i have used all manors of crappy soil. if you are careful of watering, your plants will be okay. i like the turface for it's ease of use and benefits to the plant.

Maxthedog, who is the local supplier of pumice? I have not been able to find it anywhere in Canada, and the ebay sellers do not ship it to Canada. I finally found turface through a major bonsai source in Quebec, but it was twice as much as the price mentioned here.
Joe in Montreal
ps are you a Pomeranian? I have a fb friend named maxthedog pomeranian, but from the other end of the country.

winnjoe:

The supplier is called Keefer's Greenhouses in Richmond, BC, Canada, and is distributed only through retail outlets, a couple of which are about 10mins away from me. Here is what the bag looks like:

{{gwi:646225}}

When I went to one of the retail outlets this past weekend, the particle sizes looked much smaller than the bag I got. They sell horticultural sand and drain rock too, but those are too fine and too big to be of any use. I used to use traction sand from another local supplier and sift out the fine sand, but now I just go to the local playfield and scoop up some gravel along the edge of the field, as those particle sizes are much better. I don't use decomposed granite, but alot of our Desert Plant Society members use it both as a mix and a top dressing.

I finally got around to potting up one of my jades in 100% Turface, but I didn't get around to the 1:1:1 mix yet. I had to prepare the pot first (I'll show pics later and talk about that in a separate post)

As for my username, hahh hahh. No I am not a pomeranian. I can most assuredly tell you I am human!!! ;) My dog's name was Max. Sadly, he passed on about 5 years ago, but I still kept my username. He was a Chow/Shepherd, but not the ugly kind of mix, but the cute cuddly kind. I don't have any pics but one day I'll post them.

Winnjoe - do you mind sharing the name of the bonsai Turface supplier? Do you know if they do mail order? The only places I've been able to find it are in the US, and shipping charges are at least triple the cost of the actual product.

Tyler

LOL! Except for the size turface sounds like my "native soil". Drains fast, doesn't break down, can reuse it for years, has no nutrients, doesn't stick to the roots, won't compact..... life on a barrier island. Like Jade man I've used a lot of crappy soils over the years, as long as I watch the water the plants could really are less.
Tally HO!

Tyler,

Here's what I brought up from Bellingham, WA. You might look for a similar distributor in your area at the Turface website (I posted a link to it in my post about finding Turface in your area) - surely Toronna has Turface!

Here's the bag (50 lb. for, I think, about $13 and change):

{{gwi:646226}}

Here's what I did with it - added to the nursery potting soil that I had, along with some decomposed granite sand)

{{gwi:646227}}

I realize I've forgotten a picture of what the Turface looks like, but it's similar to, if not the same, as what Josh posted.

Anyway, things were in such a Turface tizzy that Yoko ascended me to have a better look:

{{gwi:646229}}

I got this awesome Operculicarya from an SD friend. Love those roots!

{{gwi:646231}}

And here's part of the plant potted in the amended-with-Turface potting mix:

{{gwi:646233}}

Wow...those roots look almost as tall as the plant.

Thanks for the tips on the turface. There is no place that I have been able to locate in Toronto. According to the locator you pointed to there is a place in a city relatively close-by. I just have to figure out how to get there, as I don't have a car. Living downtown, I've found it far easier to get around on transit, and far cheaper since I don't have to pay the ridiculous parking fees. It just creates issues when I'm trying to get things that aren't within easy reach of public transit.

Tyler

Tyler,

Well, sounds like a road trip is in order. I know the situation you're in, and heartily approve your method of lowering carbon and costs. Anyway, perhaps you could undertake a expedition to the Turface Islands, on behalf of your plant-growing friends / the Toronto C&S Club, and have the costs of your trip underwritten by a wealthy benefactor (just like in Orchid Fever). You will become history personified by answering the drainage needs of many orchid/bonsai/C&S enthusiasts - heck, there's even talk of you on a stamp.

lol :)

I'll probably just bribe a friend of mine with another donation to his chicken charity. He's involved with a farm that rescues factory hens past their egg laying prime, and has been willing to drive me around to pick up heavy stuff in the past for a small donation.

Tyler, Josh, et. al.,

I've recently had some very helpful information from a gentleman (also named Jeff, so we enjoyed instantaneous rapport about drainage products) at Profile Products, the company that makes Turface.

What Josh pictured and what I pictured are the same product - that is, they're packaged under different names (Josh's was the MVP, whereas mine was All Sport) but are the same thing.

There used to be a similar-but-noticeably-larger product that Jeff mentioned was made at one time, but no longer is it made.

And chicken charities are a fine thing to support, especially if souvlaki's for dinner.

This just in from The Man (the Turface one, that is)....

'It's (All Sport Turface) actually not on our primary Turface.com site since it is a private label exclusive to John Deere Landscapes. But all of the information for Turface MVP is applicable to All Sport so you should have what you need.'

Turface in abundance
Plants are green and plump
I can rest well

You are correct Jeff...Turface MVP and Turface Allsport is one and the same product just different names and packaging.

Here is a link that might be useful: Turface post

Pug,

I wasn't correct, but I was corrected. I haven't spent enough time at the Container Gardening Forum.

I'm not sure if and why John Deere repackages it, but I'm glad they do. It seems like the only place to get it is at the yard/field amendment places.

Interesting enough, if you have to find the John Deere distributorship for Turface, the lawn/farm equipment-John Deere dealer is different from the irrigation/field amendments place, at least in Bellingham, WA. Separated by miles and miles, it was. Naturally I went to the wrong one first.

I learned so much reading this post. My husband is mechanic and he use oil dry, he buys from auto zone. By reading this post I asked him if he still have any more. He said yes, a full bag and only cost him about $6 per bag. I will use it next year when growing season begins. Very good info in this gardenweb.....I thank you all very much.....

John Deere is the same way here too Jeff.
JoJo

>Ooops...Correction! My mistake, after looking at old >receipts, It was the Silica Sand that was a little over >$6...the Turface was $9.50. Still half the price of the >other place. Now I can get both products in one stop.

9.50 is still a really good price. I have really fair pricing overall at the place I buy from and I am paying 11.05 a bag. I read the $6 price and just could not believe that I was getting gouged so badly.

Jamie

> andrew78 6 (My Page)
>That was maybe a week ago. I filled a ceramic saucer with >turface and laid the entire branch on the top of the >turface. Last night, I found roots! Also, I recieved >cuttings from a friend from the forum a while back and one >of them has rooted. Even the leaves that fell off of my >large Hummel's have rooted! This is great stuff! I also >think I will stick to the turface.

Andrew;

What are the conditions your keeping your cuttings in? I have jade cuttings sitting on and slightly in pretty dry turface and they are being extremely slow to root.

Jamie

This 'Hobbit' cutting took almost exactly one month to root - snipped on October 6th.
Since I already had a few cuttings in a container full of Turface, I figured I'd just lay this on top.

Now, where to plant it....

{{gwi:646236}}

Super Cute Josh! Didn't take long at all for that to root. I actually have a couple of very small Var. Jade cuttings that rooted in turface too. It seems to me the smaller the cutting the faster it roots.

i think that you may be on to something with that idea Pug. i think that the larger cuttings have more reserves so they do take more time to be stressed enough to put out roots.

At my house Josh.. LOL!

Looks great! Cute as Pug put it! :)

JoJo

Hello! Thanks, Nancy and JoJo!

Yes, the larger the cutting, the longer it'll take to root.
A healthy growing tip with two to three pairs of leaves will just about root the fastest.

Doug, in order to tap those extra reserves, I often pluck leaves (or even prune whole branches)
from large cuttings. I *think* it works ;)


Josh

Wonder if I should prune a few inches off that HS cutting I'm trying to root...the leaves are all shriveling up anyways, I'm sure they won't plump back up its been 4 months...I'm thinking I'm going to lose those leaves anyways. Can't hurt and it might just help?

Hey, Nancy!
You might try pre-emptively plucking those shriveling leaves. Hopefully, that'll cue the plant to think,
"Yikes! That was the last canteen! Better send out roots to scout for more!"


Josh

Thanks Josh, I'll do that today..."no loss, no gain".

Josh!
I love how you worded that! "canteen" cute! ;)
LOL!

JoJo

IME, turface outperforms Diatomaceous Earth (like kitty litter and oildri). Diatomaceous earth breaks down faster than turface, into a dense clay (bad), and is so absorbent that it is hard to water a pot deeply. I noticed that plants only tended to grow roots in the top inch or so. Fast growing plants, like stenocereus, really suffered in it, slower growing species seemed to tolerate it better, but over time as it broke down I would expect them to suffer too. The top always looks like gravel, but down deeper in the pot the fine silt accumulates.

I'm potting up all the plants I tested with kitty litter and oil-dri with turface.

I was hoping that the diatomacious earth might have some insecticidal properties, but if anything plants seemed more susceptible to pests when growing in it.

I just bought some turface allsport today and i am SO excited. (who thought i could be this pumped about small rocks...) I am doing a crush test now to make sure it does not turn to mud and I am going to pot things up tomorrow.

Zach

hi there :),
you must excuse me but i didnt bother to read all 71 post to find out :), but i was wondering, what is turface? i see you guys talking about it all the time and when i see pictures of it, it just looks like kitty litter?

now for something else :), in my experience i've found that jades and other succulent cuttings roots faster when its cold, i got a C. arborescens cutting to create roots in a week under cold and dark conditions.
what conditions do you guys usually root cuttings under?

turface is calcined clay. different than kitty litter.

i usually root my cuttings in the same conditions i grow my plants.

Jonas,

Cuttings root better when it's warm. Look at the thread titled 'Rooting Jade Cuttings' on this Forum for all the information you'd ever want or need to enjoy.

That's correctly 'Best Temps for Rooting Jades'.

Here is a link that might be useful: This is how we do it

thanks for the replies :), so its just dry clay? is there any nutrients in it or do you guys have to apply fertilizer to the water?

yes i know that plants form roots quicker under warm conditions, and theres prob just another explanation to why im having better luck rooting my cuttings under cold conditions than i am rooting them in the heat of the summer.
i was just wondering if any1 else has been getting good results rooting jades during winter

(im sorry if my comments come out sounding the wrong way, english is my 2nd language :) )

No, not just dry clay, it is modified by heating to high temperatures. I don't think I have seen real Turface, but it looks very similar to the type of cat litter made of "moler" that is available in Europe.
The nutrient content is very low.

yes you do need to supply nutrients when using turface. a good fertilizer with micro nutrients. jade plants can grow in very poor soil, they just grow slower.

Doug

Jonas, read the Threads! It'll be a good read.

When I root cuttings in the Summer, I always put them in a shady, protected location.
Heat and direct sun will often dessicate a leaf or cutting before it has a chance to send
out roots.

In my climate, the cooler temperatures of Autumn and Winter, with bright sun during the
day, is very good for rooting plants.

Josh

I stumbled onto this discussion. It's 11 years old, but I found an answer to my question. I'm wanting to use 100% turface on all my plants but have been worried about making the change. My biggest worry has been getting enough nourishment to my plants. Tomorrow I will begin my journey. Thank you to all the people that have made comments. Fingers crossed, 1 plant at a time.

I haven't had any luck with turface. Bought horticultural grade turface from RepotMe. 2/3 turface, and 1/3 pine bark. Even my Sansevierias withered in that mix. I've now moved towards more organic soils.

Interesting. Today I switched 30% of my plants over to 100% turface. I fertilized each one and hoping for good luck. My Brother also uses 100% turface and fertilizer every 2 weeks and has done this for years.. All his plants look awesome.

I'm pretty sure all my cacti and succulents will do fine. I'm trying it on an Orchid and an African violet. Will see how that goes.

What soils are you using?

HU-890817108

what zone/general location are you in?

Growing in 100% Turface is much like growing in 100% pumice or any other inorganic medium. It is imperative that you provide some source of nutrients as the inorganic mediums do not offer any nutrients you'd find that come already present in the most common pre-bagged potting mixes. I prefer to fertilize with the maintenance dose of Dyna-Gro FP at every watering and flush the pots at every 4th or 5th watering (or whenever I remember). It's worth considering that fertiziling at a comparitively lower dose with every watering as opposed to more concentrated doses every once in awhile more closely mimics what a plant would likely receive in habitat.

While the discussion around plants growing in habitat vs. in cultivation is not always productive (and I have many a bone to pick with ppl who insist on replicating habitat conditions exactly) I tend to (anecdotal evidence, grain of salt) have better results offering a consistent, low-medium, level of nutrient supplementation compared to higher levels, less frequently.

John, what do you grow in. I do add nutrients when I water. I'm in Zone 5a NY. I'd be interested in hearing more from you. You sound like you've been doing this a long time. I've only been growing for 2 years.

Rina, I'm in Zone 5a

Same as me...You can grow plants in just about anything just watch watering. I have some in pure perlite, some in just grit. But most are in a mix of little soil (15-30%), & rest is aprox. equal amounts of perlite (sifted) & grit. I still have 1x 25lb bag of turface left - I hardly ever use it since it holds too much water for my liking: I keep plants outside & drainage is imortant especially if it rains few days in a row...and too many plants to pay close attention to all at all times, lol. I don't use pumice because it is hard to find around her, otherwise I would instead of the perlite.

Rina_Ontario, Canada 5a, My house has its heat vents in the ceiling, so everything I have is continually getting blasted with heat all winter. (House is over 100 years old, I rent so can't fix that. Moving soon) My plants completely dry out in a day. So I thought turface would help. Going to see how it goes.

If they dry out completely in such short time, it could work...just make sure it is really dry thruout before next watering.

My grow zone is 5b/6a, which means I grow inside for about 4-5 months out of the year. I've been trying to expand the mediums I grow in, just for my own interest really, but I generally use the classic gritty mix (I substitute the turface with SafeTsorb Oildri because it's cheaper for me. However it does degrade and I've been noticing some problems beginning to crop up, probably due to this) and I grow mostly cacti+succulents. I've only been growing for about 2 years, same as yourself.

Any reason I may sound proficient is due to almost solely to the veteran users of the forums found here. Rina, SLD, Greenman, the various Mikes, Al, GardeningGal, and a laundry list of others I can't remember off the top of my head. I'm still very much a novice and you can find me on threads mostly asking questions or suggesting people seek the resources I've found useful. To that end, I'd recommend you read Al's work on discussing Container Soils - Water Movement and Retention (https://www.houzz.com/discussions/6167237/container-soils-water-movement-and-retention-8-26-21). At the bottom you'll find links to several other threads that are equally helpful. Reading the comments is also extremely useful because I can almost guarantee someone has probably encountered whatever problem you may run into and been offered a solution.

And Ken, can't believe I forgot Ken. Apologies to anyone else I may have forgotten.

Thanks so much John. I just found this forum the other day by accident. I've been surfing all the questions. Learn and putting in a little input also.

See you around. I'll check the link , and keep me posted about that new medium your trying.