Jen, I grew this plant last summer on the fence at the edge of my garden here in Raleigh. It ran into and through a tomato plant - probably got 10 - 12 feet long. At the end of the fall just before the first hard frost, I dug it up and put it into a 3-gallon pot and stuck it in the crawl space with my lantanas, brugs, ee's, etc. The vine died back to about 18-inches. I brought everything out into the new greenhouse in late Jan., and it slowly started putting out new growth. This year I hope to find a more appropriate place to grow it and in the fall I will probably take cuttings and bring them into the greenhouse & leave the main plant in the ground.

hi jen, every summer i grow vigna caracallas, the white-ish flowers that are fragrant or the purple ones that are not, depending on what the mail-order place sends. I love them both!

Both types I have grow in 15-inch pots on my front steps and they trailed around the railings, probably got 15 feet or so. No problem whatsoever with it "taking over" or climbing onto the house or anything.

The ones in the ground weren't happy (terrible, terrible clay soil!) so I put them back into pots. I didn't try to cut it back in the fall to bring it in the house because my kitties would have probably munched on it. This fall I swear I'm going to try to save them!

My question, does anyone know how to save the seeds on these rascals? In previous years, I have seen no hint of seeds on the flowers or after the flowers fade? Are the seeds like microscopic specks of dust? Any techniques for seedsaving to share?

thanks!
michaluna

Yes, this vine grows well at Reynolda Gardens in W-S, NC, and even forms seed pods that look like string beans. I have tried raising them from seed with no luck whatsoever. The seeds were the size of a tomato seed, almost flat, black.

I believe their relative is the "Yard-long Bean" you see offered in some catalogs so I would think that they set seed in pods like a green bean. I have heard that germination is a problem. People I know that grow it, grow it from cuttings.

Mine just emerged last week. This is the second winter it's survived in ground. It's in moderately sandy soil with about 6 inches of partially brokendown pinestraw mulch. There's also a photinia hedge (15 ft tall) on the north side providing some winter protection. My plant gets 15-20 tall, is not bushy and mostly flowers at the ends where I can't enjoy them. I'm thinking that I should prune this year for a better effect. Its first summer I got some seeds (and yes they looked a lot like yard long beans) but while the seeds turned dark, the pods were still quite green and they didn't germinate. I figured they were too immature. Last year after it's first overwintering it wasn't even close to getting that far along with it's beans to bother to save seed.

The problem with growing the real Vigna caracalla plant from seed is that the seed coats are nearly impervious to moisture unless you poke a hole through the seed pod with a pin and soak them in hot water overnight. When I initially attempted to grow the plant from seed, I too had no germination after several weeks. Then I read somewhere about the seed coat problem and dug the seeds up and used a needle to poke a hole into the seed coat and soaked them overnight. A week after replanting four of the five seeds germinated.

The plant is not winter hardy in this area but can be overwintered inside an unheated garage that doesn't get below freezing--that is how I have overwintered my plants for several years.

There is a lot of confusion about what the plant really is listed in information out on the internet. Vigna caracalla has blooms that start out white, turn a lavender color, and then develop a golden yellow color later on. The plant is fragrant beyond a doubt but it is not typically fragrant from a far distance unless you have tons of blooms on the plant. The fragrance is most usually detected up close. The plant is only winter hardy in some areas of zone 8 and up.

There is another plant out there that mimics the blooms of this one but the blooms on that plant are a pale lavender and stay that way until they drop off the plant. This imposter also has no scent.

The seed pods are shaped like long beans that eventually darken up and contain seeds like Robin described--flat slightly elliptical black seeds about 1/4 of an inch in length.

They sell these at BBs. Have been considering a purchase, and appreciate all the information.

I'm into vines this year and am thinking about trying this one. Anyone know a good 'seed' source for this and/or other vines that don't want an arm and a leg?

Vines I'm considering..........
Adlumia Fungosa 'Climbing Bleeding Heart'
Antigonon leptopus - Coral Vine
Beaumontia grandiflora 'Easter Lily Vine'
Bignonia capreolata - Cross Vine Tangerine Beauty
Clerodendrum thomsoniae - Glory Bower
Dicentra 'Golden Tears' climbing
Mandavilla/Dipladenia
DOLICHOS Hyacinth Vine - white
Mandavilla laxa - Chilean Jasmine
Quisqualis indica Double Flower - Rangoon Creeper
Oxypetalum 'Heaven Born'
Petrea volubilis - Queen's Wreath, Bluebird Vine
Phaseolus Caracalla 'Snail Vine'
Thunbergia grandiflora - Blue Sky Vine
Vigna caracalla - Corkscrew Vine

root, i think what bb's had was the phaseolus, because it stayed lavendar ad was not fragrant. i'd love to find someone with the fragrant type. ralph was yours fragrant? root, i have seeds for oxypetalum/tweedia and can share if you want (but it really isn't much of a vine per se). i know bb's has had the dicentra, cleradendron and tweedia in the past. logan's will carry the thunbergia sometimes. i had seeds for the petrea but was never able to get them to sprout. john *might* have that. he has a couple really cool blue/purple flowered vines in the solanum family. one i got to start from a cutting this fall. i'm not a familiar with some of the others. will have to look them up when i get time. i'm such a sucker for vines, and i don't really have a good reason why.

Rootdigger I bought vigna caracalla from Parks this spring and have 5 seeds. I will mail two to you if you will send your address to ryansatgso@aol.com.

Becky

Of that list I only have:
Phaseolus Caracalla 'Snail Vine'
Thunbergia grandiflora - Blue Sky Vine
both of which are overwintering nicely in my hoophouse.

I am also looking for Vigna caracalla but I don't have much room left, especially for vines. All my prime vine habitat is being devoted to Hardy Kiwi (I'm primarily a food gardener).

I have a nice eggplant relative that makes a large vine with beautiful pale purple flowers. Very common in California but not seen much out here. I don't recall the species but it is a Solanum. Commonly called Tropical bittersweet or just Bittersweet. It is easy from seeds but not winter hardy.

For my birthday I kinda went crazy and bought a huge amount of unusual seeds from a seed shop in England - bad john, bad! I'll share if they sprout, Lord knows I don't need any more plants to water.

ok- my bad. john, what was that solanum that you gave me a bunch of flowers from that was out in the fairgrounds in a pot? that was what rooted- from that bit of flowers! it looks good and came through the greenhouse freeze just fine. i don't think that's the big vine solanum thingy you were talking about. i recall that and it is gorgeous! and, as to hardy kiwis- they'll take over the world if you let them- so you be the boss of them. what female cultivar do you have again? can't wait to see/hear what all you ordered from england. fun birthday present.

Tam, thanks for the 'where to go' ideas and the tip on the oxypetalum. I went back and looked at some more info on it and it is a little straggly according to some reports. This is why I love GW so much. That first hand experience from other gardeners is priceless.

Some of these I've seen sold as seed online and figured that would be a less expensive way to go. I don't EVEN expect to get all of these this year, but would be happy with one or two to try. When I make a list I tend to go overboard, lol. I have a couple clerodendrum cuttings, which I'm now hopeful will make it. I noticed the other day they are just starting to put out some new growth after having been nothing but sticks since last fall, so Woohoo!

I have one spot next to my back deck that I want something small and viney but with lots of flower/color OOMPH! I've tried a few things there but most were either dissapointing or tried to reach out and engulf folks (and small critters) passing by. I've tried the regular white thunbergia (and have volunteers all over the place) but saw the sky blue and fell in love with it! Trying to winter things in the house with so little window light is depressing so I had pretty much given up on house plants,... but with the greenhouse now I have been excited about trying some new things! I have orchids which I bought off a clearance table starting to bud!! The others which we got from a plant swap are putting out new growth. This is so cool!

John, is the Blue Sky as awesome as it looks?

Becky, I sent you an email... Thanks!

well, i'm happy to share some tweedia seed if you still want it. it's a bit scraggly, but the blue is outta this world. yes, the sky blue thunbergia is amazing. the flowers are huge (as is the plant if it's happy).

if the conditions would suit, that solanum vine of john's is a knockout, and i don't think it's a thug (but he may set me straight on that!). what about a mandevilla there? or have you ever seen the bowtie vine? wow! but it's very hard to find. ooh- or one of the semi-bush clematis. tho that would only be a fairly short bloom time. one smallish vine i like that has small but many flowers is asarina. i started it from seed eons ago, and now it pops up in unlikely spots. pretty lavendar snapdragon type blooms about thumb sized, pretty much most of the summer. it's fairly easy to control. 'pictoee blue' morning glory is a less vigorous type whose blooms are an amazing shade of blue edged with white. if you did an annual you could do sweet peas there in spring. what are your conditions there?

Root - My Sky Blue Flower only had blossoms on it when I bought it (from the grocery store of all places!!). I loaned to someone to use in their fair garden where it lived all summer long and got HUGE, but it never bloomed again. I have big hopes for it next year. I am thrilled it likes overwintering in a barely heated hoophouse and now I just have to think up some place to grow it during the summer. The plants get very large and need big support. I think I can get away with pruning it all the time. The flowers are maybe 3-4 inches across so you see them when they open - kinda hard to miss.

Tammy - that must be the Solanum thingy I'm talking about. I didn't realize it grew so easily from cuttings. I keep collecting seed from the plant and so far haven't needed to sow any because seedlings keep showing up in the original pot. The plant looks like cr@p during the winter and can only handle a mild frost, so you have to protect it. It is one of those vines that grows up a certain height and then sends out arms in all directions, kinda like a big sagging umbrella. Each branch is tipped with a large cluster of flowers. I was told that the fruit is very poisonous but online I see where people eat them in small doses.

I wanna say that my kiwi's are 'Issai', but that may be just the females. They have grown very well this past year. I plan on keeping them pruned. The male is still in pot and was never intended to actually get planted. I just need him for the pollen anyway so he will live off to the side and I will hand pollinate along with the bees. Hopefully I can control things so that I keep the fruit where it is easy to harvest.

Anyone know the exchange rate for English Pounds to US Dollars???? Credit cards are a dangerous thing.

Right now it's $1.98 to the pound - ouch.

http://www.xe.com/ucc/

Tam, remember the pictures I posted of the red mandevilla on the white lattice? That's the spot. Southern exposure but on a corner between buildings so it loses direct light about 1 or 2 in the afternoon. It did very well there but I had to take it up from there for the winter and it's not happy at all about that. It was in a pot but the roots had really taken off into the ground. Between that and trying to keep it in the house while we were finishing up the GH it has suffered and I may have lost it. Fingers crossed! I've had it a couple years and it really shined in that spot last year. It bloomed from the time I set it out there until I brought it indoors in October. It was perfect as far as size in that spot and the constant blooming was nice. If it lives I may try it again there. I'll have to look at the bowtie and asarina too!

John, let me know if you get it to bloom this summer and take pics!!

root, yeah- i kind of recall those pretty pix. so many things do well with morning sun- it sounds like a great spot. i may be able to bring you asarina babes in spring, but i don't think they normally show up til it warms up nicely. i'll keep my eyes peeled. it's much more subtle than mandevilla, though, that's for sure! and it's only annual, but if you get it there it'll seed around. crossing my fingers for your mandevilla. someone brought little ones to the fall swap and i grabbed one. not sure if it's still going or not- it's in the basement, dormant. the bowtie is amazing (i saw it in person at JCRA one time and about peed myself), but i have yet to find a seed source and plants are pricey and hard to find. i've not seen it again at JCRA- and that was about 4-5 yrs ago.

john, if they're issai you don't have to worry as much. it's self fertile, for one thing , tho it does better with a male pollinator, but it's also not early as crazy vigorous as the regular hardies. and that's a really good thing, actually! means you won't have to prune 2-4x a summer like i do/should. my small 4 or 5 yrs old issai may have died in the drought, but i can tell you it definitely did bloom and set fruit much earlier & smaller than my anna did- though i never did get to try any (birds or something got fruit first yr and the frost got it last yr). i don't know if your male will bloom if it's kept in a pot. if i were you, i'd stick him over by the woods and let him semi-climb up into some trees and keep him whacked back a bit. then when he blooms, just cut that cluster off & hand pollinate. that's how i get the best fruit set myself. i don't trust the bees since there's so few anymore. my male was shy bloomer and about 2yrs behind my girl. so, if yours is the same, when your issais bloom, come get some branches from my guy & pollinate. a sort of a stud service if you will.... heh heh heh

i was shocked about that solanum thingy. i literally had it in a cup a while and noticed it still looked perky and finally stuck it in some dirt (didn't have roots at that point), and it's got new growth so i guess it rooted. it was just a little sprig. the plant you cut it from was butt ugly, so it must be the same thing. the blooms are gorgeous, tho- and your vines at home are beautiful. hey, when you're whacking away at that thunbergia see if you can get some to root. i was way wowed when i saw it blooming one time at logan's and have coveted it ever since. it's really hard to miss, that's for sure! like a giant blue/lav black eyed susan vine. but with white eyes.

My vigna (thanks Becky!!) has sprouted. I poked a hole in it and soaked it for 24 hours and then potted it and set it on top of my fish aquarium light. The light only stays on for abt 7 hrs a day but looks like that was enough warmth to get it going. I've potted it in a nice fluffy potting soil, added perlite, small bark and added some of that clay looking stuff that you use for water plants. It seems happy so far!

There's also some Eccremocarpus - Chilean Glory Vine 'tresco' just starting to peek up out in the greenhouse!

Waiting to see if my hardy kiwi's made it through the drought last year. If they croaked I think I'm going to replace them with blueberries and bush cherries.

Here's a great page on vines...

Here is a link that might be useful: Vines

My Eccremocarpus sprouted last year but never did much so I lost track of it (possibly lurking somewhere in the hoophouse).

My bush cherries are just now blooming. They are worth growing for the blossoms alone!! such a cute springtime plant. The cherries taste like wild plums - which means 'ain't special' but they make a lot of fruit, look cute, stay small which is what I need.

I've grown the Eccremocarpus (plant) before and it really takes its time getting started. Once it gets warm enough it'll take off growing but it takes forever to bloom and bloomed so late I couldn't collect any seed from it. Beautiful when it's blooming though!

Debra, if you are interested, I have several Pandorea vines overwintering, and I expect to have some of the Clitoria ternatea seedlings up and growing for the Spring plant swap. The latter should produce the first year lots of gorgeous double blue and white pea-like flowers until frost, but is very cold sensitive and must be overwintered inside an area protected from freezing. I recently planted seed of the native butterfly pea, Centrosema virginianum, for sharing at the swap. I am looking for the native Clitoria mariana, which is similar (both are NC natives) and is also referred to as Butterfly Pea.

ralph, i have one of those 2, but i'm not sure which one. i can dig one for the spring swap, and if it's the same as you already have, you can pass it on. i don't know if the annual clitoria you gave me at the fall swap made it through my greenhouse freeze or not. some of the other things i though were gone are resurrecting, so we'll see.

Thanks Ralph, I'd love to have some Pandora (wonga wonga) vine, what a cute name, lol.

That Podranea ricasoliana * Port St. John's Creeper vine that I brought to last fall's swap is a close relative of Wonga Wonga and look almost identical and has proven hardy in my yard. Not very invasive. Blooms way late in the year but blooms more than any Pandora I've ever seen. I'll have more at the spring swap.

There is also a tropical pigeon called Wonga Wonga.

Hello All
There are 2 diffrent kinds of snail plant (Vigna Caracalla) or corkscrew, That is fragrent and starts off wight then light purple to another color latter on. Then there is (Phaseolus Caracalla) That stays purple all year with very little to no smell.
Germination takes a long time if you direct plant the seed 1' deep. Keep the soil moist.I place mine 5 to a 10' pot. I add 1i add 4 cups of water 1 time a week.and i keep the plants in a shady place till they reach 6" tall. i transplant to a sunny area.
The plant require ants for the plant to be germinated so planting by a old stump or place ware ants are is a good thing.
The zone we live you must take the plants in doors for over wintering they make a good indoor plant so long as they get at least 8 hours of sun. You Should prune back when you grow them indoors.
to save on digging them up all the time you could use a large pot and bury the pot and all so un the fall you can pull it up and bring them indoors till next year.
The germination takes 30-45 days and in some cases 60+ days.
I hope this information will help...I sell the plants and seed and give many to family they are a nice plant that attracts butterflies. Best of luck...