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Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Posted by brute Florida 9B (My Page) on
Wed, Aug 10, 11 at 14:01

What with the Stock Market, Defecit ceiling, urban riots, etc., maybe it's a good time to start.
I started taking "survival" steps years ago. Now, I'm thinking of building a solar-powered food dehydrator. A couple of years ago I saw one at Echo Farm's annual Farm Day event and never forgot it.
I wonder if Florida's humidity would defeat a solar-powered food dehydrator?


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Knowing Florida's humidity, it could probably defeat a NUCLEAR powered food dehydrator - but what the heck, give it a shot!


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Florida's humidity is very low for 4-5 months per year, yet the sun is bright. It's also the time when typical produce is coming in.

Regarding survival gardening, it takes years to get operational in any major way. Not to be left late.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

I worked on my yard for 10 years, and could have probably survived on it if I had homesteaded like I wanted to. Life interferes with the best laid plans, though. I had all my fruit trees in place, and I had been amending the soil for years. All I needed was to set up the veggie gardens.

I'm seriously thinking of giving up veggie gardening altogether. It's really nice not to have to tend a garden right now. I could get used to this. I can still garden. I have space, but no sun, so it would all be ornamental. I'm sort of burned out on growing my own food, but if I had to, I sure know how!


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I've learned in my later years that successful farming takes lots of stamina, could have done it in my 20's and 30's but didn't have the land, now I've got the land and not the physical or financial resources. So I've decided to find out where Silvia and Lou lives and camp out at their places when it does hit the fan! The only other choice is to find out what's edible on my 5 acres of woods and weeds.


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I have been experimenting with low-input staple food production for a long time, in MA and in FL.

Everywhere, the first critical factor is controlling animals. This fall I am going to break down and install a ten-foot high deer fence on an acre. In florida I will do 8-foot high fence around much smaller areas. A big advantage to suburbs and urbs is that animals are little or no problem.

Next is concentrating on the right crops. leafy greens are easy and incidental, many can be established as self-perpetuators, those are the ones to use. No effort. Greens and fruit are good and necessary, but are not starvation hedges. Tubers and legumes are the easiest way to produce quality carb and protein. In florida the tuber of choice is sweet potato. If one is serious about survival, don't waste any time nor space on irish potatoes - without trucks or ships and electricity they are not viable in florida. Don't waste any time nor space on maize, florida soil will not sustain it. In florida survival, forget about grain.

Must stockpile minerals. N is not required, don't waste money on it.


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I have been growing fruit and veggies for years now. Nothing better tasting than something you nurtured. I have aproimately 50 varieties of fruit. What edibles do you grow? A year ago I got 3 chickens so we have fresh eggs and the best fertilizer.

What is the solar powered dehydrator like? I have been to echo many times but never saw that. I dehydrate a lot of fruit so this is of interest to me. I would like to build one of those earth ovens but I am not much of a builder.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

  • Posted by brute Florida 9B (My Page) on
    Thu, Aug 11, 11 at 10:14

Keiki, the one I saw was sort of a cabinet with several shelves, each made of a stainless wire screen. At the bottom was a part sticking out that served as a "collector". This was covered with a pane of glass so the sun's heat was trapped and rose up through the cabinet, past the shelves. The entire thing was painted black.
As soon as I can find good plans for it, I'll get started. Just plywood, glass, insect screen, and wire for the shelves seem to be most of what's required.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

pnbrown,

I have to differ with you on your assessment of Florida and grains. Florida is a prime area for growing rice. I planted 'sticky rice' as a test. I planted approximately 25 to 50 seeds (a fairly level teaspoon) and my return was approximately a quart of harvested rice. As I trimmed off the ripe heads of grains the rice plant would put up another head of grain. Every week or two I would go cut more ripe golden heads of grain and this lasted all through the summer. There was absolutely no maintenance of the plants required. If anybody has a wet boggy area I suggest a small planting of rice in that area as a test. As everybody knows, rice has been a staple food of the Orient for ages past and could be an excellent survival grain. For those people living in dry areas a child's wading pool or rubber maid tubs could be used.

I'm presently experimenting with other types of grains that will do well in Florida.

Lou


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pnbrown said "A big advantage to suburbs and urbs is that animals are little or no problem.". Tell that to the squirrels, racoons and opposums that freely roam my subdivision. Ha! LOL

Moo (Lou), where did you get your rice seeds? My subdivision has terrible drainage and my backyard is a mud pit all summer long! I'll have to try rice next summer!

Has anyone tried sesame seeds. They are supposed to grow well in heat and humidity as well.


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new2gardenfl,

My rice seed was purchased on eBay and came from Bangkok, Thailand. You also may be able to get them locally at an oriental foods market. If you search online make sure you specify organic whole rice seed.
NOTE:
Many seeds when hulled will not sprout because they are subjected to a low heat to crack the hulls.

Lou


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

That's interesting, Lou. For those with low wet areas.

However, if what we are talking about here is survival in disrupted conditions, then it has to be crops that are near-certain to produce a good return for the least labor. For most parts of central florida probably that won't include rice. As an educated guess.

I think it will be down to tubers, legumes, berries and tree crops.


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I have been reading and writing about tropical vegetables for a few years, and I have some that I would grow if I had to have a survival garden:

Amaranth - leaf and grain types. They will grow through he!! and high water, and are a great survival food. Grain amaranth was one of the foods the Native Americans taught the settlers to grow and eat.

Edible hibiscus - Well, it's hibiscus, so it's terribly easy to grow down here, almost invasive in some cases. With the leaves, flowers and fruits that can be used to eat and make a drink from, they are a great suvival food.

Tropical root crops. Eddoe, malanga, even edible dioscorea alata will survive just about anything you throw at them, and many have edible leaves and tubers.

Edible gingers - common ginger, cardamom, turmeric all are edible and medicinal.

Sorghum or broomcorn - the grain can be used like oats, and the entire plant can be crushed and made into syrup. Grows much better than real corn down here.

Southern peas - great protein source that will grow well in our summer weather.

Luffa - well, you have to have something to clean and strain things with, right? They are edible when small as well.

And the shocker....Daylilies. Grow like weeds and ALL parts are edible and tasty too!

There is more, but those are the main ones.


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Thanks for the information Lou. How large of an area did you plant?

Nancy


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Nancy,
As a test I planted the rice in a tub approximately 2'Wide by 4'Long with spent mucky potting soil that was used previously for growing my veggies. The sides of the tub is around a foot and a half high and half that height was filled with the muck. I kept the muck covered with water around 2" to 4" deep after the directly sowed seeds sprouted. I even had some small lily pads sprout and grow in the tub which I didn't disturb by weeding them out.
I plan to terrace my hill area with the rice as it is now a wasted 2 to 3 acres of my land because of the slope.

DG, Thank you for your list of plants that are easy to grow in Fla for survival purposes. Is there any way I can entice you to list the 'there is more' plants? I have ten acres and would like to plant the easy to grow edible type of survival plants that are not readily apparent to the untrained eye as a food crop. Thanks in advance.

Lou


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Lou/Moo - check out Deane Green at eattheweeds.com. He has a tremendous list. And youtube videos also! If you have any interest in adding greenbrier (edible leafs and tubers) or Poke Sallat to your acreage you are welcome to get starter plants from my place. As well as coinwort, dandelion and purslane. And thanks to Wallasadi's tempting Jewels of Opar, they are now artificially introduced!

Sometimes I think that with all the naturally occurring 'weeds' around and about our just under 1 acre that it would be next to impossible for us to starve. Of course I kid myself ...

I'll try to not get to up on a soap box, but I think that part of 'survival food production' needs to include eating and growing local. Joining and supporting a CSA, community gardens, neighborhood sharing.

Oh, and get those dang.nab.blasted HOA'ers to get off their uppity better than thou high horses about growing edibles. In an urban/suburban setting, neighborhood sharing is probably more important than we might think. For example, I've got lots of shade and can crank out sweet and bell peppers like mad all summer long - but can't grow a single lima bean. Meanwhile Kimberly down the street has lake water irrigation and full sun, and boy can she crank out the lima beans. Swap - swap.

Oh, almost forgot .... I'm keen to try dehydration on my dashboard :) Or, better yet - a solar cooker.

~dianne

Here is a link that might be useful: Eat The Weeds


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Gardengimp, using naturally-occurring weeds for survival is definitely a fantasy, IMO. They are a great way to grab some supplemental minerals in the diet at critical times, but won't provide significant calories.

Population growth is now being considered as the original spur to the domestication of food plants, rather than the other way round as had been thought. IOW, a given area only supports so many people by foraging. In most of peninsular florida, absent major riparian resources, it would be very few.

Just imagine, clear-headedly, what would happen if you couldn't buy most of your calories. No bread, tubers, meat, etc at the stores. In a very short time all the deer, rabbits, and squirrels (and cattle) would be killed and eaten, at least until the ammo ran out as well. At least for a while raising staple crops would be easier in that regard. The implication of "survival garden" is that supplies are interrupted. No reason to think that trucking of fertilizers and composts would be an exception. Very little calories will be produced in florida without them, and even those will be of low mineral value.

Talk to a row-crop veggie producer about the inputs required in florida sand. The inputs are just about everything. Survival would require a good permaculture and full incorporation of what are now treated as wastes.


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  • Posted by Yme405 10b SW Fla (My Page) on
    Fri, Aug 12, 11 at 16:01

Fortunately for me, I have been learning from and can follow the ways of the Calusa. They were not farmers by any stretch, but were primarily fisherman and only minor hunter/gatherers. And they were in SW Florida for close to 1250 years before the Spanish brought them low. So I'm thinking they knew how to survive in this area - and the things we rely on now were not even a distant thought for these people. Pays to be a historian some days!

And since I'm just starting to garden here, I'd be hesitant to rely on my skills in that area. But hand me a fishing pole and that's a whole different story. Maybe I'll be able to barter fish for crops with the Okeechobee folks... just like the Calusa used to.

Diane, my stance is right beside yours up on that soapbox

Chrissy


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Well have not really been thinking about a survival garden but this would be a good spot. We are on a lake so fish, turtles and gators are available.......I have the rabbits (7 does and 2 bucks) so protein. I have about a dozen citrus trees, 5 or so mulberry trees, about 20 pomegranate bushes, 20 black berry bushes (3 types), about 20 Black raspberry bushes, 45 blueberry bushes, bananas, 100 or so bamboo for shoots, chestnut trees (thanks Lou) and figs as well as 2 large vegetable gardens.

For those looking for easily and abundant food crops don't forget bidens alba. The weed grows abundantly and the leaves, stems and flowers are all edible. The rabbits love it and if something interrupted the pelleted food supply it would become a staple of the rabbits.


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I'm still trying to get any actual fruit from my veggies. I don't think even the deer could survive off what I grow now. But we got chickens and are working on adding rabbits, so if I never manage to grow veggies at least I could barter with some of you green thumbs!


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Here on the beach (exactly 1 block from the beach) very few foods grow because of salt--in the air and in the water. I have found a small oriental food store here in town. They loved it when I came in and I stocked up. We love oriental foods. Anyway, the farmer's market and Publix has to keep my cooking in business, because growing it on this beach lot ain't gonna happen.

Good luck everyone!


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Yes Bamboo, your lake is quite an asset. But the gators and turtles would probably go pretty fast. I was conceived in Florida, and if my dad hadn't gotten transferred I would have been a 5th generation cracker. I remember my grandfather and uncles hunting the Okefenokee Swamp. Heck, my brother and I went out several times hunting frogs and gators. We got lots of frogs but only got a gator one time. Oh, and the still was in the swamp. So trading 'shine for veggies.

Oh, and we can't forget cattails. One of the greatest plants for survival. I've been thinking of trying to get some cattails growing on the sly in the lake in our neighborhood. Wonder if anybody would notice? Probably would take a ton load of cattail roots to make a loaf of bread though.

~dianne


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Photobucket


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Lots of cool ideas here. One no one has mentioned, maybe because so few of us down in 10b even try to grow food, is arugula. It's great in many ways down here: labor efficiency - it grows from seeds scattered on top of mulch, pushing out other weeds, and reseeds, plus it has a long growing season - I just found a seedling coming up through the pavers around the pool. Very few edibles besides purslane grow wild down here in August. And it's still edible after it bolts - granted, it's a bit spicier, but it doesn't become bitter. Resource efficiency - it can survive dry spells, hot spells, cold spells, wet spells and poor soil and hasn't been subject to any pests in my yard, so no watering, fertilizing or treating required.

dirtygardner: fascinating list, though some of it wouldn't work down here in 10b. Daylilies, for example, don't thrive here. But I'm interested in the broomcorn. It was grown commercially down here (to make brooms) into the 40s and 50s. How do you eat it?

The Seminoles and the early Florida crackers got their starch from coontie flour, but they harvested wild coonties. I'm not really clear on how many acres of coontie you'd need to grow to feed a family, but I suspect it would be quite a bit, considering you have to harvest their roots. Might make the atala butterflies happy, but I'm not sure it would really be sustainable. Then again, in a true cataclysmic event, there might be a bunch of land available, if you could find the labor.

I guess if the market crashes any further, I'll need to learn to like catfish. And lionfish and Burmese python. The Florida ecosystem has changed a lot since people actually lived off of what they could grow here. Then again, I've read (here on Gardenweb somewhere) that Brazilian pepper actually makes an edible pepper if it's dried properly.

I'd definitely grow Cuban oregano, my only unkillable herb. Because those survivalist days are going to be pretty poorly seasoned, I suspect.


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I think the farther south in florida the more survival would depend on tree and bush crops.


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A couple things I haven't seen mentined on here that grow without any work are katuk and pigeon peas. The katuk is a year round green. You can eat the flowers, new leaves and new growth on the stems. It has a nutty flavor that isn't to strong. I use the top couple inches of stems in stir fry and the leaves and flowers in salads. The flowers are great snacks while in the garden if you are a grazer like I am. Pigeon peas are lovely and help fix the nitrogen in the soil. You can use the peas green or let them dry and use them as beans. Both also make good chicken food.


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I've really wanted to try katuk. I read it will do well in part shade, do you know? And does anybody have an idea where to get it around Seminole county?

Dianne


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Keiki, Yes, those two were on the "rest" of the list I didn't post.

Natives and Veggies, coonties grow so slowly, but they can be started from just a portion of a root. A better root crop is the Dioscorea alata. It grows in one season, and makes a huge root. It's pretty invasive, but who cares if you're growing it to survive, right?

Broomcorn is eaten as a grain, cooked like a grain cereal. The stalks can also be used as fodder for animals if you don't want to go through the trouble of pressing them for syrup.

There are a TON of things that could grow where you are! Almost any true tropical fruit or veggie would grow there, and don't forget sugarcane and bamboo. If bamboo shoots are good enough for pandas, they should be good enough for us.


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This year I planted calabaza and sweet potatoes. I got a dozen calabaza in a small space and the sweet potatoes are growing like crazy. Years ago, I planted boniato (Cuban sweet potatoes) and they became like a weed in my back yard. That sounds like a great survival food. I used to grow yucca, another high calorie weed. Calabaza keeps for a long time and the boniato you can leave in the ground till you need it.


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 15, 11 at 19:47

Looks like I'm late to the party, Brute, SEE what you've done!

I guess if the market crashes any further, I'll need to learn to like catfish. And lionfish and Burmese python.

Suzie, it will, we'll be in a full blown depression by 2015 at the very latest. You're on the right track, the natives here were predominantly meat eaters just like most early North American inhabitants. While we like to grow veggies they are not sustainable for life calorie-wise. Folks, don't kid yourself about this....Many will be hunting pythons in the glades and it will be a godsend for survival....

I think the farther south in Florida the more survival would depend on tree and bush crops.

Sounds good in theory but I doubt it seriously...early man didn't live long because of mostly meat-eating but certainly survived longer than would have been possible trying to live off of a plant diet. Vegans, don't take offense, sure we can do better now with a diet high in veggies, BUT in a catastrophic environment without meat nobody will survive long on the calories provided from plants.

Tom


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Most people aren't going to survive major catastrophes, period.

I think we are talking about situations where conditions are difficult and fragmented, but still some level of civility.


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Dianne Katuk does best in part shade but I really don't think you can kill it :0). I will pot up a plant for you. I can ship it in about 6 weeks or if you are close to Cape Coral you can pick it up. It doesn't like being transplanted and will sulk for a while but I have more than enough to share.

Tom I am not trying to completely feed my dh and I from my garden I know meat is needed. I am just doing what I can to have healthy fresh fruit and veggies. We have chickens for eggs and my hubby is a fisherman so that will also help.

Frday I am getting a freezer for the garage at 1/4 the price. I am so excited to have more room to store more of my homegrown goodies.


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Echonet.org sells katuk seeds. Will katuk survive in zone 9a?

Getting back to grains, buckwheat does well in central Florida during the cool months. When I had chickens, I used to grow it for forage. Wait until the grain forms and the chickens will eat it down to the ground.


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Tue, Aug 16, 11 at 19:44

Kieki,

I agree with you 100%. I just hope it doesn't get as bad as I honestly think it's going to get.... I'm 4th generation here, I know how to survive....

I posted this this morning but for some reason it didn't take:

"...but still some level of civility.

I pray your right"

Tom


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Tom,

What I mean is that I don't think gov and social structure are going to break down totally in NA in the next 50 years. Serious re-organization and decrease of societal wealth will occur for sure, is already occurring due to the beginning of energy descent. The impoverished class will grow enormously, and become very restive.

Some people will be living close to the solar budget soon. In some places hunting game (which it seems you were hinting at) will be a stopgap but not generally. However I am greatly in favor of a huge reduction in the deer population, so that raising plant calories can take its critical role.


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Wed, Aug 17, 11 at 13:20

If things get critical we'll run out of game to hunt very quickly given the population size now vs. during the Depression. I don't hunt anymore and have no interest but I believe poaching would be widespread. I'd sure have to hone my fishing skills....

Clearly there is a shift in wealth and economic status happening before our very eyes....

Regarding the 50 years, not only does China own our debt, they just built a huge aircraft carrier....

Tom


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I used to think China might be a military threat at some point in the next 50 years, but I now think that they have correctly figured they can get where they want with "soft" power.


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Wed, Aug 17, 11 at 19:24

That's rather scary, more so than thinking first step will be Taiwan....


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  • Posted by brute Florida 9B (My Page) on
    Thu, Aug 18, 11 at 13:25

So, I've been told that my deleted post with my prediction of how society will break down after an economic collapse was "borderline racist".
Okay, fine.
Sorta reminds me of a scene from the wonderful PBS mini-series "Shaka Zulu".
A group of European explorers were gathered in front of Shaka's throne with the whole village looking on. This was a big deal because they had never seen a white man before.
Shaka kept staring at one of the Englishmen who was wearing eyeglasses. The Zulu chief said something to one of his aides, then the interpreter said, "He wishes to examine your spectacles".
These were handed up to him and he put them on his own face.
Shaka then looked around for a few moments. Of course, everything he saw was blurry and distorted. Then, he handed them back and said with disgust, "It would seem that this man does not wish to see the world as it really is!"
Okay folks, here's your fashion eyewear back.


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So, are you Shaka or the Englishman? Because things didn't go all that well for the Zulus, even with their 20-20 vision.


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  • Posted by saldut 9-10 st pete, fl (My Page) on
    Thu, Aug 18, 11 at 15:43

I don't know how many of you-all actually remember firsthand the Depression, I do- I was there...... and people got by, we all had a garden, and it extended into the War, to grow your Victory Garden... we lived very simply, no pre-cooked meals, no Instant potatoes or this-n-that from the freezer... we didn't have a freezer, we didn't have a fridge---- we had an Ice-Box, and the ice-man cameth, and the milk-man cameth, the back-door was never locked and they came in and put the ice in the ice-box and left the quarts (glass bottles) of milk in the little box..the milk wasn't 'homogenized' , it had real cream on the top and you drained it off for your coffee.... there was no 'margarine' you used butter if you could afford it, if not, lard..... Mom put a note what she wanted with the money in the box and it was there when we came home.... no A/C... no TV..... we rode the bus we didn't have a car, and the bus-stop was 6 blocks away....we did our laundry by hand in the kitchen sink and hung it out on the clothes-line in the back-yard... we washed our dishes in the same sink, no dish-washer there ! we had chickens in the back-yard because meat was rationed or we couldn't afford it.....if someone came to the back-door hungry, we fed them part of whatever we had and didn't think twice..... but people got by, and I think people were happier then.... sally


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Survival gardening here would not be possible in the event of a total breakdown of society. Our population is too high. Your food would be taken from you before you could harvest it. The best thing to do in that dire situation is to pray and get as far away from other people as possible.

I am thinking of how to grow more due to the rising food prices. Pretty soon fresh produce will be a luxury item and only junk food will be affordable.


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Sally, I wasn't very happy when as a kid I forgot to empty the pan under the ice box and had to taste the strap a few times to reset my memory bank. We also had chickens, rabbits, pigs, & cows plus 2 plow horses and a huge garden that always needed weeding. Those kerosene lanterns were murder on your eyes as you tried to do homework in that light after chores. We had no electricity until much later on. Entertainment was Saturday eves when the neighbors gathered together with their musical instruments and made music while us kids square danced. Good times, yes... tough times, yes... but they were honest times unlike now. I miss the honesty in this world. You could be Democrat or Republican without killing each other over discussions and each would respect the others views.

Lou


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  • Posted by saldut 9-10 st pete, fl (My Page) on
    Thu, Aug 18, 11 at 17:41

Well Lou, you remember a farm life 'before', I remember a suburban City life 'before'.... my hubby also grew up in a rural farm-life, like yours... real rural, he learned how to run a trap-line and set snares when he was a small kid, and how to hunt..and how to work the end of a cross-cut saw...there was no ice-box, meat was hung in a shed and froze and hunks were cut off to cook over a wood-stove..... they all had shot-guns over the door and a pig out in the shed, and mink or coon or some other pelt (pelts) hanging on the shed-wall drying for the fur-buyer, who came in the winter in an open horse-drawn sled and stayed over-night, with all the news from the town.... now there was a self-sufficient life, no electric, no phone, and snowed-in a lot during the winter... he went to school in a horse-drawn box on sleds, and carried a hot-brick warmed on the wood-stove to keep his feet warm.... there were bears and occasional wolves in the woods, and when they went berry-picking in the summer they carried a gun.... a different way of life, indeed.... sally


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Thu, Aug 18, 11 at 19:17

Sally, Amber is right, people won't survive a true breakdown now because nobody is self sufficient other than maybe Lou, and without fuel I'm not sure how long he will last or how many guns an ammunition he has...we've become too specialized in our careers an if society collapses I'm not sure I care to be around to try to survive it :-( This will be a whole lot different from the way people were during the GREAT depression....


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Cooperation will be required.


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Tom,

I'm becoming very skilled at using my crossbows. I love the silence of it. I still use my guns, I cast my own bullets from wheel weight lead, load my own ammo and can even make my own black powder if need be. I'm an old school farm kid and we had to do everything ourselves including blacksmithing. I'm an ex-marine and well trained in survival skills. I'm in process of installing solar here 10KW system grid-tie for the house and a lesser system 7KW off-grid for my barn and out buildings. I have some olive trees and will be expanding it into an olive grove and will make bio diesel from the olive oil. I'm not squeamish about what could be eaten in a pinch and Fla has a great variety of bugs and critters for the palate. YUM YUM
We are a rural community of farmers out here and each would look out for the others well being.

Lou


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  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Fri, Aug 19, 11 at 7:54

I believe you Lou, out there, the cities and suburbs will be another story....

PB - you're right, folks did help each other during the Depression, I remember many stories my mom told me about my grandfather, who was a farmer, giving away a small fortune in vegetables.

Tom


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Exactly. humans have never existed solo.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Interesting discussion, you all really got me to thinking. I'm a city boy but my grandparents were farmers in Alabama who were completely self-sufficient farmers. Poor, yes, but as my Mom always says, We didn't know we were poor. She likes to talk about how Christmas presents were an orange and a big stick of peppermint candy, and her "dolls" were the lady models cut out of a Sears Roebuck catalog. They raised crops, slaughtered animals, hunted rabbits and squirrels, fished, and picked poke sallat and blackberries. I remember my grandmother cooking on a wood stove, drying apples in the sun, doing laundry on a wringer washer, and having a great little strawberry patch. First thing I think I'd do in a worst case scenario is move back there, gather the kin, and begin farming my grandparents' old homestead of 40 acres. What's that song by Hank Jr? A Country Boy Can Survive. I think I still have it in my genes.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

  • Posted by Yme405 10b SW Fla (My Page) on
    Sun, Aug 21, 11 at 19:34

When I think of a complete break down scenario... I think less about living on land and more about moving onto a sailboat full time and heading for one of the thousands of uninhabited islands in the Caribbean. My knowledge about surviving on the water far exceeds my capabilities on land. My husband and I are strongly considering this type of lifestyle right now purely due to the rising costs of everything.

I completely agree with the "soft power" comment about China. They are a very patient and unforgiving culture. I think their plans for a subtle takedown started long ago.

Chrissy


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Mon, Aug 22, 11 at 7:22

I completely agree with the "soft power" comment about China. They are a very patient and unforgiving culture. I think their plans for a subtle takedown started long ago.

I agree, that's why I was startled to see they just completed a HUGH air craft carrier.

Tom


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Next step in the grand scheme of things perhaps. Seeing what they can get away with while our forces are spread as thin as they are, combined with the shakiness of our political and economic climate - saw their opening to take things to the next level undeterred?

Very disturbing to say the least.

And they are not usually so open about such things. So it makes me think hard about what we don't know they have created or planned to create just yet. My mind wanders to the German u-boats that were regularly found in the Gulf during 1942-1943 attempting to cut off our oil supplies.
Chrissy


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Good thing the Chinese built a carrier. At least now when they take out 2 or 3 of ours with their missles, we can smack'em back and take out their 1.

Seriously though, present day carriers are becoming obsolete because they are so vulnerable to small powerfull weapons and the Chinese seem to be entering this game a little late.

Maybe the carrier is meant to complement the empty bullet trains that run to the modern cities that are ghost towns where all the homes and condos are owned by factory workers who are in danger of losing their jobs from competition with other countries who have cheaper labor costs.

The only thing that really worries me about China is their stockpiling commodities. That was a major mistake the Axis made in WW2. They didn't have the material resources or manpower necessary for fighting a prolonged war. China may be gearing up for a longterm economic war and if push comes to shove, manpower ain't a problem.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

  • Posted by tomncath St.Pete-Z10A-Heat 10 (My Page) on
    Tue, Aug 23, 11 at 18:34

At least now when they take out 2 or 3 of ours with their missles, we can smack'em back and take out their 1.

Seriously though, present day carriers are becoming obsolete because they are so vulnerable to small powerfull weapons and the Chinese seem to be entering this game a little late.

Are you sure about that? If the Germans had stayed closer to home with their tanks they might have had the airpower to transport troops to the oilfields first...IMO the Chinese would not concern themselves with us, we're spread to thin now as it is...while crushing us economically, militarily first would go Taiwan, then Japan, then Australia, then they could move troops to the oilfields.

Tom


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

My survival plan is to move in with Lou. ;)


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Worthless crops, all of them. Grow Cannabis and there's NOTHING else you'll need when society falls apart.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Tom, I was trying to say the Chinese are entering the "carrier" game a little late. Carriers will be the next battleships to go extinct. Too big, too clumsy, too slow, too obivious and the perfect psychological target.

As for WW2, both sides made so many mistakes that I sometimes think pure luck determined the winner of that one.

The Chinese will not crush us economically because they would be shooting themselves in the foot. Why destroy their best customer when that customer is faithfully paying their bills with worthless promissory notes (dollars) and promising to buy even more stuff if the price is always cheaper than it could be bought elsewhere?

Why would China want Taiwan (buncha rebels), Japan (Fukushima and more earthquakes), Australia (and more rebel types) and depleted oil wells.

I hate discussions like this. I can't type as fast as I can think and it all has already been said much more eloquently by so many others.

Think I'll just plant something tomorrow and let the really smart leaders figure out what I really think.

Maybe Ricky gave me some ideas of what to plant. Medicinal uses only of course.


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

For anyone that has plenty of acreage and their land sits well above the underground natural water level I recommend using the steel shipping containers as underground survival bunkers. They are available fairly cheap at the cargo ports and can be moved to your site by independent truckers wanting to earn a few extra bucks. The insides can be furnished with camper type appliances and furniture from MFG home salvage yards. They can be placed side by side and/or end to end and welded together to make a large shelters with rooms such as a house has and then covered over with dirt. It also makes a great hurricane or tornado shelter and your survival garden can be planted atop over it.

Lou


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Hi
Find it interesting that nobody mentioned "global warming" If even partially true Florida would be the most seriously impacted due to tides . Don't think much farming will be going on under the sea lol
One of the most interesting is the "end of time" occuring in May of 12 how do you prepare for that?? lol
Be tough to make up a calandar for gardening??
I've got the whole thing beat anyway I'm old and sickly
What are they gonna do to me ?? Good luck everybody
gary


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Good suggestion Lou. You need to find the drivers with the special trailers made for the containers or a flat bed, at least. And you'll need some sort of heavy forklift to get it down from the truck since the ports have cranes for this. How do you work out air circulation though? I've watched a few documentaries on the specialized pods and what I took away from that - the largest market for them was DC... Makes you wonder why that is.

Gary,

The tides are subtle and it's already been going on. My coast used to extend 15 miles past where it is now. Not sure any of us will see major impacts in our lifetime. Future generations definitely will.

I have my own theory on the Mayan calendar. I think they were exterminated before they had a chance to expand on it. As for preparation if that's not the case... I live as fully as I can each day :)

Chrissy


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RE: Started Your 'Survival Garden' Yet?

Chrissy,
It's easy enough to rent the cranes to get it off the truck and put them into the place you've dug out for them. A solar panel or two will make enough electricity to charge the batteries, run the fans through vents for air circulation along with the LED lighting. It's up to you how elaborate you want to go. There are many diverse DIY write ups you can apply to your shelter needs such as driving a well point down to the water table source in the ground for your water needs.(very easy in Fla's sugar sands)

Lou


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