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Guns Don't Kill People..People...erm...

Posted by WxDano none (My Page) on
Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 15:57

Dog shoots man accidentally, police say
By JAY MEISEL : Highlands Today
Published: February 25, 2013

EBRING --

It's a case of dog shoots man, not man shoots dog. Well, sort of.

A Frostproof man reported to Sebring police on Feb. 23 that he was traveling in his truck when his dog kicked a gun on the truck's floor, resulting in him being shot in the leg, according to a report.

Sebring police ruled the shooting accidental, and apparently the victim was not seriously injured.

Sebring Police Cmdr. Steve Carr said police did not arrest the dog or detain the animal, pending the investigation. He said he has never heard of a case like this.

Gregory Dale Lanier, 35, the victim, told investigators that he thought the gun in his pickup truck was not loaded.

He said that he was driving on State Road 17 North "when his dog kicked his unloaded .380 pistol causing it to fire and the bullet struck his leg. Lanier said he heard boom, saw smoke and felt a burning in his leg."...


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Guns Don't Kill People..People...erm...

  • Posted by momj47 7A..was 6B (My Page) on
    Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 16:00

It's about time, this is long overdue, too.


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I saw this and loved the picture and caption on my FB. "Try prying this gun from my cold dead paws."

Not so funny was the grandma who shot her two baby grandkids today, one who was celebrating his 2nd birthday. OR the two cops mowed down today by a peeping tom.


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Not so funny was the grandma who shot her two baby grandkids today,...R the two cops mowed down today by a peeping tom.

All we hear about in the librul media are the white flag-lovin' homeowners who patriotically defended their property agin' intruders.


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Idiot. Irresponsible idiot without a lick of common sense.

Reminds me of the idiots who place their digits over the gun barrel, then are surprised when they're being rushed to the hospital to have a thumb or finger reattached... no common sense or sense of safety.


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  • Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
    Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 17:03

Posted by lily31

"Not so funny was the grandma who shot her two baby grandkids today, one who was celebrating his 2nd birthday."---------------Late term abortion?


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Guns don't kill grandkids, grandmas kill grandkids.

-Ron-


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  • Posted by momj47 7A..was 6B (My Page) on
    Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 19:07

No, grandmothers with guns kill grandkids.

Heartbreaking


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almost as funny as Al Gore peeking down thje barrel of his M16 40 years ago. Guess he never wised up.

But I have to wonder why he had a round chanmbered, or why wasnt his .380 on safe at the least? bad things happen when ya dont pay attention.


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I heard about the grandmother and the babies. Supposedly she was bipolar and off her meds, and actually kidnapped the kids from daycare. Heartbreaking is right.

I also heard about the dog "shooting" his owner down in Florida. JG, what's with people down there???? Is there ANYONE down there that has any gun responsibility??? LMAO Last week, someone puts his magazine in the oven, and this week he leaves his gun on the floorboard of his truck so his dog can take aim!

On a little more serious note, I saw this graphic come across my Facebook page a few minutes ago, and it got me thinking-- what they were talking about. What I came up with was Wounded Knee:

Photobucket


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Exactly, Bill... this is one instance in which I can't and won't stand with the alarmists.

Murder happened before the advent of firearms... it's not the weapon; it's the intent.


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Switch drone for guns.

A federal judge issued a 75-page ruling on Wednesday that declares that the US Justice Department does not have a legal obligation to explain the rationale behind killing Americans with targeted drone strikes.

We haven't come so far.

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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Hey! Good segue gang.

-Ron


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Switch drone for guns.

Photobucket


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  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 20:44

I have a question for the gun owners .... how many rounds does a police revolver/gun hold?

They have released the videos of the cops involved in a shooting here and the one they showed on the news fired "49" rounds into the car, he actually jumped on the hood of the car and fired several into the windshield, during the interview it seems he does not remember much about that night except he "was very scared" Oh and by the way he is an ex marine iraq war vet.

137 rounds were fired into the car killing the two UNARMED occupants after a car chase.

So if he fired 49 of the above rounds how many times did he need to reload?


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Okay- nevermind Florida civilians.. we've got our OWN screwed up stories, nd it's a state pollice lieutenent!

Here is a link that might be useful: Maine state trooper’s handgun discharges during staff meeting Wednesday


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OM-- a revolver will typically hold 6 rounds. As for a pistol, the most that most common service pistols will hold is 19 rounds, and depending on the caliber, it could be as little as 7-9 rounds (for a .45 ACP)


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  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Wed, Feb 27, 13 at 20:51

Thanks Bill ...


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and most cops are'nt too good on the speed reload.


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Fancifowl: make sure you tell the families of the two officers killed that it was because they don't speed load. Couldn't have anything to do with the type of weapon their killer had. Your compassion and empathy for others is astounding.


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Its an arms race. Once the bad guys get more powerful weapons with bigger magazines, then the cops need them as well.

They make speed loaders for revolvers. A famous bank robbery case in Denver revolved (pun intended) around someone who robbed a major bank, shot all the guards with a revolver, and used a speed loader in the process. The chief suspect was a retired security guard, but they never could prove it.

Here is a link that might be useful: link to article about the bank robbery


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  • Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
    Thu, Feb 28, 13 at 13:55

Posted by lily

I saw this and loved the picture and caption on my FB. "Try prying this gun from my cold dead paws."

Not so funny was...OR the two cops mowed down today by a peeping tom.
---------------------------------------------------------------------

The peeping Tom could have been put in prison for a long time for a previous gun related crime, including discharging the weapon, but was not.
As has been said, many, many, many, many times--we do not need more laws, just enforce the ones that exist.
------------------------------------------------------------

In 2008, Goulet was accused and convicted of a sex crime, allegedly filming an unsuspecting Portland, Ore. woman in the shower. When the victim's boyfriend later tried to apprehend Goulet, Goulet fired a handgun during a struggle.

Portland resident Danny Thomas said he was the one who fought Goulet after catching him spying on his girlfriend. Thomas said the struggle lasted about 20 minutes, with a gathering crowd refusing to intervene �" a fact that garnered media attention.

“I approached him and everything kind of went down,” Thomas said. “He shot the gun off a couple of times, and I bit part of his ear off.”

Thomas said Goulet was charged with several crimes, but was acquitted of the most serious �" attempted murder. After the dispute with parole officer, Thomas added, Goulet asked to be locked up for two years rather than abide by parole meetings and conditions of release.

Thomas continued to check up on Goulet's whereabouts, searching for him as recently as a few weeks ago. Asked whether he was surprised by Tuesday's shooting, he said no.

“Absolutely not. I feel horrible for the families of the police officers,” Thomas said.

He then added: “To me and my family, this is mostly a relief.”

A jury convicted Goulet of the peeping incident and of not having a permit for a concealed weapon, and he was ordered to undergo sex offender treatment. Goulet admitted on the stand that he liked to secretly record women using his cellphone, according to a story in the Oregonian newspaper.

Goulet later ended up in jail after a disagreement with his probation officer, refusing to answer questions during an appointment and then refusing to leave the premises. The article noted that Goulet peered into the windows at his probation officer's building.


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  • Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 2, 13 at 13:52

Uncle Joe knows best

http://www.gunauction.com/news/index.cfm/march-01-2013/women-take-joe-bidens-buy-a-shotgun-advice


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I still say we're not looking at the issue realistically, or fixing the holes we could fix...

Our Justice and prison system need to be looked at. Overcrowding and plea bargains are issues.

Our health care and facilities for mentally ill need to be looked at. None of the people involved in purposeful shootings are in their right mind. These are not reasonable, rational thinking people.

And as far as accidents go... they are accidents. Some are caused by stupidity, some by carelessness or ignorance or safety, etc.

And,,, have we discussed exactly what constitutes an "assault" weapon?

What about the laws that already exist? Are we enforcing them? Why is it that so many criminals wander the streets armed with illegal weaponry, yet the ire is always aimed at those persons who safely and responsibly own and use guns?


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RpR-- thanks for that. I needed the laugh!


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I would bet( a small amount) that even the anti gun crowd knows better, they just cant quit the argument no matter how silly they look.


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I think the pro-gun crowd has lost; just haven't seen the results yet. Not the loss of the right to bear arms, just the moral high ground as the crowd becomes painted with the tar brush of the NRA and other extremist groups.


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RE: what make it an assault weapon??

Jodik, what gun people know to ba an assault weapon is far different from what the gun banners like to think constitutes an assault weapon.
They cant make up their minds from yeat to year but they started out calling any black rifle an assault weapon,. They then became more unclear in their dislikres. An adjustable stock, a threaded muzzle, a pistol grip, a verticle forward grip a barrel shrouud and a magazine which can hold over 7-10 rounds, . All of these things they deem evil?/ Why? who knows? an adjustable stock enables proper fit for different clothing or body size. A threaded muzzle allows for interchangeable ch9oke tubes to adjust for game speci3es and allows a compensator to be threaded to the bbl to assist in muzzle jump, not all barrels can be ported nor do some want holes in their barrel proper. A pistol grip? well, thats how ya hold the darn weapon, a verticle front hold can take the place of a bi-pod, tri-pod or bench for stability while shooting. The barrel shroud allows air flow arouind the barrel to sassdit in cooling the barrel. How any of these individually, or collectivly make any weapon more lethal defies rational thinking. The gun granbbers only use these things as an entry to demonizing more guns in the future.
They prey on lawful gun owners because they cant seem to do anything about the criminal element. And they sure dont show any signs of trying.


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I think the pro-gun crowd has lost

As long as you have people like Sarah Brady and Diane Feinstein, Eric Holder, etc. leading the charge, we have nothing to worry about re the moral high ground.


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Did the gun rights jerk in Colorado who used his office computer to make racial slurs and physical threats against a state legislator - a black woman who son was shot and killed by gang bangers as he was going to testify - make the national news?

You can read the threats at the link.

And best of all, he hired two attorneys who went on TV and started complaining that his First Amendment Rights were being attacked.

Not exactly the moral high ground.

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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I must say, Fancifowl, there hasn't been a lot of rational discussion on the issue, in my opinion.

The dictionary defines "assault" as a violent attack... and in that vein, I suppose one could say all guns are assault weapons IF they're used in a violent attack. By that definition, however, we have to add anything that can be used to violently attack another human being... hammers, baseball bats, box end wrenches, D cell batteries or rolls of nickels, tire irons, chain saws, and a long list of other equally deadly weapons that could be used to violently attack someone. Virtually anything could fit this definition.

If I'm out hunting in areas with populations of large predators or other dangerous animals, I know I wouldn't want to be there without a decent rifle of high caliber that I can swiftly aim and shoot accurately enough to defend my life. A semi-automatic would be nice, just in case a pack predator is the threat. Black or grizzly bears can be a threat, as can large cats. Badgers, martens, rattle snakes, rabid animals... there are still a lot of places where the threat of coydogs, wolves, bobcats, or bears is very real.

There are many areas where a stocked grocery store is not right around the corner, and one is dependent upon hunting for survival.

But even as an urban or city dweller, I'd still like to be able to defend my safety and that of my family from any possible danger. Even if I never have to pull that trigger, the knowledge that I have the wherewithal to ensure our safety is good enough. Preparedness is a good thing.

The color of a gun is completely irrelevant. Most of the things you mention, Fancifowl, are irrelevant to the issue. What IS relevant, but seldom mentioned, are the social issues that are at the root of all the problems.


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The dictionary defines "assault" as a violent attack... and in that vein, I suppose one could say all guns are assault weapons IF they're used in a violent attack.

Guns, knives, cars, bats, pitch forks, whips, bows, spears, branches, rocks, .....


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Jodi, you forgot to add moose (esp. the cow), elk, wild pigs, escaped lions and tigers, alligators and escaped crocs. The list of dangers are unending, dear. Oh yes, bucks in rut.


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You're absolutely correct, Marshallz. We could increase this list by a lot and we'd probably still forget some danger that might be faced out in the wild... depending only on what part of the world we're in. Elephants, hippos, hyenas, etc...

That list, Bill, could be added to without end. Anything and practically everything could be an assault weapon in the right hands, if the object is used in a violent attack.

Ball point pens, hat pins, forks, frying pans, bowling balls, flower pots, pitch forks and other garden implements, etc...

Guns are probably the most convenient or the quickest way to commit a violent assault upon another human being while assuring that assault in retaliation won't happen, but it's still the intent behind the attack and the mental frame of mind of the attacker that are the root causes.

Murder, violent assault, and war took place long before the invention of guns or gun powder, and such acts won't stop just because such tools are removed from society. Where there is intent and lack of conscience to stop such actions, they will continue.

Without fixing the root causes within society, violent assault is inevitable.


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For the vast majority of people, violent assault leading to death or serious injuries is not very common; in most countries rather rare in fact. Please don't bring up examples from war zones and civil strife, nor cite a hundred examples taken from the lives of 300,000,000 people. Yes, if you live in a dangerous area, please be armed. For most of us, we are more in danger crossing the street.


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That list, Bill, could be added to without end. Anything and practically everything could be an assault weapon in the right hands

That is EXACTLY the point I've spent hours upon hours, typing HUNDREDS of posts, over countless threads, since 2004 (just in THIS forum), trying to get across. It's nothing more than a political term used to strike fear into people and turn them against specific weapons, just by their color, or innocuous features. And rather successfully, I might add.


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And,,, have we discussed exactly what constitutes an "assault" weapon?

The gun manufacturers seem capable of working around even the most well intentioned and carefully worded regulations. And of course the Right Wing of the NRA love to make the definition of an assault weapon (such as the 1994 Assault Weapons ban) into a moving target....all in an effort to avoid banning the manufacture and sale of any weapon to anyone.

Of course there can be no perfect definition of a weapon that has not yet been built, correct?
Having recognized that, this is an issue that needs some compromise and cooperation from gun owners and from gun manufacturers. It certainly would help if they joined in to help craft a sensible limitation on what kind of firepower civilians should be able to purchase lawfully.

I am not a weapons expert but what was the problem with the 1994 weapns ban which was the law for 10 years. I didn't hear much from the NRA or from people who purchased fire arms during than period. Perhaps that can be tweaked and the major gun manufacturers can agree to abide by the letter of that law.

I have heard that there is no difference in what kind of weapons people carry vs. what kind of weapons Police have. Do you really believe that?
Or do you think that Lanza could have shot up Kindergarten so efficiently with a lesser capable weapon?
How about Loughner? Wasn't his massacre interrupted when he tried to load another clip?

If you want to take the position that ANY weapon is lawful to manufacture and that it is lawful to then sell it to any one, I guess we part ways on this issue.
How about a shoulder mounted rocket propelled grenade launcher? If you have a Bushmaster and are robbing me, don't I need something more deadly to protect my freedom? How about a bazooka?


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Bill, you and Jodi and other defenders of semi-automatic weapons fail to sway those wishing to limit and even ban these weapons. Why? Because you insist that it is not the fault of these weapons.That these are not dangerous if properly handled and deployed.

Yet you cannot deny the misuse and mishandling of such weapons even by people supposedly trained in the proper storage and handling of such weapons, leading to injuries and deaths of the innocent. Yes, there are hundreds of other potential "weapons" you all love to haul out as potential killers of innocents. All or most have one to many other uses while weapons are designed to kill or give the thrill of competitive shooting. When was the last time you heard of a bat competition mimicking bashing of skulls and breaking of limbs/

Got to meet son for dinner. I will be baaaack.


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Marshall, if it were the rifles, they've been aorund IN CIVILIAN HANDS since the late 60's. Why all of the sudden are they NOW being used? Because of the hype on tv and in video games. They're the so called "tough" weapon. Get rid of them, and something else takes that title, and being that what's left is a whole lot more destructive than what's being taken off the street, I shudder to think what would happen. This is why I fight so hard. The arguments make no sense. The ones that DO make sense, if you've noticed, I've been willing to go along with.


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Instead of trying to define what an assault weapon is, perhaps the onus should be placed upon weapons manufacturers. They should be compelled to obtain approval from the government before manufacturing and selling ANY weapon or ANY type of ammunition or ammunition clip.
The manufacture of any ammunition, weapons or adaptors by a unlicensed gun manufacturer would be illegal.

The next question would be who would sit on a Government board tasked with certifying weapons and who would hear any appeal from their decisions. I don't think that would be difficult to set up. I would want a physician and a few law enforcement officials on such a board along with representatives from Congress. The standards for approval would be written into law, but not the hardware. That seems much more doable, IMO.


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And still, no one wants to discuss the elephant in the room... the reasons WHY a person might assault another with deadly intent, or what type of person uses weaponry in a violent and unlawful manner.

I've owned all kinds of guns in my lifetime, and it's never occurred to me, not even once, to march into a crowded venue and begin violent assault against a group of people. Why do you suppose that is?

Meanwhile, in another thread: "So some people on welfare are scamming the govt... It is not food stamps that CAUSE people to misbehave. The CAUSE is flawed human nature!"

Hmm... except for a word or two, that sounds mighty familiar...


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Horsepuckets. We have had thread after thread on the subject of flawed human beings and the Constitutional limits put on by the courts on identifying and tracking the nutters and the rage-filled and revenge-minded types "going postal."


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Once again: paint them pink, and the problem should go away. Then we'd know just to be on the lookout for tweener girls. Profiling them, as it were.


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Without an incompetent or mentally disturbed person to pull that trigger, what is it?


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We would know more about crimes committed with guns but the NRA successfully shut down the CDC research into the subject in 1996. If there's a lack of solid, verifiable information on the subject, you can thank the NRA.

Censorship, pure and simple, to protect the profits of one industry.

Gun violence is a public health issue.


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My gr daughters M & P is pink camo, ugly as sin to me!


The Remington 7400 is a semi auto in production for decades, as are the Winchester 100, the Ruger der Slayer, and the browning semi auto rifles. There are many more similar. What they have in common with the AR types is they all function in the same way, as do many many shotguns. Yet due to a more modern ergonomic appearance they are called evil by the banners. Its a people problem, the society is in decay. I will not allow myself to be compared to murderers, gang bangers and other human garbage just because I like guns and exercise my RIGHT to own them without infringement. Of course we already do have resonable limits on what a civilian can own. Now we need some reasonable enforcement of exixting laws.


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I've never cared for the color pink, myself. Too girly. Combine it with camo and it's downright ugly, in my opinion.

Exactly so, Fancifowl... I'm no lunatic murderer or criminal devoid of values, and I resent being classified as such just because I am knowledgeable and capable of handling firearms, not afraid to do so, and safety conscious enough to never have had an accident related to the weapons I own and use.

If I could bring down a deer by throwing flowers at it, I'd do so... but that's not realistic, and won't help fill my freezer with meat for winter survival.

I live in a state that has incredibly strict gun laws already... what more do people want? Well... we could enforce those laws and quit plea bargaining every felony down to a misdemeanor... for starters.

They're still ignoring the growing elephant in the room... a decaying society containing mentally incompetent people and criminals...


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  • Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
    Mon, Mar 4, 13 at 13:16

Posted by heri_cles

"If you want to take the position that ANY weapon is lawful to manufacture and that it is lawful to then sell it to any one, I guess we part ways on this issue.
How about a shoulder mounted rocket propelled grenade launcher? If you have a Bushmaster and are robbing me, don't I need something more deadly to protect my freedom? How about a bazooka?..."---------------------------That is an asinine analogy of desperation and ignorance.

It makes anyone who uses it,, look stupid but of course that is why it is often farted out of the cheeks of Democrats as they are not the brightest bulb in the bunch.

A: Anyone, who is not a criminal, who wants to really own a bazooka can, if one pays the price and deals with the legal paper work and gets the proper permit.(Not as hard, or expensive, as you think)

B: Rocket launchers use exploding ammunition which is illegal across the board. (Including said same for rifles and shotguns)
Now one can get a permit for said same but it costs a bit more than a standard class 3.


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There have always been mentally incompetent people, angry people, violent people, criminals.
The difference is that now is that many more have easy access to deadly weapons.
We can't eliminate mentally ill people or control anger and rage by law. We can try to start working down the number of the most deadly weapons that are being manufactured.
That is going to happen, sooner or later, just like the way we are starting to whittle down on new tobacco users.
You can choose to stand your ground, but the world is changing around you.


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Today's version of just how easy it will be for the True Patriots to take on Gub'mint tyranny.

Thanks to Bush and his new Homeland (<==shades of pre-wwII Germany) Security department, Obama has now bought 2,700 MRAPs for, you know, dropping off SWAT teams. Has nothing to do with spending billions to keeping the MRAP manufacturers in bid'ness, I'm sure.

But me? With my AR15, I'll take 'em on. Yea. Just watch.

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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In fact, its more difficult to get any weapon now than in the past. It used to be possible to order from Sears or Herters or many other mail order catalogs any gun one might want. Any kid could walk into any hardware store and get ammo.

Come on David, you're better than that!

You're right heri, things do change. Most of todays weaponry will be wlorn out, lost or just plain junk in 200 years and the 100 year supply of ammo in private hands will be gone. Some timeschangrs are for the better, some times not so good. As long as I am on this earth, I will exercise my rights, I bet my children will do the same. The time may come when only those powerful few will have arms, few are gonna like it.

Right now Germany is working towards full registration of all weapons, and uinder EU rules, all EU countries must do the same. The UN is working very hard to include the USA but as yet there is plenty of resistance. A few more socia;list leaders like B-rock OO Bama and they will accomplish that goal.


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B-rock OO Bama

Talk about disrespect for the president and the office of the President of the United States.

and with that kind of name calling you want people to listen to you and believe that you know what you are talking about?


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RE: Guns Don't Kill People..People...erm...

No, we can't eliminate those people who have issues... but we can help them or contain them properly instead of loosing them upon the public for various reasons... overcrowding of prisons, lack of funding for proper rehabilitation, lack of access to health care, etc. These are problems.

Laws already exist that limit who can and who can't own weapons in many states. We've been over this before.

In Illinois, where I live, a check is done on everyone to ensure they don't show up in any data bases anywhere that would suggest they were convicted felons, committed to an institution for mental or drug treatment, etc. BEFORE they can legally purchase weapons or ammunition.

There's also a waiting period before a purchased weapon can be picked up at the point of purchase.

If I sell you a gun, I am legally obligated to record your valid FOID number and other details of the transaction or I can be held responsible for your actions with that weapon and do time in a penitentiary.

These are just a few safety features that help ensure guns are only placed in responsible, reasonable, legal hands.

A few people that are not competent happen to steal or otherwise obtain weapons they have no business having, commit crimes with them, and suddenly there's a nationwide panic and paranoia.

No, Heri... the world is changing around EVERYONE. The difference is that you are depending on others to belay your fears, keep you safe, and defend your life... while I am not.

The criminal element is not to going to diminish in number, nor are those with issues such as mental incompetence or drug or other abuses... in fact, it's safe to say that as our population, our society increases, so does the decay from within.

As climate change becomes an increasing force, the government's inaction to acknowledge or formulate a plan to rectify this issue has made a lot of people believe that some sort of apocalypse is coming, ranging from natural disasters to EMP attacks, and everything in between. The point is, Many Americans now are arming themselves, taking gun and survival classes, and preparing for what they see as the end of the world... in numbers far larger than ever before seen. These are not criminals. These are not incompetent men and women. These are god fearing Americans with an extreme outlook on the possible future of our world.

Only about 1% of preppers are planning on helping anyone else. The rest are planning to defend their property, food, water stores, other supplies, and their families with deadly force.

As our economy suffers, our job market worsens, our housing and mortgage problems increase, or austerity measures fail, our homeless population grows, inner city crime increases, the changing climate affects food production... as the wealth in our nation becomes ever more concentrated in only a few hands, what do think will happen? Crime will rise exponentially... mainly out of a need for basic survival.

This is the future that's on its way. The writing is pretty much on the wall. I can't imagine how so many don't see it and are so willing to hand every right and freedom over to a government that isn't concerned about the individual, and will use military and police force to keep peace... peace through superior firepower, that is.

Our natural resources are dwindling. How long will it be before fresh water is a valuable commodity? How long will it be until the wildlife to hunt or fish is no longer available? How much longer will farmers be able to produce the amount of food the nation needs if drought conditions persist or increase?

You can't possibly think that you'll be safe without any form of protection if our nation goes the way of others.

The bottom line is... whether we want to accept it or not, the world is changing... you're right, there, Heri... but it's not changing for the good, as you seem to see. Everything is increasing... crime, poverty, ignorance, populations, the spread between wealthy and poor, joblessness, homelessness, drug and alcohol abuse, weather patterns and storms, land that can't be farmed, drug cartels, etc...

Why would you want to place your very safety, your very survival, in the hands of your admittedly corrupt government and their police force?

If we do not repair the underlying problems within our degrading society, Heri, it's not going to matter much what we do... we'll be fighting for our very existence. It may not happen tomorrow, or the day after that, but I don't logically see a world that suddenly turns around and repairs its environment, gains sudden compassion for all the homeless and unemployed, and lives happily ever after in some rainbow hued fantasy land.


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RE: Guns Don't Kill People..People...erm...

well by your standards then, littleone, the left was 100% dis-credited when Bush was the president, right?


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Seriously, though, what does Homeland security need with 2700 new mine-resistant military vehicles?

Ah, edited to find out who makes these things. At the link.

At $500,000 base, before they add anything at all, some serious money in them thar bomb resistant police cars.

Here is a link that might be useful: link

This post was edited by david52 on Mon, Mar 4, 13 at 15:47


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buying more union votes???

Or maybe just some department shuffling of funds?? or, we keep an eye on anything this administration is up to.


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Just this very moment, PIX11 on the east coast is reporting the story of a hit and run driver that fled the scene of an accident he caused in which a young couple and their unborn baby were killed. The driver who fled the scene is a convicted felon several times over, for offenses ranging from DUI, armed robbery, to actual murder. Tell me how it is that this individual is still free and walking around, able to commit any new crimes he sees fit?

These are the kinds of criminals that commit violent assaults on others.

These are the individuals that society should fear and do something about... not the responsible gun owner with a clean record that uses his weapons as they were intended.

This is a clear example of the social decay we're talking about, and the problems that could easily be fixed... if only the paranoid keening would stop for a moment so the real issues can be identified and discussed.


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Occupy Wall Street might be planning a spring offensive, using IED's.


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David-- the scary part of that AK is that is a real weapon that is mass produced. Even scarier is Norinco isn't the only company doing it.

Photobucket

Sig Sauer put out their Hello Kitty P-226 9 mm last year, and through a good friend of mine that works for Sig, I sent the CEO a scathing email about manufacturing deadly firearms made to look like toys and attractive to children. Never did get an answer back (go figure), but atleast I had my say. Ruger's another one. They don't do the Hello Kitty format, but they DO put out a .22 that's pink in color.


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You have to register your CAR! You have to have car INSURANCE. You have to get your DRIVER'S LICENSE *renewed*. Why aren't lethal weapons at least as regulated as cars?

No, we can't stop some people from driving illegally, but we TRY. How is it different for something MADE to kill?


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Driving is a priveledge. Defending one's self is a right. Apples and oranges.


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I dont care who knows where my car is, or how many or what kind of car I have. My guns are MY business and no body elses. If I misuse my vehicle I can lose the privelege of driving it, if I misuse my gun I can lose the right to own it. No body has a right to either if I use them properly.
Many manufacturers are coloring guns these days. Partially, its like anything else, marketing and keeping up with the times. Several years ago I thought the AR types were ugly and I'd never want one Now I now their practicalitiy. My 7 year old gr daughters new Savage .22 is neon green!


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Exactly, Fancifowl... thank you.


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SOB -- more deflections, this time color coded and accessorized for the junior set.


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kids have always enjoyed shooting sports, now there are more guns sized for their smaller frames. Same for female shooters, thus, adjustable stocks.


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You know, Bill... I've been thinking about it, and not only is pink a color liked by a lot of women, and not just little girls... Hello Kitty is also a logo seen worn and liked by adult females. So, I'd have to say that there's nothing wrong with a company trying to appeal to a wider clientele. It's not like children can buy firearms.

And, you have to admit that there's nothing wrong in teaching our offspring to respect and properly use firearms at an early age. I would never keep guns in my home the way I do without knowing that everyone who had access to them was fully aware of the safety issues and the responsibility involved in handling them... which is precisely why we insisted on hunter's safety courses for every member of the family, and why my husband spent so much time teaching and closely supervising the kids through target practice and small game hunting.

It was important to us that they learned to respect the tools used to hunt, and the life taken while hunting, not to mention proper harvesting of game. We're not trophy hunters... we hunt to eat. Safety, respect, and responsibility are all crucial aspects of the subject.

Now, if those companies advertised such products on mainstream television and directly aimed their ads at children, then I'd take huge issue with it! It's a parent's decision whether or not to purchase firearms, and whether or not to teach their children the respect, safety, and responsibility that goes along with handling such items.

Personally, I don't care for pink or Hello Kitty items, so those sorts of things don't appeal to me. A gun is utilitarian, as far as I'm concerned, and I'd prefer it had a more utilitarian finish... but that's just me.

And Fancifowl makes an excellent point... it's much safer overall if the weapon you're using is better fitted to your frame and hand size... and that's precisely why weapons are manufactured for women and children of various ages. The guns our boys hunted with as youngsters are no longer usable to them, and will be passed on to the next generation.

I don't know what the big deal is... kids who are properly taught and supervised often do enjoy shooting sports. So do many adult females.

Accidents happen when we DON'T teach safety and respect for weaponry. I'll never understand how people who have never even held a gun can profess to know so much about the intricacies of shooting sports and the tools used therein, and automatically deem such things bad for everyone.

Cars and guns ARE apples and oranges... although, and yet again... most guns legally purchased ARE recorded or registered, depending on the state one lives in.

Here, in Illinois, there's a paper trail leading to every gun sold legally. And by holding a valid FOID card, I AM licensed to own and use firearms, in a manner of speaking. I live in one of the strictest states when it comes to guns and gun laws.

I'd be fine with every state lining up and having the same set of laws and regulations. There's nothing I need to do with guns that I can't do now... except for concealed carry, for which I'd need a permit and specific training.

The huge to-do regarding firearms is nothing more than fear mongering and overactive paranoia. We don't hear anywhere near as much crowing about all the lives lost to alcohol consumption, or heroin addiction, or gang banging, or any number of other dangers within our decaying society. Why is that, I wonder?

One more time... laws only work when everyone abides by them. Every respectable, responsible hunter or gun owner does abide by the law. What good is writing and passing yet more laws when specific persons do not respect or follow the laws regarding weapons we already have in place? How are more words on paper going to solve the underlying social problems at the root of the issue? i'd really like to hear an honest answer to this.


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So, I'd have to say that there's nothing wrong with a company trying to appeal to a wider clientele. It's not like children can buy firearms.

You're right. I mean, what could possibly go wrong with real guns that look like pink, sparkly toys?


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Yes, I am sure policing agencies are pleased as punch at these stylistic "improvements."

I do appreciate that laws are only good when everyone obeys them. Odd that we have so many prisons and prisoners. Odd, isn't it? Jodi?


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  • Posted by RpR_ 3-4 (My Page) on
    Tue, Mar 5, 13 at 14:07

Here is how dangerous the ATF, oops, I mean guns are.

This special agent seized 30 toy guns.
I think they mean he was in the special class in school as he tries to insert a magazine backwards.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rEuTwYALho

It is odd how this did not makes the network news where every misspoken word by a conservative is trotted out.


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What's odd about having these people in jails? What should we do with the bad guys? I would say there are quite a few who should not be in prisons. They could be fitted with a tracking device, the non violent types that is.

Wish I could post photos of some of the bench rest and race guns Ive seen over the years. Some have paint jobs that would equal any hot rod paint job, and thats nuthin compared to the styles of some. Then there are the Hollywood and fantasy guns!! What ever trips yer triggers I say.


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Headed back to Homeland Security, there is a local kurfufle about declaring the Gunnison Sage Grouse an endangered species, which means placing some restrictions on habitat. This, of course, does not go over very well around here. At the meeting with the Feds, they brought along two "Homeland Security Agents" armed with rifles and wearing body armor, ostensibly to protect the sage grouse lovers.

So now when you want to have a rowdy, tea party shout-'em down at the gub'mint bureaucrats, they're bringing their own body guards.


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A gun is utilitarian, as far as I'm concerned

Jodi, I agree with MOST everything you said. But look at that Sig. To me, that LOOKS like a toy! God forbid a child sees that and thinks the same thing! It's already morbidly obvious by the headlines that there are all too many parents that don't put their weapons up when not on their persons. This would just be another attraction to a child. I can understand the pink fiber stocks. But not this. Hello Kitty is the logo for a child's toy, and has no place on a deadly weapon.


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