WTG! I can't wait to see the open blooms. It already looks like an interesting color.

Congrats Mark for growing this one to bloom and for the amount you paid for it! Looking forward to pictures when the blooms open.

Great job!! I can't wait to see the blooms open.

Today's update:

The first two photos are the same buds/flowers as above:

{{gwi:576060}}

{{gwi:576061}}

I'm curious whether the bud that is farthest along (right in first photo, left in second) in the above photos is almost there. If so, I take it it's a bit stunted?

Here's a third flower that I suspect will be the nicest of the bunch:

{{gwi:576062}}

It looks like a beautiful sunset color! I can't wait to see it when it is more open!

Pam

I like that color. Sunset certainly describes it.

Yay!! Congrats! This is sooo exciting! They look awesome already, what a color!!! I cant wait for more pix!!! I am so excited for you!!!

Beautiful color,Mark. I want to see it opened all the way. Keep us posted.

Few weeks ago I found a Sanguinea at Raynolds Nursery but it came from Annie's Annuals, the tag said. It was about 2 ft tall in a 4" pot and payed $6. Can't wait to see it grow.

Mark, do you keep your Vulcanicola outside? I live close to you on the Peninsula. I want to know if I should keep mine outside or put it inside. Thanks.

Pat

Hi Pat,

I saw those sanguineas a couple months ago at the Annie's retail store in Richmond. They had a ton of really nice plants in 4 inch pots, for $5.25. They also had B. arborea.

My vulcanicola is in the ground. I'm not sure exactly how long it has been--a couple months? I seem to remember that we had one of our heat waves after I put it in the ground.

A friend of mine in Sunnyvale who is very good with plants says that he has killed more than one B. sanguinea. I'm not sure why, but my impression is that he thought it was due to the heat. I'll ask him. I gave him a rooted cutting of my vulcanicola and he's keeping it in his cool greenhouse for the winter.

Since I didn't follow up on it in the other thread (which has gotten too long), here are two of the other vulcanicola cuttings, which I just put outside a few days ago. They are staying outside for the winter--I don't have space or sufficient light inside. These are going off to a couple people in the Spring. A third plant is back East and I'm told is doing well.

{{gwi:576063}}

I've been to several Strybing sales since I got my plant. I have never seen them for sale again (and mine was the only one at that sale). The guy who works at the Cloud Forest table at the sales says that one of the reasons they are not sold much is that he is the only person who has luck propagating them. However I did speak to another customer at that sale who has successfully propagated them.

I've also been looking for the mature vulcanicola at Strybing, without success. I think I heard that they had two. I'm pretty sure I also heard that one died recently. If anyone knows more about this I'm curious. It's really hard to find some things there unless you are taken to them by someone who knows the park well.

Strybing's monthly sale is next Saturday. It's a two-for-one sale on all plants.

Here is a link that might be useful: Strybing plant sales

This is what they look like this morning.

{{gwi:576065}}

{{gwi:576067}}

It is a very lovely color. Now I want one:))

Thanks, Mark for the info. I've never been to their sale. I wish I could go but I have to pass it for now. I just had a knee surgery and I am walking with crouches. I can not go to far.

Pat

Oh, they are a beautiful color!

Would this be the same brug as the one pictured when you first open the Brug-forum??
Ingrid

Hi Ingrid,

Yes this is the same plant that I was looking for advice on propagating a few months ago.

I like how it started to flare back on this mornings pics, and also the color is very nice.

Looking great Mark! The bell and coloring are spectacular. Any more changes or is that how tight the bloom is?

Hi Eloise,

If by tight you mean that the tips have turned inward more, yes, but just a little bit.

Oh I bet she/he is even more beautiful by now Mark! I read they need a cooler climate so I won't even try to grow it here in southern CA.

I am drooling!!!!!!!

Congrats. Got more pictures to satisfy our need to see more of this beauty?

WOW I am going back and take another look, it is so beautiful and..DIFFERENT from what we usually see here :-)

Lucy

Wow Mark, That is a beauty! Great job!

Theresa

Randy the blooms are beautiful. I just love the shape and the plant looks great too. The color is a bit more orange then the pics I've seen in the Preissel book. I wonder if it was crossed with a sang at some point? These were definitely worth the wait.

Karyn,

Thanks for mentioning that--this is a very long and complicated situation that I noticed yesterday and that I should have mentioned.

I had written pretty much an entire post (to start a new thread) asking whether somehow it could be a different clone than the one that Strybing has sold in the past.

Here goes:

1) The color of the flower is definitely more orange than most of the photos I can find online. On DG (last I checked it was forbidden to mention the name here!) most of the pictures are very pink. See for example the photo by Dave H.(who as you know consistently takes fantastic photos). Also see those by EricInSF.

On Strange Wonderful Things they are more pink but a much darker pink:

http://www.strangewonderfulthings.com/189.htm

2) The colors on my computer screen are generally a little off, but my pictures look fine. I checked on another computer and the color is much too orange and too dark.

3) I looked at one of my pictures taken with different settings on my camera. This time it was too pink (as seen on the computer with better colors). The true color is about half way in between those taken with the true settings.

A few of the true differences of the pictures I've posted compared to almost all of those online:

a) The color is more orange

b) The tips of the flower curve inwards more than any other flower I can find online, to the point that they at least one touches the the corolla tube in one flower.

c) If you look at the regions between the "stripes" they are variable in both color, texture and "shininess" between these flowers and virtually all vulcanicolas online. Probably this is different than all photos online.

I considered (c) to be the most reliable difference--the others seemed like the could vary based on conditions.

So I had written a post to start a new thread asking whether it was a different clone. I abandoned it when I found a couple photos online which resembled mine more closely.

mdv_graupe's photo on Flicker is reasonably close to mine. I know him and I suppose I could ask him what's going on. That by J. G. in SF is also not that far off. In both cases the petals don't curve inward.

http://www.flickr.com/search/?s=int&w=all&q=brugmansia+vulcanicola&m=text

The situation is a mess. So perhaps I should show all of these photos, including the one taken on my camera with the different settings and mention that the true one is halfway in between.

Are there two clones that Strybing is selling? Probably not, but it's worth noting the the appearance of flowers online is awfully variable.

This is confusing but worth mentioning. I might be able to tweak the brightness on the photos I posted and get it a little closer.

I also know Dave H. (who has photos of very pink flowers on DG) so I suppose I could ask the two people who have the extremes in colors posted online.

Just to add to the confusion about the color of my flowers.

1) They start out more orange and gain more pinkish coloration with time. The elongated yet unopened flower above (following "Here's a third flower...") is indeed completely orange.

2) Here's a picture from yesterday that shows too much pink and not enough orange:

{{gwi:576068}}

I contacted the guys who posted the two pictures that have the extremes in coloration from the flowers I found online.

This most recent photo looks more pink. I think that what I've heard about B. vulcanicola, including the Strybing clone is likely true. That there's no true (pure?) vulc plants to be found anywhere in the US. Regardless, the shape of your blooms is just beautiful and close enough for me! lol I hope mine does well. It will be interesting to see the comparison between the vulc that you sent and the other vulc that another West Coast friend sent. That's if I can get them to bloom. If the other vulc I have does well over the winter I'll send you a cutting as it will likely bloom for you whereas getting blooms here might be iffy. So far the foliage looks the same, no difference aside from size, due to maturity, that I've noticed.

From what I have learned on BGI....the Strybing Vulc (which I believe is also known as Lockwood 621) is not a pure vulcanicola, but a vulc/sang hybrid.
The only pure vulcs known to be in the US are the zunac Vulcs, grown from seeds from Equador. Not many people have them, and no one is 100% sure they are pure vulc yet, becasue none have bloomed yet.

Whether it's a true vulcanicola or not, it is still a beauty and I like the bloom when orange and also when pink :-)

Here is an example of what a pure vulc is believed to look like, if you are interested. It has shorter tendrils and the corolla is puffed out in the middle, then narrows a little before the opening.

Mark, are you going to try to cross yours with something to get seeds?

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:576055}}

pagrndr,

I'd be more than happy to try pollinating something if someone were to send me pollen (which I guess would be sanguinea, arborea, vulcanicola and their hybrids). I've never made a Brugmansia hybrid, so I have no clue when the flower is receptive, and whether any of the current batch would still be OK. I wouldn't personally have any space to raise seedlings, but I can give back all the seeds to whomever sent the pollen.

I heard from the guys with the flowers that I mentioned above. One only remembered pink flowers and said he had never seen orange. The other said his faded from salmon to pink and that there was also a huge variation in color in both his vulcanicola (hybrid) and sanguinea due to such things as temperature and season.

I've seem to get the best results with hand pollination when I do it in the evening and shortly after the bloom is fully or almost fully open. I still don't get great results and almost never get a naturally pollinated flower. Why don't you collect the pollen from your vulc blooms and store it in the freezer. I just pick off the anthers allow them to dry overnight then freeze them.

Hello Mark,
Those are gorgeous, congratulations!
There has been a little misunderstanding on these, due mostly to errors in labeling by Strybing Arboretum. Their mother or grandmother originally came from South America (Colombia if I remember right) via Tommy Lockwood, the noted Brugmansia author & explorer, in the 70's. He brought one (1) plant that he considered full vulcanicola to Strybing, and it grew & flourished there for many years. Recently though, they have admitted what we have suspected for awhile, that all of their current plants were seedling-raised. Since Strybing did not have two vulcanicola cultivars to cross, and since these clearly exhibit perfect intermediate/hybrid traits, we can be fairly certain that they were open pollinated with Strybing's sanguineas, and are therefore only 1/2 or 1/4 vulcanicola.
The mistake happened when Strybing put a vulcanicola label on seeds from a vulcanicola tree, without knowing the father, and so they have caused much confusion in the identification & discussion about these plants here in the US.
A correct name for them instead would be Brugmansia Vulsa, to indicate they have some of both sanguinea & vulcanicola in their heritage somewhere.
Here are some nice pictures of true vulcanicola:
and here are more pictures of the Strying Vulsa hybrids like yours.
- Tom

Tom thanks for the clarification.
Took a look.

man I like the look of the hybrids better :-)
The true vulcanicola look more like the Iochroma in shape.
The bloom looks fairly small or is it just that my eyes play tricks on me this early in the morning?

Regardless....because you have and give that information...eventually all owners of a hybrid who think they have a true vulc...can correct the name and in time hopefully there will not be anymore confusion :-)

Lucy

Fantastic info and photos Tom! That hybrid tree by the Golden Gate (assume it's in San Francisco) is amazing. Mark, can't wait till your brug gets that big so you can show us pictures :-)

Thanks for the pics and info Tom. Were you by chance one of the people that got the Vulc (hybrid?) seedling from the orchid grower in CA a couple years ago? I remember someone else getting one around the same time as me and thought it might have been you. If it was you how is your plant doing and has it bloomed yet? Unfortunately I lost mine to some unknown problem early last year. If it wasn't you sorry for the questions : )

Karyn,

I also have 2 Zunac vulcanicola seedlings. One has just 'Y'ed and has a bud that is about an inch long, and the new bud that is coming from one of the 'Y"s above that is about a millimeter long.
The problem with these plants is that they are super sensitive to overwatering and humidity in the air when it is cold. They get fungal attacks like no other. Hopefully I will be able to show pictures of the blooms in a month or less if the temps stay cool. Otherwise I will at least get pictures of the buds. From the growth habits of the plants and the shape of the buds, and the homogenous growth and flowering of all the plants in the area where the seed was collected, these should look much more like the type specimens of vulcanicola than the Strybing hybrid.

- Matt

Matt that sounds great. I'd love to see them. It appears that I lost my vulcs during the 2 weeks I was away in Jan. I haven't tossed them in the hopes that I might get some new growth from the roots but I'm not terribly optimistic. At least my arborea still looks good and I was given some interesting arborea crosses (seeds) that I friend got from the UK. I just started some of those yesterday. There's not a whole lot else to do while I'm stuck in the house because of the snow. lol

Karyn and Matt,

Where does the specific name "vulcanicola" come from?

My plant has some buds on it and it should bloom again in a few weeks.

According to Preissel, vulcanica = growing in volcanic soil, which sounds right to me. As far as I can find, the suffix "ola" = small or diminuitive. I am not exactly sure what the connection is between the word and the suffix. I would assume though that the suffix is perhaps because it appears to be similar to sanguinea in some respects (at one point it was thought a subspecies of sanguinea, but I am sure that will be clarified soon) but vulcanicola is a smaller plant with generally smaller leaves and flowers. Just a guess.

And I thought it was because the leaves looked like Mr. Spock's ears. I'm sorry I couldn't resist. I had no idea where the name came from but Matt's answer does make sense.

Is there no possibility the name came from a local tradition? Do the natives use the plant for ceremonial purposes (could that be why it's found in such low numbers?). Perhaps consuming the seeds leads to some sort of trip that they would use that name to describe it for some reason??

Karyn, my recent stitches above my eye gave me the vulcan eyebrow thing, sort of, for a few days. Coincidentally this was following my trip to bring "vulcanicola" cuttings to a friend in SF.

No, vulcanica is definitely latin. Natives use names like "Toe" with an accent over the 'e' or "boracherro" or "guamuco" for sanguinea.
I am assuming they closely relate the two. Vulcanicola is found much higher up in the Andes than sanguinea generally. It is found in locations with a thin layer of top soil, followed by a layer of volcanic rock and ash below that, and below that the soil is clay like. It seems likely that the plant was used in much the same way as sanguinea, but since it seems there are very few names used for different varieties of Brugmansia by the natives and these names are quite different than latin, I would assume that vulcanicola is not a native name. Take for example the name of sanguinea in Peru and the name of insignis in Peru also. Both are named "Toe" in some places.
Perhaps Tom will chime in with more. And he'll probably correct me on some things too. : )

Matt,

Of course the native name could have been immediately translated into the Latin. But if it grows in volcanic rock perhaps that is a possibility.

How is B. sanguinea used?

I also picked up a nice B. Sanguinea 'Inca Princess' at Hortica in SF last month for $11.99. That's the yellow form. They had another at the time, but that was a month ago. It's now in the ground next to my B. "vulcanicola". I think I'm going to plant my Passiflora umbilicata next to two Brugmansias and let it climb up.

{{gwi:576069}}

Passiflora umbilicata:

http://gkexoticplants.com/products/Passiflora_umbilicata_4_pot-108-1.html

What a beautiful color on those blooms! I like the Passiflora idea too. Would love to see the two blooming at the same time.

Oh Mark, you're sooooooooooo lucky great job!
I want the pink one sooooooo bad just love
the color!
Susan

Randy, you got a very good size plant. How much did it grow since you bought it? Does it have to Y in order to have buds?

Pat

Hi Pat,

I think it was about 30 inches tall in a 1 gallon pot in June. It Y'd at about 4 feet and yesterday I had to cut back a branch above the Y that must have reached close to 7 feet. I gave that and some lower cuttings to a friend in Colorado who is very good at rooting things.

The rooted cuttings I have outside (near the bigger plant) are also doing well, although they haven't grown much the last month or two. Presumably when it starts to warm up they will grow faster.

Brugmansia vulcanicola was first described by Arthur S. Barclay, a Harvard trained botanist & plant explorer, in 1959 (he called it Datura vulcanicola then). The name is from the location of it's discovery, the side of a volcano named Puracé, in west-central Colombia, at about 9-12,000 ft elevation in the northern Andes.
That should not be construed though the plant prefers only volcanic soil, since 1) it has been found in many other areas, and 2) Dr. Barclay himself believed that "the abundance of individuals at the type locality is probably the result of human activity" (since the plants were long used by local peoples in shamanic medicine).
It sure does like a lot of drainage to grow well though. :)
- Tom

iwalani,

I suspect the Passiflora will be a nice antidote during those times when the Brugmansias get ugly.

Tom,

That's fascinating that it may have been planted on the volcano. What did/do volcanoes symbolize to the local people? Are there any hints as to what sorts of medicine the people used the plant for?

Are there compelling reasons to call the plant its own species and not a (possibly cultivated) variety of B. sanguinea? I know that if you do a search on Tropicos an entry for Brugmansia sanguinea subsp. vulcanicola pops up. Is there thinking that B. vulcanicola is not in fact a valid species? Is there any evidence for genetic diversity among the specimens of B. vulcanicola, or could it all be the same clone?

Sorry,

I didn't realize that on the other thread Matt had indicated that there are indeed multiple colors, and thus multiple clones of B. vulcanicola. I'm still curious about whether there is consensus that it is a valid species.