bamboo. Never again. I have since stuck to planting only clumpers in my yard.

Kt

Mike in Marietta seems to have optimal growing conditions and contains alot thru rhizome pruning as seen on his pictures of his tight clump groves of some species.[semiarundinaria fastuosa,is one I remember].
I have heard that Phyllostachys nigra grows extremely well
in certain parts of Oregon.
Bobnorth: what part of oregon and what type of barrier and how deep was it planted and at what angle and what did you use for clamps.These seem to be imperative criteria before "alarming the world" of the "Bad bamboo"...please give us some more details and photos if possible.
thank you.

bobnorth-
Remember...your mileage may vary. Some of my bamboo groves have been growing in the same location for over 30 years, required hardly any maintenance, and did not get out of control.

I echo Kudzu - what did you do, in terms of containment. A colleague of mine has had a black bamboo in a corner of her yard for the past 15 years, and the furthest the runners have got to was within 7 feet of the original clump! I took up her offer to did a clump for myself - and the rhizomes were all less than 12 inches below the surface. That's mighty tame, compared to what a stand of P aurea can do to your yard in less than half that time!

Also, some people here don't have limited space. Therefore, the bamboo can be let to roam without worry.

The best barrier information that I have seen in one place is in the handout by James Clever and Ian Conner for their presentation at the 2005 ABS conference last Friday. It should be in a future issue of Bamboo magazine.

Bill

I disagree that there is not enough information on containment. Every bamboo book or website seems to have extensive information about containment. But I'd wager alot of beginners don't pay attention to it so your warning is well taken.
I grow black bamboo (nigra, bory, henon) in Oregon zone 8 and would add that when given water in the dry season this stuff grows and spreads vigorously.

I guess I should have pointed out my feelings on barrier usage... I have done a lot of research as have most and the conclusion that I developed is that any barrier that I have heard of may not turn out to be a permanent resolution, a kind of false sense of security regardless of environment. I have used one and hope that it holds up for quite a while. If it does not I have every intention of sharing the information with others.

One question I do have is how HDPE material holds up to large tree roots. When I dug the trench for my barrier, the backhoe cut through many large roots. This has been my biggest worry. BUT, I anticipated before putting in the barrier that it would fail at some point (was hoping for 20+ years)....

Kentuck,
thanks again for sharing your experiences. My questions were directed primarily at bobnorth and I apologize for not being more clear.

Hollenback,
thanks for the info, and please let us know when they are available.

rfgpitt-
I would think, but don't know for sure, that tree roots are not nearly as good at penetrating barrier as bamboo is. However, I should point out, for the future at least, that severing large tree roots can lead to the demise of those trees after several years. I generally try to work around tree roots when excavating. I just took out 3 trees that were about 75' tall because their roots had apparently been damaged during constuction when my house was built 4 years ago. I just bought it this year, so I wasn't involved in the earthmoving. I have two neighbors whose houses were built at the same time, and they have dying trees, too. It doesn't happen all the time, but those big old trees are more fragile than you'd think

kudzu,
thanks, but I did not dig that close to any trees that were not expendable. I have a few odd narrow branched maples and some weed trees at the property line and these are what the barrier is against. It would have been fine if a few died since they shade the area at different times of the day. It's been 2 full years and if anything, they are probably happier since they get more water and a little fertilizer since i have "good" plants around them....

I am worried that the roots may push against the barrier causing a surface that is not smooth, allowing the bamboo to more easily penetrate.

I think you're right about the tree roots in that they're more likely to distort, or even lift, than penetrate.

for the barrier around my nigra I used stainless steel buddy of mine owns a heating and air company he cut it to 30" deep and made interlocking channels for each of the seams and sprayed it with a waterproofer when done hopefully it will hold for some time :)

meat-
I'm impressed. That sounds pretty bulletproof. I'll email you in 30 years or so to see how it's holding up...

BOBNORTH:

Still curious what barrier you used?

Well I have seen Moso bamboo travel under a hotel under a parking lot to pop up in a dirt property divider a total distance of over 100 yards, so I can see why some people can be bamboo wary. Whenever I pass it I'm always amazed at how strong bamboo can be.

Well I have seen Moso bamboo travel under a hotel under a parking lot to pop up in a dirt property divider a total distance of over 100 yards, so I can see why some people can be bamboo wary. Whenever I pass it I'm always amazed at how strong bamboo can be.

bobnorth,

I am not trying to be mean spirited in any way toward you. The goal of this forum is to educate, and if anything we throw a little fun in. I came across this forum when searching for information on bamboo several years ago. As I would search for other terms, I continually found hits from this site. At first I really did not want to have anything to do with a forum, but found it to be tremendously useful. I would assume that since you joined GardenWeb the day you made this post, you too found it through your searches. Bamboo does have a bad reputation, and not everyone should grow it. If you are willing to put the time in it will reward you. No plant is perfect. If you grow conifers I'm sure you understand that statement. You can spend tons of time trying to adjust the soil and water and the thing still dies on you. I wish we could just plant bamboo and watch it grow, but in most situations, it's not that easy. I would assume I'm not the only one who really wants to know what has happened in your case. I (we) are hopeful for our sake that some sort of detail was left out or overlooked in the process. If not, it will back your statement of this posting and have meaning, else we are left to think it was ignorance. Again, this is not a stab in your back, but yet an effort to obtain more knowledge. Please try to let us know in detail what was used for a barrier, how it was installed (most important), and how it was breached.

Thank you,
rfgpitt

My rule (for my own use) is not to plant more than you can individually monitor and take care of. I have found that containment is easy when I patrol the plantings several times a year to look for shoots that are out of bounds.

Bamboo becomes a problem when it is put in the ground and then never maintained. Ten years later, you have a real disaster. If you can't maintain a yardful of 'boo, only plant a single running specimen and take care of it with annual inspections.

The situation may be worse than Bob described. I think his boo got him and he is no longer able to speak. Sounds to me like he's got the Triffids strain of black bamboo. Or it might be that someone is yanking our collective chain with this post, who knows? All I know is in zone 4/5 you'd be lucky to get your bamboo to grow out of control. :)

But you got good icefishing Mike...[lol].

Ya, but my cane pole is too small of caliper. Walleyes keep busting my culms. ;)

Heh heh.
A decent Fargesia nitida culm could handle a pumpkinseed or bluegill.

Thuja, I hope I get to be one of the lucky ones who have hard to control bamboo. I'm not even sure if they will survive the winter, but if a single division can run 10 feet in every direction in one year's time; what can a grove that is 2 acres do? I saw some rubro rhizomes sure wandering around, possibly lost? In any case I have my rubro in a perfect spot. If it can't do what I want, I'm sure no other bamboo will have a fighting chance.

Strangelove, rhizomes running that far under things sounds quite extreme! I like that.

The post didn't appear for awhile -- thought the admin zapped it. Anyway, here's the details: I'm in the Medford, Oregon area--real hot summers; pretty cold winters.
The stand was approximately a 4' wide and 10' long oval shape. The barrier was 36" deep with 2" above ground. The barrier was joined and clamped at the seam, but not with the metal clamp kits I've heard of. I got the barrier from a large bamboo supplier -- I think it's the 40 mil because it seems thin to me--but it's what they stocked. The penetration came at many different points of the barrier -- but the nigra just punctured right thru, none of it over the top. In my diggings I've gone down a good 3-4 feet and still found straggler roots in the clay. If you define rhizome as a horizontally travelling 'larger root' capable of sending up new canes, then I discovered around eight of them...a few under the fence and 1-2 feet into the neighbor lady's yard (she let me dig those up and any smaller roots). The main runners extended about 10 ft. to the left of the stand. That was in spring 2005. I've been digging most of the summer with pickaxe and shovels, cutting the cane first --then the thick roots supporting the cane...then the rest of the original footprint of the stand...then I stated digging down. I'm blown away by the enormous volumes of roots of black bamboo; I've made 4 trips with the pickup to the yard waste recycler and more to go. By the way the stand was 4 1/2 years old. My main concerns are the infamous spontaneous growths away from the stand causing liability problems and unending invasiveness. What remains are the thousands of "straggler" fragments and slightly larger straggler roots, and I'm at a loss as to how to pick all of them out of the dirt which I have sitting in about 20 trash cans. If I theoretically put the yards of dirt back where it was, cull out as many of the fragment roots as I can, I have no assurance that those roots will not re-root and ruin all my labor. O.K.--I shoulda planted a clumper, but...(from the responses) the bamboo non-afficianado is not going to find the needed info for containment. The sources I read on the web understated the prep-work...a sort of "set the barrier 3 feet down, seal it good, plant the stuff...and yer in like Flint." No way, Jose! Wrong. After much thought during my digging, I think the bottom line comes down to the supplier carrying an inferior product from the manufacturer. The barrier was bound to fail. Now I have to deal with all the roots to keep it from growing back. And if I knew who the manufacturer was, I'd call him up and chew him a new one for the hassle he's caused. It was beautiful stuff....until the day I looked out the window and saw a new cane coming up...outside the barrier. I dropped my glass and told God I'd never look at Suzanne Somers like that again.

Thanks for the info BOBNORTH.The 36" inch barrier is hardier to come by than the usual 30" inch barrier so you went the extra mile in depth which is good to know for our own purposes.40mil is the culprit it looks like from a few testimonies from people. If you don't mind, can you email the supplier where you got the barrier from. Again thanks for the info, sorry to hear about the mess this has caused-maybe this will help others in the future.

Koniferkid

bobnorth-
It has been my experience, too, that nigra establishes an impressive rhizome system, but you generally don't have to worry about severed pieces of rhizome left in the soil, unless they are fairly well-established. Typically, they don't have enough bio-energy to regenerate once they're severed.

I can atest to the rapid growth of certian Nigra strands of bamboo, Phyllostachys nigra - Dikokuchiku in my case. I started out with 2 5 gallon containers and let them grow for a year. Transplanted them into 2 10 gallon pots that grew for another year. About 10 months ago I divided the bamboo into thirds and planted them in my neighbors yard. Once the bamboo got into the ground it is now growing very strong. Each division put up 3 to 4 culms and doubled in size, from 8 feet to around 15 feet. So if these bamboo continue their growth rate they should be 30 feet and a culm diameter of 2 inches. What a monster, can't make a tree do that, or be as beatiful as a bamboo groove. Since I'm in California, we get warmer weather, plus I think I over fertilize as well. If Bob is in Oregon his climate is probobly perfect for the type of bamboo that he is trying to eradicate and I hope for all the best for him. Meanwhile I guess I should start keeping an eye on the hedge I planted. Lucky for me though all my surounding neighbors like the bamboo so I don't see it being a problem if it starts growing out of control. In fact I'm looking forward to it.

bobnorth,
Thanks for the reply. I did do my homework just like you on the barrier. Since it was such an expense at the time, I special ordered it from a manufacturer to my specs. 60mil X 35" high. The bad thing was that it only came in 25' lengths and I needed over 100'. At each seam it was melted together, and I was told "it would be just as good if not stronger". That was bull. First it was uneven and on top of that it was thinner in some places. Not only would it have had surfaces that were rigid, the bamboo would have had an easier time going through the thin spots. I was at a loss as to what to do. As we dug the trench it appeared that I would have extra so this is what I did. Cut the oval a little short, and anywhere there was a seam (4 plus bolted one), I cut a 3' or so extra piece and put it in front of the seam. This is in hopes that if (when)the rhizomes get behind the extra pieces they will be running horizontally with the barrier, and won't make a 90 degree turn when it goes across the weak points.

I think I'm safe with the 35" depth given that I have heavy clay soil. If you have good soil below a foot, I can see the rhizomes going deeper.

I don't know when people started to use barriers, but I agree that unless it is a dwarf variety, 40mil thick should not be sold.

I hope in a few years were not all talking about how our 60mil thick barriers have failed.

In the future I hope to get a hold of a few of those blue plastic barrels/drums that carry liquids. My neighbor has one (for kegs), and I can't believe how thick it is. Not only that, but it is perfectly round. The bamboo won't get close to maximum size, but at least they won't go anywhere. These probably would work great for a hedge! (anybody know what industries use these?)

It sounds to me like your at a point were everything can be filled back in. If you have any more top-growth left, I would post here and you could possibly get some help digging up what's left. The rest of the "pieces" are now independent and will not have that much strength. If they would somehow grow, you could spray and remove anything that grows above ground, and it will eventually starve the plant. This could have been done in the beginning, but it sounds like it was pretty out of control by then and you needed faster results.

rfgpitt: I found a local source for 30 gallon white plastic barrels which I've been hoarding for a bamboo hedge composed of MOSO seedlings. I haven't found a source for 55 gallon ones, but I would suggest talking to a local soft drink bottling plant for starters. Any local business that needs to purchase large quantities of liquids probably gets them.

One thing I've thought about is the possibility of cutting the barrels so that the sides could be removed and joined together to make a large rhizome barrier for an area. I've been considering various ideas for joining them together.

One thing I haven't seen in this discussion of installing barrier is the detail of slanting the barrier wall outward about 10 degrees so that rhizomes hitting it are (hopefully) directed upwards. I understand that barrier that is simply installed vertically is more likely to be penetrated.
And rfgpitt: I would be concerned about using those barrels. I have a friend who sunk a very large stainless steel container in the ground and planted a runner in it. The container is about the size of a small barrel. The bamboo has completely filled the container and is totally rootbound. It's starting to look sickly, but it's impossible to get it out of the container or even divide it and pull it out, and it's too heavy to get out of the ground. I also suspect that, because there is no drainage in the container, that this is also contributing to the decline of the bamboo.

kudzu,
if you cut the barrel in half (leaving 30"-35") and put stone in the bottom so roots don't take hold(proper drainage of coarse by drilling holes), the plant should come out ok. Not sure how tall the barrels are, but they get bigger toward the center slightly, so that slant should enable you to remove it (the outside of the barrels may have a design, but the inside is smooth). I normally would keep my eye on it and would remove the plant before it got root bound. The weight factor probably won't be an issue for me for a while.

Everyone says to slant the barrier outward so rhizomes are directed upward. I tried my best, but if you have 1 long piece of barrier there has to be at least one place where you lose the slant. In order to keep the outward slant you would have to make cuts into the bottom every so often and securing it would be a problem. If the barrier was made properly as we need it, there would not be rolls of barrier, there would be corkscrews. Hope I was clear...

foxd,
thanks for the info
don't think I would want to cut up those barrels to try to make a larger barrier..not only would it be almost impossible to join (many seams), but it would be extremely heavy..let me know if you lose your sanity and try it!!

Rick

I tried keeping the slant in the barrier but eventually areas wound up being straight up especially where the seams met and were secured with the stainless steel clamp.

rfgpitt-
You sound like you know what you're doing and did the best you could. The gap between the ideal installation and real world conditions is one of the reasons that I have shied away from installing barrier (that, and my laziness). I'm still making do with my Wolverine shovel and rhizome pruning. Ask me in 5 years if I'm still winning!

kudzu9: I've been cutting and inverting the barrels so I have an area ner the bottom where the barrel side slant in and open at the bottom for drainage. I also fill them with better soil than the clay and stuff that is normally found in my yard.

rfgpitt: I figure one seam per barrel used, but the enclosed area goes up quickly with the number of barrels used. Four barrels could be used to make a barrier four barrel diameters across to enclose the same area as 16 barrels.

rfgpit and foxd,
Although I have never used them on bamboo, that will be my next project. I cut both top and bottom and then bury all but 4". Works well to contain spreading plants like the notorious Himalayan blackberry and spreading cactus. If you plan to cut and splice be careful of the shape of the barrel. You need the ones with the straight sides or you will not be able to straighten the pieces out. Even those are tough to work with but joining 2, 3, or 4 together can be done. I just use stainless steel screws to join. Perhaps with bamboo it might be wise to use a metal strip inside and out to make it stronger.

Just my thoughts,
"gene"

I had fastuosa and bambusoides go under a barrier that was 2 1/2 feet deep.I wonder if any barrier would be a permanent solution.I have found a good way to get rid of a grove is to cut it down then when it sprouts spray with solution of 1/2 water 1/2 roundup concentrate. I did this on a grove of black and it worked great.

Gene, I hope my fastuosa doesn't go under my barrier.
Why did you kill the poor black bamboo? I bet you could have had alot of willing people to dig it up for you...
Also, could you tell me how long you had the barrier and was it 60mil? thanks for any advice...

I had 2 groves of black and wanted to have different bamboo there instead of 2 of the same.The barrier was a convayer belt from a paper mill.L don't know how thick but it was really strong .The bamboo was not able to go thru it .Barrier was about two years old.Both these plants were 20-30 feet tall when I put them in the barrier.The fastuosa has really deep roots and this was the place in my garden with best soil and lot of water.I thought the phylostachys would work since their roots aren't as deep.I am wondering if just cutting down unwanted canes would work or will they fill the whole planting area with roots?

I have fastuosa "viridis" smack next to the house. Let's see it go under or through the granite field stone foundation...

Bamboo coming up in the living room would be quite a conversation piece... :)

We've been growing bamboo for about ten years with just two specie (both nigras) in barriers. IMHO soil type and irrigation habit has more to do with how far bamboo spreads then what most people think. We have heavy clay soil which even at the end of a dry summer has good moisture to just a few inches from the surface. I'm in Portland which is cooler in the summer and wetter in the winter then Medford. After our plants have gone through their second summer they receive no other artificial irrigation. I also am vigilant on keeping each bamboo thinned out to reduce its vigor and increase the clumps beauty (of course in my opinion only.) In addition, once per year with the aggressive runners only I take a sharp spade around the perimeter of each clump. Between the soil type (they always have moisture so don't need to go searching for it) and thinning along with perimeter trimming we have no issues with out of control bamboo.

BTW - This is Adam Williams for you PNW ABS folks. Hello!

Here is a link that might be useful: Our Bamboo Garden

Buddyboy...those are some nice pics!!!
CJ