|
| Economic crisis that is... This stems from a light hearted conversation I had with a friend about what we would do (or grow) to sustain.
Some of the ideas were rabbits, chickens etc... but then crop discussion came up and things like malabar spinach, moringa tree, winged beans were mentioned. Again, this is all to be taken (semi) lightly, but what would you plant to survive if there were no available fertilizers and possibly no water except for hand pumped wells and rain...? |
Follow-Up Postings:
|
| Cannabis. |
|
- Posted by tony_k_orlando Z9 Fl (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 14:52
| heck with that, POPPIES. brugmansia and certain coleus and hopps. Some lettuce can grow real fast from seed to table providing it is not real hot out there. |
|
| Poppies have to be processed. Cannabis just needs to be dried. |
|
| Steven Solomon, founder of Territorial Seeds, has an interesting book on this subject--or at least that uses this subject as an excuse to write about his gardening theories. It's called "Gardening When it Counts." He categorizes vegetables according to input--collards being low, tomatoes medium, etc.--and their food values. Sweet potatoes in the South are very high on the list. He also stresses that vegetables grown at wide spacings don't need nearly as much irrigation/fertilizer as those grown in intensive beds. I'd grow Bill |
|
- Posted by wanna_run_faster 10 SoFLA /9 orl (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 15:01
| Or what about that Salvia that MsMarion mentioned???? I got a moringa tree from Chippi...it really sounds like a wonder tree. I'm definitely impressed with the moringa projects they have going in Africa. I don't know why they have done a similar project in Haiti! It's fast growing, easily replenished (if it does get burned for firewood), drought resistant and every single piece of the tree (roots, leaves, bark etc) is edible and highly nutritious! I've got mine ready so when gas hit's $5 this summer I can still eat. Anyone have any moringa recipes? |
|
- Posted by barbcoleus z10 SWFL (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 15:24
| A money tree. Why do I have to think of everything. |
|
- Posted by gcmastiffs z10 Florida (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 16:35
| We are already *in* a major crisis! Looked at the prices of produce lately? Avocados were $4.00 each today, Tomatos as high as $6 lb, peppers $5 lb, and cukes were $2 each! CRAZY! Had a $20 salad today, since my veggie garden is awaiting rebuilding and planting:(. Malabar Spinach is excellent for summertime greens, as is Chaya. I have 7 Moringa trees, planted in the driest, most inhospitable places in the yard, where nothing survives except Beautyberry, Wild Grapes and Palmettoes. Bananas are exceptional producers of delicious, healthy fruit, and they reproduce themselves. In the spring we have Peaches, Apples, Cherry of the Rio Grande, Plums, Mulberries, Blueberries, Starfruit, Papayas, Bananas and Muntingias. Summer is Figs, Grapes, Bananas, Jaboticaba, Sugar Apples, Atemoyas, Pomegranates, Pears, Avocados, Barbados Cherries, Mangos, Longans, Sapodillas, Jackfruit, Pineapples, Guavas, Blackberries and DragonFruits. Fall/Winter brings Citrus, Sapotes, Bananas, Persimmons, and Papayas. I'm sure I'm forgetting lots of plants... The goal is to be able to walk out into the yard and pick enough fresh fruit/veggies so we no longer have to rely on imported stuff from 3rd world countries. But, it is hard work, and it takes time to grow mature fruit trees. Lisa |
|
- Posted by naomilovesflipflops 9b FL (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 16:58
| Well if we are talking the easiest growing (fertilizer wise), most nutrient dense food- I'd go with Bill on the avocado and also add in a bunch of sunflowers. I heard once that sunflower seeds are the only edible food on the planet that contain every single nutrient the human body requires (vitamin C from sprouts, not seeds alone). But don't have any references to verify it! One of those "oh yeah, where did I read that?" Naomi |
|
| I'd have to go with Bill and Lisa. And, if I had room, I'd plant a neem tree and maybe some stevia if I couldn't manage a hive or two of honey bees. I have to admit that peanuts were one of the first things that came to mind. I'd build a "chicken tractor" and be doing some serious composting, water recycling and seed saving/swapping. I probably sound like an old back-to-the-land hippie, but then, I'm old enough to remember when my grandfather refused to have a tractor plow his little bit of land because they compacted the soil. Anyone have a good mule for sale? cora |
|
| Sweet potatoes would have to be close to top of the list. So tolerant of heat and range of conditions, and can produce some crop in most any soil. I havn't grown peanuts but I reckon they can produce a crop in poorish soil as well. I wonder why pecans aren't more common in fla? |
|
- Posted by countrynest z9 Summrfld,Fl (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 17:58
| Many of us are already have an edible yard with our fruit and nut trees.Honey from our bees and their wax for candle making. Foraging for food is an option that is available to those in the suburbs and country. wild Blackberries and other berries,air potatoes,wild persimons. Wild games such as squirrels. Felix |
|
- Posted by abendwolke 9 FL (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 18:18
| I'd grow broms and swap with you all for food :-)... no, really I would go for potatoes and have a few geese for the feathers (and a good roast), rabbits (yummy stew with the potatoes), chickens for the eggs and all kinds of chili peppers to spice it all up. Of course the usual, citrus trees, bananas, Mmulberries etc. that's growing already in the yard. :-) |
|
- Posted by gcmastiffs z10 Florida (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 18:50
| Pnbrown, Pecans can grow here, but do not fruit well in S. Florida because of lack of chill hours, and humidity which causes disease/fungal issues. Also, not too many people have room for a 60' tree. Squirrels are a huge problem here, for any nut tree. I have 2 Macadamia trees, and doubt I will every get to taste any. The squirrels strip them when still green. Pecans are a good choice for N. Florida according to EDIS. Naomi, Sunflowers are a great idea! They do well here. I see them in lots of local gardens I've never grown sweet potatoes because I thought they needed lots of room. How do you grow them when you have restricted fenced garden areas? I did grow red potatoes one year, and they worked out fine. But potatoes are still pretty cheap, so I opted to grow more costly stuff. Cabbage is another cheap veggie that takes up too much room for me to grow it anymore. Hmm, maybe I need to expand the darn gardens? Felix, squirrels, YES, fat/healthy from stealing my fruits and nuts, pan-fried squirrel sounds yummy! But how will I explain it to "Sis?" Lisa |
|
| Ok we can't eat the "air potato" but you can eat the sweet potato from the purple or green plants? I need to know before I get all into this. I would try to do my part by learning to like iquana meat. Maybe a side of muscovy duck l'orange. When I was at Gene Joyner's, his sister showed us that begonia flowers are edible.(but it would be hard to make that a meal) |
|
- Posted by tony_k_orlando Z9 Fl (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 21:08
| Sweet potatoes are a good idea but in order to have a lot of potatoes and less leaf growth, I found to NOT fertilize and plant them in the lousiest soil you have. I grew them two yrs and the second yr, it seems nematodes got into em and very many were mushy. All this talk has me thinking of growing some again, maybe some white potatoes too. Problem is the available areas are where the tomatoes were and the soil is quite built up and fertile so its probably not a smart place to plant em. This is a good topic! |
|
- Posted by the_musicman z9 FL (My Page) on Thu, Mar 20, 08 at 21:14
| * Posted by fawnridge * "Cannabis." Yes. Yes indeed. That's sustainability for you :) |
|
| I think sweet potatoes do need at least a tad of fertility. I just planted up my bed before leaving fla last week. I had to use whole tubers again because I didn't have the time to produce slips. This time I used the smallest and skinniest tubers, because big tubers produce way too many sprouts and they over-compete with each other and make mostly small potatoes. Tony, did you change beds from year to year? I think that's mighty important for nematode control, and also another reason to introduce some organic matter to the sweet-potato bed..... |
|
- Posted by karen_florida 9 (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 8:56
| If we had to produce everything we consumed, I'd scramble and scheme until I found a way to grow COFFEE beans here. If you guys are anything like me, you'd give me your last dang sweet potato or peanut to get your hands on my crop! :) |
|
- Posted by tony_k_orlando Z9 Fl (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 9:37
| pnbrown, I am guilty, I did NOT rotate the crop and you are probably so right about this being the reason. I had some some 10 gal totes I grew extra in and I found the sandiest soil was best and even hay was real good too. When I provided even the smallest shot of fert the top growth went out of control for me. I am talking some 20 ft of greens in all directions from one slip. |
|
- Posted by gcmastiffs z10 Florida (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 10:13
| Karen Florida, Arabica Coffee grows fine here. Treefrog has a lovely one that produces LOTS of beans. I have 2 Coffee plants, but mine have not produced enough to be worth the trouble of processing/roasting the beans. They sure are pretty plants as well. Lisa |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 10:24
| Castorp, I just finished reading that book "Gardening When It Counts". I hate the guys "tone" but there was some really good information in it. I read somewhere that in a survival situation, plant potatoes (sweet & Irish) for calories to fill you up and greens for nutrition. Corn is a hungry feeder and will use a lot of N, plant potatoes after corn in your crop rotation. (B.T.W. according to Tom MacCubbin's book, you can plant corn in March! ; ) ) |
|
- Posted by solstice98 9b Orlando (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 11:30
| Well, first I would get rid of all the grass in my yard - I don't mean Ricky's version (*) - but all the lawn grass would have to go. Sunflowers, sweet potatos (maybe in sandy mounds?), peanuts, cukes and lettuce (too expensive at the store!), and any greens that would grow well. I've already got the citrus and bananas. I would find something in my yard that Tony K wanted and trade that with him for tomatoes. Of course I have plenty of squirrels to harvest! I wouldn't eat the fish that come out of the golf course pond behind the house (too many chemicals from run off!) but I wonder if they would be a good suppliment for the dogs and cats? Maybe too many chemicals for them too. Has anybody ever eaten Ibis? I'm guessing they would be tough and muddy tasting, but might be worth a try. I know where there's a large flock of turkeys, too. *What was the old line? "Dope will get you through times of no money better than money will get you through times of no dope." And speaking of favorite old hippy quotes: |
|
| Ah... Hunter. |
|
- Posted by teka2rjleffel z10FL (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 12:06
| I'd be going to Karen for my coffee. She would make a mint on her crop. Of course I'd have to go raid Barb's yard and grab some cash from her money tree before I got my coffee fix from Karen. Nancy |
|
| I planted corn in late feb, came up fine and survived a couple of light frosts, too. |
|
- Posted by ladybarber101 9a (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 13:47
| I Have been thinking on this one for awhile now so here it goes.. I need a nanny goat for milk, squirrel sandwiches, turtle /rabbit stew, chickens of course... To grow I need to figure out morel mushrooms...Ummm Yummy Happy Gardening Everyone ! |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 14:27
| pnbrown, I wish I could have planted my corn that early. I am a little late (as usual) in getting my garden ready. I've had a small garden since I moved into my house, but this year I decided to make it a LOT bigger. I've been working on it for a couple of weekends now. It's roughly 13' X 50'. I've dug out sod (no RoundUp), added a couple loads of spent mushroom compost and tilled until I could no longer feel my hands. LOL I plan on finishing raking and forming raised beds tonight after work. I'm debating, should I wait a week to see if any remain sod comes back up and weed seed germinate before planting........or get everything in the ground this weekend. hmmmmm.......any suggestions? |
|
| --following this thread for several days now, has reminded me that my grandfather once told me they had 9/10ths of an acre. That seemed like a LOT to me because besides the house (and at one time the outhouse!)there was a roomy barn for the draft horse, the chickens and a coal bin, also a pig pen and house for a sow and piglets. The back yard had a Golden delicious apple tree and a black walnut tree. Every year, grandpa planted, sweet corn, pop corn, tomatoes, potatoes, red beets, turnips, carrots, salsify, cucumbers and cabbage. The rhubarb came back every year with little or no help. Mom and grandma canned like crazy most of the summer and apples and potatoes went into bins in the cellar along with all those jars of good applesauce and pickles. The turnips were buried in a straw lined pit at the edge of the garden for easy access during the winter. Several years ago, I went back to Ohio and nothing of the old place was left standing - even the cellar had been filled in. It looked so SMALL. It was hard to believe those two grew so much on that little nine-tenths of an acre. |
|
- Posted by barbcoleus z10 SWFL (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 17:01
| I also thought I might be able to get sheep. I could have them trimmed to look like poodles since we're not allowed sheep in our little 'burb. |
|
- Posted by jupiterplants 10/A (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 17:55
| I'm with Evelyn on the rabbit....... My grandpa raised them for food. I did not mind watching them get butchered when I was a kid. but now...... ?????? Okay I will grow them and someone else can conk them on the head and gut em ! D`Ann |
|
| Shrimp plant..........yumm! |
|
- Posted by solstice98 9b Orlando (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 22:07
| ...I could have them trimmed to look like poodles... A perfect example of why I love the Florida forum! |
|
- Posted by countrynest z9 Summrfld,Fl (My Page) on Fri, Mar 21, 08 at 23:43
| coffeemom, with all respect,I disagree with your statement of air potatoes. I eat them and so does my 15 year old and my 90 year old mother and all my relatives. My wife only likes them fried as chips. I like mine boiled. I also eat tomatoes, eggplants and other crops that once was believed to be erroneously poisonous. I am alive :-) as you can see this post as a testament to my statement. Felix |
|
- Posted by treefrog_fl z10 FL (My Page) on Sat, Mar 22, 08 at 0:32
| Solstice, you mentioned ibis? AKA "Chokoluskee Chicken"! Sounds good if needed. And there are plenty of doves so far. And mullet. Around here known as Indian River Chicken to some old timers. They have gizzards didja know. Excellent smoked. Snook, originally called soapfish, are plentiful in my area too. I'll aways grow some tomatoes obviously. Easy to dry or process into sauce and grow much of the year. They really liven up a dish. I'd have to get some chickens, town ordinances be damned. Collards and mustard, malabar spinach, chaya, oriental greens in the cool season, and some chile peppers. Lots of herbs. Fawnridge, I'll come by with some mulberry wine and carambola whisky to share with you! But I'm not waiting 21 years for it to age! Oh yeah, no gas! Where is that dang mule hiding?
|
|
| What an informative thread, I cut and pasted the entire thing and printed it out for future reference...Ricky, you crack me up, no wonder your swaps are so well attended... :) Lisa, we are all coming to your place for a tour/workshop! Treefrog, I remember catching "soapfish" in the Jupiter inlet so big you could put a soccer ball in it's mouth!! Those were the days... List of things to research: scott |
|
- Posted by solstice98 9b Orlando (My Page) on Sat, Mar 22, 08 at 18:56
| Bee hive - I hadn't thought of that. Good idea! And the mule. And the rabbits. |
|
- Posted by junkyardgirl (My Page) on Sat, Mar 22, 08 at 22:15
| anything that would grow without fertilizer. I already have all my fruit trees, and some tropical edibles. Other than that, I'm thinking the three sisters; corn,beans, and squash. |
|
- Posted by treefrog_fl z10 FL (My Page) on Sat, Mar 22, 08 at 22:22
| Floridays, the soapfish are still there. And huge as they ever were! I like 'em a little smaller though. They got that name because if you didn't fillet them and get the skin off they had a soapy taste when you cooked them. Once filleted they're a wonderful white, flaky, mild fish. |
|
| Don't forget pigeon peas. They grow without much attention in s Fl. You can eat them green or ignore them and they will dry out and hang on the bush a long time. In a major crisis I would plant them on every vacant lot around me. |
|
| I planted a few and they were just up when I left. I reckon they taste a lot better fresh than canned? |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Sun, Mar 23, 08 at 12:41
| Sumala said: In a major crisis I would plant them on every vacant lot around me. I think we have a guerilla gardener in our mist......... |
|
| I found this thread very interesting. Not strangely, I believe the time to be self sustaining will be upon us sooner than most people think. We have 7 acres to work with. Our ultimate goal is to have a couple of Dexter cows for milk and meat, a few pigs to help till the land and provide meat, a couple of goats for milk and meat, chickens for fertilizer, bug control, eggs and meat, rabbits for meat and fertilizer, and a couple of bee hives. With all those animals, they will have to be fed. Moringa is an excellent plant for livestock as well as humans, bamboo also provides good fodder also the "dreaded" kudzu vine. I just read a very interesting study on duckweed. I posted a link. A large pond for fish, turtles and the occasional alligator. Bananas, citrus and other tropical fruit would be a must. I'd have lots of herbs for health and seasoning and many of the other greens and roots mentioned in earlier posts. When we bought the land, it seemed SOO big, but as we plan, it seems to shrink at an alarming rate. Regardless of the food items, I still want my tropical garden. Now that will be food for the soul. Jo |
Here is a link that might be useful: duckweed
|
| pnbrown, I have never ate a pigeon pea that I liked but I like their hardiness and their on plant storage system. I also like the fact the plants will live 5 to 6 years or more and will reseed themselves. They are drought tolerant but don't like cold and will grow in almost any soil. I bet I could learn to love their taste if I was hungry enough :) new2, lets hope the worst case scenario we may ever have to face is the "guerilla gardener". A guerilla "food" gardener is or might be a scary thought. Lets hope we never go there. |
|
| I was thinking about a Dexter milk cow also. Seems like a good breed for a household, but I was surprised to learn that they can thrive in such a hot climate, being kind of a shaggy breed. Of course the great thing is being able to keep them on green forage all year round. Those of us short on pasture could irrigate the bahia during the dry season. |
|
| pnbrown, there a a number of dexters here in FL. They seem to do OK.Jo |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 8:02
| sumala, a guerilla gardener is one who plants on vacant land that does not belong to them and without permission. It is a whole movement. People go around planting edibles on vacant lots an in parks and such. I guess it it mostly practiced by young adult apartment dwellers. Google it! |
|
| My garden is just getting started this year and will have a range of high vitamin vegs and a few luxury items such as cantaloupe. I agree that the time is already here to plant survival food and try to live off your garden as much as possible. The cost of vegetables and fruit has gone through the roof in the last year. The one thing I am missing is a high quality protein source- good free range eggs. Since I have just a standard suburban lot, there isn't room for bees, geese and rabbits (I can't kill them anyway). I am thinking about getting a hen and calling her a minipoodle or yorkie. Maybe harness a small tapedeck to her back with a recording of "YIP! Yip! Yip!" to cover the sound of her clucks. With just a single hen, I might convince the Homeowners' Association that she is a pet and not livestock, in the event someone looks over the fence to check out the clucking little yipper. Kate |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 11:15
| Animals aren't the only source of protein. What about growing something like edamame (soy beans). I believe that they are a complete protein and greens like collards have calcium. |
|
| If you raise rabbits you'd not only have a food source but a good source for manure. Chickasaw plum trees are a good native tree that requires no care and can produce lots of fruit. I have several and the big one looks like it's going to be loaded with fruit this year. Some other native fruit trees and plants that I don't think have been mentioned and don't require any care are crabapple trees, pawpaw trees, and shiny bleberry bushes. I've also read that cannas are completely edible, everything from their rhyzomes to the leaves and flowers. I'm not sure how you'd prepare them though! lol Currently, I'm growing potatoes, pineapples (4 of which are currently going into bloom), garlic, all kinds of herbs, and will be planting a bunch of sunflowers soon. Mom, next door, is getting her veggie garden cleaned up and ready to be planted now. She usually grows tomatoes, peppers, collards, brocolli, cucumbers, pole beans, egg plant, and squash. She also has lots of raspberry plants! We've talked about plowing up the area around the chicken pen and planting corn but first we'd have to take down a tree. |
|
| I keep meaning to plant a couple chickasaw plum trees - next year perhaps I'll remember. I think we have a volunteer southern crabapple in the citrus orchard. |
|
- Posted by naplesgardener Naples FL (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 12:56
| I have such a small yard that I'd really have to think hard on how best to maximize the use for food from the garden (crisis or not). Has anyone ever seen a cost analysis of an individual gardens production per square foot? For example, based on grocery prices should I grow pineapples or tomatoes in a given space? I would definitely grow basil, dill, rosemary and other spices. I'd love to find out what the square foot cost of veggies/fruits are to grow. Any suggestions? |
|
| I love this discussion! I've been trying to figure out edibles and this has a lot of things beyond all the cucurbits that I have had little luck with. Currently I have tomatoes and various beans, as well as herbs, and in the fruit dept-- mulberries, blackberries, and two tiny citrus trees. In a crisis, I would be relieved to have a chance to hunt down those stupid muscovy ducks. I know that might offend some, but they're non-native and quite offensive on their own. And all the gourmet cooks say they are delicious! I want to plant peanuts as it is; I never see plants. Any notes on how I could start this? The extension didn't have much info. Shelbey |
|
- Posted by gcmastiffs z10 Florida (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 14:13
| Shelbey, peanuts are easy! The local squirrels plant them all over my property. They grow fine in pots or in the lawn(G). All you need are some squirrel nuts(G). (raw peanuts, in the shells). Lisa |
|
- Posted by new2gardenfl Z9 CentralFL (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 15:58
| Amaranth grows well in Florida. There is the kind for leafy vegetables and the grain kind. If you grow the grain kind, you can eat the young tender leaves in salad or cooked like spinach, then later harvest the grain. I haven't grown it yet, but am going to try it this summer. I'm not sure when the best time of year is, but they are supposed to like it hot. I imagine you would want to time it so that the grain isn't ready during the rainy season. I imagine it might get moldy, but I don't have any experience growing it. Maybe, us folks living in HOA land could trade grain for eggs. Has anyone else grown grain amaranth? Please share your experiences! |
|
| New, I grew grain amaranth last year (in Mass):
Florida it isn't, here, but nevertheless summer is hot and humid for a good while. I harvested the grain later when it was less humid. It's a fair amount of labor for not a lot of seed, but the stuff basically grows itself. No pests, no trouble, huge plants as you can see. It self-sows like mad, so I expect to be seeing a lot of it in a few months. |
|
- Posted by an_ill-mannered_ache 9a (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 21:42
| i grew some, from ECHO. did great. tasted like a slightly nutty, very mild spinach. good stuff. they say it's very sensitive to nematodes. |
|
| FRUIT-grapes, bananas, and any berries I am am learning to grow. Tomatoes, always, potatoes would go a long way. I figure if we are desperate there aren't going to be any ordinances against having cattle and barnyard animals. I would buy a cow and a steer(to reproduce) cow = milk and maure. Slaughter the cow only after she could produce another female to carry out the reproduction process and provide milk. Chickens, of course = Eggs, food and manure. Sell the extra manures on EBay so I could afford gas to drive to Ricky's, enjoy some of his Cannabis, get the munchies and eat all HIS food before coming home! |
|
- Posted by treefrog_fl z10 FL (My Page) on Mon, Mar 24, 08 at 23:19
| I'm with you Sumala. Pigeon peas everywhere! Perennial tree-like plants that grow in the poorest soil, and are so generous. May want to tuck a few of those little cannabis seeds on those vacant lots too. NIMBY though! |
|
- Posted by solstice98 9b Orlando (My Page) on Tue, Mar 25, 08 at 6:57
| Cindee, I hate to tell you this but if you are looking for reproduction with "...a cow and a steer...", you'll be waiting a REALLY long time. Might want to try a bull instead! I like the plan to sell the manure on E Bay and then drive to Ricky's though! Kate |
|
| Rocky mountain oysters,Cindee? |
|
| Very interesting thread I would love to have chickens for fresh eggs, a milk cow and more tropical fruit For veggies, I am shipping my parents from Belarus here! My Dad is an agricultural engineer, and on 1/5 of an acre, in approximately 4 months of warm weather he grows enough fruit and veggies to feed him and Mom all year long. Mom makes super yummy wine and pickles!
Olya |
|
- Posted by treefrog_fl z10 FL (My Page) on Tue, Mar 25, 08 at 12:26
| Oooooh, currants! I haven't seen them since I was a kid in New England. It's amazing how lush and productive those northern climates can be during their few warm months. Is it the soil, longer daylight hours, more industrious gardeners (naw that's not it)? Would love to meet your parents, Olya. They remind me of my grandparents, where I spent my early years. Every square inch of the yard was both productive and beautiful. And nothing was ever wasted. |
|
| coffeemom - my e-mail to you with the invite bounced back. |
|
| OOOPS, Solstice-been off the farm too long.........OK Some one Gimme bull to survive! Oysters, YUK, Kristi. I will still go to Ricky's, by way of Olyas...look at her produce. She could feed us all! |
|
| I don't think your plan will work, Olya. Not confident your dad's expertise/experience will have prepared him for Florida. :-) |
|
| Treefrog, yup, these are currants! My last name, Smorodinova, actually means currants :) Lakeron, naaah, I think my Dad can adjust ;-) His specialty is soil - he even worked in Africa for 3 years! And for fun, he does grafting :) All the fruit trees in the garden that are grafted - he grafted :) Olya |
|
- Posted by an_ill-mannered_ache 9a (My Page) on Fri, Mar 28, 08 at 20:44
i've been meaning to post this pic from ECHO's farm day a few weeks ago... ECHO does a very cool wick garden... ultra low inputs. nothin' fancy:  Instead, they use old bits of fabric (nylon, presumably -- it wouldn't rot) and discarded rubber and plastic mats. A bucket with a three-eights inch hole drilled into the lid (above) is filled with compost and manure "tea".  The bucket is inverted, and the fertilizer solution flows out. When the carpet/mat becomes saturated it creates a vacuum that seals the hole and the water flow ceases. Evaporation and absorption lowers the water level, the vacuum is broken, the solution flows out...
Circle of life, un-Disney-fied. The chickens in the coop are fed a mix of grains and greens. The greens grow on top of the coop (same wick garden set-up -- you can see a bucket peeking out of the upper-right-hand corner). The greens and wick garden keep the coop cool. The chicken waste drops through to the pavement below, then goes into the barrel of manure tea. The tea goes into the wick garden. The greens go into the chickens... Out comes the poop and the whole thing starts again. Ultra low inputs (just some grain), ulta low space requirements, and you get three "crops" (collards, eggs, and meat) from one set-up. Very smart. |
|
| In preparation and because it is fun, I have been saving seeds from store produce - tomatoes, melons, cucumbers, squash etc. I grew tomatoes from those seeds this year and they are doing great. You never know what you'll get. Maybe not as many tomatoes as regular seeds but very good. I also tried germinating dried beans and lentils last year. They came up but weren't in a good location so died out. No luck on the cucumber seeds so far. I am a country girl at heart in HOA land - I would love chickens. Ill-mannered, What a cool coop with vegetables on top! I hope it doesn't come to that, but if things get bad enough the HOA's will probably be lax on their rules. Of course by then a chicken and rooster would probably cost an arm and a leg. I would think hopefully there would be alot of victory gardens in public areas, easements, etc. It seems ashame to waste the areas when we could grow some of our own food. I like the peanut idea. I am going to look for raw peanuts to grow. I don't know about pigeon peas. Here is a link to thread on them: |
Here is a link that might be useful: Pigeon peas
|
- Posted by treefrog_fl z10 FL (My Page) on Fri, Mar 28, 08 at 23:52
| I have to try that irrigation, fertilizing system Ill. I hear it works well for cucumbers and squash too. I've never been able to grow beets or swiss chard here. We might learn a lot about gardening during a crisis by looking at Cuba after the collapse of the Soviet Union. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/280951_focus13.html http://www.harpers.org/archive/2005/04/0080501 |
|
| Thanks for those great links treefrog! |
|
| That chicken/collard contraption is astounding - hard to believe that the collards could be so lush and thriving in what looks like a little bit of straw and no soil. Very cool. And handily beats the nematode problem. BTW, did anybody know that rice is a significant crop in south florida? I didn't, and I spent a lot of time in the major rice-growing county - palm beach. I wonder if a dry-land variety could be grown farther north. Did they have rice at ECHO? Seems like it would fit their scheme perfectly...... |
|
- Posted by an_ill-mannered_ache 9a (My Page) on Sat, Mar 29, 08 at 8:05
| they had a couple of cool rice paddies -- one flooded, one dry-land technique... |
Here is a link that might be useful: rice at ECHO
|
- Posted by an_ill-mannered_ache 9a (My Page) on Sat, Mar 29, 08 at 8:39
| treefrog, we don't have to look as far as cuba (tho those were some really interesting articles) -- detroit's already entered into the post-apocalyptic age... http://www.harpers.org/archive/2007/07/0081594 (it's a fabulous article, but i'm not sure non-subscribers can read it...) |
|
- Posted by naplesgardener Naples FL (My Page) on Sat, Mar 29, 08 at 8:41
| treefrog a second thanks for the articles. you are better than Mother Earth News. (How do you find them?) Now how do I put some of those Cuban organic strategies to work in my yard which I have tried to make organic? I am especially interested in their whitefly control since being infested last year. Cuban farmers have so much knowledge learned the hard way. Most information given out in the US tries to steer me toward pesticides, probably because there is more money in selling that product. Some of the organic solutions I've tried don't really work that well, or maybe I'm too impatient. I'll read the articles again, print them out and highlight specific cures. Please post anything new you find, it's good news to share. Denise |
|
| My goodness, yet another project for my long-term list: growing dryland rice in central fla (it's my favorite grain, and if supplies get more precarious in the future - has anybody been tracking the developing global rice shortage? - growing my own could be necessary). I'm starting to wonder if I'll live long enough to do half of that list...... Thanks for the rice photos, Ill. |
|
| Its a b****h being a vegetarian. I am not a vegan however so I produce lots of eggs, goat milk, yoghurt and cheese. Also have 25 big old pecans. I am working with moringa and chaya now and as well as regular veggies and fruit, I grow coffee, tea and cocoa. I love growing the exotics. I use solar heated greenhouses. The best thing about living in North Florida is having real grass. It is so important for the goats and other livestock. Also being able to grow all those great winter greens (which I hate but are good for the livestock) |
|
| new to the forum, i do some what agree we need to start being responsible for our selfstarted last year clearing out the overgrowth, planted a garden 30 x5 , planted 2 mango trees glenn, pickering, 2 peach trees, avacado, star fruit, pomagranates what else will grow during the dog days of summer in extreme soth fla. |
|
- Posted by flyingfish2 9b w stuart (My Page) on Mon, Apr 18, 11 at 20:26
| Wow, we are really getting serious with survival gardening ideas. Treefrog, thanks for the cuban articles, I really enjoyed them. One thing folks have not mentioned is heat for cooking. Has anyone built a solar cooker? Another thing is that folks talk about rabbits, but from what I read, young domestic rabbit breeds can not tolerate green stuff but need rabbit pellets, will they be available?? Aquaponics seems like a good direction, but once again, it needs fish food for input. I have a 5000 watt PV system, but will need another type inverter if the grid is down. Keep saying I'm going to change it out, but haven't :>( bernie |
|
| Your existing system is grid-tied? |
|
| I plan on only two things. Growing corn and having a still. I'll barter moonshine for food. Seriously, I'd add a wood stove for cooking and whatever heat might be needed in FL. I remember from my childhood seeing my grandmother cooking on one in rural Alabama, in a tin-roofed farmhouse with only a Warm Morning stove for heat. |
|
| solar power is expensive and battery storage inverter takes up a lot of room, i like the still idea,. i do not think we could go back to our grand fathers way of living . but i do belive there are rougher times ahead. higher gas means higher food bills in a already tough economy, permaculture is a state of mind, you do not need to grow everything neighbors helping each other is how we will survive. but food is a issue |
|
| Richard, do you have experience growing maize for grain in south florida? I suspect not, and that there will be serious difficulties due to several factors at least. That aside, there could hardly be a less sensible use of the resources required to make a corn crop than to use it to make alcohol which then reduces the health and productivity of humans. What a great plan for a situation that would by definition be precarious. |
|
- Posted by flyingfish2 9b w stuart (My Page) on Tue, Apr 19, 11 at 8:02
| PNBrown, yep , I'm grid tied and have net-metering with FPL. They credit me with kwh's on months that I generate excess the next month. Florida paid me $20k and I got a $2k tax credit. Did it in 2008 and the system has made up the difference in electric cost since Aug 2008. |
|
| So the problems with grid-tie as a useful off-grid situation is the emergency disconnect required by FPL and the fact that you don't have a separate 12v household wiring system. Presumably you could have a 5000 watt inverter(!) - imagine the cost - and have an entirely separate connection to your household AC system, if you could persuade FPL that it was safe for their grid repair needs. Not likely. Not to mention that would be the most wasteful way to use the current. Cheaper to install a limited 12v DC wiring system. Buy an old rv and you'd have all the appliances and light fixtures. |
|
- Posted by writersblock (My Page) on Tue, Apr 19, 11 at 11:37
| > Growing corn and having a still. I'll barter moonshine for food. I think you'd need a lot of sugar cane and a cane mill, too, at least based on the descriptions of 'shining in Marjorie Rawlings's books. This is a fascinating thread. |
|
- Posted by flyingfish2 9b w stuart (My Page) on Tue, Apr 19, 11 at 11:39
| A 5kw xantrax inverter that can run grid, battery, or generator is the same price as the PV4800. No difference IMHO whether I disconnect the grid and run on a whole house generator or run with the xantrax battery plus PV's. Currently the whole neighborhood runs generators to the house grid when FPL is "off line". Everyone is well aware of unplugging the grid line before turning these systems on. Some are automatic, mine is manual. |
|
| Good grief, PN, lighten up. That was meant to be funny. |
|
| Okey-doke, Richard. I get a little worked up over wastage of good tortilla corn. |
|
- Posted by gardencraze 9b winter garden FL (cmcginnis3@cfl.rr.com) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 6:08
| I all the planting and growing food and energy and animals and canabis and moonshine and electric grids and allllll that.... Do not forget to to move in some family members and get your weapons ready, cuz somebody is goin to have to protect your family and your crops 24/7 from the masses that have not or will not plan for what is coming. |
|
- Posted by gardencraze 9b winter garden FL (cmcginnis3@cfl.rr.com) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 7:06
| bump |
|
- Posted by gardencraze 9b winter garden FL (cmcginnis3@cfl.rr.com) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 8:48
| bump |
|
- Posted by loufloralcityz9 Z 9 (My Page) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 9:08
| Does anybody have seeds for any 'man eating plants' like Triffids or Audry? Lou |
|
- Posted by gardencraze 9b winter garden FL (cmcginnis3@cfl.rr.com) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 11:11
| LOL....Lou I like that!!!!!!!(still lauphing!!!!) If you find any of those man eating plants will you please share with me LOL |
|
- Posted by billbrandi 9 (My Page) on Sun, May 1, 11 at 11:27
| Perhaps in a crisis okra and beets would be outlawed. One can only hope. And, Lou, your reference to the movie "Day of the Triffids" brings back some memories. Not only could plants kill people, they got up and chased them. Maybe I could grow Soylent Green? Got some neighbors looking a little plump and ready to pick. Get Charlton Heston to help me. |
|
- Posted by Silas(silas150@hotmail.com) onThu, Jun 2, 11 at 16:29
| Interesting discussion. Reading what others have said set me to thinking. It seems it would be best to consider growing foods that give high yield with not a lot of effort and they have to be foods that I like! I would definitely do sweet potatoes and some kind of bean. But what foods can you grow without the use of pesticides in Florida? I would use onions, garlic and herbs to help keep some of the bugs away. I've read also that some insects don't like marigolds. I'd have to research more on using plants to protect other plants from bugs. Of course, citrus fruits, mangoes and bananas. I read recently about a peach tree that has been developed to grow in Florida. Tomatoes, squash, peanuts. I like the idea of chickens for fresh eggs, but I couldn't slaughter them myself. (Yeah, I'm a wimp.) And a dairy cow would be useful too. But if things got really bad and you couldn't get butter or vegetable oils, I guess olives would be nice.I have no idea how many trees you'd need to be able to press enough oil to make it worth while and if you've got olives,capers would be nice too. I would really have to try growing coffee. |
|
- Posted by writersblock 9/10 (My Page) on Thu, Jun 2, 11 at 18:39
| >And a dairy cow would be useful too. While I'd rather have a nice amiable Mistress Moolly for a lot of reasons, it seems to me that for many people a goat or two would probably be more practical, especially if you don't run to acreage. :) |
Please Note: Only registered members are able to post messages to this forum. If you are a member, please log in. If you aren't yet a member, join now!
Return to the Florida Gardening Forum
Instructions
- You must be a registered member and logged in to post messages on our forums.
- Posting is a two-step process. Once you have composed your message, you will be taken to the preview page. You will then have a chance to review the contents and make changes.
- After posting your message, you may need to refresh the forum page in order to see it.
- It is illegal to post copyrighted material without the owner's consent.
- HTML codes are allowed in the message field only.
- No advertising is allowed in any of the forums.
- If you would like to practice posting or uploading photos, please visit our Test forum.
- If you need assistance, please Contact Us and we will be happy to help.