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orcuttnyc

Dead Bees??

orcuttnyc
15 years ago

Hello,

I'm in lower Orange County, NY. I put in a hive this spring. They seemed to thrive until recently. A few weeks ago, I raised the lid to check on them after finding a pile of dead guys on their entrance door step. The inside guys seemed ok.

Today, I went to put in a sugar water feeder.

It's cooler, in the fifties here. Lifted the top, then each super. They look all dead. I looked down into the lower supers, no movement. The cool weather should slow them down, but not make them look curled up dead? Shouldn't there be some movement?

Was the dead pile on the doorstep a signal that the brood was dieing??

I never collected any honey. This being the first season. They had the two, out of four supers with honey. They shouldn't have starved? I have the hive box, a BetterBee, styrofoam kinda insulated special material,facing south. Can't imagine it was cold? Mites? Disease? Any guesses??

Should I order a new brood box for spring and try again?? Should I just be patient and wait till spring to see if any survived?

If I need to order a box, i'll need to do so before spring.

Thanks in advance ;)

Bill

Comments (16)

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    American foulbrood or Varroa mites could be one of many things come to mind.
    A little late to take the hives apart.
    The one with activity, do a mite count first, check inside what's going on, on a warmer day.
    Treat accordingly.

    Konrad

  • ccrb1
    15 years ago

    The time to check for a mite drop is throughout the summer.

    At this point I'd strongly suggest you take several hundred bees and send them to the Beltsville lab. TOMORROW.

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    >>The time to check for a mite drop is throughout the summer.Here in Canada, it's common practice to check for mite level in spring and fall, if need treated, no honey super
    is on at this time of the year, several weeks before the honey flow in spring, to ensure no, or minimal traces of treatment could
    end up in honey super.

    Konrad

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Thanks all. I am a newbee. Or, under the circumstances, should I say, was?
    I'll pack up and send samples to Beltsville.
    recommendations on what next to do? I'm assuming that cleaning my boxes is in order? How do I prevent this from happening again? what precautions can I take?
    I'll try and get new bees right after the winter.
    Really too bad though. They were doing soo well ;(

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    Wait until results are in.
    How does your wood ware look? New, old?
    If you have old frames and boxes and you have American foulbrood, you should get rid of them.
    Somebody donated a hive when I started out, this one had foulbrood, I burned everything.
    When someone starts bee keeping, it's good to start with brand new equipment.

    Konrad

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Like my first post says, it's a BetterBee styrafoam hive box.
    Brand new ;)

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    Are the frames out of styrofoam too?

    Konrad

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    No, there plastic. This is what I got. Received it, painted it, put it in place.
    Faced it south in my twelve tree orchard. Not too windy, plenty of sun/shade. Surrounded it with chain link fence enclosure, surrounded that with solar electric fence forbears.

    http://www.betterbee.com/products.asp?dept=220

    They were busy as...all summer. I didn't know to check for mites then, as you suggested though.
    Didn't get any honey this fall. Attributed this to it being a first year hive. Left them with all their reserves.

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    Strange, on new equipment heaving problem the first year is a bummer!...did you put in a package of bees from
    a reputable dealer?
    Here, for the first 2 years I didn't have to treat for mites...I'm lucky, so far no foulbrood since I started with new equipment.
    Again, wait until you have results in, not sure if the lab can detect foulbrood from the bees, around here, usually you have to send in some comb, they can detect spores.
    If you have foulbrood, then I would burn everything.
    If I had wooden boxes, I would torch them inside, it will kill the spores.
    You can consume the honey right now if I was you, it is save, even when tested positive.
    If you have no foulbrood, then leave about 6 frames for the bees, when you install a new package.
    In the freezer is a good place to keep honey.

    Konrad

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    Ok, ok...By process of deduction...I killed my own bees ;(
    I put them in last spring. They flourished, or so it seemed to me as a newbee keeper.
    You all know what i've written in previous posts.
    Now, i've had a local beekeeper look at my box. He was quick to point out...no honey!
    My bees starved. I was a week, two weeks late in supplimenting their feed.
    Why, after a full summer of foraging, they had not enough reserves to even get them through the fall...who knows?
    I never took any honey at all.
    I feel really bad, but will try again this next season.
    Thanks for all your advices.

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    I'm not so sure it you had a normal looking hive, if you had, then it's no point getting into bee keeping when they can't even
    go into fall on their own.
    I suspect something was going on to slow them down.
    It's always good to start with two hive, then you have one to compare with.

    Konrad

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    I tend to agree.I can't imagine why the bees couldn't make honey all summer?? I had the hive boxes all apart today. The bees had access to all parts. They had formed combs on two thirds of the four supers racks?
    I don't know~

    Today, I was considering adding two other hives this spring. With the recession/depression about to hit, know of any cheap new/used sources for bee hives and racks? ;) BetterBee is about $200 per setup. Not to mention $70-90 per bee package ;)
    I'll also have to invest in a larger chainlink enclosure. Perhaps a second hand dog pen. I have bears. I can always extend my electric fence too.
    If only I had known to put in the feeder earlier. Live and learn by mistakes, huh? ;)
    Bill

  • Konrad___far_north
    15 years ago

    Sounds good,..good luck!
    Not sure if you know beesource, a good place to get information.

    Konrad

    Here is a link that might be useful: Beesource

  • buzzbee
    15 years ago

    If it wasn't an extremely large colony it could have gotten robbed out.If there was a dearth at the end of summer they may have not gathered enough to hold them over winter or even into the fall for that matter.Next year use an entrance reducer if there is not a fall nectar flow to help prevent robbing.A colony getting robbed can get cleaned out pretty fast.Try again in the spring and consider doing two colonies as suggested.You should place an order for bees soon as they often sell out quick. Good luck Ken

  • orcuttnyc
    Original Author
    15 years ago

    I sent a pile of my dead bees along with a comb sample to The Bee Research Lab in Beltsville, Md.
    I just received a reply that eleven Varroa destructor mites were found in my sample. They suggest I call them in a few days.
    Ouch! Varroa Mites! I've read up on them in my "Beekeeping-A Practical Guide" book.
    I guess there was precautions I should have taken, that I didn't due to my 'newbee' lack of experience.
    I'll have to ask them if the mites can live on after the bees are gone, in the remaining hive comb?
    I was going to leave it for the 'next' bees. Maybe I shouldn't?
    I have a Betterbee polly strafoam hive box and just got a new wood one from them. The new one comes outfitted with a Varroa Mite detector tray.
    There you go. Live and learn, or die and learn, in the case of the bees, I guess.

  • pembroke
    15 years ago

    If the hive is empty put in freezer. Will kill mites. Mites need drones to survive any length of time. the life cycle is about the same as a drone's cycle. About a month before the first day of Spring take hive out of freezer and be ready for your nuc or package. New bees will clean cells before queen will lay eggs. You've received a lot of good info here and you've learned a lot on your own. Find you a real good beekeeper and ask lots of questions. Most will be glad to help a newbee.