Check your overwintering pupas

9 years ago

Every fall I put my overwintering BST, GST, and PVST pupas out in an old building where we keep our tools and various things. I've never had any problems until this season. I was out there this past week one day organizing things and just happened to notice that a pupa container looked empty. I opened the lid and sure enough, it was! I usually keep about 15-25 in each plastic shoebox-sized storage container. I decided to look through all 20 or so of them to see if other pupas were missing. There was one more container that didn't have any in it. It didn't take long to come to the conclusion that mice were the culprits. Both screens had holes chewed in them and I saw mice poop in both containers. Both were missing all pupas that had been in them. The only signs that there had even been any pupas in the containers were a few partial pupa "shells".

Losing all of those butterflies was and still is very upsetting to me. I can't help but think that the time spent raising those 30-50 caterpillars was for nothing. I raised them only to have them get eaten by some vermin. I suppose I'm overreacting, but I feel so sad for those butterflies that will never be. I wouldn't be so unhappy about it if butterflies would be plentiful, but they aren't. I have to look on the bright side and be glad that I noticed now that the pupas were gone instead of not seeing it until Spring. By that time, those darn mice could have had every one of them eaten, and that's a lot of butterflies!

I wanted to post this to warn you all to check your containers that you have your pupas in to make sure that the mice aren't getting after them and maybe check them periodically throughout the winter. I didn't exactly know what to do with the containers to prevent further damage, but my solution was to buy big storage containers and put the smaller storage containers inside the bigger ones. I could fit six in each one that I bought. Now I'm wondering if pupas need air, which they won't be getting if they're in there.

I've been butterfly gardening and raising butterflies since 2005 and this is the first time that I've had this happen. I don't recall if anyone else ever mentioned it.

Cathy

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Comments (4)

KC Clark - Zone 2012-6a OH
9 years ago
Very sorry to hear mice got your pupae. :(

Mice have been mentioned. Looks like the last time I wrote about it was Sept. '13. In the linked thread, bananasinohio mentioned it in 2012 and the thread got bumped back up late last year.

Mine are all in aquariums for protection but I know a determined mouse could gnaw through the metal window screening lid. I'm counting on the fact that the mice have no idea what is in the aquarium so they have no reason to do the work to get in. Makes me wonder if your containers had a smell this year that made them attractive to the mice.

I have friends that keep their dirt pupators in buckets of dirt outside. The buckets are covered in screens. One friend did not put enough weights on the screens this winter and racoons had their way with the contents of the buckets.

Here is a link that might be useful: Overwintering butterfly pupae

This post was edited by kcclark on Tue, Jan 6, 15 at 16:50
alex928 Z8/LA
9 years ago
That is pretty sobering. I've got one overwintering in a largish mesh container outside. I figured it was mostly safe out there...I do occasionally worry about ants getting in there, but I never thought of mammals. There are a fair amount of raccoons around, although I rarely actually see one. It was still there this morning when I last checked. Maybe it won't hurt to go check again, right? :)
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caterwallin
Original Author
9 years ago
KC, I suppose that during the few times that the subject of mice getting after pupae was discussed, it was during periods when I wasn't getting online much and I missed it. I thought surely that with all of the people raising butterflies, they must have run into this problem before and I guess they did.

Thanks for the comments and for the link to that other thread, which I read down through everything and am still not quite sure what would be the best course of action. We don't have a garage, so I can't put the pupae in there. Besides, I suppose mice could get after them in a garage too, but it would probably be more secure than the building that I keep them in, which is the best place here, I think. I can't keep them in the house, and the other buildings here aren't any better than where I keep the pupae. We live in an old house that was built in the 1800's that my grandparents lived in and my great-grandparents before that. The house is in okay shape, but the buildings that used to be a "shanty", chicken house, and corn crib have seen their better days. There used to also be a smoke house and pig pen, but we tore those down. Anyway...

Since I read over that other thread, now I'm not only concerned about them not getting enough air but also if it's humid enough inside those storage containers. I'm thinking that I might move them over here on our back porch (screened-in) and open the lids during the day and close them again at night. We already have so much stuff sitting on the porch that I'm not quite sure where I'd put them though. We keep our bird seed there and also all of the shovels and various other things. It seems a person never has enough space!

I don't know if the containers would have a scent or not. I either have 50 or 60 of these containers (at least half aren't being used right now), and I'd hate to think of having to buy new ones because of a smell. It's quite time-consuming to cut those plastic lids and put mesh screening on them (to me, anyway), so I feel like I'm situated pretty well now as far as having enough containers to keep pupae in and would hate to start over again from scratch. Just call me lazy. ;-)
Cathy
caterwallin
Original Author
9 years ago
Alex, Yeah, I wasn't happy at all when I saw what those mice had done. I guess it wouldn't hurt to check on yours. I just hope that nothing gets to it. I've also had ants get to a few of mine already (not for awhile though). I get so mad when something gets to a butterfly in whatever form it's in because there are too few butterflies around but plenty of wasps, flies, mice, ants, etc. We're trying to give the butterflies a fighting chance and even in containers, they're not 100% safe. But at least they have a better chance than if they're left outside. Good luck to you with yours.
Cathy