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What is safe for killing grass where a citrus tree sits?

JR78
12 years ago

Hi everyone,

So I'm doing a little landscape work and this particular project affects a small orange tree of some kind. Well previously this tree had grass surrounding it, I'm changing that. I put in a barrier which you can see in the picture below. The question I have is, I have not used any kind of grass killer inside my barrier. I don't want to hurt the tree, but at the same time I know once I start watering, my Bermuda grass is going to start growing in. My plan is eventually to put a layer of some kind of ground cover inside the barrier, maybe like bark chunks or something of the sort. Can anyone advise me on what will be a safe effective way to get rid of the future grass without hurting the citrus tree?

{{gwi:576730}}

{{gwi:576732}}

Thanks, Jon

Comments (25)

  • johnmerr
    12 years ago

    Well, you have done several things right; painted the trunk which is exposed and could sunburn; removed the grass under the tree. Most here would advise you to put a mulch of bark or something similar.. just keep it a few inches back from the trunk. I would put a drip emitter or 2 or 3 for water around the drip line.
    After that, if the bermuda or other weeds start to grow, the simplest thing is roundup. Fertilize your tree 3 times per year with a good quality citrus fertilizer and you should be rewarded with a healthy productive tree.

  • hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
    12 years ago

    John has given you very good advice. I'll add, due to our rather thin soils (minus organic materials) here in California (not sure where you live, you didn't mention and it's not in your sig line), I would first put down 2 to 4 inches of compost, keeping it about 4" away from the trunk. Then top with wood mulch. Use either microsprinklers or adjustable drip irrigation, 2 to 4 emitters at the drip line of your tree. And we usually fertilize a little more often here in California, especially again, if you're on sandy soil or DG (decomposted granite). I fertilize every other month from February through October. And, if you're done a good job mulching, you can pull out any grass or weeds, as they'll not have good rooting. Better than risking using Round Up, imho.

    Patty S.

  • tantanman
    12 years ago

    Without knowing your soil, Patty nailed it. If you use a compost use a twig type not leaves. I would use pine bark instead of wood cover since it does not have such a high nitrogen drain on the soil and we cannot fertilize late in the year to make up for lost nitrogen. Actually with a tree of that size, if you have afternoon shade, may not need a ground cover other than the composted mulch.

  • JR78
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Patty,

    I'm in Phoenix, Arizona.

    I bought the composted mulch (below) from the nursery when I bought new citrus trees I planted a while back. I amended soil about 40% product to 60% soil. My question is, would this be the product I would want to use as the layer of compost? Secondly, the tree does get afternoon shade, but I have a dog and one of the reasons I did this is to keep the dog out of the mud when it rains, which is why I wanted to put a layer of some kind of mulch. Keep her little paws off the ground.

    The soil is pretty dry. Picture this, a yard that gets nice and grassy when it's growing in summer strong, and then this area of shade under the citrus tree and house that grass really doesn't grow. Now imagine this going on for years in these dry summers we have. Needless to say, the soil is crumbly dry, and it doe's seem to drain in a timely fashion.

    Regarding the irrigation, I have 2 existing drip lines with flag type emitters. I plan on putting one on each end of drip line. How much water do you think this citrus will need during the summer? I was planning once a week, just not sure the amount of gallons? The tree is 13 to 14 feet high and has a 13 foot canopy.

    Thanks a bunch.
    Jon

    {{gwi:576734}}

    Tantanman,

    The tree does get afternoon shade, but I have a dog and one of the reasons I did this is to keep the dog out of the mud when it rains, which is why I wanted to put a layer of some kind of mulch. Keep her little paws off the ground. I bought a bag of All Natural Bark Nuggets by EarthGro. I was thinking about using his, I don't believe I have seen Pine Bark, but haven't ever looked for it. Is this an everyday product I should be able to find at my local Home Depot or nurseries?

    Thanks.
    Jon

  • hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
    12 years ago

    Okay, you're probably on sand, or a combo of sand and caliche (which is code for "concrete", lol!) So, like my DG, very organic-poor. Definitely compost will help. Do not amend your hole. This is old thinking. You are much better off planting your tree in native soil. Dig a hole two to three times as wide as the rootball and as deep as the tree was in the pot. Plant, making sure to water in well to remove air pockets. The trunk should be higher than the perimeter of the well, so the water drains away from the trunk, and towards the perimeter of the well, where the feeder roots will be (they're at the edge of the canopy, or drip line, and slightly beyond). Fill your well with compost. Add in worm castings if you want to be particularly nice to your tree. Top with bark mulch as Larry mentioned. The bark mulch sounds fine. Pine bark is safe to use, but most likely the product you've found is just fine. I also add chicken manure twice a year, which I have found gives the tree a nice, long lasting nitrogen source (I have wood chip mulch all over my hillside, so this helps with the drain on nitrogen due to the wood chips as well). I have not had any issues with salt burn at all, but then, I'm on DG so everything drains well for me. I'm not a fan of flag emitters. Way too low for citrus. I would switch to 360 degree fan emitters which can put out up to 28GPH. And, they're adjustable. How much water? For you and I it will vary due to our heat (especially for you). I use a long green plant stake to check. One of those cheap green plastic-covered things you can get at Home Depot/Lowes with a pointed end. I stick that into the ground. If I can get it stuck in to about 18", then I know my soil is moist enough. Once a week in the summer is most likely not enough. The deep watering philosophy for citrus is also out the door. Citrus are shallow rooted, so your better off in the summer with 2 or 3 moderate waterings that water down to about 2 feet, than one long deep watering, as you're wasting water. And I hear you about mulching to prevent muddy dog feet :-) That's why I have wood chip mulch everywhere front and back. I have two active Aussies that I'm constantly doing the paw wipe. They wear a track in the mulch down to the dirt. Ugh.

  • JR78
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thanks so much for the help. You mentioned worm castings? Who has these? Are these live or dead? Sorry for the lack of knowledge, as I'm still learning. Is there directions on when and how much to apply?

    Also, chicken manure, when do you make those applications? Do you want to avoid applying when I do my normal 3 fertilizing a year?

    PS. I will look for those emitters you spoke about.

    Thanks again, your a big help. I feel comfortable to finish this project without any worries of having to go back and fix something later. Thanks!!!

  • hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
    12 years ago

    Worm castings are what earthworms "cast" off, after consuming organic materials. So, they're dead :-) You can apply them with the chicken manure once in the spring, as you start seeing growth, and then again in the later summer, early fall. For me in Calif. I usually apply both of these products in February and again in Sept/Oct. I use about a small coffee can of each for small trees and up to 4 coffee cans (1 lb can) to my large, mature trees. And, I fertilize every 2 months from Feb through Oct (so, I fertilize 4 to 5 times).

    Patty S.

  • pgde
    12 years ago

    See the link below for citrus water needs in AZ. The same site has AZ-specific fertilizing and care recommendations.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Citrus Watering

  • JR78
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Hi everyone and thanks for all the input. Here is a picture of the final product. Thanks again. Jon

    {{gwi:576736}}

  • hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
    12 years ago

    Bee-u-tee-ful, Jon! That is one very well-tended citrus tree, well done :-) I will not allow my citrus trees to see this photo, or they will become intensely jealous!

    Patty S.

  • JR78
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thanks Patty! It will be so much nicer as soon as the grass grows in. 2 months and I should have a nice spread of grass.

  • merrybookwyrm
    12 years ago

    Beautiful indeed.

    I know zip about citrus trees, but do know something about bermuda grass. If you have to go the roundup route to get rid of the bermuda (and you probably will have to unless you have something that eats bermuda to death), keep the bermuda pulled out as well as possible and then round up under the tree in small areas, over time. Don't use the roundup under the entire tree all at once.

    Good luck. As pretty as the area under your citrus tree is, the rest of your yard must be beautiful also.

  • tantanman
    12 years ago

    JR:

    I have read in "Citrus Industry" that Florida citrus needs about 1" of water a week. Their soils average lighter (hold less water) and the temps are less than you have so that may be a starting point for you to experiment with.

    Larry

  • blazeaglory
    12 years ago

    For a ground cover would those white "marble" rocks be OK? I think that would look nice around that beautiful tree. Good Job!!

  • meyermike_1micha
    12 years ago

    Jon! Wow, your picture took me by surprise!

    Absolutely brilliant and a job well done. I love it!
    I am sure that tree is one happy camper too.

    Mike

  • andrewofthelemon
    12 years ago

    Wow, that looks great. Man I wished that I lived in an area where I can do this, I would love to have a huge citrus tree outside my house. Great job

    Andrew

  • hoosierquilt USDA 10A Sunset 23 Vista CA
    12 years ago

    Wow, Andrew (of the Lemon), where the heck have you been? It's been a while since I've seen you post!!

    Patty S.

  • wunderpit
    11 years ago

    What did you use for the border around the bed? Thanks, looks cool!

    We have several fruits trees in our backyard, surrounded by grass, which I hate. This is a great idea.

  • johnmerr
    11 years ago

    Hint, Surflan will also kill off Bermuda grass; it is used a lot in vineyards in California.

    Not as harsh as Roundup, but quite effective

  • rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
    11 years ago

    Surflan is NOT a post emergent herbicide. PERIOD. Surflan is strictly a pre-emergent chemical....preventing seed germination only. It's not effective in preventing rhizomatous and/or stoloniferous grasses from taking over.

    These two chemicals cannot be substituted for each other at all.

  • johnmerr
    11 years ago

    Rhizo,

    I understand that; but in California vineyards, when it is applied annually, it eliminates Bermuda grass. Maybe something like 2-4-D eliminates nut grass in lawns, even though it supposedly only kills broad leaf plants. Go figger. I don't know the science exactly, but I do know the results.

  • rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
    11 years ago

    Surflan has NO mode of action as a contact or systemic killer of vegetation. It is, however, often used as a herbicide soup in combination with RoundUp (or other contact killer), a tank mix applied to kill existing vegetation and prevent germinating seeds, as well.

    Not something I would recommend to anyone who doesn't know what they are doing. Herbicides are the most misunderstood and misapplied pesticides in the world. And the most dangerous to the environment and the inhabitants of that environment (including us).

  • Georgieboy
    10 years ago

    Why is the tree trunk painted white??
    Surely this can't be beneficial?

  • manfromyard
    10 years ago

    It's painted white to prevent sunburn in skirted trees.

    When you cut the lower branches off to make the plant more tree-ish, it exposes the trunk to sunlight. If you don't paint it, it can get burned badly in hot regions...

  • johnmerr
    10 years ago

    I always paint my trunks, when they are quite small, and until the canopy will shade the trunk. In hot climates direct sun can sunburn the trunk and kill your citrus.

    Paint them with cheap white latex paint thinned 1 to 1 with water. I would paint the trunks every year in Spring, as long as the trunk is exposed to direct Summer sun.