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midnightsmum

Weekend Trivia - Sunday

Happy Sunday Morning, Cottagers. It is cool and breezy here, and my allergies are running rampant!! This is the part of Fall that I hate. But on to trivia:

Who invented Cement? You know, good old, run of the mill "lime, sand, and gravel aggregate". It's been around a lot longer that I imagined, when I looked it all up. I do have clues, will be back with them. No gypsies on the horizon today, so far at least!!

Nancy.

Comments (20)

  • thinman
    10 years ago

    I really don't mean to be annoying, but are we talking about Portland cement, the gray powdery stuff that comes in 94 pound bags, or concrete, the stuff made with Portland cement that our sidewalks and basement floors are made of?

    I'm pretty sure you are asking about concrete, and maybe it's the same person for both. That would make sense.

    TM

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    10 years ago

    I have some idea poking at my pathetic memory, but it can't quite break through yet. Are you looking for a civilization or a single name?

    Sounds as if TM is there already again today. Must be all that fish he catches and eats! Brain food, you know. :)

    Cynthia

  • thinman
    10 years ago

    Cynthia, I think you're more on track than I am. I was thinking it was a person, but your idea of a certain civilization sounds better to me.

    TM

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Aaahh, TM. I should not have added the word 'aggregate' to that line. I am indeed talking about cement, the stuff between the aggregate. Cement is the binder, if you will, so yes - cement. To geek it out completely, the word "cement" traces to the Romans, who used the term opus caementicium to describe masonry resembling modern concrete that was made from crushed rock with burnt lime as binder.

    Ah-huh, so it wasn't Gauis Cementus of the Romans!! I'm looking for an earlier civilization.

    Sorry, that was supposed to have been posted an hour and half ago - this site hates me!!

    Nancy.

  • mnwsgal
    10 years ago

    I am thinking of a Biblical structure that most likely used a cement aggregate and is often attributed to an early civilization that has a similar sounding name.

    No movie again today. Will try to catch it next week when I'm home.

  • thinman
    10 years ago

    I don't know that structure, Bobbie, but working from your clue, I did think of a group that shares a syllable with the word cement.

    TM

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    It is uncertain where it was first discovered that a combination of hydrated non-hydraulic lime and a pozzolan produces a hydraulic mixture, but concrete made from such mixtures was first used by the Ancient Macedonians and three centuries later on a large scale by Roman engineers. They used both natural pozzolans (trass or pumice) and artificial pozzolans (ground brick or pottery) in these concretes. Many excellent examples of structures made from these concretes are still standing, notably the huge dome of the Pantheon in Rome and the massive Baths of Caracalla. The vast system of Roman aqueducts also made extensive use of hydraulic cement.
    I believe the structure Bobbie is referring to fell in the time of Genesis. Basic cement is from a civilization older than that - and guess what? They invented beer, too!! What a bunch.

    Nancy.

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    It is uncertain where it was first discovered that a combination of hydrated non-hydraulic lime and a pozzolan produces a hydraulic mixture, but concrete made from such mixtures was first used by the Ancient Macedonians and three centuries later on a large scale by Roman engineers. They used both natural pozzolans (trass or pumice) and artificial pozzolans (ground brick or pottery) in these concretes. Many excellent examples of structures made from these concretes are still standing, notably the huge dome of the Pantheon in Rome and the massive Baths of Caracalla. The vast system of Roman aqueducts also made extensive use of hydraulic cement.
    I believe the structure Bobbie is referring to fell in the time of Genesis. Basic cement is from a civilization older than that - and guess what? They invented beer, too!! What a bunch.

    Nancy.

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    10 years ago

    Hey! You are ending this pretty early. Darn. Oh well, interesting nonetheless. Thanks for the fun! Have a great week all.

    Cynthia

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Ending it early??

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    10 years ago

    Oh...didn't you just say it was first used by the Macedonians? Is that not what you were asking? Now, I am the one who is confused (not an unfamiliar feeling). :)

    Cynthia

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    10 years ago

    Okay, I am an idiot...so, my guess is the Egyptians. That seems to ring a bell, but maybe that is just tinnitus. ;)

    School night, so off to bed. Can't wait to check in tomorrow for the answer.

    Cynthia

  • thinman
    10 years ago

    Although I'm sure that my students used to think that I had lived through ancient history, I really know almost nothing about it and I'm drawing a big fat blank here so far.

    TM

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Well, I seem to have made a mess of this, and feel like such a turkey....

    Nancy.

  • mnwsgal
    10 years ago

    I was thinking of Babylon and the Tower of Babel. How about Greece and the early Greek aqueducts?

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    Babylon was part of the answer, but I was going to Mesopotamia. Widely considered to be the cradle of civilization in the West, Bronze Age Mesopotamia included Sumer and the Akkadian, Babylonian, and Assyrian empires, all native to the territory of modern-day Iraq. An early version of cement made with lime, sand, and gravel was used in Mesopotamia in the third millennium B.C. and later in Egypt.

    Although any preservation of this knowledge in literary sources from the Middle Ages is unknown, medieval masons and some military engineers maintained an active tradition of using hydraulic cement in structures such as canals, fortresses, harbors, and shipbuilding facilities. The technical knowledge of making hydraulic cement was later formalized by French and British engineers in the 18th century.

    And yes, you could make a construction guy (or a guy, TM?) crazy by referring to cement as concrete and vice versa.

    Mesopotamia, by the way, was very advanced for the age. Mesopotamian religion was the first to be recorded. Mesopotamians believed that the world was a flat disc, surrounded by a huge, holed space, and above that, heaven. They also believed that water was everywhere, the top, bottom and sides, and that the universe was born from this enormous sea. In addition, Mesopotamian religion was polytheistic. During the earliest Sumerian period, the "en", or high priest of male gods was originally a woman, that of female goddesses, a man. Thorkild Jacobsen, as well as many others, has suggested that early Mesopotamian society was ruled by a "council of elders" in which men and women were equally represented, but that over time, as the status of women fell, that of men increased. Unusual for that time in history, women in Mesopotamia had rights. They could own property and, if they had good reason, get a divorce.

    So a very advanced society back in the day, and the original 'Stairway to Heaven".

    So Bobbie, who was on the path:

    For Cynthia, for Egypt:

    Thanks for playing this week. I'm getting the hang of this again, I think. See you all next week. Hope it's a great one!

  • thinman
    10 years ago

    Mesopotamia, huh? Who knew? Obviously not me. :)

    Thanks, Nancy. It's always fun to learn new stuff.

    TM

    P.S. Cement/concrete: I'm a stickler, but I try to keep my thoughts about cement and concrete to myself most of the time.

  • midnightsmum (Z4, ON)
    Original Author
    10 years ago

    lol. I can't remember which DIY show it was but the host or someone was waxing poetic about idiots who didn't know the difference. It may be where the germ of this came from!!

  • cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)
    10 years ago

    Oh! I should have remembered that! Great question, Nancy. I also love learning new things and with my memory being what it is (apparently), almost everything is new, ha.

    Speaking of new things, I welcome the reminders for which is cement and which is concrete. I can never remember or keep them straight (are you recognizing a theme here?).

    Have a terrific week all. Next week, our Saturday question will concern cement vs concrete! ;). Also, hope to hear about "Gravity" Bobbie.

    Cynthia

  • mnwsgal
    10 years ago

    Thanks for the stars, Nancy. Pays to have even a little knowledge.

    I saw the movie "Gravity" this week on the IMAX screen in 3D.
    It was okay but I expected more. Way too short without any back story to build the characters so one would actually care about their situation. Good computer effects. Wasn't worth the $10.50 I spent for the ticket and the $8 for a large (seemed more like the old medium size) popcorn to share.

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