Joespider, it seems like a long time ago I read something here about Howdy and Magic Dawn... That Howdy was the correct name but it had been sold under the name MD also? Maybe someone that knows the whole story will chime in.

So, Magic Dawn and Howdy are both bi-colors, but
Magic Dawn is pink and Howdy is orange? I'm still
confused about this so if someone could explain a
little further, I'd like to know.

And Joe, you are suggesting that there are more than just
these three sets that have been mixed up? I guess
my concern is that I may be identifying my unknowns
incorrectly unless I make absolutely certain.

Joe,
You may remember I brought this topic up to the spider group some years ago. A gentleman from PA visited my garden when our club sponsored the Regional meeting in 2005. He saw MYNELLE'S STARFISH blooming and went on to tell the story of how this cultivar is the exact same cultivar as MORMON. He told quite a story about the hybridizer of MORMON being ill and giving it( as a seedling) to Mynelle Howard, who then registered it. These two cultivars are very similiar! I found it odd that both are registered at the same height ( 20") and both have very large blooms out of proportion to scape height - MS is registered at 10" and M is registered at 8.5". Clayton Burkey grew both and he said he had heard that story too, but that they weren't the same cultivars, although very similiar. I have always wondered, given the extreme simliarity between the two, if some have gotten these mixed up.

There are some plants that Oakes Daylilies sells, that I understand were registered as something else at one time. I bought May May and have read that Blooms of Bressingham may have renamed it, and May May is the same as Oake's Miss Amelia. There are others - Miss Victoria, which I have, and Lady Lucille, which I also have, are two more.

Linda

Two others that look very much a like and have been sold under the wrong name over the years are Orchid Corsage and Lilting Belle.

One of the biggest "Classic" mix ups is CLEO. It is supposed to be an orange self, but everything I have ever seen with the name CLEO on it is actually MISS JESSIE.

It's no wonder there is so much confusion. Seems to me that deliberately renaming a daylily that is registered by one name is irresponsbile and should be illegal. It's confusing enough trying to keep daylilies straight with 60,000 plus registered names. Linda, May May is a daylily registered with the AHS--and a great bloomer. None of the other names you mentioned are registered. I know lots of people don't care about registration and as long as someone knows the daylily isn't registered that's fine. There are some really nice daylilies that were never registered, but people should be informed before they buy.

I just looked up the description of Cleo in the AHS database online and it describes it as a ORL2-S-P. This means: Orange-Red, Light, 2 indicates the veins -S for spot or eyezone, and -P for Polychrome. But I've seen some places that are selling Cleo list it as a pink and yellow, or even yellow-lavender.

Not sure if these are certified AHS gardens or not... or even if it makes a difference. But if they are selling dls, one would think that they would care enough to make sure of what they are selling and check theirs against the dl "bible".

I have a lot to learn about the dl world, I know. This kind of thing will certainly make me double check my own purchases from now on.

By the way, does anyone have a picture of the real Cleo to share?

waitforspring, the purchase from Oakes where I bought Miss Victoria and Lady Lucille was very early in my "daylily growing life." I was buying from their website and didn't think or even know to look up registrations. Through the years, on various message boards, I read about the renaming of this particular group of daylilies that Oakes sells. I can say the Miss Victoria and Lady Lucille are great performers. MV starts blooming early and can bloom off and on until frost. I'd say she's a better plant than Stella. MV is taller than Stella, a clear, pretty, diamond dusted yellow that's fragrant. Lady Lucille is bright orange and a vigorous grower and bloomer. If LL is in bloom when I have visitors, they always want to know about her since she is so striking. It's a shame that these plants may not get the recognition they deserve because they've been renamed. It's confusing too!

Linda

Shoot! I have Cleo ordered for spring and I already have Miss Jessie in the garden. Am I really going to end up with another Miss Jessie? Tinker's lists Cleo at 4' and an evergreen - Miss Jessie at 3'4" and a dormant. Photos between the two are very similar though.

There's a fantastic story on the mix up of 'Catherine Neal' and 'Super Purple'. Jack Carpenter wrote a long explanation of the sequence of events that lead to the mixup but here's the reader's digest version as quoted from Jack's story...

"That next spring when I visited Jean's garden one morning and was looking at her lovely seedlings and the things she had brought back from Bob Dove's place in Pleasanton, I noticed my CATHERINE NEAL blooming among the things she brought back from Bob Dove's place. I asked Jean to come over to see the flower and asked her what flower that was to which she replied it is your CATHERINE NEAL. I asked her to see how it was marked and she read the sign label on it- it said SUPER PURPLE! She said the label came from Bob's place just as it was marked. She said that is not SUPER PURPLE! SUPER PURPLE is over here. She took me to another spot where she had some more of his things growing and there was another purple growing there labeled SUPER PURPLE just as it had come from Bob's place and it was not the same as my CATHERINE NEAL. What seems to be apparent from all of this is that two different lilies were marketed under the name SUPER PURPLE. Bob must have had a mix up in his garden is what I suspect."

Interesting stuff. Mistakes make great stories.

Ah, Cleo vs. Miss Jessie. I remember this one because when I posted photos of the dl in question, this very subject came up.

Here is my photo of Miss Jessie - I don't have Cleo.
{{gwi:678178}}

Well, it appears that I will either have both or 2 Miss Jessie's. I will plant them close together to make height/foliage comparisons and take photos as well, assuming Cleo blooms for me this summer...

Oh yes, I forgot to mention why it is Miss Jessie and NOT Cleo

-FORM
Miss Jessie is a spider/varient ratio 4:1
Cleo is not listed as a varient or spider
-COLOR
Miss Jessie is an orchid mauve and light yellow bicolor
Cleo is listed as ORL2-S-P: Meaning (as eluded to above) that the petals all should be (O)Orange (R)Red with a(L2)Light marking (S)Spot or band (P)Polychrome

If Cleo looked anything like the plant pictured, the color description would look something like: VRL/YWL3-H

(VRL) means Violet Red Light the / is an indication that the flower should be bicolored - the first color for the petals and the second listed color is the color of the sepals (YWL = Yellow White Light). 3 indicates a bicolor flower, and (H = Halo).

I just looked at Oakes website and there are several daylilies with names starting with Miss or Lady that don't list a hybridizer. Didn't check then all, but my guess is that those are some of the ones that aren't registered. One problem with these is that they can't be entered in a daylily show if anyone wanted to do that.

I have Miss Tinkerbell. The "Miss" and "Lady" series of unregistered daylilies are hybridized by Robert J. Roberson for Bressingham Gardens, an English company that has an outlet here in the US.

I've read by many who grow them that they are very garden worthy plants.

Oakes carries a number of them.

For the purpose of anything to do with AHS, including not only shows but also registration if they are used in hybridizing, they must be designated "seedling".

I'm not sure why the House of Bressingham has decided they don't want to work with the AHS registration process.

Thanks for adding to my info about the Bressingham plants, berrytea4me.

I will mention what you said about the "seedling" designation if the plant is used in hybridizing. I know someone who is using Miss Victoria right now in their hybridizing program and will tell them about it.

Linda