Difference w/ Squiggles, Wiggles, Mini Twists, Tiny Curls etc

10 years ago

So 'Mini Twists' is a sister seedling to 'Tiny Curls'.
Mini Twists being a slower grower (2"-3") with a globe habit and Tiny Curls growing faster (3"-4") and forming an oval to pyramidal habit. TC found as a Pinus strobus 'Tourlosa' seedling. Then throw in Pinus strobus 'Vercurve' which is apparently a sister seedling to 'Mini Twists' which has shorter more twisted needles in which the growth rate falls inbetween TC and MT. Habit starts out like MT and maturing more like TC. Can anyone confirm this info?

Then you have 'Squiggles' and 'Wiggles' which are also brother sister plants. What are the differences with these selections compared to each other and the three selections above? I can't find the difference between the two but they both appear to be flat top globes that grow more slowly and compact than MT at 1"-2".

Another one I found is 'Green Twist' which is a witches' broom from Pinus strobus 'Contorta'. Besides its origin how is this one different than 'Mini Twists' or 'Vercurve'?

Although they all have different origins I feel like I'm splitting hairs trying to find the differences between them. At the end of the day if you just wanted a couple twisted dwarf strobus selections I'd go 'Tiny Curls' for the more upright growth of 3-4" and then one of the ggles like 'Wiggles' for a more compact slow growing globe.

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Comments (5)

ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
10 years ago
back in the day ... pre WWW [which loosely translates to limited information available] .. in the hosta world.. i went thru this ... i finally realized... i was a name collector ..

that when it all boiled down ... there was not much difference between the lot.. in a circumstance like this ....

which was supported by most cultivars.. having never been grown to maturity ... and all the verbage being little more than speculation.. based on the history of the parent ... if known .... or observation of plants growing in pots .. hyper-fertlized to the extreme ...

i started to do the same with conifers.. collecting every blue p parv i could find.. being a blue freak and all ... and now 13 odd years later.. catalog info long forgotten.. i have 6 to 8 blue parvs.. that all look the same ... not much better than 'glauca' lookalikes ..... TO MY EYE ....

pick one ... and enjoy it ... but dont waste your money on two.. as all you might end up with is a duplicate ... or until you can see.. with your own eyes.. a difference.. at maturity ...

and of course.. i am not at the level of a joy.. or fincham .... so as to define minute differences .... all the power to them ... but for 99% of us ... the differences are nil ....

i hope.. but doubt.. this was helpful ... lol ... at your end of the learning curve ....

ken
cubicmile
10 years ago
Perfect example of Ken bumping a post. We like your contribution Ken but you added nothing meaningful to what Whaas was searching for. A little ramble about hosta and then your opinion

From what I've gathered...
'Squiggles' and 'Wiggles' are both seedlings from "Contorta'. They look similar. I think Wiggles grows a little faster. I think 'Squiggles' was a Duvall Nursery introduction. Both are globose in shape.
'Mini Twists' and 'Tiny Curls' are both seedlings from 'Torulosa'. 'Tiny Curls' grows a little faster. Both are pyramidal in shape.
"Vercurve' appears to be like 'Tiny Curls'shape and groth rate. I don't now any background on it.
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outback63 Dennison
10 years ago
The Picea glauca cultivars have a 100 look a likes. Probably 75% are the same cultivar. Some misnamed and who in the hell knows and cares when you reach a point when one looks like the other.

Yes "Zukerhutt', 'Daisy's White', 'Pixie' and a few other green/blue cultivars are nice. The rest I don't even know why I keep them. Probably time to cull a few and replace with some others that will curl your toes.

Dave

This post was edited by Davesconifers on Sun, Dec 29, 13 at 14:41
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
10 years ago
touche mr miles ...

you said: They look similar.

unfortunately your descriptions and admissions support my theory that they are basically.. a bunch of lookalikes ... with a slight suggestion that MAYBE some grow a bit faster than others ....

so why in the world would whaas need TWO of them???? its not like he has a couple hundred acres for duplicates .. variations on a theme ...

i choose p.s. tortulosa [over contorta] .. because it has curly needles and curly branches .... if any of those listed by whaas has both.. i would go with one of those names .... rather than one with straight branching and curly needles ... therein would be a defining trait ... but i am not researching such ....

ken
baxswoh
10 years ago
Those who attended the ACS national meeting in Michigan two summers ago had the opportunity to see these cultivars on display.

Andy Duvall, the originator of "Wiggles & Squggles" had both specimen plants at his nursery.

Hidden Lake Gardens and Gary Gee had these cultivars planted in a grouping so you could compare them side by side.

To Ken's point: Yes they are very similar and which ever one you have in your landscape you will like. You will not need to have all of the cultivars unless you are creating an arboretum or reference garden.

Picture is side by side at the Harper Collection. Wiggles & Squggles.