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dianega

Anyone doing Four Season veggie gardening?

DianeGA
14 years ago

Hi! I posted this on the Four Season Gardening page, but thought I'd check with you guys here, too.

I've never tried this before & was wondering if there are any websites that have some basic "how to" info on this. I'm hoping something along the lines of how Square Foot Gardening has a website with a lot of info (squarefootgardening.com). I know Eliot Coleman has a book, but my library doesn't carry it & I wanted to at least get a better idea of what this is like before I buy the book.

My garden faces South so it'll get plenty of sunshine. I won't have a greenhouse or big hoop-houses. I could do some small hoop tunnels as necessary.

Some of my questions (among many!) are:

- Which veggies can take some frost or even a light freeze without protection?

- Which need more protection (need covers even for light frost)?

- Can you plant new veggies during the winter or need to already have planted during the fall & just harvesting during the winter? Is it too late to put out some transplants now (I can still buy from nursery)? And can I even plant new seeds of cold-hardy veggies if I made a mini greenhouse under a clear box until they're a few inches tall?

- I think I read somewhere where floating row covers gave an extra 10 degrees or so of protection... is that true? or will it need plastic?

Thanks for any help you can give me!

Comments (9)

  • girlgroupgirl
    14 years ago

    Yes. I've been growing vegetables year 'round here for the last 10 years or so.

    "Non-tropical" vegetables can take light frosts. There is a large list of them. Almost all root vegetables, however these must be started off in warm soil. I sow them in early September.

    Cole Crops - brassicas of all kinds, many Asian vegetables -pretty much anything related to cabbage or mustard. Cauliflower is a pain here.
    swiss chard, and many lettuces and other greens withstand frosts. I just planted lettuces today at church from transplant. I am no longer planting anything from seed.

    Seeds need about 70 degrees, in general to germinate. Tenting them can help.

    Row covers work unless it is freezing rain. I use old sheets for row covers in my raised beds, and I usually use plastic on days like today, to heat up the soil a bit and get better growth. I never ever let the plastic touch the vegetables because that burns them when it freezes. I keep frozen wet out of the vegetables, that kills most back to the ground and they don't aways recover.

    I protect spinach and lettuces. There are a variety of ways to do that.
    I protect only when there is going to be a hard frost, artichokes, and celery. I use old tree pots for this, or heavy cardboard boxes (not in rain) with a rock or brick on them.

    You can use heat sinks if we get a 2 week freezing period like we sometimes do. I like bricks the best for this. I just plop them inside the tented veggies. I make tent frames out of PVC and use them every year. My favorite covers for the garden are old shower curtain liners. Heavy plastic!

    You can also build units around existing beds using bales and plastic held with bricks . I have done this. The most important thing when tenting or protecting is getting in the light and ventilation. You can't let the heat build up for any length of time (under a tent it can easily get 20 degrees warmer than outside, if it's sunny)...so you have to be present to tend the vegetables.

    GGG

  • DianeGA
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    Hi GGG!
    Are you saying you DON'T cover lettuce/spinach even on nights with light frost like we've had this week? So why are you covering them now that the temps are higher? I'm a little confused about just how tender lettuce & spinach are. Do you only cover for hard freeze? Or at what temps?

    Also, are you saying broccoli, collards, cabbage will grow even without being tented (except for hard freeze)? Or will they need a tent to grow? I saw some little 6-packs still at the nursery & was thinking of trying. Never grew any of these before so kind of confused which things keep growing even when it's cold.

    I guess I'm just confused about WHEN things need to be covered. Do you keep them under row covers &/or plastic all the time or just when there's a frost or hard freeze coming?

    I like the idea of pvc instead of trying to bend wires for the hoops. I assume you use only clear plastic shower curtains. Do you think it would work to put the row covers on but leave the ends open for ventilation so won't accidentally "cook" them? Or will that let too much heat out? Do you cover the ends & just open little slits for ventilation?

    Thanks for your advice! I sure wish that Four Season book was at the library so I could get a lot more details without asking a million questions.

  • girlgroupgirl
    14 years ago

    I've not yet really had any frost on my veggies, the garden is oriented to first morning sun - East and South. I had one frosted area today only (with no plants in it yet...but now I know what to plant there :)

    The only reason I'm tenting vegetables now is to increase the warmth surrounding slow growers. Daily temps not so warm...and growth is slowing considerably. I need to speed things up and get the teensy seedlings moving it along for January's food! So tenting helps keep off frost, but it also helps by warmth moving things along. I keep the tents pretty open and well ventilated for that. Even being fairly open keeps the light frosts from settling. During a LONG hard frost everything is tented. During a short harder frost I do not tent any brassicas as they taste better with some frost.
    It will take you time to learn when to tent and when not to tent so much. Every year is different, every day is different. The 4 seasons book is much more geared to growing in Maine...much less here. There really isn't a book that teaches you to do this particular method here. It's trial and error.
    Last year I didn't get tents up in time and I lost almost everything around christmas in freezing rain. Even chard died in a sluggy slush.

    Yes, the biggest problem with tenting is cooking plants. I cover ends on coldest nights and clip them with wooden clothes pegs. This keeps out frost but doesn't seal in too much heat if you don't vent first thing in the AM if you need to.

    There really are no really good, thorough books on vegetable gardening in the South. The closest I've found to what I like is the Southern Living Encyclopedia out a few years ago. There are some older ones, but they deal with what the climate was like here 20 years ago, and not what it is, now.

  • DianeGA
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    GGG,
    Ok, I think I've got it... lettuce/spinach need covers from frost. Most of the other cold-hardy root veggies, cabbage family, broccoli can survive light frost (temps around freezing mark) without covers but need protection from hard freeze. However, all of these (even frost tolerant) would benefit from row covers even at above-frost temps because the heat will help them keep growing bigger/faster. They wouldn't die from the cold temps, but won't keep growing much if below, say, 50's.

    Well, even though so late in the year, I might just try planting a 6-pack of collards & broccoli & see what happens. I wish I had started back in Oct, but it'll be interesting to see if they'll produce if I can rig up some protection.

    Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge with me!

  • DianeGA
    Original Author
    14 years ago

    GGG,
    Ok, I think I've got it... lettuce/spinach need covers from frost. Most of the other cold-hardy root veggies, cabbage family, broccoli can survive light frost (temps around freezing mark) without covers but need protection from hard freeze. However, all of these (even frost tolerant) would benefit from row covers even at above-frost temps because the heat will help them keep growing bigger/faster. They wouldn't die from the cold temps, but won't keep growing much if below, say, 50's.

    Well, even though so late in the year, I might just try planting a 6-pack of collards & broccoli & see what happens. I wish I had started back in Oct, but it'll be interesting to see if they'll produce if I can rig up some protection.

    Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge with me!

  • girlgroupgirl
    14 years ago

    And you may find your garden is completely different than mine, so please approach with an open mind and for learning each season.

    This year I am tenting quite a bit, just for heat and to move things along. I want my onions to come along faster than last year for example, so I can rotate what's in the bed at an earlier time...you can play with it!!

  • girlgroupgirl
    14 years ago

    Diane, this is the weather I tent my garden for. Wet today, then freezing tomorrow and the next night. I know I'd loose a lot of veg in my garden (like lettuces) if I let things get wet and then freeze. The tents will keep the frost directly off the plants!

  • ourhappyhome
    14 years ago

    I've been too lazy to tent and everything in my garden is doing fine. I'm about 35 miles outside Atlanta. We've had two freezes. My collards, mustards, broccoli and cabbage are all doing fine. I thought my broccoli would die because it looked completely frozen and discolored. That was at about 7am. By 9am, they looked fine. I do have the problem of slowed growth. Everything has slowed to a snails pace. My broccoli should have produced heads in 50 days max. Instead, it took 75 days from transplants. Cabbages have headed but heads are grapefruit size. I guess I'll have to break down and buy row covers online. Can't find them anywhere locally. Last thing is lettuce. Man, my lettuce is beautiful but I'm growing it in large pots on my deck. I'd planned to transplant into the garden but that won't be necessary. Its doing very nicely in the pots. I'm growing Nevada, Little Gem and New Red Fire.

    GGG, have you tried 'Amazing' cauliflower? I'm trying cauliflower, brussel sprouts and russet potatoes for the first time this Spring. I heard Amazing was great for warm areas.

    Oh, and I'm trying onions from seed for the first time also. Would you ladies like to join me? I have 'Candy' seed and I'd be willing to share a few for this project. The goal is to start seeds indoors and track our progess online with photos (from January to June). PLMK

    April

  • girlgroupgirl
    14 years ago

    I have not tried Amazing cauliflower. I've only tried one or two heirlooms and gave up in frustration.
    I have my onions in already - they are Granex sweet onions, I plant onions outside in October around Halloween ever year and they do just fine. I do not start any seeds indoors anymore at home (when I get a greenhouse, I'll do it in there, but right now, it's open air!!). My onions are up and are very strong, about 3" tall right now! Of course I also have the perennial onions and they too are doing just super.

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