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Sensible Immigration Policy

Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
Fri, Jun 15, 12 at 11:49

"WASHINGTON Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants who came to the United States as children will be able to obtain work permits and be safe from deportation under a new policy announced on Friday by the Obama administration.
Related

The policy, effective immediately, will apply to people who are currently under 30 years old, who arrived in the country before they turned 16 and have lived in the United States for five years. They must also have no criminal record, and have earned a high school diploma, remained in school or served in the military."

Makes sense to me on the face of it.


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

If it follows the Dream Act then it would have positive benefits:

Young people who were brought into the country illegally or overstayed their visas as children are commonly referred to as "Dreamers," referencing the title of a decade-old bill that would have given them legal status if they joined the military or attended college. The Dream Act passed the House nearly two years ago, but was blocked by Republicans in the Senate. Opponents of the bill have argued that it would encourage more people to enter the country illegally, while supporters say it helps people who were brought up as Americans and whose lack of status is not their own fault become full members of society.

I guess more details will be available after 1 pm.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Fri, Jun 15, 12 at 12:00

Clearly Obama wants hispanic votes as well as a showdown with Republicans... I don't care what his motivation on this is AT ALL. If it is what I think it is, it's the right thing to do.


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!RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

I also like that it allows us to focus resources on the ones we have a more urgent need to focus on:

"This grant of deferred action is not immunity," she said. "It is not amnesty. It is an exercise of discretion so that these young people are not in the removal system. It will help us to continue to streamline immigration enforcement and ensure that resources are not spent pursuing the removal of low-priority cases involving productive young people."

A senior administration official told reporters on the condition of anonymity that most eligible undocumented immigrants will be required to go to the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services to provide documents and pay a fee.

Still, there will be no pathway to citizenship for undocumented immigrants eligible for the policy change, because "Only the Congress, acting through its legislative authority, can confer these rights," according to the DHS announcement.

Here is a link that might be useful: source of course


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About time!

I don't care what his motivation on this is AT ALL.

Same here.


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I'm so glad that Obama made such a bipartisan move. Oh wait, no, this was executive order. It's good to be king lol.

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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So now we're linking to racist websites, whose founder compared immigrants to bacteria.


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Oh you poor thing, I forget about your delicate sensibilities....this one is much better...as usual, liberals are against it until Obama says he's for it lol.

So now you can address the OP rather than floundering for a snark.

Here is a link that might be useful: link


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What about those immigrants who came here legitimately and need to pay lawyers to process paperwork and pass various tests to get their green cards? Will they get a free pass too, or is it only illegals - people who flagrantly violated immigration laws -- who will be the recipients of such largess?


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Lionheart, you must have no heart if you're against this! :-P

Shall we all take a stab at which group Obama will pander to next? Actually, I'm not sure what's left. He's covered women, gays, illegals...


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Just think of it as babies being saved. That should make it A O K. Pro-life.

They could make more Babies to be saved . And, How about they all speak Spanish. WOW we will be a Spanish Speaking Brown America before we can blink.

If the President had not implemented this policy...Your 5 year old could come to you and ask "Mommy do they throw babies out of the country?"

Answer: Yes!!! That was my CHOICE!! I used my vote so that would happen.


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Marquest, you are so smart! In fact she asked me that just today! But I told that she was safe because she has blue eyes!


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I bet you did.


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All this red meat for fear of the latin tongue. Romney never a did a thing in Massachusetts to route the thousands of illegal Irish immigrants hiding out in that state. Pressure would have been too high all those Irish American upper middle class votes might have swung back to the Democratic side. One & 2 generations away from the old sod, cousins were still being ferried over to take care of elderly, granny & great grandpa.

After the Celtic Tiger had it's teeth pulled it's estimated 120,000 fled Ireland many went to other EU nation quite a few came here where an IRISH nanny in NY is a hot commodity.


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"Lionheart, you must have no heart if you're against this! :-P"

You made me chuckle. :-)

Actually the people I was talking about were also so-called "brown", except they are from the Middle East and the Indian Subcontinent.

I know several who are twisting themselves into pretzels trying to get their green cards. They should not have bothered with getting visas, renewing visas, getting sponsors and references and immigration lawyers, learning the language, and all that silly stuff. What were they thinking?

Anyhow, those folks have to be pretty ticked off. And, they are. By trying to romance one group, the administration is alienating other groups. Now, if the administration wants to extend the same benefits to legitimate citizens-in-waiting, I would be a little more amenable to the idea.

After all, there are practical considerations to dealing with the reality of illegal immigrants. But it shouldn't be at the expense of legal immigrants who are trying to become citizens and have to jump through hoops to do so, instead of just existing and occupying space in the country for 5 years.


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I think we should round up the remaining 12 million illegal immigrants and deport them all - babies, kindergarteners etc . Go door to door, class room to class room, demand papers, and if you can't show them on the spot, off to jail they go where they have to prove citizenship.

We can do this if we quadruple the prisons, 10X ICE personel, spend an extra 100,000,000,000 a year.

All the while cutting taxes for millionaires.

For fun, look up the number of people this admin has deported - record highs. They concentrate on criminals and so on, not children. These are kids whose parents brought them here.

reality meets theory.


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All the while cutting taxes for millionaires.

*

So millionaires should pay for criminals that break our immigration laws?

Parents use the children for this purpose.


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So just who profits from depressed wages?


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Parents use the children for this purpose.

Parents bring their already born children into this country for what purpose? Neither the parents nor the children are citizens. How do the children help them?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Posted by david52 z5CO (My Page) on
Sat, Jun 16, 12 at 12:22

So just who profits from depressed wages?
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Illegal immigrants and their employers.

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Posted by esh_ga z7 GA (My Page) on
Sat, Jun 16, 12 at 12:28

Parents use the children for this purpose.

Parents bring their already born children into this country for what purpose? Neither the parents nor the children are citizens. How do the children help them?

*

Free schooling, free health care, jobs.
Parents get help with their kids, that's how their children being in this country "help" the parents.

Not to mention, but I will--the sympathy factor to circumvent our immigration laws.

As Barry demonstrated yesterday.


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well, nobody wants to pay taxes to increase the police state: build, staff, and operate the kind of authoritarian prison and deportation machine that would rival Nazi Germany, and deport all those nannies and gardeners and sheep herders etc, and it seems to me that if we don't want to pay to inforce the laws, and don't want to risk our own freedoms creating the draconian state where you have to show proof of citizenship everytime you move 10 feet, then you accept reality for what it is.

And given that around here, the biggest employers of illegal immigrants are the same rock-ribbed Republicans who run the place, I won't hold my breath waiting for them to destroy their own buisness model.


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well, nobody wants to pay taxes to increase the police state: build, staff, and operate the kind of authoritarian prison and deportation machine that would rival Nazi Germany, and deport all those nannies and gardeners and sheep herders etc, and it seems to me that if we don't want to pay to inforce the laws, and don't want to risk our own freedoms creating the draconian state where you have to show proof of citizenship everytime you move 10 feet, then you accept reality for what it is.

And given that around here, the biggest employers of illegal immigrants are the same rock-ribbed Republicans who run the place, I won't hold my breath waiting for them to destroy their own buisness model.


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Everybody knows that immigrants work harder for less and often bring skills that we have risen above. Once they have melted into the amoral mainstream, however all bets are off.


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Posted by david52 z5CO (My Page) on
Sat, Jun 16, 12 at 18:

And given that around here, the biggest employers of illegal immigrants are the same rock-ribbed Republicans who run the place, I won't hold my breath waiting for them to destroy their own buisness model.

*

If you can prove that that statement is the truth and not conjecture, I certainly hope that you have reported the crime.


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Oh, you want me to rat out my neighbors, destroy their livelihoods?


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It would solve the immigration problem a lot sooner if you did, that is--if you truly know that they are illegal immigrants and are not speculating.

I would think you might have to see their papers to know, but then, it's wrong to ask someone with dark skin if they're here legally, right?

I know someone that was discussing someone they knew that had hired someone that worked very cheaply. Without saying anything specific, I wondered aloud if the worker was perhaps here illegally.

I told them I'd never do that and hoped they wouldn't, and hoped their acquaintance was not doing that.

People complain about the situation of illegal immigrants, but let their pocketbook be their guide.

Not me, I pay three and four times more for yard work than I would if I hired someone that was likely an illegal immigrant. I will not do it.


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I don't pay anyone for yard work! Although I will contract out for large tree work ... and the companies are run by light-skinned citizen-looking people.


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Do you do it all yourself, esh?

My husband used to do it all, except for the container gardening and roses, which I took care of. I have three acres front back and side, several gardens, including vegetable, flower, butterfly, shade and ancestor garden, front beds, and cannot keep up with it myself.

I'm glad you use legal citizens, regardless of appearance.

If it did not violate our covenants, I'd get a goat.


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Yes, I do all the work myself - except I do have the kids (mine) cut the grass because they are capable and should contribute ;) We do have two acres but most of it is woods so I guess I don't have as much work as you probably do. The only work I do for the woods is to pull out the invasive plants that come in (like japanese honeysuckle, stilt grass and the occasional privet, nandina or mahonia).

I imagine if I had 3 acres of grass and ornamental gardens it would be a lot of work.


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Houseful,
Marquest, you are so smart! In fact she asked me that just today! But I told that she was safe because she has blue eyes!

My question was....If the President had not implemented this policy...Your 5 year old could come to you and ask "Mommy do they throw babies out of the country?"

houseful, I feel better now. If you learned nothing else this year you learned to answer a question of a 5 yr old by responding with a answer that has nothing to do with the question. That is something a 5 yr old can learn when they are old enough to understand the answer.

Other topic.....I only hire tree service when needed. I have 4 acres 1 acre of that is woods. I do my lawn with a tractor. Tend all my gardens myself. There are 15 flower, vegetable, orchard gardens. Before I retired I did hire that out lawn service.

But like Romney when you hire out jobs you do not know who that company hires to get the job done.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by batya Israel north 8-9-10 (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 17, 12 at 11:03

Dear Houseful - The president is not pandering to me. He reiterated (not invented, not bestowed) my civil rights. That is not pandering. That is leading.


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  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 17, 12 at 11:58

....from what I just read, seems Romney is going to go along with the Obama immigration policy. He says these kids were brought here "through no fault of their own".


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seems Romney is going to go along with the Obama immigration policy

He would be a fool not to. Otherwise, the GOP might as well stop running its Spanish-language political spots.


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seems Romney is going to go along with the Obama immigration policy

That is after he was against it. He is funny. During the Republican Debates he wanted them all to self deport.

Watched the Sunday news round the talking points made it clear that President Obama did this to draw him off the fence. He has to state his position.


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Yup, Romney "the flip flop". Just acting like Romney always does. If it's good for Romney's goals, both long term and short term, he will support it, if it doesn't fit into his short and/or long term goals, well he's against it.

He's against it until he is for it, when it serves his purpose, it's "flip flop time" for Romney.

Been there, done that with this character. What does he believe, what does he support? Depends on the circumstances and what his goals are.

Problem is what happens when he no longer needs what he is supporting, he'll just toss it out with the trash.

That's the "Romney way". Those of us in MA know all about that, time the rest of the country learns it as well.


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Do. Say. Anything.

See how long before it's back to the opposite again.


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During the Republican Debates he wanted them all to self deport.

During the primaries, Romney, or at least his strategists, had to be aware of the importance of Latino votes, especially in battle-ground states. I suppose that 'self-deportation' was seen as kinder and gentler than 'round them all up, and sent 'em back across the border' stance of his opponents. Now his campaign has to hope few remember his self-deportation comments.


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Now his campaign has to hope few remember his self-deportation comments.

The Democrats will not let it be forgotten.

Romney is the "king" of the "flip flops"


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Opportunistic, no principles and a compulsive liar. Won't matter diddlysquat to his supporters--birds of a feather.


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"I will always be for a woman's right to choose". Whoops, that was my evil twin talking.

Littleone. You should be beating the drum since you suffered under his four years of lies and misrepresentations.


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  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Mon, Jun 18, 12 at 10:18

If it's true that Romney supports Obama's policy of giving "dream" candidates working papers I'm glad he does. It's good policy, it's the right thing to do and I don't care what his motivation is.


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  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Jun 18, 12 at 10:26

I agree KWoods "it's the right thing to do" ...cept' Romney's base is not in agreement with this policy, how they gonna attack Obama when their own guy is walking in lockstep with the hated socialist from Kenya ?

:)


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I am so happy to see this president take strong leadership positions and this policy is long overdue! Afterall, it is immigrants that are the fabric that makes our nation so great! Look at the founders of any tech company, start up etc - very often immigrated here as a child.


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Unless you are full blooded Native American, you or your ancestors immigrated here from elsewhere. It doesn't matter from where or how.

Many times I've stated that I'd do anything to make a better life for my family... if I lived in fear of being inducted into a drug cartel, or there were absolutely no jobs and no way to provide enough... I'd try as hard as I could to go elsewhere... where I could provide. Many people have come here, to the US, to escape something we can only imagine...

Imagine all those people who can't just pick up and walk away... but are stuck in a life they had little to do in choosing...

I, too, am happy to see a sensible plan laid out by strong leadership. This is long overdue!


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I just made remarks in esh's other thread on this same subject.

I would't change a word I said after reading throught his thread.

In reading the responses here, I can't remember why, for so many decades, I was conservative with my politics.

I think those few agitating conservatives out there protesting the state of the GOP are correct. Things with that party of voters (or with the 'Independents' who are only that much more conservative and embarrassed of Bushjr - conservatives in general) are out of wack.

In other words, wacky.

This thread only reinforces the reasons why I renounced my conservativeship. When - if - the conservative voters grow some human sense, I'll probably lean back in a bit.

I'm convinced it will happen, it's just a matter of when.


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...a goat.

Demi, you did it again. Just spewed my drink.

: )


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...a goat.

Demi, you did it again. Just spewed my drink.

: )


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"Romney's base is not in agreement with this policy, how they gonna attack Obama when their own guy is walking in lockstep with the hated socialist from Kenya ?"

Really creates a serious problem for the GOP doesn't it?

Remember the GOP chose this guy, gave him the delegates to get the party nomination, even though they really don't want the guy, don't like the guy, don't really support the guy with their heart and sole.

How they resolve their own disaster that they made is really their problem.

Obama, and the Democrats just need to continue on with an even keel, take control of the issues, as Obama just did the a "sensible immigration policy" and the GOP is just going to fall apart.

Heck "King flip flop" is at the helm of the GOP. They don't even know what Romney supports and believes vs what he would actually do.

Odds are good "Mitt" "Mitster" doesn't know either. He has to have his flip flop time on everything.


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I keep pushing for a couple of fully legal, American born and bred lambs to frolic and play in our back yard, while keeping our grassy areas nicely shorn.

White, clean, healthy, CUTE wooly lambs (like in the childhood picture book story) - they would take care of my grassy areas for me (I do the grass cutting, he does the edging), be happy because with two, the lambs would always have each other (can die of lonliness if deprived of other lamb company, so I've been told) be cute if they stay spanking clean and white as the driven snow (as in the picture book, no black lambs for ME!) be loving an playful with my two dawgies and vice versa (as long as my dogs don't get visions of lamb chops dancing in their heads) - and .... free work force thrown in! What more could I want?

DH puts the nix on the whole idea. He says it's against the law to have lambs in a (fenced!) back area in our city.

Stupid ole' city.

:(


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We had a goat (Star) and a lamb (Ram) growing up. My paents were city people that got like one of everything when we moved to the country. I got rammed by that sweet lamb more times that i want to remember! I would have glady eaten him ;)


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Once again, Progressives expect unemployed Americans and legal immigrants to shut up and go quietly to the end of the line. How that plays with struggling Americans in November is yet to be seen, though.

Maybe the electorate is ready to see what happens when Democrat politicians are on the unemployment line, instead of American workers who can't get jobs in their own country.

With Democrats crowing they plan to open up the few available jobs we have in this country to illegal aliens (to whom Obama will grant faux "legalization" with the stroke of his pen) there is nothing "sensible" about hard working Americans voting for anyone whose loyalties lie with "immigrant communities" rather than with the American people. Looking forward to Americans weighing in how Democrat "representation" is working out for them.


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Nik, I sometimes wonder if we have access to the same news sources, because I rarely recognize your interpretation of any event that has to do with immigration.


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"Nik, I sometimes wonder if we have access to the same news sources, because I rarely recognize your interpretation of any event that has to do with immigration."

Nancy,

My "interpretation" simply notes who benefits and who gets screwed. As usual, Obama and the Democrats have taken sides against the American people. What part of Democrat politicians throwing American workers under the bus to help illegals is news to you?

I just hope Americans will see to it that their pandering politicians get all the credit they deserve for helping the "immigrant community," don't you?

Democrats should keep right on crowing until everybody understands once and for all that Americans aren't that special and neither is their country. And what better way to prove it than to make all those ugly Americans compete for jobs against illegal aliens. In their own country! How cool is that? It's good to be king!


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I just hope Americans will see to it that their pandering politicians get all the credit they deserve for helping the "immigrant community," don't you?

Just like I wish Americans would see that Republicans are only pandering to the wealthy citizens, screwing the rest of the American people while they're at it. Talk about taking sides against the American people!!


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I just hope Americans will see to it that their pandering politicians get all the credit they deserve for helping the "immigrant community," don't you?

Nik, you do know that this sort of rhetoric is why the GOP polls abysmally with Latinos, and other immigrants?

Your interpretation is fanciful at best, vindicative against the children of undocumented immigrants at worst. These children had no say in their being brought to the U.S. Many are in colleges and universities, or have graduated with B.A.s or advanced degrees. We ordinarily don't punish the children of lawbreakers, but that seems what you want to do.


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Nik your interpretation is so wrapped in down and out, negative, rhetoric.

Unless you are full blood American Indian you are a immigrant. What would you think if the Indians rose up and said this was their land? Everybody that was not a Indian has to go now. This it is my land and you have to go attitude is just crazy talk.

It is good Republican Propaganda that has been successfully used to get the base going but do not start to believe the lies.


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As usual, Obama and the Democrats have taken sides against the American people. What part of Democrat politicians throwing American workers under the bus to help illegals is news to you?

Apparently the fact that Democrats are also American people is news to Nik.


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Too bad the American Indians didn't think of a "sensible Immigration Policy."

Look what we, the immigrants did to the "native" people of this country.

and the GOP has the audacity to criticize something that the Democrats are trying to do.

Reality is that unless you are an American Indian, you are an immigrant. Which makes all of us part of the immigrant families that came to this country.

Kind of makes you wonder how we, as a country and a people, can "dictate" terms of an immigration policy.

Strange isn't it.


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I am going to use Nik's train of thought and say "White Man Speak with Fork Tongue" He is evil. He wants to kill my land and take the food from my children. There are not enough buffalos out there to feed my children and his too. He has to go back to his country. He is not King.

Are you getting the point yet Nik? How does it feel when the walking shoes are on your feet? Get the stepping. Good enough for them is good enough for you the immigrant.


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Nik,

I can understand that you don't support this policy what I can't understand is why you make this an Obama/Democrats issue.

Mitt Romney is supporting the initiative and it was GW Bush and the Republicans who wanted to grant full amnesty a few years back and nobody was more of a flag waver than GWB!

Be against the initiative if that's how you feel but don't make it an Obama hates Americans issue. That is simply not true.


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posted by nikoleta:
"Democrats should keep right on crowing until everybody understands once and for all that Americans aren't that special and neither is their country."

Actually, the Declaration of Independence already made that clear. Maybe Dems are just more tuned into the founding documents of our country? It's pretty explicit that the rights we happen to enjoy here (or that the authors hoped we would eventually enjoy) don't make us particularly special, but are the natural birthright of all of humanity.

Never saw where there was any exceptions for Latin Americans either ...


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by batya Israel north 8-9-10 (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 20, 12 at 3:19

""immigrant communities" rather than with the American people".

Um, immigrants BECOME the American people.


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Political theatre and peoples lives. Hyper-partisanship and 'gotcha' politics and kindergarteners thrown out of school. Thousands of kids raised in America who view themselves as Americans now treated as scum, all to score political points, oh, and scapegoat their parents for a lousy economy and lack of well-paying jobs.

Then blame Obama. Sounds like a great idea.


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"Nik, you do know that this sort of rhetoric is why the GOP polls abysmally with Latinos, and other immigrants?"

I doubt it. Hispanics/Latinos are like everyone else. Some are honest and follow the rules. They understand why illegal immigration is a disaster and not in our national interest. Others don't care about our national interest, or laws, or anything else. I'm just hoping elected officials who confuse illegal aliens who come here with a sense of entitlement as a "constituency" deserving of special rules and special treatment are held accountable for working against their constituents. I think the American electorate wants and need electeds whose loyalties lie with them. For some electeds, that's asking too much. They need to go.
----------------------------------------------------------

"I can understand that you don't support this policy what I can't understand is why you make this an Obama/Democrats issue."

Chase, it's Obama's executive order. It's Democrats who are giddy over handing out hundreds of thousands of work permits at a time when Americans can't find work.
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"Um, immigrants BECOME the American people."

Don't you mean LEGAL immigrants? I don't think illegal aliens are entitled to citizenship or legal residency under our laws.

Not sure harming job prospects for desperate American citizens, while shoving amnesty by executive order down their throats is a good strategy.

But what do I know? I told Democrats shoving Obamacare down their throats was a bad idea, too, but they didn't listen to me then, either. They had to learn for themselves that Americans don't like top down dictates. Electeds who forget who works for whom deserve what they get when election time rolls around.

As long as Americans remember whom to "thank" for handing out hundreds of thousands of work permits to illegal aliens, they'll know what to do in November. Remember 2010? There's a lot more where that came from.


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  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 20, 12 at 10:25

"Chase, it's Obama's executive order. It's Democrats who are giddy over handing out hundreds of thousands of work permits at a time when Americans can't find work. "

So..... you're against the belt tightening going on right now at the state level? The public sector is where jobs continue to be shed and that is a direct result of "austerity" policy. If you are truly concerned about jobs that is where you should be looking.

BTW, having working papers makes these dream candidates "legal".


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What I wanna see is a real ICE bust at an elementary school. You know, the balaclava-clad agents all in black, automatic weapons and bullet proof vests, busting down the door to Mrs Smith's 3rd grade class, telling all the kids to hit the floor with their hands where they can see them, then any kid who can't produce a valid, state issued ID hauled off in busses with blackened windows and deported.


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Nik you say.....Remember 2010? There's a lot more where that came from.

My question is do you remember 2008. There is more of that to come. People have short memories. 2010 has made them remember. You can continue to live in that bubble but reality live among the American People that truly love the spirit of the United States of America.

I noticed you did not address your immigrant status. Are you an American Indian?


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  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 20, 12 at 11:13

David, don't laugh, that Arapaio sheriff guy has arrested and is trying to deport a 2nd grader as a direct challenge to Obama's order. Saw it the other day.


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Nik, yes it is Obamas executive order, supported by Romney and it falls way short of what GWB wanted to do......so its not a Democratic thing...its a political thing and your guy will do it too.

The Hispanic vote is way to important to both parties...and its getting more important every year. You ain't seen nothing yet regardless of who is elected....and my bet is your VP candidate its going to be Latino.


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I doubt it.

Why? The Latino vote didn't go for eMeg Whitman, iCarly Fiorina, nor Sharron Angle.

How Hispanics Voted in the 2008 Election:

Hispanics voted for Democrats Barack Obama and Joe Biden over Republicans John McCain and Sarah Palin by a margin of more than two-to-one in the 2008 presidential election, 67% versus 31%, according to an analysis by the Pew Hispanic Center of exit polls from Edison Media Research as published by CNN.1 The Center's analysis also finds that 9% of the electorate was Latino, as indicated by the national exit poll. This is higher, by one percentage point, than the share in the 2004 national exit poll.2

Nationally, all Latino demographic sub-groups voted for Obama by heavy margins. According to the national exit poll, 64% of Hispanic males and 68% of Hispanic females supported Obama. Latino youth, just as all youth nationwide, supported Obama over McCain by a lopsided margin -- 76% versus 19%.


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Latino youth, just as all youth nationwide, supported Obama over McCain by a lopsided margin -- 76% versus 19%.

Ah youth - it will be the end of the Republicans once all the old people die off.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

The real problem here is that even being Native American doesn't make you native for unless you believe the cultural belief of natives "that they have always been here' which of course doesnt hold up to scrutiny(they are of asiatic derivation) everyone here came from someplace else and that someplace was a place they went to as well for if we can believe Anthropology we are all immigrants from Africa. People will move and will move into any space that fits a need and trying to stop that movement is like trying to stop the tides. All you can hope to do is exercise some control on the movements and that is a wan hope since it has never worked in the whole history of the world-yet-Hope springs eternal..as for getting all excited about it I cant.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 20, 12 at 14:39

" doesnt hold up to scrutiny(they are of asiatic derivation)"

Irony of the full circle variety.

"Although the Latino vote could very well decide the upcoming presidential election, Hispanics no longer make up the fastest-growing immigrant group in the United States. That honor instead goes to immigrants from Asia, according to a new study by the Pew Research Institute."

快樂的畢業!


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"BTW, having working papers makes these dream candidates "legal"."

No it doesn't. The president is simply giving them a free pass because they are Hispanic. His authority to hand out those work permits (which will hurt Americans) is not clear. Are you really OK with the president singling Hispanics out for special treatment? Are you really OK with Democrats setting them up to take jobs that should go to American workers?

My DIL had to qualify for a work permit. There is a process in place. She had to enter the US legally. SHE had to follow the rules. But she's black. Not special enough? If only she were Hispanic, maybe the rules wouldn't apply to her either. Democrats must be so proud.

By the way, Obama is really getting into this "executive privilege" stuff! Now he's asserting executive privilege to keep Congress from getting documents they asked for regarding deliberations over Fast and Furious. I thought he didn't even know what was in those papers. Now he's getting involved in an issue he said he didn't know anything about. What's up with that? Sounds like he DOES know what's in them. Maybe the name of the person who authorized Fast and Furious is buried somewhere in those documents. How weird that Congress still can't get that information out of this "transparent" administration, a year and a half of the murder of Border Agent Brian Terry.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Are you really OK with the president singling Hispanics out for special treatment?

As far as I know, this is not true. "Dream candidates" are from a number of countries, and not exclusively Latino. One of the spokespersons for the Dreamers in California - out as undocumented - is Filipino. Others are from Asia as well as the Pacific Islands.

And as you must be aware, Hispanic includes more than your favorite target of scorn south of the Rio Grande; Central and South Americans are also among the Dreamers.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Wed, Jun 20, 12 at 19:47

By the way, Obama is really getting into this "executive privilege" stuff!

....and BTW this is the FIRST time he has used executive privilege stuff :)

Just thought that little "fact" should be mentioned :)


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 21, 12 at 9:31

"The president is simply giving them a free pass because they are Hispanic."... "Not special enough? If only she were Hispanic, maybe the rules wouldn't apply to her either."

Woefully misinformed.... or perhaps willfully.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"As far as I know, this is not true. "Dream candidates" are from a number of countries, and not exclusively Latino."

Ah, yes. A handful of non-Hispanics may benefit. As if the illegals walking into our country by the millions, demanding their "rights" and marching with the Mexican flag above the American flag aren't Hispanics from south of the border.

As if the only group politicians left the door wide open for speak Tagalog. As if Americans are burdened with feeding, housing and educating millions of illegal aliens from the Philippines.

We aren't stupid, Nancy. Obama didn't get an "Atta Boy!" from Mexico for opening up jobs to illegal aliens who speak Greek or Dutch or Tagalog.

Mexico said "Thanks!" because Obama promised to let illegal aliens take American jobs unemployed Americans need.

Romney says serve in our military and you have a path to citizenship. That works. Handing out work permits for being here illegally does not.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

As if the illegals walking into our country by the millions, demanding their "rights" and marching with the Mexican flag above the American flag aren't Hispanics from south of the border.

Nik, you seem to need a history lesson. Los Angeles is the home to the largest community of Guatemalans outside of Guatemala City. We also have numerous immigrants from El Salvador - thank you, Ronald Reagan! - as well as Honduras - thank you again, Ronald Reagan! - and Panama - thank you, George HW Bush! All of those flags were visible during the immigrants' rights marches against the Sensenbrenner bill, as well as many, many U.S. flags. I was there on Broadway in downtown Los Angeles during the million+ march. Were you there?

We also have a large Korean community with its share of undocumented immigrants, as well as the Filipinos, Vietnamese, Cambodians, and Chinese.

I wouldn't bet the farm that all the Russians and Armenians in greater Los Angeles are documented, nor all the residents in Tehrangeles.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"""""""""Unless you are full blooded Native American"
"""""""Too bad the American Indians didn't think of a "sensible Immigration Policy.Look what we, the immigrants did to the "native" people of this country."

Even the "native Americans" arrived in this country from another one making them immigrants as well. Genocide was perpetrated on early "native Americans" by those same innocent "native Americans" that you feel so sorry for.......... before the white man ever set foot on America's shores.

""""""""""What I wanna see is a real ICE bust at an elementary school."

Let's get real here for a change. So """"The policy, effective immediately, will apply to people who are currently under 30 years old, who arrived in the country before they turned 16 and have lived in the United States for five years. They must also have no criminal record, and have earned a high school diploma, remained in school or served in the military."""" OK, is this going to apply to all those "illegal immigrants" still in school now when they meet the requirements? What about those in elementary school? Will it apply to them or will they automatically have amnesty. What about the "illegal immigrant" parents of these people......can't just kick them out of the country because their children are here........and on it goes........where does it end? They broke the law, they are here illegally, yet you want to welcome them with open arms and have them bring their brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts and cousins. As Lionhart said, what about those who are going through the legal steps to immigrate and become a citizen. If we are going to continue to make law breakers legal why bother having ANY immigration laws. While we are at it let's let all the burglars out of jail. What is the difference? They illegally entered some one's home and these illegal immigrants illegally entered the country......same difference.

Reagan gave us one amnesty, Bush tried to shove another down our throats but thank God the people raised such a stink it didn't happen. What good did the Reagan's amnesty do? Nothing was ever done about "illegal immigration" and here we are right back where we were when Reagan declared his amnesty. Until this country starts guarding our borders and enforcing immigration laws I don't think there should be any kind of amnesty offered. Why bother when it is just a vicious cycle?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 21, 12 at 14:36

"Until this country starts guarding our borders and enforcing immigration laws I don't think there should be any kind of amnesty offered."

Do you understand and acknowledge that the current administration has done far more in regards to borders and enforcement than any other preceding it? This has been the toughest administration re immigration by far.

When facts are not on your side arguing nonsense is not going to help you.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

When facts are not on your side arguing nonsense is not going to help you.

you took the words right off my keyboard.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 21, 12 at 16:00

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!

So, who of you that have objected to Obama's plan will be voting for Romney after the speech he just gave?

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by kwoods Cold z7 Long Is (My Page) on
    Thu, Jun 21, 12 at 20:53

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!

So, do those of you who reject Obama's policy endorse the policy Romney laid out today?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

As in, what policy? From what I read, he said "I'll fix it on DAY ONE" but then didn't say how or if he'd overturn what Obama did or not one detail. Just a bunch of 'feel good' words that don't mean jack to people looking over their shoulder every day.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

There hasn't been a sensible immigration policy for a very long time; i wish someone would come up with one.

The immigrants who "made America great" went through a rather different process.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Mittens has a secret plan but he still hasn't said if he'll permit the current situation remain while he perfects that errrrr ummmmm kettle of fish heads.
Common grow a pair Willard.
I wasn't joking when I suggested mining the border last year if we have an immigration law then abide by it.
But we simply don't abide by it & pretty much it's been a political badminton (doesn't qualify for football) game for yeasr regardless of party. from Ronney Regan and his precious Soviet Jewry turned into a huge republican voting block in Brooklyn. To Bush's amnesty all those companies wanted cheap labor & guest workers & hey their might have been some votes in it for bi LING ual Bush.
Unfortunately someone will bring someone across the border as a sex slave/housekeeper under a legal documented guest worker programs. Or we will have the other topic that the concerned righteous folk keep ignoring guest workers abused
none of you righteous types have a 2 words to say about the possible abuse of guest workers in Louisiana. Why should anyone take your concerns/opinions as serious their soooo one sided.

I want fewer specialist being admitted under work visas & a more egalitarian lottery in place. I like strong borders & I think some of you who have housekeepers should be sure they are here legally.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Evangelicals Not Satisfied With Romney's Vague Immigration Position.
I'm not satisfied with anyone's immigration policy but that comes from being an individual.
When the job situation changes here then we can open the borders again.
Free immigration is like free trade a ludicrous fiction that ends up looking like Gericault's Raft of the Medusa.
No political exceptions either ohhh that's cold Joe...yeah it's quite chilly.
If I want regulations on banking & a repeal of the Bush cuts & I want it badly. I want the same kind of enforced regulations on immigration & deportations not an on again off again lets play politics or ohh look sad puppy in the box approach to regulating the nations population & taxes.
You have wage slaves in this city I can't imagine what it's like around the rest of the country. This story stands out because the characters were wealthy. Mansion servant enslaved by uber-rich New York family for nearly six years.
A wealthy New York woman is facing criminal charges after being accused of keeping an illegal immigrant as an indentured servant and forcing her to live in a closet for nearly six years this is just a couple of months ago.
When I worked at the Daily News Year's ago we processed hundreds of ads for live in housekeepers for immigration lawyers. I'm sure some of them did alright & some where family but I can almost guarantee that a good percentage were in situations like the one above.

This one was in April, Police discovery that an out of state subcontractors carpentry foreman on a Kent, Ohio student housing complex construction project was operating a meth lab in his motel room led to discovery that 23 of the 25 construction workers in the foreman's crew were illegal immigrants.

In Chinatown 385,000 Chinese were listed in the 2007 of which 135,000 were not citizens I would suggest there are again as many who didn't respond or even know such a thing as a census exists let alone labor laws.

Smuggling fees now range from 70,000 to 85,000 dollars. It's a bounty that migrants always pay. " The organisation will sell you to someone else and you will have to work to pay it off," (old NYT article)
The life is miserable in apartments that were once hovels for the immigrants at the turn of the 19th Century have been further divided up into rabbit warrens where workes sleep in shifts. These hovels are dangerous for any fireman who responds to a blaze as many of the cubicles are gated & locked & the layouts the fireman are following haven't existed in years.
In 2010 23 business owners in Chinatown were busted for illegal smuggling & importation of "wage slaves" who paid as much as $75,000 a piece to come here.

So back to the opening gambit.

"Last week, a coalition of evangelical organizations, many led by Latino religious leaders, formed the Evangelical Immigration Table to mobilize support for immigration reform among the evangelical community and put pressure on legislators to pass reform. Members of the group met last week with President Obama’s staff as well as with Florida Sen. Marco Rubio. They told TPM that what Romney laid out Thursday was not enough.

“We want real, you know, muscle and details,” said the Rev. Gabriel Salguero, president of the National Latino Evangelical Coalition and one of nine heads of the new coalition. “What are we going to do with the 11 to 12 million [undocumented] people here?” he said. “Right now what we lack is details on policy. Everyone is speaking in generalities. We want details.”

“He did not address at all what he would do with those who are currently here undocumented,” said the Rev. Samuel Rodriguez, president of the National Hispanic Christian Leadership Conference. “And I do believe that somewhere down the road, that is the Jordan, the proverbial Jordan, that Governor Romney is going to have to cross in order to make a significant run for the Hispanic vote.”


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Fri, Jun 22, 12 at 17:43

"fact and fiction" .. and it seems both sides have a hard time telling the difference between the two, what a surprise NOT.

OBAMA: "We should have passed the DREAM Act a long time ago. It was written by members of both parties. When it came up for a vote a year and a half ago, Republicans in Congress blocked it. The bill hadn't changed. The need hadn't changed. The only thing that had changed was politics."

THE FACTS: Five Senate Democrats voted against sending the DREAM Act to the Senate floor for full consideration. The bill would have created a path to citizenship for many young illegal immigrants brought to the United States as children. Last week, Obama announced plans to stop deporting illegal immigrants who would have qualified for the DREAM Act. The policy change does not include a path to citizenship.

ROMNEY: "As president, I'd reallocate green cards to those seeking to keep their families under one roof. And we will exempt from caps the spouses and minor children of legal permanent residents. And we will eliminate other forms of bureaucratic red tape that keep families from being together." He added: "And if you get an advanced degree here, we want you to stay here. So I'd staple a green card to the diploma of someone who gets an advanced degree in America."

THE FACTS: It's unclear whether Romney would have the authority if elected president to change the way green cards are issued, or whether he would need help from Congress. It is Congress that sets the annual limits for visas for foreigners who have advanced degrees in certain fields of science, math and other professions. Lately, Republicans and groups representing U.S. workers have blocked legislative attempts to increase those limits.

Here is a link that might be useful: source


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Fairly presented, OM. Provocative and real.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Fri, Jun 22, 12 at 20:22

I am trying to point out how "both" sides play around with the truth in their quest for power (votes) and how "we the people" are being divided by petty partisan games.

How about our representatives actually represent us instead of the money interest in this country?

We are so screwed.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

I see that, OM, and I applaud it.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

What I don't understand is the willful, flagrant refusal to allow bright, ambitious kids a chance at a college education.

Why create a whole sub-culture of bright, ambitious, really p*ssed off and resentful people, forced out of the economic mainstream?

What could possibly go wrong?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Jun 23, 12 at 10:17

Why create a whole sub-culture of bright, ambitious, really p*ssed off and resentful people, forced out of the economic mainstream?

What could possibly go wrong?

.....the militarized police state is in place, and we always have the "drones" to use on the masses.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Posted by david52 z5CO (My Page) on Sat, Jun 23, 12 at 10:08

What I don't understand is the willful, flagrant refusal to allow bright, ambitious kids a chance at a college education.
Why create a whole sub-culture of bright, ambitious, really p*ssed off and resentful people, forced out of the economic mainstream?

What could possibly go wrong?
________________________

What does that mean; don't piss them off or there will be trouble? So it is fear that persuades you?

______________________
Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on Sat, Jun 23, 12 at 10:17

.....the militarized police state is in place, and we always have the "drones" to use on the masses.

____________________
Another good reason to guard our 2nd Amendment rights.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Oh, I think its a great idea to deliberately create a furious underclass, don't you?

As for your 2nd amendment rights, good luck against the SWAT units.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Yikes! Underclass? Like SERFS?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Where's my violin?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sun, Jun 24, 12 at 8:27

Like David I wish you good luck going up against the strongest military on earth ... :)


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Where's my violin?
demi,
Check your bible. Open it up. Don't use it as home decor.

Another good reason to guard our 2nd Amendment rights.
elvis,
You want them to pry it out your cold dead hands. That will be arranged. I see that RIGHT as good to have the choice being able to shoot yourself or the drone take you out. So you have choices both will be the same results. You will be dead.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Posted by marquest z5 PA (My Page) on
Sun, Jun 24, 12 at 8:37

Where's my violin?
demi,
Check your bible. Open it up. Don't use it as home decor.

*

Considering some of the remarks you have made on this forum, I'll pass on spiritual advice, as well as decorating advice (as I haven't seen photos of your home) from you!


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

During the three years of the Obama admin, they have beefed up border security, hired more ICE agents, and deported more people than the 8 years of the Bush admin.

Now given that there are still some 10 - 12,000,000 illegal people in the country, they concentrate on deporting criminals, dangerous people, repeat violators, etc, not grade school kids. Does anyone think thats a bad thing to prioritize?

To round up and deport the 12 million, lets keep in mind that the US leads the world with 2.4 million prisoners, prisons are at over-capacity, congress refuses to appoint Federal judges out of political spite, and just what is the alternative here?

Build a wall? Like what, the one that surrounds Israel? What about the 200,000 people, along with all that commerce, who legally cross the border every day? What about the approx half the illegal people who entered the country legally - entering by car, plane, etc., and just over-stay their visas?

What Americans fail to grasp is that the world now has 7 billion people, half of which are desperately poor and willing to try just about anything to survive, including horribly dangerous immigration elsewhere out of their hell holes. Millions of people are on the move, and thats just going to get worse as climate change wrecks havoc and people are flooded out, drought-ed out, forest-fired-out, dust-stormed out, etc, let alone people trying to escape the carnage and chaos of wars, including the drug wars in Mexico. Does anybody think a wall is going to stop them?

So the reality is that there are some 800,000 young people here illegally, brought by their parents, but aside from that, haven't broken any laws, are going to school and want to go on for further education.

Whats wrong with striving for an educated population? I, personally and selfishly, would rather have educated people taking care of me in my old age than uneducated, resentful people.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"I was there on Broadway in downtown Los Angeles during the million+ march. Were you there?"

No way! I would be ashamed to join foreign invaders in trashing my own country.

But thanks for being there yourself. You helped deliver a badly needed wake up call. Every image plastered on our television sets was worth at least thousands words!!!

If Americans had vague concerns about illegal immigration and the threat it posed to their own interests before the march, seeing that sea of Mexican flags, ingratitude, and sense of entitlement quickly removed any lingering doubts.

You have no idea how helpful that march was in opening American eyes. Thank you!!!


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

I would be ashamed to join foreign invaders in trashing my own country.

They were opposing the Sensenbrenner bill. If you characterize the exercise of freedom of speech and assembly against proposed legislation as trashing the U.S. I guess you would also be highly critical of the Tea Party assemblies and their opposition to health care reform.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"What Americans fail to grasp is that the world now has 7 billion people, half of which are desperately poor and willing to try just about anything to survive, including horribly dangerous immigration elsewhere out of their hell holes. Millions of people are on the move, and thats just going to get worse as climate change wrecks havoc and people are flooded out, drought-ed out, forest-fired-out, dust-stormed out, etc, let alone people trying to escape the carnage and chaos of wars, including the drug wars in Mexico. Does anybody think a wall is going to stop them?"

I grasp it. Consequently I think that standards of living for the overwhelming majority of the descendants of today's adult north americans will be far lower.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Posted by pnbrown z6.5 MA (My Page) on Sun, Jun 24, 12 at 14:42

"I think that standards of living for the overwhelming majority of the descendants of today's adult north americans will be far lower."

And to an extent, I believe that can be a good thing. Maybe one TV set would suffice, along with just enough transport vehicles as is necessary, no phones or ipads for kids, no soda or booze or cigarettes for anyone, no Starbucks, grow as much of your own food as possible, buy your clothes at the thrift (charity) shops, etc. There are a myriad of things one can change with minimal "sacrifice".

We already do that, and we can do even better. how 'bout the rest of you?


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Any future lowering in the standard of living would be a forced lowering - not the optional measures adopted by elvis.

Try to get the mindset of a whole nation in tune.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Like you can do that, DIB? If you can, I'll vote for YOU for president!


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

You can't get everyone on board, but I couldn't find an icon for being "sardonic". Suggest enforcement of real austerity? Why, we'd take to the streets like the Greeks.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

"Why, we'd take to the streets like the Greeks."

________________
I tried to conjure a picture of that, and I kept losing it. That sounds too funny, DIB.

Seriously and OT, though, we'd better do SOMETHING about an immigration policy. There isn't going to be a solution that everybody is happy with, for sure.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

Nancy:

Sensenbrenner, which you say you were out protesting, was an attempt to put Americans and their social and economic interests FIRST. That's what Americans once expected of elected leaders.

Sensenbrenner would have introduced meaningful efforts to secure our borders, and would have provided meaningful punishment for violating American immigration laws. People who helped illegals stay here would have been punished. What part of that did you oppose?

The names of folks with revoked and expired visas would have been put into a criminal data base, to help Americans avoid another 9/11. Our government would have had better tools for knowing who was here, legally and illegally. State and local governments would have gotten grants and training to expedite identifying who was legal and who was not. Sensenbrenner would have made smuggling human beings an aggravated felony. Which of those measures were you against?

Sensenbrenner would have helped discourage violating our immigration laws, thus easing the crushing financial burden illegal immigration puts on American taxpayers. What part of that did you oppose?

The thought of protecting our own folks set off massive demonstrations in Democrat circles. Sadly, a sovereign, secure America with politicians responsive to the American people does not fit with the Democrat agenda today any better than it did back then.

It would be fascinating to know what Democrats think openly betraying their out of work constituents with a million or more faux "work permits" will get for them in November.

Dems posting here love berating America. We'll soon find out if we are really as stupid as they keep saying we are.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

1.3 Million illegal immigrants have been deported under the Obama administration. More than any other president in history.......just sayin'


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

The thought of protecting our own folks set off massive demonstrations in Democrat circles. Sadly, a sovereign, secure America with politicians responsive to the American people does not fit with the Democrat agenda today any better than it did back then.

Nik, the Senate defeated a bill for immigration "reform" and prevented any reconciliation with the House's Sensenbrenner bill. Both Democrats and Republicans in the Senate supported the filibuster which prevented a vote from being taken. Your revisionist history isn't supported by fact.

While the Republican Party held majorities in both houses of the 109th Congress, it, like the Democratic Party during the seventies and eighties, was divided between its conservative and moderate caucuses. The more conservative-wing, led by Jim Sensenbrenner and his H.R. 4437, favored a restrictionist policy that focused almost exclusively on enforcement. The Senate's more comprehensive approach, S. 2611, represented the moderate-wing of the Republican Party that sought, at least in some way, to seek bipartisan support from Democrats and Independents. Despite the Senate’s attempt at bipartisanship, it seems S. 2611 may have come a bit too late in order to avoid the polarized environment that had developed during the 2004 campaign season. It is very likely the partisan divide sparked in 2004, continued into the 109th Congress as the war in Iraq took center stage as the nation's top issue and became the primary cause for President Bush’s declining approval ratings. During the same week the House passed H.R. 4437, an ABC/Washington Post Survey found 47 percent of respondents approved of the job President Bush was doing, while 52 percent disapproved. The same survey in May of 2006, after the immigration reform protests of April 10th and May 1st, found 33 percent approved of President Bush while 65 percent disapproved. These numbers are intriguing considering -- "at least according to the April 2006 LA Times/Bloomberg Poll -- "that a majority of the public favored immigration reform similar to that which President Bush proposed in January of 2004 and had advocated since. However, such a drastic decline in President Bush’s approval ratings over a relatively short time span may indicate why some G.O.P. members were hesitant to cast their lot with the president on this issue.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Jun 25, 12 at 15:23

If the businesses/individuals who knowingly (dont give me any bull that they dont know) hire undocumented people were punished severely the problem would be solved ... no jobs available unless here legally would have few if any crossing our borders.

Our system is so jacked up, we punish the drug user but not the big pushers/importers of drugs ... and we punish the worker and not the company.

When the Social Security administration notified large companies (probably small too) that they had workers with false ids (social security cards) NOTHING WAS DONE! No one in authority raised a finger to stop the real criminals .... American businesses from hiring the immigrants without papers because they KNEW why. Undercut the American worker, specially those uppity union folk, and what they cannot "insource" they "outsourced"

You republicans that are voting for Romney ? I guess it is AOKAY with all of you that he was in the forefront (BAIN Capital) of outsourcing AMERICAN JOBS.


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RE: Sensible Immigration Policy

A cranky underclass is as disturbing as an entitled imported working expert.


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