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Republican Feedback

Posted by citywoman2012 none (My Page) on
Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 1:01

Frank says I have lost all support of the Republicans on this forum. I guess I just don't understand how forums work
and if I have embarrassed any Republicans and made you feel uncomfortable I am terrible sorry.
I just say what I think and most times most people agree with me.
But I will have to say...most times they are Republicans agreeing with me.
Is the word racist usually thrown around so readily on this forum?
I guess I did come to the wrong place to discuss my views
on anything. Seems I stepped on toes.
To all Republicans and Independents please enlighten me if I come across as a racist .I will only believe it if it comes from posters on here who I know are honest and do not throw verbal slurs lightly.
I realize "they " call most Republicans names and that doesn't bother me when its me....but I would hate it if I thought as a conservative Republican I had embarrassed anyone of you .
Thank you
Sara


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Republican Feedback

I see myself as an Independent. I am pro-gun. I am against illegal immigration. Most other things, I certainly lean towards the left. So, as an independent, I think you come across as racist.
Do you feel better now?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Is the word racist usually thrown around so readily on this forum?
I guess I did come to the wrong place to discuss my views

Personal accusations have been throw around way too often here, and that should stop.


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RE: Republican Feedback

cw, let it roll off your back. Every conservative on this forum has been called a racist at one time or another. If that doesn't get you and you happen to live in the south...racist. Disagree with Obama...racist. Didn't vote for Obama...racist. Don't take it personally, when you have won an argument, you'll know it, the name calling begins.


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RE: Republican Feedback

You posted that Obama was elected because he was black, and because black men with billy clubs stood outside of polling places to ensure his election ... and you even have to ask if that is racist?

Seriously???


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 7:18

You posted that Obama was elected because he was black, and because black men with billy clubs stood outside of polling places to ensure his election

...and

Don't take it personally, when you have won an argument, you'll know it, the name calling begins.

....really MrsK ? Really ???

Surreal


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RE: Republican Feedback

MrsK I cannot believe that you would support the type of statement made by citywowman. I really am surprised.

I don't think politics has a thing to do with the reaction of some to the statement she made.


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)))RE: Republican Feedback

I was just thinking what an excellent opportunity this would be for the conservatives on the forum who criticize the liberal members for not calling out other liberals for over the top comments to do just that.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Posted by mrskjun 9 (My Page) on
Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 4:58

cw, let it roll off your back. Every conservative on this forum has been called a racist at one time or another. If that doesn't get you and you happen to live in the south...racist. Disagree with Obama...racist. Didn't vote for Obama...racist. Don't take it personally, when you have won an argument, you'll know it, the name calling begins.

*

Ditto.

This forum, as much as some apparently believe it is, is not some junior high group where someone has to be publicly excoriated or blackballed if they have opinions others to not agree with.

Everyone is entitled to their say, as long as they do it within the forum rules (which daily people do not) and the fact that some don't like what is said does not make it incumbent on others to gang up, verbally chastise the
offender" and ride them out of town.

Unless, of course, you have a junior high clique mentality.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 9:31

Et tu Demi ?

When you went to vote in 2008 there were black men with clubs ???

Okay if any democrat said some ridiculous thing like this I would be the first to say WTF are you talking about ??

The last thing I would tell them is they "won the argument".


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RE: Republican Feedback

I've said it before, but it's worth repeating.
Some people posting on this thread showed me their hand a looong time ago. Thanks for showing it to me again!


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RE: Republican Feedback

"When you went to vote in 2008 there were black men with clubs ???"

Nope, just the same set of septuagenarian and octogenarian poll workers that always work my precinct. Although I'm pretty sure the one was contemplating smashing the toes of Republicans with thin shoes with the wheels of her walker -- she just had that dangerous look in her eyes.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Obama is President of the Us because he is black.
Now, howl about that til nightfall but it is the truth and we all know it.
He wasn't elected on his merit. I think we all know why he was elected. Didn't I see black guys with billy clubs at the poll doors making sure what?
Anyone who says he isn't in the WH because of the color of his skin is spinning a yarn.
Sometimes I think there is so much hoopla over race because
it doesn't sit well with lots of folks because he was elected because of his skin color not his merit.
I think having a black President would have been a wonderful thing IF he had been put there by merit instead of by billy clubs and racism.
Now don't start calling me racist. Most times these posts become so full of name calling one can't find out what
others really think. "

To the same conservatives ("Republicans") addressed in this thread, please tell me how Citywoman's post, above, ISN'T racist?


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RE: Republican Feedback

CW, I am independent. No apology needed.

racist: "The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others."

Just recognizing that a person of any particular color did any particular thing, i.e., being voted for, or standing outside a polling place armed with clubs isn't inherently racist in itself.

CW didn't say "despite being black, Obama was elected", or "the men with clubs were threatening because they were black".

When a reader takes those statements and gives them attributes that CW didn't give them herself, i.e., racism, then what does that make the readers making the judgments about CW's statements? Are they racist (as defined above), or should they maybe take CW's statements at face value? No judgments, no reading more into them, just they are what they are. Her observations.

Fair enough? Or beat this dog to death one more time? CW does have a right to her opinion, thank God.


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RE: Republican Feedback

BTW, I responded but I am NOT a Republican.

I am not allowed to vote for a presidential candidate in today's election because of that.


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Pathetic Attempts

Elvis, you are exactly right.

People "see" what they want to see.
I do not believe that citywoman is a racist, and certainly one cannot logically conclude that by her statements, when deconstructed.

However, if one is prejudiced towards another person by their other opinions, if one has a political agenda, and if one responds based on their emotions or doesn't tend to think things clearly and logically, AND one feels a need to call other people names and accuse them unjustly, then they arrive at the conclusion that CW is a "racist."

Even so, you're not supposed to call people names like that on this forum, and certainly should not encourage others to call a person names.


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Never never land....

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 10:15

Stick a fork in me .. I am done !


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RE: Republican Feedback

Gee Elvis, so which is it?
Obama "wasn't elected on his merit. I think we all know why he was elected", CW's statement above which you apparently don't find racist in the least,
or
what you just posted on another thread:
"I'm more inclined to think that despite the prejudices the person of color may have faced in achieving that level, they made it, so they must be brilliant. Don't you think it would be fair to give that successful person a little credit instead of giving them a chip on their shoulder that just maybe isn't there at all?"


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RE: Republican Feedback

Black men with clubs at the polls??? Really? Cite your source, please, or get real.....


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Nope, just the same set of septuagenarian and octogenarian poll workers that always work my precinct. Although I'm pretty sure the one was contemplating smashing the toes of Republicans with thin shoes with the wheels of her walker -- she just had that dangerous look in her eyes."

That is really funny! Your precinct and my local supermarket can be dangerous places.

I didn't notice Sara's original post, but upon reading it now, it appears metaphoric (as in strong/overwhelming support from the black community). Are posters actually taking it literally? I would think that a quick call to the local police would be an end to voter intimidation, if the case.

I wouldn't discount the fact that there are some that voted for Obama because of his skin color, of course there are. But many or most did so because they believed in his merit.

Sara, you are entitled to put thoughts out here, without fear of embarrassing anyone. There are several far leftists that do so without worry, so join in the fray. If everyone had the same thoughts, life would be pretty boring.

Carry on!


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RE: Republican Feedback

WN: 2008 elections. Philly. Black Panthers. Google it if you like. No foolin'; it happened.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by vgkg 7-Va Tidewater (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 11:02

Yes, I recall seeing Hannity push this isolated incident as if it were nationwide. It appeared to me the the Panthers were present not to intimidate white voters from voting but rather to insure that black voters could vote without white thugs intimidating them. Nevertheless it was a typical non-issue that Fox loves to play up to elevate the adrenalin level of it's base viewers.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"it appears metaphoric (as in strong/overwhelming support from the black community"

Right. Just like one might say that there were women with billy clubs at the polling booths in support of Sarah Palin. Or wait .. no .. yeah, nobody would ever think to say that, because "women with billy clubs" is NOT A RACIST METAPHOR like the other is.

Honestly, do you folks even listen to yourselves sometimes??


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RE: Republican Feedback

I love these types of threads. As kwoods so wisely said - let them show their true colors.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Or wait .. no .. yeah, nobody would ever think to say that, because "women with billy clubs" is NOT A RACIST METAPHOR like the other is.


*

How many women do you see outside voting polls brandishing weapons?

Nothing racist, no metaphor, just a fact--Black Panther members, black men, self appointing themselves as "security"
outside a polling booth brandishing billy clubs.

If they'd been white and affiliated with the Ku Klux Klan instead of black of members of the Black Panthers we'd be hearing a different song and dance, now wouldn't we?


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RE: Republican Feedback

CP, I understand *racist* metaphors very well and intimating that there were black activists who were forceful in support says more about the men than the color. JMO


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RE: Republican Feedback

I was just thinking what an excellent opportunity this would be for the conservatives on the forum who criticize the liberal members for not calling out other liberals for over the top comments to do just that.

EXACTLY what I was thinking. I read cw's post before going to bed last night and was thinking exactly the same thing.

It is so dissapointing to me that the conservatives on this board are not even able to stand up to awful things if they are said by another conservative.

On another thread someone posted something about ignorant people in the south. Several liberal posters called her out for insinuating it was a southern thing. I was hoping to see the same thing here. So disappointing and the perfect example of what is wrong with our society. In my opinion it is NOT ok to express racists opinions in any setting. Disgusting.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Citywoman..Did you ever think back to 2000 when WHITE thugs descended by the bus loads from the north paid to go start up trouble and not allow the Democrats to finish counting the hanging chads in Florida? They pounded on the doors, snarling like pit bulls scaring the crap and intimating the workers who were doing their job. As a result the wonderful Supremes stopped the counting and "gave " the presidency to your guy, the biggest dunce and worse president in history. THAT'S intimidation at it's worse.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Maybe I didn't hear about that here in the frozen tundra, Lily. Where can I read about that? Scary stuff.

Anyway, whst cw said is true about the black guys and the clubs. Doesn't mstter who reported it, Veggie King, and if Fox was one of the reporters, so be it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"If they'd been white and affiliated with the Ku Klux Klan instead of black of members of the Black Panthers we'd be hearing a different song and dance, now wouldn't we? "

I don't believe you would. I believe that thinking people would decry either situation.

Yes it happened in one, or perhaps several,polling stations but to say that that is one of the reasons the President was elected is preposterous at best.

It had absolutely NOTHING to do with him being elected. How many republican voters were intimidated and turned away? Better have been over 10 Million because that is what the president won by!

To support a statement that the President was elected because he was black is outrageous. The barbs about liberals saying outrageous things and then all sticking together will never again have any meaning.

By the way, must a been a whole bunch of whites who voted for Obama because he is black. The States with the largest black populations, except for Florida and North Carolina, all went to McCain! Obviously those black thugs, and that's what they are, picked the wrong whites to intimidate!


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RE: Republican Feedback

Two black thugs? The bar set here for influencing an election is surprisingly low..Barak Obama got elected because white American had to vote for him because a couple of black thugs were seen at one polling place. Two guys so scary that no one called the police-though they should have. Yes, to believe this is a sign of racism. So this is a wake up call to you citywoman. We all have our racist and sexist beliefs and it is up to each and every one of us to uproot them without mercy so go to it. I have faith you can do it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I didn't read these comments on the original thread but must say that I'm shocked to read them now. I read them to DH and asked if he thought they were racist. His expression told me all (you have to ask?) and said, "Hellloo?". Two black men at ONE precinct, making sure the African-Americans who came to vote there were able to vote, with billy clubs (a little over the top but anyone who might want to intimidate the voters got the message, I'm sure), does not mean that everyone who voted for Obama was racist and voted for him because of skin color. Every white person I know who voted for him did so because the alternative (a dunce vice president, a heartbeat away from the presidency) was too horrible to contemplate. Does their voting for him make them racist?

And, no, Elvis, cw didn't write exactly what you wrote and said would be racist. She wrote something that could only be interpreted as racist. cw's remarks are either racist or extremely ignorant.

And, if African Americans turned out in record numbers to vote for him, why is that bad? Are you saying that they should have voted for a Republican, against their interest? If I were black, I would NEVER vote for a Republican. I'm a woman, and I would NEVER vote for a Republican today if that person were in favor of any of the anti-woman legislation being proposed and/or passed (Cathy McMorris Rogers from Washington being an example).


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RE: Republican Feedback

African Americans turned out in record numbers to vote for him

Dating back to the time of Roosevelt, there are very high percentages of the African American vote for the Democratic candidate for president. At one point during President George Bush's term in office, his approval rating among African Americans was so low that with the margin of error, he could have had 100% + disapproval rating.


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RE: Republican Feedback

You'd think they'd learn voting for Democrats isn't doing them much good, wouldn't you?

Still high poverty, high drop out rate, high teen pregnancy.


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Feedback on Republican Rhetoric

Demi, please; enough of the facile comments -- unless you believe that the Voting Rights Act was unimportant, and you can willfully ignore how many Republican administrations have been in power since Roosevelt.

One has only to cite the Republican rhetoric of the 2008 and 2012 election campaigns to have some insight as to why the majority of minorities - especially African Amercians - are loathe to support the Republicans.


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Vote for what?

No, Nancy, I do believe that the Voting Rights Act was much needed and much, much overdue.

I've heard ad nauseum from the Democrats how they intend to "help" minorities with special treatment and services.

What I've heard from Republicans is that everyone should be afforded equal opportunities so that they can help themselves if they choose.

Neither have done much to deliver.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 14:16

This is so friggin hilarious, I don't know what is funnier, the inane claim that "two black thugs" in "one city" skeered all the white folks into voting for Obama, or the ones who defend this insanity.

More than on definitely few over the cuckoos nest in HT...

Thanks for the "giggle"


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RE: Republican Feedback

thank you demi for my down deep belly laugh here at 12:00.
I read all post and thank you elvis for being able to interpret what I was trying to say.
Some of you understood I was trying to make a point.
I guess I should have included that yes, lots and lots and lots of white people voted for Obama.
But why wasn't Hillary Clinton the candidate?
I would have voted for Hillary . She was by far the best choice. So, that was the point I was trying to make.
I want to say up front to the few on here who never name call ...who will discuss topics even if they don't agree that I admire your courage in the wake of the backlash it could cause from the peanut gallery.
Also to the right...sitting in the common sense section...I salute you .
Obama was chosen over Hillary and Hillary would have been the better President by a loooong mile. I still say Obama is President because he is black. I have not backed down from that statement and that is not a racist comment at all.
If the better man HAD won on merit Hillary Clinton would be in the WH.
Also, I didn't ever say the reason he was elected was because of the Panthers with the billy clubs.
I was trying to make the point that some factions were going to make sure he was elected right there...in that particular voting poll if they had to beat the heck out of you to achieve that goal. Why else did they have billy clubs? I just say it as I see it.
If it makes some of you feel better to call me ignorant and racist...thats your prerogative.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"If it makes some of you feel better to call me ignorant and racist...thats your prerogative."

*

Actually, CW, it is NOT their prerogative according to the rules of this forum.


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Re Rules

Really Demi? I wasn't aware the forum had any rules.
I wish the forum guardians would take a stand on some of the name calling here then.
I think thats why so many of the people who use to post here
left. At one time there were alot of interesting discussions
on here and it did get heated but not nasty.
Several good contributors quit posting because of the few who just go ballistic I guess.
One does get tired of verbal abuse.
But I still enjoy being able to state my opinion and I always think I'm right. My husband said I always was lol.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Yeeeesss, CW--it's kinda strange, the nastiness. Clever barbs; okay, that goes along with spirited discussion. I think a lot of folks ended up at this site on this Forum because they hit it during a search for something else. Many of these posters haven't been members of GardenWeb long, have the same birthdate (!), and have no seed or plant trading lists. Also, the majority don't show up on other Forums. There are exceptions, and I figure they got here like me, scrolling down through the list of Forums and thinking "wonder what this is?"

I figured it was a group of normal gardening people. Silly me--that's not why they are using GardenWeb.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I think I love you elvis lol
Now away to my other life.
Have a good one!


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RE: Republican Feedback

I am very disappointed in some posters here within this thread.

It is certainly not uncommon for the more liberal posters here to disagree or even vehemently disagree with other liberal posters, even down to personal issues with that poster on stands they might take.

I did so with a poster here over comments regarding Romney and Mormonism, as did one or two other more liberally bent here. I have done it before with posters who are more liberal here regarding other issues.

In discussions, this happens with liberals or centerists with a liberal or conservative bent (used to be to be the hallmark definition of an Independents but, alas, no more) not infrequently.

I have often thought that conservatives DON'T do this but very extremely rarely, but have allowed to myself that I could also be prejudiced and not storing away the number of times it actually happens - a human reaction.

And yet, when this *perfect* time for conservatives to finally call another conservative out for their remarks, a couple (at least) of conservatives who I thought would certainly do so, if for no other reason that that of of personal accountability, they did not. They did exactly the opposite.

Of course Kate can say whatever she pleases. That is the point of the forum. That is NOT the reason or the point of why she started this thread, so please don't use that as part of this issue, it would be disingenuous. She has every right to say what she thinks as long as it's within the forum rules and she did so.

That she chooses to say what she said was never the point.

It is the perception of what is taken from what she said to be the point.

Only once do I recall any conservative disagreeing with another - in the case of FigDan. And it was very carefully worded,(and that is fine, actually good) - but that is THE ONLY time I ever recall an issue where a staunch conservative strongly calling out another one on their political stand or personal behavior which was a calling out of real merit. If I am incorrect, please link to the thread.

I challange all conservatives on this forum to re-think their comments on this thread and then come in again and either underline them again as words and ideals they choose to stand by, or decide to publically re-think their stated position.

It's easy to agree when you do not like a bunch of people on this site who think differently than you do OR you feel you have been abused by them, and perhaps you have. There has been a whole lot of back and forth by ALL which should be realized, nobody is innocent in this forum except for a VERY, very few. And they haven't posted on this thread as of yet.

It's a whole lot harder to break rank and say how you really feel, especially if you feel that others will no longer (insert word - I have at times) and worry about it (as I have at times) because you don't want to feel the alienation from those you personally like and/or feel an affinity with, which you know might happen if you say what you honestly think.

If there was ever a time to be true to yourself in a political forum, this is that exact moment in time that might not come around again. Being true to yourself and who you are is most important, be it in any forum or in the interactions with people in your life. It doesn't matter where it is, when its called for, it becomes who you are in how you choose to deal with it.

This woman obviously was trolling for support after a person who is the true Independent in my book called her out on her words. She was obviously upset and then came trolling for support. As much as I understand her desire for support, it was - to me - bad form.

If you really believe in yourself, you don't absolutely require support for a stand you take. If you are openminded and willing to be self aware, you take what has been said and carefully weigh it for accuracy and truth or even partial truth and if you are a self honest person and are willing to recognize ANY TRUTH AT ALL - you apply it either to yourself or even openly in the forum you participate in.

Not many have the guts to do this because it's HARD and requires a bit of humility, but I have seen it happen on occasion. With Sara, this was obviously never going to be one of those times.

Opportunity wasted.

What we say and what we don't or won't say defines who we are. Now is the time for personal definition in Hot Topics. What you say or don't say after this specific comment of mine will define for me who each of those who were previously supportive, actually are as a person.

It doesn't matter what I think but I feel it should matter a whole lot to the people who have supported her - IF in fact they disagree with her, even partially. If you supported her in this issue or let her THINK you were in support (even if that is not exactly what your specific words might have said = game playing) that is not being self true. I thought more of some of you.

Kate has every right to say what it is she thinks. She has every obligation to expect a response be it negative or positive, just like everyone else. We have all taken hits for what we have chosen to say in this forum and sometimes they were hard hits and sometimes they were deserved.

This particular thread and how it will go is really important to me, I really want to maintain the positives I have always thought was in each of you.

This is my own very honest opinion, I fully expect to have reactions to it also, both positive and negative, but I am willing to take it and evaluate them. But as far as what it is that Kate said, I consider it to be racist and think that there are conservatives here who agree with me if they are actually the people I have always thought them to be. But I could be wrong, am worried I am.

I follow it but will not comment in this thread or this issue regarding Sara's request for feedback again. It is what it's going to be.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Trying to follow your rap here, Mylab. We all know that people from "both sides" tend to come to the aid of one another. So is your point that everyone takes a stand against everyone else EXCEPT conservatives?

Second question: second paragraph from the end, did you mean to say that what Kate said is racist?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Mylab, I can appreciate your position but I don't dance to everyone's tune--my strings will not be pulled to say this or say that or agree with this or agree with this or disavow this or disavow that to prove my "worth" as a human being to you or anyone else.

In real life, perhaps--to an extent.
Certainly if anyone makes overtly racist comments, I will say something, and have.

This is a forum with many people with political agendas.
Some people, like me, pop in and out and don't even open many threads, or get tired or bored of a thread and don't even bother to open it back up.

It's hit or miss with me unless I'm truly interested in the discussion and for the most part, unless someone says nasty personal things about me, I'm not going to comment negatively about anyone after they post, when they post within the rules of this forum.

That is their right--it's not my right to call them names if I don't agree with them, it's not my right to assess or assail their character if I don't agree with them. It's not my place to tell everyone what I think of them personally after they make a post.

That's why I have never become too involved unless I see someone continually picking on someone for no reason, and harassing them.

So, regardless of what you think, what I don't say in this case does not define me. If I start that, I'd be here forever being chastising for not "calling out this person" or "calling out that person."

We are are entitled to our opinions and you don't see me "calling out" liberals for many of their positions.

I'm a more live and let live person, you believe what you want, I'll believe what I want, and I won't assume the worst about you and I won't call you names.

But start in on me, you're likely to get it back (not you personally). That's been me since I've been on this forum and will continue to be.

So, I'm not going be held to your standard of how I should participate on this forum, only mine and Gardenweb's.

I truly hope you don't think as ill of me as you say you will, but that's the way I roll/don't roll.

Life is too short and too precious to worry about what any of you think about me, when if you met me you'd probably like me if you didn't know that I believe fervently in justice and personal responsibility.

I can also tell you that the older I get the less black and white most issues are, and that I don't dismiss people as not as good as me or good enough to associate with just because they happen to believe differently than I do.

Peace,

Demi


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RE: Republican Feedback

Obama won over Hillary because more people voted for him in the primary.

Obama won over McCain because more people voted for him in the national election.

That's how Obama became president. Not because he was black. In both elections a lot of white people voted for him as well as a lot of black people.

Cannot understand why you think that so many white people voted for him "just because he is black". I voted for him and I am white and there were no thugs at my poll. I voted for him over Hillary.

Your "logic" just appears to be your "opinion", which you are certainly entitled to. But my opinion is that you're wrong. People voted for Obama because they liked what he had to say or they didn't like what the other opponent was saying.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Frank says I have lost all support of the Republicans on this forum. I guess I just don't understand how forums work"

Hi Citywoman,

I'm a conservative, independent voter, and delighted that you are here! (elvis, too!)

Conservatives here are a minority. What happens with minorities is that their presence is not always welcomed by everyone in the majority. We see that here every day.

But that's not our problem, is it?

It's good for the folks who promote "spreading the wealth around" to try it out themselves once in a while. Here. On this SHARED forum.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Oh my, the arbiters of fairness and truth are chastising others for not seeing things in exactly the same way they do. CW has already said she is not a racist, but because of her post some are more than willing to put that label on her. The usual "suspects" it seems. Whether I agree with her view or not, she is most definitely entitled to that view, and should expect that those who disagree can do so without name calling. Yes, I do disagree with that view, but it was made impossible for me to say, I disagree, and this is why.

Immediately someone had to pull out the racist label. Who cares why CW see's it as she does? It's the perfect opportunity for name calling rather than having the discussion about why she feels the way she does.

Someone said that she is entitled to her opinion. Not on this forum she isn't!

The same people who are more than willing to rush to the defense of someone who calls others vile names or pat a liar on the back and tell people to quit picking on them, are the very first to make assumptions about people by a single post.

There is a name for that, hypocrite.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I am commenting again in this thread only to say that as Elvis pointed out to me, I repeatedly referred to Sara as "Kate" in my thread response. It was an error and my sincere apologies are extended to Kate.


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RE: Republican Feedback

So Elvis, you're questioning why some of us are here? In fact , YOU are the new poster here. I have been here for about ten years and don't remember you. I do remember citywoman under her multitude of other names. But regardless what name she posts under, the meanness shines thru.

I will say this very slowly citywoman. Obama won because he got the most votes. It wasn't even close. He beat Hillary(our candidate in 2016..I assume you'll be voting for her since you love her). Then he went on to beat the lame GOP candidate like he'll be doing this November. Suck it up.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by natal Louisiana 8b (My Page) on
    Sat, Mar 24, 12 at 18:24

I will say this very slowly citywoman. Obama won because he got the most votes. It wasn't even close. He beat Hillary(our candidate in 2016..I assume you'll be voting for her since you love her). Then he went on to beat the lame GOP candidate like he'll be doing this November. Suck it up.

Perfectly articulated on this pointless thread.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"I am always told I'm racist"

Citywoman, if this statement is true, then you really should be doing an awful lot of soul searching ASAP.

It's one thing to have members on HT call you "a racist", but when you claim that you are "always told I'm racist"

Well, that paints a totally different picture about you, about what you say, how you say it, the words you chose to use.

We, on HT and I would also include any other forum that you post on, can only respond to the words that you use, think what we do about you, based on those words and seeing and reading the posts that you have done, lead most of us to believe that you are racist.
If that is not true then, as I stated above, you need to step back and think about what you say, how you say things, the words that you use, because the words that you are using are pure racist in nature and that is how you come across.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Actually, Mylab, an apology to Citywoman might be just as appropriate, if an apology is necessary at all. Now that you've straightened that out, it's really pretty funny. But as to the apologizing part, if you think about it, Citywoman may be less than thrilled to be mixed up with Kate...

I hope this thread is taking a turn more to your liking. At this juncture it's kind of hard to tell if I'm on topic or not--sorry if I'm not.


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RE: Republican Feedback

lily not a multitude of names dear. We have discussed this before. Just three. No meanness here.
Littleone....you need to read all the follow-ups and then you wouldn't be jumping in making statements about subjects that have already been addressed.
I said to Frank or someone that this forum is the only time in my life I have ever been called racist.
This forum......Hot Topics Forum.
The only other forum I have ever been on was the Decorating
Forum and we discussed pictures and lamps. Nothing racist there.
Since I have never been called racist before then I would lean toward the conclusion that I'm not and you know what..........I think I know myself and where my heart is pretty well.
Esh nik mrskj thank you and others for letting me know I can have an opinion . Even if you don't agree with how I worded my opinion I appreciate that you gave me the benefit of the doubt.
Everyone should read Demi's last post.
It was clearly one of the very best and well worded post I have ever read on this forum. Ever.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Obama did not become president because he was black. In my own case, I voted for Hillary in my state's primary election. When I saw what the choice was between an old white hawk with a clueless woman running for VP as opposed to an intelligent, nuanced, cosmopolitan candidate with offers of hope and change, I got the message loud and clear and cast my vote happily for Obama. His race means nothing to me; his ideals are more in line with my own. Had Hillary been the winning candidate for President, of course I would have voted for her.

As for my criticisms of some aspects of the South, I was born and raised in the deep south, have lived two-thirds of my long life in the south. I call it as I see it. My point in my other post is that we should none of us get defensive in our denials, for that means the erasure of memory. "Those who do not remember history are condemned to repeat it." Let's not get complacent about race in America.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"His race means nothing to me; his ideals are more in line with my own."

Sounds as though we think alike! Like you, I vote for the person most likely to promote policies I agree with. Ancestry is irrelevant.

Mr. Obama won last time because he promoted ideas people liked, plus (IMHO) because McCain is an arrogant fool who should have been put out to pasture a decade before the last election. Americans are smart.

With over three years of service completed, voters have had time to evaluate where we are today with Mr. Obama's policies. They've had time to evaluate how our economy and energy production look after billions of dollars in government intervention. They've had time to get to know our president. They've had time to experience what Democrats, given power, were willing to do in order to make Obamacare the law of the land. As always when presidents run for a second term, we know more about our leader this time than we did the first time around. It's all good, and I expect Americans will make the right decision.


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RE: Republican Feedback

In my opinion, Nik, you hit the nail on the head. I really don't see how this post of yours can be twisted around, but you never know.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by sweeby Gulf Coast TX (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 12:56

Elvis wrote: "racist: "The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others."

By that logic, someone promoting and staunchly defending the old 'separate but equal' doctrine could defend themselves from accusations of racism by clinging to the 'equal' word - "But I said EQUAL!"

Enlightened Americans would never fall for that anymore. Nor would we fall for the argument that Sara's rant:

"Obama is President of the Us because he is black.
Now, howl about that til nightfall but it is the truth and we all know it.
He wasn't elected on his merit. I think we all know why he was elected. Didn't I see black guys with billy clubs at the poll doors making sure what?
Anyone who says he isn't in the WH because of the color of his skin is spinning a yarn. "

isn't racist. It is. Her further arguments saying "It's a fact. It's my opinion" illustrate the confusion of her thinking -- as if her opinion makes it true.

Sorry - that was one racist rant.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I agree, Sweeby, that was one racist rant. It's sad, but what I find even more disturbing is the support she received from others on this board. If one cannot stand up to racism on an anonymous board, it does not bode well for our society.


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RE: Republican Feedback

and here comes another racist word thrower..... sweeby. Nice to know you sweeby. Racist rant huh?. So many people in denial. The people who went to the polls and voted for Obama because of the color of his skin can admit it on this forum. On this forum you can say anything you like. Lots of people voted for Obama because of his skin color. Maybe even you did. Why are so many people denying it.
The black Panthers at the polls voted for Obama because of his skin color. They didn't stand outside the polls for Bill Clinton. Didn't I read where more African-Americans came out to vote this time...more so than ever before?
Well, seems they related to Obama because of the color of his skin? What is wrong with that? Maybe they felt they might get a break . Sheeree On The View made the remark..."It is wonderful to have a President in the WH THAT LOOKS LIKE ME"! Her exact words.
In my opinion I feel lots of people were ready to make history and be a part of it. Isn't that what they said on tv thousands of times. I heard that over and over.
"I am so happy to have been a part of making history and being a part of it". How did they do that????????


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RE: Republican Feedback

It totally was a racist rant and it's sad she doesn't get it.

For once I agree with Nik. I have looked at my candidate's record and now after his three years in office, I am more inclined than ever to vote for him again. I don't agree with everything he did: in fact I think he should have been further to the left but I recognize his limitations in doing that. The 1950's Leave it To Beaver crowd would oppose him fiercely, so he has to temper his beliefs. This disappoints those on the far left ,but they'll suck it up when they look at the alternative.


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RE: Republican Feedback

There has been a lot of ugly on recent threads.

And unfortunately defense of racism is seen as a legitimate partisan position - both in HT and the greater political arena.

Desperate times, eh?


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RE: Republican Feedback

AFter being called out a racist, based on a rant that was so obviously racist, the OP then comes back with the, oh so familiar, "it's my opinion" claim.

No where in the racist rant was it stated that it was the OP's opinion and not fact, even though it was presented as fact.

Be that as it may, whether it was/is the opinion of the OP or the OP was stating it as fact doesn't change an thing.

The rant, and that is exactly what it was, a rant, was racist pure and simple.
There is nothing that can be said to change the fact that it was racist and all the claims from now until the end of time will not and can not change the words that make it racist.

Doesn't mater that the OP claims something different now that she's been called out on it.

As for telling me " you need to read all the follow-ups and then you wouldn't be jumping in making statements about subjects that have already been addressed. "

No, citywoman, I don't need to read all the follow-ups because you made the statement as clear as possible and now you are trying to twist your words to means something else.

Anyone that clearly states "I am always told I'm racist" has some very serious problems when they attempt to then deny to everyone that they aren't a racist.

There is a reason that you are "always called a racist", and that reason is clearly what you say, how you say it, the words you use and how you use them.

You can deny it all you want, make all the claims you want that you are not a racist, come up with all the excuses you want to from being poorly misunderstood to blaming liberal democrats, it doesn't change the facts that you and you alone made the statement;

"I am always told I'm racist"

Spin it all you want, it doesn't change a thing, you statement, your rant was nothing more than a racist rant, nothing you can say or do will change those facts.

You need to take a good hard look at yourself, what you say, how you say things, the words you use and how you truly feel.

You are not always told you're a racist for no reason, that's the issue and now you try to explain it a way and it just doesn't work


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RE: Here we go again

lily what do you think Sheeree on The View meant when she said "It is wonderful to have a President in the WH that looks like me". Did she mean he looks like a woman?
What were people meaning when they were interviewed and said they were so happy to have been a part of making history and being a part of it? Making history because he was Asian? Because he was an Indian?
Nancy lily others....what is your view on this?
Instead of just spewing ....address it.
Did African-Americans come out in record numbers because Obama was short? Tall?


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RE: Republican Feedback

JZ and too many others to name: As I understand your definition of the term "racist", CW is one.

So, okay. She's a racist. And someone else is a pompous a--hole, or an ordinary, boring jerk. So what!

JZ, she's been tarred and feathered, so you now want to hang her from the nearest tree?

CW, I would just accept that according to a lot of folks on this Forum, you are a racist. Conservative me--calling you out (see that, Mylab?). Now what should I do with you? I think I'll extend you the courtesy and the right (at least so far, in this U.S.A.)to speak out your opinion. On whatever you like, just like EVERYBODY ELSE HERE WHO WANTS TO. First Amendment, make it your mantra.

You can burn a flag if you want to, also.


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RE: Republican Feedback

citywoman, I have already answered your question. Evidently you weren't happy with my answer.

To accommodate you, I'll answer yet again. Since the Roosevelt Administration African Americans have overwhelmingly voted for the Democratic candidate for president. 80-90+ percentage is not uncommon. At one point during Bush II's time in office, disapproval by African Amercians was so high that if the margin of error were assumed to go against President Bush, his negative rating among blacks would have been more than 100%. If that much negative existed for President Bush, why would anyone (in their right mind) expect that Senator McCain - whose candidacy was viewed as an extension of Bush II policies - would receive any African American votes at all?

As I have also previously written, the disaster of the Iraq war and occupation, the absence of WMDs in Iraq, the near collapse of the financial system, the beginning of a deep recession, the failed attempt to privatize social security - all these made the Republican brand toxic in the 2008 election.

I hope you're not going to demand that I address your question yet a third time.

For your information, I don't 'spew' and I would appreciate an acknowledgement when I take the time to explain my positions.


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RE: Republican Feedback

cw - if Hillary had won the nomination and you had voted for her in the general election (which if I remember correctly you said you would have?) and she won, is it possible you might have said/thought "it's wonderful to have a woman President"? And if you did think/say that does that mean you voted for her BECAUSE she was a woman? Or because you agreed with her position on the issues and the fact that she was a woman was an added bonus?

I voted for Obama in the primary and AGAINST Hillary. I am a white woman. I do not trust Hillary. I would love to see a woman President one day, but I did not think Hillary was the right choice. Their gender and color had nothing to do with my vote in either case.

One day I hope to be able to vote for a woman. And when I do, I will be happy to say "isn't it great we have a women President". It will not mean I voted for that woman because she was a woman.

If you cannot see the parallel, and I suspect you cannot, I give up.


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RErerere: Republican Feedback

elvis - are you saying that being a racist is the equivalent of being an ordinary, boring jerk? I really hope I have misunderstood you.

And, no, you didn't call her out. You stated that others said she was racist. Not that you thought she was racist. A big difference.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 14:32

EVERYONE who voted for George W. Bush voted for him because he was a WHITE MALE, no other reason, not his policies not because they agreed with the republican platform ONLY because he was a WHITE MALE.

EVERYONE who is going to vote for the future republican candidate is voting for HIM only because he is a WHITE MALE, no other reason.

GOT IT !!

Whew glad that is over with :)


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RE: Republican Feedback - white or white

W-e-l-l, OM, it was white male or white male, so no contest anyway, on the race thing.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 15:01

No you have convinced me that the only reason republicans are voting for (pick a winner) in the republican primaries/2012 election is because they are WHITE MALES. I now believe you and know that your only criteria is that they are WHITE MALES and no other reason.

Thank you for showing me the white way :)


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RE: Republican Feedback

I was more intimidated by the blue suited attorneys who were present as poll watchers in the 2008 election. They stared at the voters as if they had sprouted additional heads.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Lots of people voted for Obama because of his skin color.'

As I said earlier CW that is probably true...lots of people did exactly that but that is NOT why he was elected. In the US a President is NOT elected by popular vote.

You go on about others not understanding what you say...open your ears and digest theses FACTS.

All but two of the predominately black states went to McCain , not Obama. If the blacks there voted for Obama it certainly did not help him get elected. That is a fact.

Now we are left with the white vote. If millions of white folk voted for Obama simply because he was black then it follows , if Obama had have been white, they would not have voted for him , they would have voted for McCain..

So it is your contention that, had Obama been white, millions of Democrats would have voted for McCain......that's more bizarre than believing he was elected because he is black!

Why am I even bothering.....


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RE: Republican Feedback

I know, Chase , it's like arguing with a rock. Americans came out in record number because they were deathly afraid that the erratic old man would win along with his dim witted VP nominee. And CW.. Address this. Why else was Palin on the ticket? Her great intellect? Perhaps because she was a woman and this was to counter the fact the Dems chose Obama over Hilary?? Answer me that, why don't you? Was Palin a token woman?


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Can't stop smiling..... (^_^)

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 15:41

The only reason people voted for McCain was because he was white.

You have to stay with the program ladies ... if dems voted for Obama only because he is black, then it stands to (their) reasoning that the only reason they vote for their candidates is because they are WHITE !

Don't you get it ? I do ... and I believe them :)


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RE: Republican Feedback//

I wonder why Dick Gregory didn't win in 1968?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Yer killin' me :)


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RE: Republican Feedback

Lily...yes..Sara Palin was the token woman as McCains VP.
I personally think..in my opinion....so that makes it a fact...in my mind...he chose Palin because she was popular and he thought she would boost his chances.
If I think something ...I usually end up considering it a fact....in my opinion...and in my mind. Palin was the token woman. McCain might say different. If he calls me out on this.....who is right....me or McCain?
Have we all the opinions and facts straight here.
Lots of folks have opinions on this forum don't they.
I wonder who is right? Do you think you are right?
Your reasoning is embedded in your mind.
Trying to get through to some of you is like trying to argue with a rock.....in Lilys words.
I just went and looked at myself in the mirror. I see a 70 yr old woman that has lived alot of life.
I am who I am. Alot of people in my life love and respect me.
I love and respect myself. I love and respect alot of people. No one has ever changed my mind on any subject by calling me names.
When you try to belittle a person and call them names they are just going to dig their heels in deeper. Its call self preservation. People always duck when you throw rocks at them.
If any of had sincerely wanted to show me the error of my thoughts ...the first time the word racist was thrown out there pretty much made me dig my heels in on this.
How is that for honesty.


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RE: Republican Feedback

You have to stay with the program ladies ... if dems voted for Obama only because he is black, then it stands to (their) reasoning that the only reason they vote for their candidates is because they are WHITE !

Got it OM. The answer is, well, black and white.


Now can you answer this one?...
When do we get out of the rabbit hole?


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 16:09

If I think something ...I usually end up considering it a fact.

...and who said HT wasn't a fun place :)


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RE: Enough Already

Knock it off, OM. Enough, don't you get it?


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RE: Republican Feedback

city woman - Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his or her own facts.


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RE: Sick Puppies

If CW was teaching this in school, I would agree with you, JZ. But she's not.

You know, you guys are acting like the kind of people who would actually enjoy kicking a puppy in the head--over and over. I'm serious, and I'm outta this thread.

Good luck, Citywoman.


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.....at this point Epi

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 16:36

....I would say "go ask Alice when she's 10 feet tall"

(^_^)


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Oh please ...

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 16:47

....and liberals are constantly and I mean CONSTANTLY accused of being sour pusses with no sense of humor.

Enough .. yeah I agree :)


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RE: Republican Feedback

If CW was teaching this in school, I would agree with you, JZ. But she's not.

So, elvis, what you are saying is that it's okay to believe something that isn't true just because it's satisfies you. Don't you have any desire to seek the truth? To me seeking the truth might be the most important thing a person does in his life. I hate when lies are told and people believe them not because it will "hurt my guy" but because it's such a cowardly way to go through life....believing the lies that Fox News, or Rush Limbaugh, or other talking heads tell you...without questioning provenance or authenticity. Truly and I don't mean this in an ugly way) but I just don't know how you guys can stand it. If I knew my TV or radio station was feeding me a line of bull I would switch it off.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I think all Elvis was saying is that Citywoman has been beat up enough.

Elvis, you're my new hero!


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RE: Republican Feedback//

The strangest things excite you, paulines.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Mar 25, 12 at 18:31

Ahhhhhh I see ... she is a "victim" of her own words.

Okay

Peace out


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RE: Republican Feedback

Opinions are allowed, we all have them and they are a good place to start. When you air an opinion and it meets with resistance and you cling to that opinion regardless this is not being intelligent. Abandoning that opinion just because someone disagrees is equally unintelligent. If you consider the objections to your opinion and come back with a modification then you are on your way. Truth has not put in an appearance in this process yet although basing your opinion on facts helps.

The logic of the argument as presented goes like this: Barack Obama is the POTUS: he gained this position because he was voted in: Obama is black: therefore he was voted in because he is black. Although the premises are true the conclusion is speculation and without further evidence must be assumed to be false.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Well put ink. And though I agree with everything you said, a person is very unlikely to change their opinion when instead of a cogent argument otherwise is presented, they are called names and met with angry retorts, they are far more likely to dig in their heels. Just human nature.


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RE: Republican Feedback

To be fair Mrs when an outrageous opinion is presented it is likely to be met with an equivalent response. And obviously I am assuming the intent above.


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RE: Republican Feedback

a person is very unlikely to change their opinion when instead of a cogent argument otherwise is presented,

There were reasonable rebuttals presented, but they suffered the usual fate - they were ignored.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Ridiculous. Still jerking leashes CW? I've heard this tired refrain about Obama for 4 years and it is getting so tiresome to respond to. Do you realize how long blacks have been voting for white presidential candidates? They are about as prone to vote for someone that looks like them as a white voter. How many candidates did you vote for that didn't share your skin color. You shrug off Obama's win as if electing a black man is the easiest thing in the world. Point me where blacks rallied to elect President Shirley Chisum, President Jesse Jackson, or President Al Sharpton, or for that matter President Cain? The problem with your comment is that it is dismissive and insultingly stupid. Is your purpose to have a dialogue or to collect angry responses. You join a club of conservatives who lacking the ability to command facts and argue persuasively, are content to just outrage. What a boring waste of time.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Then why waste your time kt?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Mrs, you are absolutely are entitled to your opinion but that fact you agree and defend a position that the President was elected because he is black has made me think of you differently.

I know that doesn't matter much to you but I feel sad about it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"To all Republicans and Independents please enlighten me if I come across as a racist"

If you dont want feedback dont ask for it.
When you ask for feedback dont be surprised when you get, it we are a helpful bunch.

"He wasn't elected on his merit. I think we all know why he was elected"

Coupled with the part on his being elected because he was black the conclusion can only be Obama cant have any merit..well I think we all know why that is.....it is an unfortunate juxtaposition if you dont mean to sound racist.

FYI, it is possible to be appallingly racist and have no idea of it. How else to you account for so many southern people not understanding why flying the Confederate flag is racist.

I had this thought re the black thing-conservatives are very fond of reminding us that Obama is 'half white' How does that figure into this senario? Did I vote for the black half or did I vote for the 'like me' half. If Obama is half white then how did he get elected since the only reason to vote for him was that he was black? A problem of logic there...?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Like I said waaaayyyy up thread -- If you cannot see the parallel, and I suspect you cannot, I give up.

Now I know for sure.

Did you even try to think about anything anyone here said? That's what intelligent people do. Even those with strong opinions (and every intelligent person I know has strong opinions). They listen, really listen, to the arguments and make logical conclusions. They don't "dig their heels in". But, sadly, I'm not surprised.

And, I agree with chase about thinking about MrsK differently. There are others that can be put in that basket also.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Why are people defending CW saying enough is enough? Who started this topic? She just wants to reiterate over and over again her tired "facts" that she "thought" up. .


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RE: Republican Feedback

What chase? Did you spend all day coming up with that opinion? Wow did you waste your time. I specifically said that I do not agree. Nevermind, it just isn't worth it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Republicans are all about the details of candidate platforms - NOT. Compared to the hot debate we saw here in 2008 among liberals and moderates over the specifics of Clinton and Obama (remember Clinton wanted a mandate as did McCain but Obama didn't?), the discussion on this forum about Republican candidates has been shockingly shallow. Frankly, I've seen Republicans on this forum use about as limited criteria for their vote as the accusations being made about blacks who voted for Obama. It seems the main criteria for Republicans is someone with sufficient anger to tell Obama off and beat him! Its ridiculous. If it weren't for liberals discussing the various Republican candidates' tax policies, etc., nothing substantive would have been discussed here at all. Pathetic.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"a person is very unlikely to change their opinion when instead of a cogent argument otherwise is presented, they are called names and met with angry retorts, they are far more likely to dig in their heels. Just human nature."

Exactly right, Mrsk. People tend to "change their own minds." It's a process, not an event. Persuasion takes time. If posting endless links (AKA reading assignments of lefty propaganda) and disparaging the opposition's intellectual and moral standing were persuasive, Obama and the Democrats would be wildly popular today, and this forum would be "converting" conservatives into liberals as quickly as they arrive. Alas, libs are reaping no such rewards. And that's exactly the outcome you want, if you're a conservative. It's all good.


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RE: Republican Feedback

If posting endless links (AKA reading assignments of lefty propaganda) and disparaging the opposition's intellectual and moral standing were persuasive, Obama and the Democrats would be wildly popular today, and this forum would be "converting" conservatives into liberals as quickly as they arrive. Alas, libs are reaping no such rewards. And that's exactly the outcome you want, if you're a conservative. It's all good.

*

Accurate analysis.

Positions attributed to you that you don't have, being called stupid, ignorant, selfish, moron demographic, haters, racists, unintelligent, regressive, uncaring, unsympathetic, unable to process information, and backward by strangers that disagree with you about how to make this country a better place is not very likely to cause one to even WANT to be like them.

Unfortunately, they need to convert the very people they are castigating and alienating to accomplish their objectives.

That would seem to me to not be particularly intelligent behavior. See how nicely you can word things if you want?

We'll make sure those rednecks in the south know exactly what you think of them--surely once they're advised by you liberals how to think they'll change their idiotic minds, huh?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Hilarious. Perhaps you've forgotten that the OP was about an insulting remark by a conservative to liberals. Woosh right over your head.


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RE: Republican Feedback

What was the insulting remark kt?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Mrsk, it was the remark about the only reason Obama was elected.


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RE: Republican Feedback

It may be human nature to "dig in one's heels" in the face of relentless argument on a forum like this one, but I don't think it is intelligent behavior. Nor does stating an opinion make it a fact. Digging in one's heels is an emotional reaction. Would it not be more intelligent to carefully weigh and mull over the assorted postings on this forum, in order to get as close to "truth" as possible. Truth, not rhetoric.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I have been an active member on this forum for, I think, three years and change. Not all that long compared to some, a very long time compared to others.

In her other names, I remember her popping in, making some disparaging remarks in a few threads over a week or two -remarks for which she would be challanged - then leaving again for a good long while. This is the forum habits I recall regarding CityW.

This thread was started by CW to troll for sympathy from other conservatives on this forum - started by a woman who made ugly remarks for which another conservative called her out on as being racist in nature and (especially) telling her that it was so objectionable that other conservatives no longer supported her. - the point that greatly upset her.

Thus, the "Republican Feedback" trolling for sympathy.

Frank, you were dead wrong after all. Frankly, I'm as surprised as you are.

She got, from the conservatives, EXACTLY what she went after.

Mission accomplished.

If conservatives here who responded couldn't bring themselves to forthrightly disagree with her remarks and tell her directly why they disagreed- then it would have been so much better had nobody said a single word. Not a word.

There have been a lot of truly awful threads in this forum - ugly behavior from both sides.

To me - my opinion only - this thread has been the most impactful regarding my perception of others, more than any other ugly or good thread we have ever had in this forum, I'm not completely sure why that is, but it has been.

I wish I had never, ever opened this thread - I have discovered that ignorance really can, after all, be bliss.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Mrs, the reason that remark was so insulting is because it infers, well more than infers, that liberals could see nothing beyond the Presidents race and voted for him solely on that matter.

To educated, intelligent, informed liberals...of which there are many, that is very insulting.

Think of it the other way...what if someone said conservatives only voted for McCain because he was white and had a female VP candidate.

It's insulting.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I do not think you can change a person that is racist if they are surrounded by like people all their lives and have no reference of why it is wrong. Unless that person requested understanding and really wanted to change within a discussion forum limited effect I would not even try. The best you can do is pray for that person.

How can they recognize it as wrong if they have no teaching, or reference in their life? Short of a miracle the deep seed of hatred because of a person's color will be with them until the day they die. JMHO.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I don't think I was the only conservative that disagreed that Obama was elected only because he was black. And I'm sure that there are more people than CW who believe that, also with whom I disagree. She gave an opinion, hers. And immediately the name calling began. You can be sure that nothing that was said after that was going to sway her opinion. But did anyone really want to?


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RE: Republican Feedback

That was never the point, Mrsk. The point was to gather to her conservative support,(all because Frank told her she didn't have any) and she accomplished her mission to perfection.

I never called her a racist. I said that what she said was racist in nature.

I obejected to her comments and thought they were, indeed, racist in nature but I also said she had every right to say them, just as every person who read them had every right to disagree with her and to state that they thought the comments were, after all, racist in nature. That is the purpose of this forum.

Her entire purpose in this thread was for a gathering of support from conservatives. And she got what she asked for, with Frank being the sole critical and non-supportive conservative. I hope you are not disregarding this because if you do, you miss her point and there is no longer any point in any exchange over this.

She won. And you helped - it doesn't matter that you said the words that you disagreed, Mrsk - you supported her. Exactly what she was trolling for and asked for - and, in fact, CW came back and thanked you for it.

Game over. She won.

But this thread was certainly not an entire loss, for I learned what it is I really needed to know for as long as I intend to participate in this forum.

But I sure would have been far, far more content and comfortable had I never opened this thread. It is what it is.


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RE:One more time

If I am capable of forming an opinion then I have enough
capability of knowing my opinion is not fact unless its based on recorded fact and data.
If you will notice I said several times "this is my opinion and I am entitled to it". After being slammed and ground like mince meat I posted again and threw in "because it is my opinion it is fact". I was being facetious in that remark because no one would assume their opinion to be fact unless like I said , it was backed by data.
Wow, did you ever run with that one.
I guess you assumed because I would make the Obama remark that I would assume it was fact. In some cases it was fact.
Some not....I guess. Maybe 50% 50%. Who knows what another person is really thinking. Not one of you Obama supporters can speak for anyone other then yourself. You know why you voted for him but you don't really know what was in anothers heart when they went to the polls.
Can you honestly say you know what others thought other than you and your close family and friends.
Not everyone is honest with their intentions and thoughts and feelings. There is no way to know how many voted for him because of the color of his skin.
All you know is that YOU didn't so that should be satisfaction enough.
I see no reason to repeat the comment. So I am going to have to back track and say I think lots and lots and lots of people voted for Obama because he is black. Some because they wanted a change.
What ever the reason....boy did they ever flub up!


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RE: Republican Feedback

OMG.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I second that mylab,

OMG


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RE: Republican Feedback

Ahhh mylab, see what I didn't realize, is that we are playing a game here. What's the score? Who is winning?


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RE: Republican Feedback

I didn't realize, is that we are playing a game here.

See the post @14:14 Mar 27 2012.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Ditto the OMG. You can't let it rest CW, can you? That's the way you were when you were one of your other persona's ..hit and run. One of the reasons Obama was elected was because your party put up an old man and a dumb woman as his opponents. As I said before, suck it up because your candidate this time ,who ever ,will be beaten as well.


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RE: Republican Feedback

hmmm, well put lily, you can say old man, (bigoted), dumb woman, (misogynistic), but don't say black man, (racist). Liberals version of PC.


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re: words

Excuse me mrsk..Elderly? Undereducated? What words would YOU use?


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?????RE: Republican Feedback

Wow, lily, you explain to me how saying that McCain didn't win because he is old, and Sarah Palin didn't win because she is dumb, any different than CW saying Obama won because he is black?


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RE: Republican Feedback

''''''''''''''To support a statement that the President was elected because he was black is outrageous"

Yes, that is just as outrageous as someone saying the only reason a person didn't vote for Obama is because he is Black. That almost became a mantra for some on HT right before/after the election and many still use it.

"""""" does not mean that everyone who voted for Obama was racist and voted for him because of skin color."

No more than it means anyone who voted against him did it because he was Black. I'm sure there were some who did vote against him due to his race but there were also some who voted for him strictly because he was Black. Does either reason make either side racists?

Citywoman,There is an old saying that I've heard all my life. "Opinions are like behinds, everyone has one", but just because you have one doesn't make your opinion any more right than the next persons. It's your opinion and that's all it is. A few on this forum however seem to believe that if your opinion doesn't match theirs yours is wrong and in this case the disagreement makes you a racist "in their opinion". As Demi or MrsK said probably every Republican or Conservative on HT has been called a racist at one time or another due to their not agreeing with some the liberals on the forum. You are entitled to your opinion, whether or not I or anyone else agrees. To second Nik, I am delighted that you and Elvis are here.


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RE: Omg is right

First I apologized to the Republicans if I had embarrassed
them with my post. I asked them if they thought my post was racist.
They all choice to Disagree with my assumption because I would imagine they didn't think the same way.
I respect their choice.
You will notice they would not bad mouth me....call me names....call me out or all the other actions you liberals
wanted ...and demanded from the other posters.
They all disagreed with my assumption.
Conservatives are not for throwing the racist card around like the liberals.
As a whole I don't think one of them thought my opinion was correct but I think and hope they as a whole, knew I did not make that statement with any malice at all. It was opinion.
This is the last word on this thread.
Please do not respond..let it go.


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RE: Republican Feedback

That's because liberals are less likely to be racist???

mrsk..Age would not have mattered in McCain's case ,but he has had health issues, and he picked a candidate as his running mate who couldn't lead this country any better than my 14 year old grandson . A president can die at any time. JFK died at 43, but the older one gets, the more likely it could happen. Would you have been comfortable with Palin leading the country? I'd suggest you watch Game Change.


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RE: Republican Feedback

  • Posted by vgkg 7-Va Tidewater (My Page) on
    Tue, Mar 27, 12 at 18:14

I saw Game Change too Lily and according to the real people involved it was so close to reality that it gave them chills. Palin is and was not presidential material, and Obama would have won even if he were 100% white.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Its become something of a badge of courage to claim that libruls called Republicans racists for not voting for Obama. I suppose it happened somewhere maybe even here by certain posters a few times certainly not ALL Obama supporters EVER made such charges. I suppose it can be explained as a lame attempt to justify wholesale resentment towards a block of voters and justify making similarly ugly statements today that they can shrug off as tit for tat. I think some here gloss over the context of discussions and arguments that occurred back then about what STATEMENTS said by Republicans were considered racist perhaps because they only remember the charge and took it personally or perhaps simply because they like to portray themselves as victims.

I'm sure we all have different experiences and memories of those instances and so I can only relate my recollections, but I most recall hot debates about campaign TACTICS of portraying Obama as an outsider, as a Muslim, as a Socialist, as a terrorist, as wanting to impose slave reparations, of hating whites, of emails depicting him with a bone in his nose or eating a watermelon, as not like the other presidents on the currency, etc. I don't recall holding ALL Republicans guilty of those tactics but I do recall some pushback from Republicans on this forum when those tactics were denounced and things were said by BOTH sides. I personally consider acts as racist not people in 99% of cases (there are people who are racists to the bone but not so much the people on this forum). But I think quite commonly on this forum, those who have their acts criticized as racist seem to like to embrace any criticism as a statement of their values not choice of words. But thats water under the bridge.

Just one parting comment on what CW posted before demanding that no one respond LOL - no you DON'T get to dictate that you will have the last word. Its laughable to compare the reactions to your charges against Obama voters from other Republicans WHO WERE NOT TARGETED BY YOUR accusations to those from liberals WHO WERE. Are you serious LOL?! I'm sure liberals on this forum wouldn't call me names (though they would likely disagree) if I asked them if they were offended if I called all McCain voters racists.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Obama is president because he got more votes than anyone else.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I noticed Obama in 2004 at the Democratic convention where he gave a moving speech. I turned to my husband and said that there was a guy I would hope would run for president, never thinking it would happen. When it did, I volunteered for the campaign. His color meant zilch to me, a white woman.


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RE: Republican Feedback

What ever the reason....boy did they ever flub up!

No, I didn't "flub up". I made the right choice.


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RE: Republican Feedback

As I have often written, I did not vote for President Obama and no one on this forum - or anywhere else - has accused me of being racist. Dockside also said that she did not vote for President Obama, and no one has accused her of being a racist. Yet conservatives have embraced victimhood and claim that Democrats and/or liberals label anyone who did not vote for Barack Obama as a racist. Simply not true.

Context is everything, and I suspect that charges of racist comments in this forum were made in light of the entire conversation/debate. Perhaps unwittingly, or perhaps not, some use the language of racists and then seemed surprised when their comments are criticized.

but I most recall hot debates about campaign TACTICS of portraying Obama as an outsider, as a Muslim, as a Socialist, as a terrorist, as wanting to impose slave reparations, of hating whites

General Colin Powell spoke out against the those tactics, and then he was accused of supporting Barack Obama because of his skin color. There's no winning with some people.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"As I have often written, I did not vote for President Obama and no one on this forum - or anywhere else - has accused me of being racist."

Excellent point, Nancy. As a liberal, you are free to express your views without being called a racist...BY EITHER SIDE.

The conservatives here enjoy no such tolerance from the liberal side.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I disagree that anyone is playing the "victim". Don't believe me? Put the word "racist" into the search box of this forum, it's either republicans (or some semblance thereof) or Southern bashing thread. Usually both.

:(


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RE: Republican Feedback

Playing the poor victim - "You called me a racist" card is a conversation stopper overused by the right to derail a debate by implying a personal affront when they have no response to a challenge to a specific often prejudiced post. Most of the threads that go downhill to the "you called me a racist" level including the one by the OP are provocative ones started by the right that at the very least walk right up to the gray line of racism without crossing it (innuendos & dog whistles) seeking to outrage and collect a victim point. Its pathetic that they feel the need to ring this bell and then run away from it wrapped in victimhood and announcing their moral superiority. This whole notion that the right is more tolerant of diverse views is laughable. You don't get tolerance points for provoking people.


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RE: Republican Feedback

KT,

Did you notice that I was talking about the thread titles? Or did you even try to do the search? Provoking is something that goes on by both sides on this forum. It saddens me, but then, you know it's a theme for me. All people do the same stupid things, so please don't call each other names. Right? I do say that a lot. Enough to call it my theme!

:)


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RE: Republican Feedback

Rob, if a Southern politician - or any politician - makes a racist statement, that's fair game for this forum. You're welcome to post offensive statements by Democratic officials from all parts of the country.

Gingrich pulled his own 'southern strategy' even before the New Hampshire primary votes were counted in his bid to win votes in South Carolina. Santorum used charged language as well. And they're doing that for a reason -- they expected to attract Republican voters in the primaries by making a show of their bigotry. If you have a complaint, please address it to those candidates.

During the 2008 campaign there were many discussions on dog-whistle bigotry and Sarah Palin. Even General Colin Powell felt he needed to publicly chastise the GOP for its campaign tactics in that contest. The McCain/Palin campaign used coded - and some obvious - language because the strategists expected to win votes by doing so.

I sincerely don't understand the sensitivity regarding references to actual occurrences in the South. I'm one of the first to talk about the nativist jerks that populate California (and the politicians that pander to them). I'm not one of them, so I don't take offense if others point out the wannabe vigilantes that periodically squawk about their helping the U.S. Border Patrol.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Nancy,

If it helps you to understand... it's when occurences happen in the South, are stated to be BECAUSE of the South. That's the difference.

Not convinced? Try reading Mississippi instead of NYC in the thread on banning words. How different the tone would be! Ok, maybe not "you" per se. But it sure would be different.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Conservative Josh Barro says

"Why do conservatives catch such heat? It's probably because there is still so much racism on the Right to go alongside valid arguments on issues relating to race and ethnicity. Conservatives so often get unfairly pounded on race because, so often, conservatives get fairly pounded on race.

And this is the Right's own fault, because conservatives are not serious about draining the swamp. In recent months, both Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum have gotten questions at public events that referred to President Obama being a Muslim. Neither candidate corrected the questioner. Santorum later told a reporter that's "not his job." PPP polls in Mississippi and Alabama have found that about half of Republican voters believe Obama is a Muslim, and others aren't sure.

....There has been a clear strategic calculation here among Republican elites. Better to leverage or at least accept the racism of much of the Republican base than try to clean it up....My challenge to conservatives who feel they get a bum rap on race is this. Stand up for yourself and your colleagues when you feel that a criticism is unfair. At the same time, criticize other conservatives who say racist things, cynically tolerate racism in the Republican base, or deny the mere existence of racial issues in America today. The conservative movement desperately needs self-policing on racial issues, if it ever hopes to have credibility on them."

Here is a link that might be useful: take it seriously


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Rob, if a Southern politician - or any politician - makes a racist statement, that's fair game for this forum."

And whether or not that statement is racist in most cases is strictly opinion. Usually all in the mind of the hearer.


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RE: Republican Feedback

it's when occurences happen in the South, are stated to be BECAUSE of the South.

And the point that I made - the Gingrich example above - was an occurrence happened because it pertained to the Southern voters. And what we consider bad behavior from some Carolina politicians is actually done with the idea of appealing to their constituents. Southern occurrences meant for Southerners. Enough of these incidences of GOPers making outrageous statements to attract votes in the South, and people begin to form an impression.

Try reading Mississippi instead of NYC in the thread on banning words. How different the tone would be!

I truly believe that you are overly sensitive, and unaware of the stereotyping/knee-jerk reactions regarding urban and/or Democratic centers. You cannot imagine invective at NYC regarding PC language, slurs about its minorities, or out-of-touch elitists deciding what is best for others?

Every area of the country has its share of charges that are routinely used against it. I'm not about to complain about what is said of California; some of it is deserved, some isn't. That's life.


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RE: Republican Feedback

"Usually all in the mind of the hearer."

If you don't mind, LB, I'd like to point out that hearing and listening are not necessarily the same animal. Do you agree with that?


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RE: Republican Feedback

Oh that is absolutely true...people hear what they want to hear. It isn't a trait held only by liberals.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Nancy,

You truly think that what NYC is for PC language? My arse! Let's burn books next! That is a regressive thought process if ever I have seen one. Really? And that if it happened in MS, no one would've said anything differently than is being said on that thread now? c'mon! I don't buy it. Not for one second. I heard that story on the news this morning and immediately thought of here. Immediately. I realized that if a Southerner posted it, it would've been one these tit-for-tat arguments. Truly. I was suprised that NYC isn't being called out for going backwards in time.

If you are "not about to complain about what is said of California; some of it is deserved, some isn't. That's life." then quit saying it about the South. I'm not sure why republicans/conservatives/Southerners are all fair game for bashing, but give us the same respect as the Coast.

People are people everywhere!


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RE: Republican Feedback

rob, you will find that this has been the mantra here ever since Obama was elected. It is really a sad thing to see. Of course there are racist within the republican party, and of course there are racists in the south. None at all in the democrat party or any other region of the country because you see...they elected Obama. And if you are not a democrat, if you live in the south and are not a democrat especially, you are a racist. And if you search the web long and hard enough, you can find some ignorant human being who only proves the point. You see, liberals define themselves by the fact that "they" elected the first black president. A fact, whether he be republican or democrat, historically we should all take pride in. Whether you voted for him or not. But liberals prefer to use the color of his skin as a club against those who did not vote for him, and do not agree with his policies. And what should be something that brings us together as far as race relations are concerned has caused an angry divisiveness among those who never considered his race when they did not vote for him, and those that feel his race is what defines him.


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-RE: Republican Feedback

Then I should be totally blowing their minds! White, conservative, and Southern. I'm sure I'm the only one though.

HA!


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?RE: Republican Feedback

Who voted for Obama. Man, I am tired today!


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RE: Republican Feedback

The following is an assumpution that those who go on the FOX news site are not progressives:

Just read some of the racist posts about Trayvor Martin, about Whitney Houston, about President Obama. They are stomach-churning. And the number of "likes" that they pull. I have no idea where these people live - I assume everywhere. But, they certainly are racist and, being able to hide who they are, not at all bashful about saying such horrible things.

Just point me to some place where a majority of the posts about any particular black person are of that stomach-churning racism and I will apologize.


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))))Republican Feedback

"But liberals prefer to use the color of his skin as a club against those who did not vote for him, and do not agree with his policies. '

What total and utter nonsense. Broad brushed generalities and biases....the kind you accuse others of.


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RE: Republican Feedback

Gee, Chase. Who said it was a liberal trait? Feeling defensive? Don't, please!


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RE: Republican Feedback

"But LIBERALS prefer ..."

Mrs said...But you knew that. No need to be defensive when you are right...oh excuse me......when you are left.


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@RE: Republican Feedback

Chase, you silly!

Yes elvis, MrsK did say it. Sorry. See? Both sides do it. I wish neither side would do it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

rob, can you point out any threads in which conservatives called liberals racists? No, both sides do not do it.


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RE: Republican Feedback

I'm not sure why republicans/conservatives/Southerners are all fair game for bashing

They are open to criticism for what they are saying. Period. You're in the middle of a hotly contested GOP primary season, and the hopes of two candidates are focused on the votes that they can win in the South. And what is said by the candidates to court these voters is being reported. If the candidates and their supporters weren't making such prejudiced statements, there would be no criticism. It's not as if the outrageous statements - students who should be janitors, for example - haven't been reported in the national news.

If Gingrich and Santorum were to continue campaigning in earnest until the California primary, and if they were to continue to make the same outrageous statements to court voters in California, they same criticisms will be made against them and focus will be on the Californians that are responding positively to their prejudiced messages.


Rob, you must lead a sheltered life if you haven't heard derogatory remarks about NYC -- about the city, the people, how they talk, how they dress, the politics, and on and on. If you are demanding that this forum reflect all the negative images of NYC (or any other region/state/city) in one thread, I think you have unrealistic expectations.

can you point out any threads in which conservatives called liberals racists?

What about the charges of reverse racism? Plenty of those have been thrown by conservatives.

I do recall charges being made that Democrats are against/don't support/despise 'real Americans' aka 'white' people. Liberals betray the troops. Liberals love terrorists. Liberals love Muslims and hate Christians. Liberals are anti-American. Liberals are elitists. Liberals only care about criminals and not the victims of crime. Liberals love undocumented workers. Liberals want to compromise national security. Liberals want to undermine the morals of this country. Liberals are killing babies. And if a liberal politician is gay, or female, or a person of color - watch the attacks fly!


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