Glad you are having sun, Cynthia. We've had days and days of warm sunny weather, hardly believing our good fortune. It was fun while it lasted, but right now we have strong wind, rain, and 44 F. A good day to do inside projects, like build an outdoor cat house duplex for my sister who has adopted two strays, but doesn't want them in the house, where she already has two Maine Coon Cats.

I'll be waiting for a hint or two, having no idea about the cigar/stogie thing.

TM

I'm with TM on this one.

Annette

Although it is cool now, we are supposed to get up to about 70 degrees. Perfect for planting! I wish I had saved my son's little red wagon to help me move plants around the yard. It disappeared from my parents' garage years ago. Think little sis might have absconded with it for her kids at some point. :( Also, need a much larger wagon to move that dang tree that is still sitting out front after I dragged it all the way from Maryland. Oh well.

The cat house project sounds cool, TM. Hope it is a fun project!

Okay, if you team up on this one, you might come up with the group that first began using the term. If you get that, there will be other connections. Must say that it originated in my home state of Pennsylvania!

Off to put the patio furniture around the new plants since the wild one is coming for a vist. Kids are going to tour the White House Gardens. Fun!

Cynthia

Hmmm. I think I may get the hint. If I'm right, there is a connection to a historical conveyance that was slow, but capable.

TM

Good Morning Cynthia! Sunny one here too but a bit on the cooler side!

Trying to think of a clue to let you know that I do know where this word comes from. I am very much a horse person and Dad has of course spoke of stogies often, being a sailor and all. So the word may have originated in the US but it is definately used in Canada too.

In the meantime, I have more yard work to do today since it is getting closer to the first s***. My little green wagon will be working overtime today and so will I! Till later.......

Ginny

Oops! Was stalling on the phone as I was typing my post so just pretend I was the second reply......k.....:)

Hmmmm, me thinks 'wagon' has some significance.

Annette

Would it help to know that the term is associated with teamsters?

I suppose sailors might get this!!! At least if I am reading this correctly.
Rainy, windy and very cool here. Home from work, and heading out shortly for Chinese dinner - I treat I hope, as it is one of the major food groups that I am missing. This restaurant is new to me, in this town. I have tried the others in this town, and they don't make the grade, imho. I'll be back later to see if I am on the right tack.

Nancy.

Well, the answer I have has more to do with the horses than with a sailor. There WAS also a horse named the same way back when.
That is the only way I know of the nickname of "stogie" which Dad referred to all the time.

Ginny

Ah, if I read you right Nancy, you are very clever. Hope dinner was good.

Yes, TM, Annette, and Honalee, think you are on to it, too.

Will check in the morning for answers.

Cynthia

Going to bed so I will leave my answer for morning. The Conestoga wagon was used in the 1800's as a freight wagon by the early settlers of Pennsylvania. Because it was so heavy, the horses used to pull it were often tall, draft type horses with gentle temperaments and stamina for long hauls. They became known as Conestoga horses. Although not a recognized breed it is rumoured that these horses are the decendents of many Dutch warmbloods of modern day.

So that is my answer to where the "stogie" got it's name. Even though the stogie is a cheap ciger, it was named after the wagon, which was named after the valley in Penn. I believe it is an American Indian name. :)

Ginny

After some good hints, I thought of Conestoga wagons too, but I can't make the connection between a wagon and a cigar.

TM

Again, here too, I cannot make the connection. I was alluding to its other name, the Prairie Schooner. Perhaps these wagons were shorter, and less expensive than another choice?? Grabbing at straws, here.

Nancy.

Hmmmmm, the drivers of Conestoga wagons named their cigars after the type of wagon they drove? What's a Conestoga wagon, not familiar with that name.

Annette

**** for Annette for making the connection that the drivers (teamsters) named their cheap cigars after the Conestoga wagon they used to haul, among other goods, tobacco. The story of the origin of this word is that George Black ran a small tobacco shop and cigar store in Washington, Pa. As the story goes, Black wanted to make a good cheap cigar. He may have thought up the idea of the stogie himself or, as has been suggested, he probably got the idea from the teamsters who used to pull twists of tobacco from their cargos and make their own smokes. At any rate, Black did develop a long slender cigar-type smoke selling for three for a cent. The teamsters who were heavy customers christened these "Conestogas" after their wagons and the new cigar soon became known as "Stogas," for short and later as simply "stogies."

Conestoga wagons (condensed from several sites): The Conestoga wagon was cleverly built. Its floor curved upward to prevent the contents from tipping and shifting. The average Conestoga wagon was 18 feet long, 11 feet high, and 4 feet in width. It could carry up to 12,000 pounds of cargo. The cracks in the body of the wagon were stuffed with tar to protect them from leaking while crossing rivers. Also for protection against bad weather, stretched across the wagon was a tough, white canvas cover. The frame and suspension were made of wood, while the wheels were often iron-rimmed for greater durability.

The term "Conestoga wagon" refers specifically to this type of vehicle; it is not a generic term for "covered wagon". The wagons used in the westward expansion of the United States were, for the most part, ordinary farm wagons fitted with canvas covers. The driver of the Conestofa wagon either rode one of the horses, walked next to the team on the left (which led to driving on the right side of the road), or rode on an exterior side seat. There was no seat in the front of the wagon as it was used for hauling.

I am sorry I can't post a picture. The Conestoga wagon's cover looks lower than the covered wagon we usually picture-long and low.

Nancy, I did think that is what you were thinking and Conestoga wagons were built to look like ships, hence the "Prairie Schooners."

Thanks for playing everyone! Off to look for Nancy's trivia question. Have a lovely Sunday.

Cynthia

Cool question, Cynthia. I didn't know that all covered wagons weren't Conestoga wagons -- thought it was just a generic term. Now I know, thanks to you.

TM

Just to add to this story a bit, apparently Prairie Scooners are totally different from Conastogas and not to be confused. Although both looked like ships from a distance Conestogas were used primarily in Penn and surrounding states for a short time as they were very heavy freight wagons and not suitable for moving pioneers and their families across long expanses of prairie. Most pioneers were lucky to have 2 horses let alone 4 or 6 needed to pull the Conastogas. Also, the shape of the Con. was specific to what they were used for. They were often made water proof (as possible) by tarring the insides and the cracks betweent the planks as they often had to cross rivers. Another reason the wheels were very broad too.

From what Dad has told me about stogies, the name stuck for any cheap cigar made of anything you could smoke as they were not tailor made. Hence the teamsters cigar was really a rollie! Same with on a real ship, or so Dad tells me.

One of the stories I have heard many times from Dad, Nancy. Sure wish he could tell you many more for your project! :)

Thanks for the fun Cynthia! :)

Ginny

You're right, Ginny. The prairie schooners were about half the size of a Conestoga wagon. However, both were sometimes waterproofed with tar. Also, oxen as well as horses were used to pull a Conestoga.

Cynthia, who needs to get busy on school work! Ugh.

Yes, they both were waterproofed, however, Conestogas were shaped different so they wouldn't tip so easily with their heavy loads. The Conestogas that the oxen pulled were obviously not in a hurry to get their shipment. :) Just an observation........hehe

Prairie Scooners were also called scooners because they were faster than the heavy Conestogas.

Back out to the garden for me. Snow will come soon enough. :(

Ginny