Theresa, If I understand correctly, the correct way to describe Theresa's Glory is "origin unknown". You can guess that it's a seedling between PG and OG, but you really don't know. You certainly don't know which is the pod parent and the pollen parent.

The only way you would know it's origin is if you pollinated the flower and labeled it and grew it out, or saved the seed from a plant and grew it out. If you didn't pollinate it yourself, it would be "Paul's Glory OP" or open pollinated. If you dabbed the pollen, then you would know which is the pod and pollen parent. It's the same with finding a sport in the middle of a bunch of Invincible plants at the nursery. You think it's a sport of Invincible, but it's still "origin unknown".

Why don't you post a photo, as we're all curious about Theresa's Glory?

bk

I think you are looking for way more certainty than hosta seeds can provide.

Experts - I'm going off the top of my head here, so if I'm off base please correct me...

First of all, this is a very unusual seedling. The seedlings from both solid colored and variegated hostas are generally solid colored. For years it was a "given" that the only way to get a variegated seedling was to get seed from a streaked seed pod from a streaked plant.

Over the years we've had enough exceptions to know that once in a hundred or once in a million... whatever... you will get a variegated seedling from a variegated plant. Very rare... but my friend Phyllis did it - once out of thousands...

Beyond that, we must factor in the "slippery genes" character of hostas. I once planted the seeds from a single pod - and I kept three of those seedlings in a display. I got green, blue, and yellow all from one seed pod. They also varied quite a lot in leaf and plant size.

Some traits seem to track more consistently than others, but mostly it is simply impossible to determine pod or pollen parentage after the fact from appearance.

There are some traits people do know about... is it that to get the fragrant genes you need to use pollen from the fragrant plant... that the pod parent won't pass on fragrance? I know hybridizers know this kind of stuff... I don't know the details.

So Theresa's Glory is a miracle plant to start with. And it would be a miracle of miracles if it was actually identical to Paul's Glory or Old Glory.

I have grown perhaps 10,000 seedlings... or I should say I've grown a couple thousand and weeded out another 8000... and have never seen a variegated seedling.

Often when people think they got a variegated seedling from a nearby variegated plant, what they actually have is a fragment of another plant... a little root and crown left over from normal gardening happens to "take" - in this case, given time, it will be a clone of the parent.

So... I understand your curiosity... but truly all you can do is grow and enjoy Theresa's Glory... and document its changes. You can speculate as much as you want, but all you will ever truly be able to say is "unknown parentage."

Hope it's one of 'those 1 in 1,000' seedlings, Theresa. Good luck! : )

Don B.

It is rather exciting because I've read here how rare it is. As far as a fragment, to my knowledge there has never been a hosta planted any closer than the crowns of the 'Glorys' , roughly 4 feet distant. Complicating the matter is that it is growing almost on top of a deeply planted group of Daffodil bulbs. I didn't want to dig everything up before because I wanted the seedling to have the best chance of survival by giving it several seasons to develop. When it was first found it was such a tiny thing.

It still has only one eye but the largest leaves (4 total) is about 5"L x 2-1/2" W. My plan has been to separate it out next spring after the Daffadil dies back and plant TG is a more friendly location. Then with the additional season under it's belt get a better idea of what it may look like as an adult.

Do you think I would do better to relocate it this fall after it goes dormant? I am thinking of a prominent location in Theresa's Angel Garden, under the Black Walnut since ever other hosta seems to love the growing conditions.

To keep it from being dug up by squirrels I would put one of the metal mesh trash baskets over it. I am not looking for any value other than the uniqueness of a variegated open pollinated seedling.

I will try to post some pictures here in the next few days. I've been having problems using the Photo Bucket I've used in the past and may have to download another software system and use that. That is why I haven't been posting pictures this summer.

Thanks for the help. I am sure you want to see what this miracle looks like. It is a lot 'prettier' than I am!. Maybe I should rename it "Theresa's Miracle".

Theresa

Herb Benedict is said to have grown 24,000 seeds of Francis Williams selfed in order to get Dorothy Benedict. That's how rare it is to get a streaked or variegated seedling from non-streaked pod parents. I have heard, however, that Bill Lachman would sometimes use white centered plants to get streakers. I believe the parentage of Sand Pebbles is Reversed x montana. Reversed is a white centered plant. So it may not be unheard of to get a variegated or streaked plant from Loyalist. Still it's quite rare. Enjoy.

Oh and post pics.

Steve

As soon as I can Steve. This is creating a sense of urgency where I have been patient to wait to see what developes. I certainly hope I don't kill it, and will at least have pics in my computer album. I do have pics when it was only 2" across dwarfed by PG and OG, I realized it was a rarity but didn't want to 'dry wolf' in case it reverted to green. But it doesn't seem it wants to do that.

Do you use a CD to store your photos, or a zip-drive? I've barely begun and have a ton of pictures. If people don't like giving up on hostas (see that string "Am I the only one?") I don't like to delete a single photo of mine or Bobbi's or Leslie's. What an obsession! I love it!

Theresa

This is my horror story about storing photos. I borrowed my Aunt's photos and copied all of them. They were great old photos from the 30's, 40's and 50's. I'm a genealogy nut, so I loved the photos. I stored them on floppies. Most all disappeared. I've since learned that you never store photos permanently on any removable media. Always keep them backed up, but occasionally move them back to your computer and make a new backup copy. Any magnetic media (or equivalent) will deteriorate with time.

She's now deceased. I have no idea where the photos are now, as her son died soon after, then her daughter-in-law a year after that. I didn't know their children.

So, lesson learned.

bk

My heart feels for you bk. How often my mind seeks answers my parents and grandmother knew. If only I had a way to protect them. That is the reason I am named Theresa after my Great-Great Grandmother Theresa, and Ann after my Grandmother Anna. It is so easy to lose available knowledge, but thank the Lord we have dna. Eventually all comes back, but not exactly the way and when we want it to.

I hope to know some day how to safely store knowledge for my great grandchildren so they don't suffer the same loss. In the meantime we just need to keep seeking answers, right?

Theresa Ann

I have an Old Glory that has flowered this year,and it never set seed,so I guess that makes it even more rare! Hope it grows well for you,and that you will be able to identify it eventually. Phil

I'll probably never be able to ID it, like those here remind me. I just hope it remains as unique as it eventually is, Phil. Thanks,

I have had remnants grow in other parts of my gardens and this has no resemblance to them. I have no doubt but it is a seedling., To have such a rare event is AWESOME folks. I reall feel a need to preserve it as best I can. If I ever do anything that would cause it's demise I would feel crushed.

Theresa

i dont think it exists... its all in her head .... or else she could show us a pic ....

wheres the pic????

i have about a billion self sown seedlings in my garden.. not a single one came up edged .. nor streaked ...

thats worse odds than herb.. lol ...

and no.. there is no way to predict maturity.... w/o some knowledge of the seed parents ...

ken

Here is a link that might be useful: HEY!!!! ... wheres the beef

I've lost a couple of heartbreakers, Theresa... gardeners have to be ready for complete failure... so much is out of our control.

I had a white-centered sport of The Razor's Edge. Kent had not seen or heard of any sport for TRE. I nurtured it through three seasons, I think, on the parent plant... then divided it... and it didn't come back the next season. We had named it First Cut and i just loved it.

This year I notices a little streaking in one eye of the parent TRC... so just a little of me holds onto the idea First Cut might show up again... but who knows?!

The most commonly held expert's opinion is that OP seedlings r most likely 'selfed' . . .

fwiw,
hh

KEN - What do you charge for your psychology sessions? lol
Now I REALLY have to try to post a picture, even if it is the only one I can.

My most recent seedling, also a Star Trek hosta (where no hosta has gone before----) is just a plain green hosta with a plantaginea leaf shape, but lavender flowers. It looks much like my ventricosa which are profuse pod producers. But hardly spectacular. Maybe next year I will cut the flowering scapes to get a closer look at the blooms.

Theresa

You can always email it to your psychologist? Lol. He really WANTS to see it. Lol.

HH just wrote it : Most open pollinated seedlings are selfed.
I read that too in my hybridizing papers. So the chance of having open pollinated offspring from two neighbor plants is low.

I had pieces of plants rooting and showing up after I had the plant removed. Perhaps during original planting or weeding a piece got cut off, and it rooted.
Bernd

When we moved here from Arkansas 10 years ago there was not a singe hosta on the property. I can't say that the apparent seedling looks anything like either PG or OG. Instead it seems more like Whirlwind in color, variegation, leaf shape and it has tended to darken as the season progresses like WW. Whirlwind lives over 100 feet away under the Walnut tree.

Theresa's Angel is darker but is still noticeably variegated. I went out to take pics yesterday and it began to pour. I will do it today.

I know this is changing the subject but not entirely. Being a seedling I had no choice in where it is growing, very close the concrete foundation of the garage. I have noticed that hostas don't seem to do well located close to below ground concrete. My theory is that moisture leeches lime out of concrete making the soil too alkaline for their taste. Above ground masonry doesn't seem to be harmful though. 3 feet or more away from foundations and hostas have no problem. Anyone else notice this. Ken must have a gravel driveway if hostas grow on it.

Theresa