Though th spines seem a bit too short it looks very much like Mamm. camptotricha.

Jordi

I'm with Jordi, Mamm camptotricha, maybe v. albescens now both of these are now subspecies of M. decipiens.

CP

Yea, a form of camptotricha, nice plant!
Used to be part of Dolicothele I think.

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:493705}}

and another form of it:

Here is a link that might be useful: {{gwi:493706}}

That is right Mammillaria decipiens ssp albescens
{{gwi:493707}}
Alfonso

Thanks

Although now I'm not sure whether to label it as camptotricha or decipiens (v./ssp albescens)

What is the difference between v. and ssp, or do they mean the same thing?

Jan

Mammillaria decipiens ssp. albescens is the (current) correct designation for your plant, the other is Mammillaria decipiens ssp. camptotricha. When I began collecting, they were nominated as separate species, so it was Mamm. decipiens, Mamm. camptotricha and Mamm. albescens, the latter becoming know also at some stage as Mamm camptotricha var albescens.
It seems to me that many people interpret 'subspecies' and 'variety' as having equal taxonomic standing, the current trend being to use 'ssp.', others cite reasons for using both, I do not totally understand the basis of all this, but maybe someone else could educate us all a little more.

Cheers, CP

'ssp.' refers to a naturally occuring 'subspecies', that is, a variation that looks very similar to the type but is sufficiently distinct to be recognised as seperate.

However it is not distinct enough to warrant a seperate species designation.

'v' I believe is short for cultivar or c.v which means a cultivated variety, i.e. one brought about by mankind-not nature.

Hi-de-ho, here to try some educating :)

A species ought to be a taxonomically distinct grouping, having characteristics that identify all members as being the same species and different from other species. A species should mostly only reproduce with other members of the same species, although occsaional natural hybrids between species are found.

A sub-species is a genetically distinct grouping within a species, but not sufficiently distinct to be treated as a separate species. Note that subspecies should be able to interbreed (if they can't they ought to be treated as a separate species) but do not actually do so in nature. This generally means that subspecies have different natural distributions.

Note that separate areas of distribution for a species do not necessarily mean that there are separate subspecies. They may just be separate populations that are similar or identical, perhaps only falling into distinct ranges very recently, perhaps even since discovery.

"v." or "var. is variety is an even lower level of taxonomic distinction below subspecies. You may occasionally also see the even lower level of "forma", but rarely in the cactus world.

Each of these various names has strict taxonomic rules for how it should be published to be valid, and when it can be changed, etc. In common usage the rules are often ignored so that, for example, Echinocactus horizonthalonius ssp. horizonthalonius var. nicholii may just be referred to as Echinocactus nicholii. In this case, E. nicholii never existed as a species. Often the commonly used name was once a species name that is now considered to fall within a different species, so that the name is now either a subspecies or variety within that species. For example, the various Mammillaria decipiens names.

Taxonomic names ought strictly to be placed in a different typeface to clearly delineate them in text. This is usually italics in normal text, but can be plain type within a paragraph of italic text or potentially anything else that makes the name more visible. If you've ever scanned a page of latin looking for the species name then you'll appreciate the use of italics!

"cv." or cultivar is not a taxonomic term. Cultivars do not necessarily occur in nature, although a particular specimen from the wild may be selected and propagated as a cultivar. A cultivar could also be a hybrid within or between species, a vegetatively propagated mutant. Cultivar names should generally be placed inside parentheses and are not in a different typeface. Cultivar names should consist of the genus name and the cultivar name, the use of the original species or hybrid parent names are optional and purely informational. Cultivar names can be registered for certain plant breeders rights (different in different countries) but do not fall under other intellectual property rules. In fact a cultivar name cannot be registered as a trademark in the US and many other countries, and the plant patent application process is quite complex. Because of this, some plant breeders have taken to selling cultivars under a separate registered trademark name, a simple process that could in theory provide them exclusive use of the name through selling the name for royalties. In practice this has blown up in the faces of a few breeders because it is generally unenforceable.

Hi- De- Ho to you S&B !!!

Kyle, Eric, Stan & Kenny wish you a Hi De Ho Christmas!@!@!@

Hugs & Kisses
Mr Hankey !

Jan:
I post some pictures of them

Mammillaria decipiens ssp camptotrichia
{{gwi:493708}}

Mammillaria decipiens ssp albescens
{{gwi:493709}}

And there are another with similar form but different species

Mammillaria longimamma
{{gwi:493710}}

Mammillaria sphaerica
{{gwi:493711}}

Saludos
Alfonso

Hey Shrubs, yak kinda stole my thunder there ;)

Just picking back up this thread after being offline for the holidays - thanks for the clarification, guys, and nice photos Alfonso.

I have about 4 other similar but different plants but they haven't flowered so I will wait to see if I can ID them myself. If not, I'll be back for more help.

I really like these long-fingered mamms so I hope I do well with them.

Jan