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chris32599

Heliconia stricta cv SHARONII

chris32599
18 years ago

Has anyone growen this plant? They say its a shade loving heliconia.... Like my bananas I had to move my other heliconias into full sun...and I like to replace them with this new heliconia, if its cold hardy for zone 9 and really tolerates shade.....

Comments (19)

  • lac1361
    18 years ago

    Sharonii is a very difficult heliconia to grow, at least in my opinion. It does fine in the hot, humid Louisiana summers but goes into a severe decline during the winter. It seems to be prone to root fungus. I really believe this heliconia needs a lot of humidity. I have tried to grow it 4 times, and actually got it to bloom once two years ago, but lost it to rot. I have another pot of it now, and it was doing fine until Hurricane Rita. It hasn't put out any new growth in a month. Since the hurricane, our humidity has been rather low. It's true that it doesn't like sun. I have to grow almost of all of my heliconia in containers and over winter them in a greenhouse. I have a friend who is growing it in a large greenhouse and she told me that while it has bloomed, it is not a strong growing plant even in her greenhouse environment. I haven't tested the cold hardiness of this plant, but my assumption is that it is not one of the more cold hardy Strictas.

    Steve

  • bihai
    18 years ago

    I am STeve's friend...yes, grow it and I agree 100% with Steve. Its finicky with a capital F. Mine is planted in the ground inside the greenhouse under the loose dappled shade canopy of a Costus stenophyllus which is about 12-13 ft tall and an Etlingera elatior Pink Torch that is over 20 ft tall. I would call its environment about 75-80% shade. It is in bloom now, I actually have 2 blooms at the same time which has never happened before. I have had this plant for 6-7 years and grew it potted for the first 3-4 years. This one is the 3rd one I have had. I killed the first 2. The plant never has more than 4 stalks at a time. It is not a large spreading bushy plant and only stands about 4 ft tall. If you can keep it alive in a container its the perfect container size. Its tough to get enough to trade with anyone or sell. For me anyhow.

    The way you know if a plant is extremely shade tolerant is if it has maroon leaf undersides, which Sharonii has. The maroon coloration on the leaves is a rainforest adaptation that allows the undersides of the leaves to also collect light (as well as the usual tops of leaves which collect normal sunlight)... the undersides collect what is called "green light" and use it for photosynthesis. Green light is weak light that bounces up off the forest floor. Photon concentration is of this reflected light is extremely small. Other plants that have the ability to use green light are calatheas, marantas...anything with maroon undersides. So SHaronii is well adapted for shade tolerance.

    I would be leery of trying it in the ground in Zone 9 unless you can get it cheepo and therefore not be upset if it tanks, and unless you can find someone in your zone that has a like climate (ie maybe So Cal vs LA/FL) who is having some success.

  • chris32599
    Original Author
    18 years ago

    Hi Steve and Bihai

    Thanks for the information, I think I won't try this one...but do you know of any shade loving heliconias that are not so diffucult to grow?

  • lac1361
    18 years ago

    Chris,

    Most of the heliconia I'm familiar with need lots of sun. There is one that I am growing that seems to not like a lot of sun: Latispatha Distans. It a smallish heliconia like Sharonii. I don't know the hardiness of this one, but the larger Latispatha Orange gyro is reportedly frost tolerant; but none are as hardy as Schiedeana.

    Steve

  • bihai
    18 years ago

    If you look for Latispatha distans, make CERTAIN you actually are getting distans. Do NOT get ROADRUNNER. Roadrunner will NOT stay small. It reaches an ultimate height in the ground (for me anyhow) of about 14 ft, and the blooms are way up high, not eye level, so are difficult to see.

    Latispatha Orange Gyro and Red/Yellow (Red/Orange) gyro are nice plants. I have both. They get about 8 ft tall and have nice blooms. These are pretty commonly grown and bloomed in SOuthern California and I believe up into the Bay Area, where the Springs are considered (by FL standards anyway) cold and wet. Many heliconias (and other tropical rainforest type plants) won't tolerate those prolonged cool wet conditions, and if they don't rot or decline and die, they don't bloom, or it takes several more years than would be considered "normal" for them to start blooming. They will tolerate some shade, not FULL shade, but like to be out of intense midday sun. You might go to the California gardening forum and see how many folks are having success with the latispathas there, as they have similarities with you on aridity and temps.

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    It was discovered by a Mr. Kenneth Sharon who lived in Florida. I obtained a plant from him about 30 years ago, before it was widely available, and grew it in my greenhouse. A picture of my small plant appears in Alfred Byrd Graf's book, Tropica. At that time, we just called it "heliconia sharonii" and much later it was determined to be a variety of stricta. Also, around that time, Mr. Sharon sent a plant to a Mr. Howard Cooper of Hana, Hawaii who propagated and widely distributed it. I suspect that the plant you have is a descendent of that plant.

  • lac1361
    18 years ago

    Chris,

    You also might look into H. Red Angusta. It is a shade loving heliconia It is also reportedly cold tolerant. I have this heliconia planted in the ground and protect it with a temporary greenhouse and occasionally a heater if the forecast calls for temperatures below 40 although I think I read somewhere on this forum that it is cold tolerant down to 36 or so. It grows to about 4 feet and blooms, at least for me, in the early spring, but in its natural habitat, blooms around Christmas. It is also called Red Christmas heliconia.

    Steve

  • bihai
    18 years ago

    There are 3 different types of Sharonii. The basic story Dilbert relates is true for the plant known as H. stricta cv Cooper's Sharonii. Cooper's Sharonii is considered the "earliest" form of stricta Sharonii to have been imported. The original Cooper's was imported to Hawaii from Florida in about 1972. It was being grown by a grower named Mr. Sharon. It was taken to the Helani Gardens in Maui by H. Cooper and cultivated.

    The other 2 forms of Sharonii are H. stricta cv Carli's Sharonii and H. stricta cv Olveira's Sharonii.

    Carli's and Olveira's resemble each other very closely, and are the most commonly sold plants in the trade. You will almost never find plants labeled as either Carli's or Olveiras though, usually just labeled "Sharonii". They both have the very clearly delineated yellow rachis, keel, lip and base, with red cheeks. The inflo is very short and stout.

    Cooper's Sharonii looks completely different, being a red-orange over almost the entire bracht and only very small amounts of yellow on the base, lips and keel.

    All 3 have the maroon leaf undersides, get about the same height and are shade tolerant.

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    I might had that Howard Cooper first became aware of H. Sharonii by seeing a mature blooming specimen at a botanical garden in Florida. I think it was Selby Botanical Gardens, but my memory could be wrong. Botanical Gardens are typically very stingy about trading plant material with private individuals. If you see a rare plant at a place with a big monetary budget like Longwood Gardens, your chances of getting a cutting from them are zero. Anyway, at the time, Howard Cooper and I were in contact by mail and I can tell you that he was pretty desperate to get one.

    In my experience, H. Sharonii is of typical heliconia vigor. A really difficult heliconia to grow is the South Sea cultivar, H. 'rubricaulis' (possibly species Indica). One short period of 45 deg. F. temperature will kill it immediately. Rubricaulis resembles the variegated leaved Canna Tropicanna, which suggests that it is a chimera. Unlike Canna Tropicanna, rubricaulis easily reverts to an unvariegated form, presumably caused by cells of one genetic makup overgrowing the other. Compared to rubricaulis, sharonii grows like a weed.

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    Correction:

    I now think that it was Fairchild Botanical Garden where Howard Cooper first saw Sharonii.

  • siegel2
    18 years ago

    Dilbert,

    I was told by a grower in Thailand that the South Seas Heliconia cultivars like H. indica 'rubricalis' and H. indica 'spectabilis' must be grown in a very fast draining soil mix. I have these two growing in a mix of 50% sand and 30% peat moss and 20% perlite. Both are doing well.

    Here a photo of the H. indica 'spectabilis' cultivar I am growing in the ground in my heated greenhouse. This is not a photo of my plant, just the cultivar I am trying to grow.

    {{gwi:421582}}

    Close up of the leaves.
    {{gwi:421583}}

  • bihai
    18 years ago

    They do have an exquisite specimen of H. indica spectabilis inside the greenhouse at the Fairchild Gardens. Its huge, and was actually in bloom the last time we were there in June. It is supposedly very difficult to get blooms, the foliage is the thing on this plant. I have been tempted many times to try this plant, I would happily make a space for it in my greenhouse by taking something else out, but I am not sure that I would be successful, and its an expensive plant

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    The nomenclature is confused. These plants were brought into horticulture around 1880 and I have read some of the original literature from that time.

    The pictured plant is 'rubricaulis' (BTW, good picture). Spectabilis does not have chlorophyl-less variegation, but it is more intensely red. Spectabilis' leaves tend to be long and there is a unique wavyness at the edges of leaves. Spectabilis is a relatively vigorous grower.

    There are also several other red leaved cultivars, but, to my knowlege, only rubricaulis has chlorophyl-less variegation. Two green leaved cultivars with chlorophyl-less variegation are 'aureostriata' (stripes) and 'Bangkok' (blotches).

    I have seen 'rubricaulis' bloom in Hawaii and at Garfield Park Conservatory in Chicago (from a cutting I gave them). The bracts are variegated and colored similar to the leaves.
    At the conservatory, it was grown in a raised bed of black loam that is typical of the Chicago area. Currently, the conservatory has no 'rubricaulis'. In Hawaii, I saw one heliconia farmer have great success growing rubricaulis in crushed lava rock which resembles black pearlite.

  • siegel2
    18 years ago

    Here`s the sign at the Lyons Aboretum on Oahu where I took the photo. I got the rhizomes from Thailand.
    {{gwi:421584}}

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    Here is Spectabilis:

    {{gwi:421585}}

    As I recall, around 1990, Dr. John Kress, plant taxonomist, decided that, since the first discovered of the red leaved South Sea Heliconias species was named "spectabilis," all these red Heliconias are of species, spectabilis. If this is true, I suppose the above would be Heliconia spectabilis 'spectabilis' and the striped one would be Heliconia spectabilis 'rubricaulis,' but I have my doubts. A lot of confusion would be avoided by just calling these by their cultivar names.

  • siegel2
    18 years ago

    Dilbert,

    Here's some more confusion. This is the place where I got my Heliconia indica 'spectabilis' rhizomes. Here is their photo of 'spectabilis'. It looks just like your photo.
    {{gwi:421586}}

    But they also offer what they call H. indica 'spectabilis' #2 which is the Heliconia in my photo. Here's their description of it:

    "Heliconia indica cv. Spectabilis # 2

    One of the most attractive foliage plants of the Heliconia group is this variety which we have called Heliconia cv. Spectabilis #2 because the real botanic name is uncertain.

    Like Heliconia " Spectabilis " this plant prefers filtered sunlight and will grow best in half shade.Dark green leaves display white and pink striations with pink midrib, while the undersides are mostly maroon-pink.

    Does most likely not grow as tall as "Spectabilis " and is harder to grow as it needs perfectly well draining soil. Any over-watering and stagnant water will lead to the death of this showy and uncommon Heliconia."

    Anyway, whatever its name is, it is definitely one of the most beautiful plants in the world. I just hope I can get one to grow in my greenhouse.

  • dilbert
    18 years ago

    Cagary,

    I assure you that the Lyons sign is incorrect. The proper way to find the correct name of a plant is to examine the original announcement of the plant's discovery. The following is from the guy who discovered it:
    {{gwi:421587}}

    About 10 years later, the name Heliconia illustris 'rubricaulis' appeared in catalogs as an extra intensely colored variety.

    Also, the Heliconia in your second picture does not appear exactly the same as in my picture. It is more on the magenta side. Also, if you look carefully at the bottom edge of the new leaf in my photo, you will see undulations that have a period of about 0.25". As I mentioned before, these undulations are unique to spectabilis. I do not see them in your photo. I suspect that the plant in your photo is rubricaulis that has permanently lost its variegation (as chimeras sometimes do). This kind may have another formal name, maybe 'Edwardus Rex', but I am uncertain.

    Anyway, you have the plant that you want which is what really matters. I hope that you are not thinking of growing it outdoors in California. It needs a greenhouse in California and Florida.

  • tropicalfreak
    18 years ago

    does anyone know if the soil in south florida needs to be amended for heliconia?? more sand added?? compost added??
    i have noticed when i dig i hit limestone a couple fet down if that and there is some sand as well. just worried they might rot. i have shoots coming up from the rostrata and dwarf jamaican. i added compost to both hole when i planted. trying not to water but once a week if that. i try to read the plant before i do. with the soil being so rocky here i have noticed water drains slower, but when it drains it is gone.

    cliff

  • floamfl
    17 years ago

    I purchased around three dozen of these rhizomes from Thailand. Tried at first to root them in equal parts perlite peat moss and vermiculite. At first they all came up fine but started to decline shortly after. If too wet the roots would get root rot. If too dry the plant also declines. Did not seem like there was a happy medium. Tried putting them in full sun to differing amounts off shade. Also had no luck with this. Tried one in a very high humidity green house. Finally this had some results but it only delayed the inevitable and the plant also started declining. Down to my last rhizome and absolutely deseperate I decide "what the heck it cant get any worse" and I through it in the ground outside in one of my beds. The plant not only stabilized but is flushing out agressively and so far has done very well. The leaves have the right shape turgor and coloration. I have no illusions of this plant making it outdoors here in my area so eventually around mid December I will dig it out bring it inside and as soon as the last danger of frost has past, I will return it back outside to the same spot. It is semi shaded right now but I also tried a second rhizome in a more sunny spot in the same bed and it is growing as well although a bit more slowly. I have come to the very carefull conclusion that getting this heliconia to grow in a pot without experiencing root rot is virtually impossible irregaurdless of the mixture. You can start them in a pot but you quickly have to plant them out in a very sandy loam similar to what we have here in central florida. I have tried the same soil in a pot and it still doesnt work. There is something about pot culture that this plant absolutely hates so for those of you in climates where you must grow it in a pot I think you might be out of luck.

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