Close up of trunk

Branch

Looks very much like pinus sylvestris.

i am surely no pine expert ...

but you start with how many needles in a bundle .. and on pic 3.. i see 2 .. which leads me to sylvestrus also ...

after count.. you go to needle length ... well i do ... lol ... and then cones if stumped at that point ....

all pines shed there needles.. in one to three years... as is seen in pic two ...

if you want its annual growth rate ... its how much the leader grew this year ... if you could get up there.. you would see last springs growth still has green needles on the trunk .. and below the whorl.. the bark and the number of needles changes. ... and finally.. by counting the whorls.. you can guesstimate.. how old the tree is ... and once you have that number ... you can estimate it height every ten years forever ...

i had 15 of these felled not long ago ... because of disease and bug.. and would suggest to you.. that yours is 20 to 30 feet .. TO CLOSE TO YOUR HOUSE ... which leads you to two options... let it go until you have to pay big money for removal [or you move to get away from it] .. or do it in the next few years.. while you can still do it yourself ... for free ....

the problem with them.. is their rather limber weak wood that can fall apart in heavy ice and snow ...

at the very top ... [and at every branch tip] ... you will find one dominant bud ... surrounded by side buds.. and that is the whorl i speak of... its how a pine grows ... and by looking at your pic.. and understanding its formation ... you can count about 9 of them in your first pic [the shadows in the pic make it hard] .. minus those already removed.. of which you could probably still see the healing wounds ... so your tree .. is about 10 to 12 years old ...

once established.. the length of growth.. between whorls.. becomes rather predictable.. subject to drought.. etc ... some years in the 2 to 3 foot range.. other years.. maybe up to 5 feet ... and once you stare at your tree.. perhaps after a few adult beverages.. you MIGHT come to understand what a problem you will have there in 10 or 20 years ... see link, presuming sylvestrus is correct

if you really like the color and texture of this type of pine.. this forum could probably give you a list of named cultivars.. much better suited to your space ... with a more appropriate growth rate ...

this is an extra link for annual growth rates:

http://www.conifersociety.org/conifers/conifer-sizes/

yours fits in the definition of LARGE

i am suggesting your space.. require a mini or dwarf growth rate ...

perhaps more info than you wish ... but its snowing like the dickens outside.. and i dont want to go out there.. lol ..

ken

ps: i wonder how many time i spelled sylvestrus wrong.. lol ...

Here is a link that might be useful: i call them telephone pole trees ...

Looks like P. contorta except the bark could point to P. sylvestris.

Those two species are related.

Specimen needs to be moved to a more sunny and spacious position.

Pinus contorta - the branches are multinodal (buds mid-way along the annual shoot, as well as at the tip), whereas P. sylvestis is uninodal.

As an aside to bboy, they aren't particularly closely related - P. sylvestris is in Pinus sect. Pinus, subsect. Pinus, whereas P. contorta is in Pinus sect. Trifoliae, subsect. Contortae.

P. contorta is actually more closely related to e.g. P. palustris, or P. coulteri (both also in sect. Trifoliae, but different subsections), than to P. sylvestris. May seem odd, but it's true ;-)

Resin

Thanks everyone for the responses and id. I only started paying any attention to trees this year. There are plenty of P. contorta in the mountains of course and I am sure around town too but I don't know exactly where. Scotch pine (P. sylvestris) does have really distinctive bark and I think I saw a big one on my walk today.

Ken, don't worry, I am a tree cutter not a tree planter right now. I think I will let this go a couple years and see how tall it gets then chop it down, maybe for a Christmas tree. I don't think it would be easy to move even now and don't know where I would put it or who would want it. I think the first owner had very few trees, maybe none in the back yard, and when the second owners bought the house in 2002 they planted so many trees.

Here's a picture of the area in spring 2002. It's dark but I don't see any trees or bushes in that corner. Or the neighbor's junipers.

This post was edited by olreader on Sat, Dec 14, 13 at 19:24

The multinodal habit would be why it looked like P. contorta. I probably got to thinking they were related because of them appearing near one another in keys to planted trees due to being morphologically similar, familiar horticultural species. And/or it used to be thought they were related.

I would still want to hear second opinion about this being Pinus contorta. Here is picture of pinus sylvestris-pines taken few minutes ago from my backyard. Arrangement of branches is not that symmetrical there. Looks very much like tree in first picture.
where i am, easiest way to tell apart contorta and sylvestris is looking at bark. Contorta is grey and more skinlike. Sylvestris has brownred tone. Later sylvestris has more thick and cracked bark on lower trunk and red glow remains on upper trunk, while contorta stays more gray and smoother.

it is still a plain green ... telephone pole type pine.. so common you see them everywhere .. as you say ...

only a fool would move it .... unless you just like backbreaking labor for little payback .... you can probably buy two year old foot tall seedlings for under a buck ... maybe dave will send his truck ... lol...

now.. if it were some $100 dollar unique specimen ... it would be a fool who did not try to move it ...

enjoy it.. until it pisses you off.. then get rid of it.. but do it before you have to pay to have it done... spend money on a good .. quality.. unique replacement... not for removal ...

so much for my ID skills.. lol ... but my comments on pines in general.. still hold ... i hope ... lol ..

enabled yet????

ken

Here is a link that might be useful: ahhhh .. pines a pine.. still a telephone pole forest ... lol ...

My first thought was either contorta or sylvestris.

Here is a bark detail pic from one of my sylvestris.
Reddish brown outer papery appearance, with a lighter green color underneath.

Maybe a bud check would be helpful.
Pinus sylvestris bud

Pinus contorta bud (tree sourced from Clear Creek county)

Here is a Pinus contorta (Gilpin county)

Follow on question - does this P. contorta bud structure (with the mini side buds) have anything to do with the multinodality?
P. contorta (sourced from Summit county)

"Follow on question - does this P. contorta bud structure (with the mini side buds) have anything to do with the multinodality?"

Yes, those are the internode buds.

Another useful distinction visible in your pics, Scots Pine usually has blue-green foliage, whereas Lodgepole Pine has mid-green or even yellowish-green foliage.

Resin

Can't be P. sylvestris with that mode of branching. In first photo looks like a million other young P. contorta in the region, the only thing that gave me pause was the bark - which turned out not to be a deal breaker.

Also it's bark colour wasn't right for Pinus sylvestris...

Thanks Resin!

Ok, thank you all, contorta it is then.