That seems a bit much. Is that one of those smaller compact Pinus taeda that are growing at the JC Raulston arboretum? I didn't know one was officially named 'JC Raulston'. They have several compact Pinus taeda growing there. I took some pictures on a winter trip last year. I gafted a few cuttings from some of those trees. I'll have to look through my pine grafts and see what I have.

Pinus taeda 'Little Albert'

Look up Doremus Wholesale Nursery, which is in Warren Texas. On a tip from Tony Avent several years ago, I contacted these nice folks and they are the only nursery that produces these dwarf loblolly pines and they said they would be happy to sell to me. For $30, I got a nice 48" tall pine grafted on a 36" standard that is now one of my favorite plants. At the time they said they wouldn't ship but my friend in Georgia got them to send him one a few years ago so maybe it is just who you are. $140 is robbery and I bet they get their material from Doremus too.

Yes that's where they get them- that 'Little Albert' is mighty fine too! I have been looking for brooms and found some in the city park down the road from me, one is pretty big and another is very small and compact but getting to them would be the problem of course, I could get permission pretty easy I think. Sadly I don't see any on my trees or my neighbors, maybe I need to look more carefully though.
I forgot to add the email notice:

Pinus taeda âÂÂJC Raulstonâ is a great dwarf pine cultivar but its availability is often limited because propagation is not simple. The pine must be grafted to standard P. taeda rootstock, which must be of a certain size and height in order for the graft to take and the rootstalk has to be robust and healthy. For several years prior to this year Mark Bronstad of Doremus Wholesale Nursery has attempted to graft this pine but due to the harsh, droughty conditions, which have persisted over the last several years, the rootstock pines available have not been robust enough and the grafts have not been successful. However, Mark attempted the grafts again this spring and was successful. I have pre-ordered a number of these pines and the plant is now listed online for purchase. Shipment of these pines will not be until November or December or until I make the trek to East Texas to pick them up. So the plant can be purchased now but shipment will not be immediate.

Here is a link that might be useful: Pinus taeda 'JC Raulston'

Just a few pictures of when I got mine and what it looks like now.

Fairfield, who told you that dwarf forms of Pinus taeda must be grafted to standard Pinus taeda understock?
I have other experiences...

Scpalmnut, is the one at your pics a 'JC Raulston' or a 'Little Albert'?
It's a very nice specimen you got there!

They just refered to it as 'Nana'.

I did not say that , they said it, re-read the article please.

Fairfield, I didn't say it was you, I just asked you who told you that (b.s) story?

I red your story several times and if wasn't a nurseryman I would believe every word of it.
But I'm a nurseryman and I can tell that propagating Pinus taeda cultivars isn't difficult at all as long if you're using the right scions and understock which doesn't need to be Pinus taeda perse.

There are several ways to get good understock for grafting dwarf forms of this species.
For eample Pinus ponderosa understock has the same characteristics as Pinus taeda understock which can be bought in large numbers at specialized nurseries.

Another thing is that witches' brooms seedlings are much easier to propagate then true witches' brooms.
The 'JC Raulston' and the 'Little Albert' are both witches' broom seedlings...

Because of their story that these dwarf forms are hard to propagate they can rize the prize till 140 dollars each.
It seems to me that people want to be fooled by such sellers who are telling them this kind of fairytale stories...

Well, coniferjoy, for what it's worth, it's highly unlikely that Pinus ponderosa rootstocks would perform well in the south eastern US.

David, it depends which subspecies of Pinus ponderosa will be used.

Pinus jeffreyi is also a good understock for this goal.

I don't understand the unavailability of good quality Pinus taeda understock. They grow like weeds here in Arkansas. I can buy thousands from the forestry service. You pot them, let them grow for a year and they are wonderful understock. They're not too difficult to graft either. I have 5 Pinus taeda brooms that Im grafting this winter. I've always seen the dwarf Pinus taeda labeled 'Nana'.

No, neither of these species would do well in most of the southeast, nor are the found in places like the NCSU arboretum or the SFASU arboretum. Which certainly would have them if they could.
Conditions are quite different in the SE US than NW Europe so I'm not sure why you think your experiences would apply there.

"Rocky Mountain ponderosa pine grows in Texas only in woodland areas of the Chisos, Davis and Guadalupe mountains in west Texas, at altitudes of 4,000 to 8,000 feet."

Here is a link that might be useful: http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/ornamentals/natives/pinusponderosa.htm

Ok Edwin, there must be a disconect, this was a cut and paste from a email newsletter from YuccaDo nursery that I received.

I googled and found several places that have small seedlings of taeda. Really, would not any SYP work as understock? Even something like virginia pine?
And must all pines be grafted on like pines? I see that japanese white pine is often on japanese black for better roots-I thought there would be incompatibilty problems.
I got one of the Pinus 'Forest Sky' mexican white pines from Song sparrow but it is on strobus and Cox and Ruter said strobus fails around 10yrs due to root rot. I've seen something that I thought might be strobus here but that is unlikely. Could the ''Forest Sky' be grafted to a SYP?

Here's some sources of taeda seedlings, there aren't many:
http://www.trees-plants.com/pinus-teada-loblolly-pine/
http://mdc.mo.gov/your-property/seedling-orders-and-planting-guide/seedling-order-how

David, theoretical seen Pinus ponderosa and Pinus jeffreyi would work out fine as understock for grafting dwarf forms of Pinus taeda.

Like abc says, Pinus taeda understock shouldn't be a problem to get because they're growing like crazy and there are plenty available.
So what's the problem?

abc, do you've pics of your Pinus taeda brooms?

Edwin, even I know that neither Pinus ponderosa nor Pinus jeffreyi would even be remotely suitable here. What are you thinking about?

Fairfield, Pinus taeda is a 3 needle pine which can be grafted on 2-and 3 needle pine understock.
Because of this Pinus virginiana should be possible as understock for grafting Pinus taeda cultivars.
Also Pinus rigida comes to my mind...

The reason that in the bonsai world Pinus parviflora cultivars are grafted onto Pinus thunbergii understock is for the specail coark bark effects of the Pinus thunbergii.
Because of this understock the plants will look much older then they realy are...

Because of this it's possible to graft Pinus (x) 'Forest Sky' on SYP understock, but the results are not as good as grafted on a 5 needle understock like Pinus strobus.
Another quiestion is how long this take will hold.
Maybe you can try this experience this winter and tell us later on what your result is, I'm very curious.

Another example is Pinus koraiensis grafted onto Pinus sylvestris.
The results are pretty good so far, but nobody can tell us yet how long they will grow hapilly under these circumstances...

This post was edited by coniferjoy on Mon, Oct 7, 13 at 2:31

Thanks Edwin, it looks like I will have to try my hand at grafting some day. There is no market for dwarf pines here so nobody grafts them, only weirdos like me and abciximab and scpalmnut would want them! Most people consider them trash. I hope the 'Forest Sky' will live long enough to try to graft. I will plant it high and then make sure to water it well. It is really nice.

Hardiness of taeda?

davidrt28, funny you should mention the SFA Arboretum in Nacogdoches, I was just there Sat. for the fall plant sale but it was raining and it had to be a quick trip anyway so I did not get to look around. I will certainly go back for the spring sale and see everything. I scored some very nice magnolias though. Must take the truck next time too and really load up!

Hardy to Zone 7 (cold hardiness limit between -17.7ðC and -12.2ðC) from conifers.org

Fairfield, it's to bad that dwarf pines are not "hot" were you live.

I wish you good luck in advance in grafting the 5 Pinus taeda brooms. please keep us informed.
Do you've some pics of the brooms hanging in the trees?

I guess that because they are all around and considered "trash" trees they do not get much attention. The same thing with Taxodium, it is just now becoming used more in landscaping and some shopping centers are planting them in the parking lot islands. Much better than Bradford pears that are sometimes still being planted. I always think why not use pines in commercial and municipal landscapes, the ones that I have seen seem to do well in the reflected heat/drought and they should be cheap too. It seems to be the "familiarity breeds contempt" thing working here. I'll try to get some pics but they're far up.

Hi Al, I guess this pic was taken when the grafts were just made.
What is the result now at this moment, how many of them take and which understock was used?

fairfield8619, P taeda grows well enough here in z6. Alittle cold-damage when tiny, but none since. About 20' tall so far. Wet snow & ice would seem the worst risk due to the longish needles.

Pond pine seems to grow even better here.

beng, it might be helpful if you could email conifers.org and let them know your experience. Every bit of data would be good I think. I really like that site. That's where I got that info. I too, would like to know the ROOTSTOCK please.

This post was edited by fairfield8619 on Fri, Oct 11, 13 at 15:54

Here, a Pinus cembra "Lilliput" grafted onto Pinus uncinata, after 4/5 years,he look healty. 5 needles on 2 needles.
Clément

Realizing this is a very old post, but I was curious if anyone in MD would be able to graft a taeda broom? I actually have one in my yard, and would be willing to shoot it down. I would need to plan for someone to graft on whatever rootstock would be best. I assume winter is grafting time? If anyone could point me in the right direction that would be great