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arbo_retum

A Shady Area Where H. Will Not Grow?

arbo_retum
9 years ago

We have a few small garden beds under a mature hemlock (taller than a 2 story house). Partially under the hemlock's drip line, there is a ~20' area of linear stockade fence with a hedge of various ~ 12'H evergreens planted 5' out from the fence, which are the backdrop for a series of mixed borders.

I got the briliant idea, 3 Springs ago, to divide a mess of h. and plant them in that 5' deep wasteland.(Unknown variety, medium size, heart shaped green and white variegated leaves.) Well, imagine my surprise when, today, 3 years later, almost no hostas exist there. What the heck? I always thought of h. as the toughest thing on the planet!

The area gets no direct sun and there are no soaker hoses there. We planted the (~30)divisions with good compost , a little super phosphate, etc ,and watered well . And kept it watered. J painted fern live on one end edge of the area. We have not tested the soil, and i'm sure you would advise that, but i just wanted to ask if anyone has had any experience like this with an area of h. that would not 'take' for you? Thx much
mindy

Here is a link that might be useful: cotton-arbo retum website; free; open daily

Comments (7)

  • ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
    9 years ago

    too much water competition from the overly mature trees...

    not to mention all the roots you severed digging the holes .. and then filled the holes with nummy amended soil ... want to guess.. where the roots regrew the feeder roots???

    and when they did regrow the roots.. they sucked the life out of the hosta ... as H are heavy waterer users ...

    if you want to try again .. bare root hosta.. refill only with the soil you took out.. never fert only the hosta.. and broadcast all water.. trying to fool the trees into not knowing they are there ... and you still might not win unless you go with the true workhorse hosta ... like undulata ...

    ken

  • User
    9 years ago

    Hi Mindy. I visited your member page link and I think it is good that you are coming here.

    Hosta are the numero uno popular gardening ....hmmmm....perennially returning plant around. So in your business of perhaps advising or showing people what trees and shrubs are best to plant in their gardens, it is important for you to get it right with the most popular garden ornamental, our hostas. Hosta fans will love you forever if you show them which trees work best with their favorite plants, or how to deal with a less than perfect tree planting.

    There are lists of acceptable or "companionable" trees and large shrubs in the books on hostas, specifically in at least one of Mark Zilis' books.

    You've come to the right place to ask your question. Ken is a font of wisdom and wit, and wryness as well. Forum participants from all over pay attention to their hosta equally well--if it hasn't happened in one or more of these hosta lovers' gardens, you'll be hard put to get first hand observations elsewhere either.

    Probably the hosta you split originally was one of those workhorse undulatas that Ken mentions.

    I know about hemlocks. They suck the ground dry dry beneath their branches. Not even weeds grew beneath them. I was briefly in MA, zone 5b, and DH had 200 foot long HEDGE of Canadian hemlock that outgrew his energy to keep it small, soon to swallow the house I imagine. They were getting HUGE. I hope the people who bought the house are good friends with an arborist. :/ I know what is coming.

  • in ny zone5
    9 years ago

    I replaced my 2 hemlocks after pruning them to size for 20 years.
    In respect to planting hostas in root zones, there are 'spinout' bags which are coated on one side to repell tree roots. I use 10 gal bags and turn them over to have the coating on the outside.
    See a link.

    Here is a link that might be useful: spinout bags

  • ctopher_mi
    9 years ago

    Hi Mindy,

    Hostas are tough on their own, but they do like a lot of water and they don't tolerate any other root competition. That spot would be better suited to groundcovers like Canadian Ginger, Lamium, maybe Vinca, or a tough understory shrub like Kerria japonica.

    Good luck!

    Chris

  • Steve Massachusetts
    9 years ago

    Mindy,

    Check out the Hosta garden at Elm Bank. It's on the far side of the All-America Trial Gardens. It's planted under 4 fully mature Hemlocks. The way we get them to grow is to broadcast fert all over the entire area under the Hemlocks. We trim the Hemlocks up so that the Hosta get some morning sun, and we water the entire area with overhead sprinkling. We soak it because the Hemlocks have a tendency to suck up the water and nutrients. When adding plants to the garden, I try never to use small ones. I grow them for a year or more in another area or in a pot and then put in plants that have a few divisions on them before they go into the garden. This year the growth was so good that I had to take at least another two inches off the lawn onto which the Hostas were encroaching.

    Send me an email if you want more info.

    BTW, the Cotton Arbo-retum is on our "must do" list for garden visits next year. We'll be in touch.

    Steve

  • hostabff
    9 years ago

    Hi Mindy,
    Having lost a lot of trees since I went down the path of hosta collecting... I have discovered how important a little sun can be in growing hosta. For years I had hosta in deep shade and they barely grew. And of course I have some hosta I am trying to grow under maple trees that are sucking the life out of the hosta - see Ken's comments. I know you are not under maples, however I have no doubt that lack of sun and tree roots are the issue. My advice - put a collection of pots with shade loving annuals or display a beautiful garden ornament. I have visited your incredible gardens and know you are great at creating those types of focal points in your garden.

    By the way, I was recently looking through an issue of Garden Design and I saw your beautiful blue garden gate featured (the one on the home page of your website). Very nice! Robyn

  • arbo_retum
    Original Author
    9 years ago

    well, i had NO IDEA about hostas and shade(boy do i feel dumb) but i am so glad to learn all this from youall.
    Looks like more Research and Redesign ahead of me!
    thanks all of you.

    robyn, long time no see! iirc, some of your babies are hriving here! BTW, i know nothing about our gate being in Garden Design. Any way you could let me know the issue/pg?

    steve, all your advice makes perfect sense for me. will follow suit.

    chris, i agree w/ your experience w/ lamium and ginger (European works for me) but vinca is not tough or robust enough for me.Epimedium is terrific. And kerria- maybe it's the straight green japonica that you and (who was it, recently--Tony Avent or Louis or some public voice) think is dry shade tolerant, but i grow the variegata and yellow leaf kerria japonicas, and they will not hold up in really dry shade. You know what woody WILL ?--Rhodotypos/Jetbeard. That stuff is TOUGH toughtough. It reminds me of kerria j. in its stem and leaf, and its simple open single white flowers are one of my fav things of the year. i wish it had the visual density and height of hostas- for this impossible strip i was describing here. Acanthopanax might occur to some people, but IME it also cannot thrive in dry shade (even under J Maples phooey)