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It's good to be a conservative!

Posted by mrskjun 9 (My Page) on
Mon, Jul 9, 12 at 19:00

Am I happy because I'm a conservative, or am I a conservative because I'm happy?

"Why Conservatives Are Happier Than Liberals"

Here is a link that might be useful: link


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

The first thing that comes to mind is "ignorance is bliss", but that would be mean. So, "Congratulations".


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Hopefully all the bliss from wealthy, white, married, church goers will not be enough to elect that Mormon.

I'm going to be a happy idiot
and struggle for the legal tender
Where the ads take aim and lay their claim
to the heart and the soul of the spender

Pretender by Jackson Browne


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Frank still being true to form!

All I know is that the with the alarmist, paranoid inclinations that libs have, I now see why they seem angry all the time.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

"alarmist, paranoid inclinations that libs have"

Really, your side has birthers, claim the Pres. is going to take our guns, and still insist the Pres. is Muslim. I don't think liberals own "paranoid inclinations".


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

I should have clarified that I was talking about the libs on this forum. So who on this forum is a birther, etc?


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I was speaking of conservatives in general, but I have certainly heard some birther talk around here.


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It is what I have said always. When you are oblivious to other's and it is about me, me. It is ignorance and it is bliss.

I think it was Bill that said God was a Democrat.....

So I will accept that Conservative are happier. To be less concern for people that have little fits my attitude. I can live with the analysis why I am not as happy.

An explanation for the happiness gap more congenial to liberals is that conservatives are simply inattentive to the misery of others. If they recognized the injustice in the world, they wouldn't be so cheerful. In the words of Jaime Napier and John Jost, New York University psychologists, in the journal Psychological Science, "Liberals may be less happy than conservatives because they are less ideologically prepared to rationalize (or explain away) the degree of inequality in society." The academic parlance for this is "system justification."


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I knew, as soon as I saw the title of the thread, that this was going to be a flamer.


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From the article:

In the words of Jaime Napier and John Jost, New York University psychologists, in the journal Psychological Science, "Liberals may be less happy than conservatives because they are less ideologically prepared to rationalize (or explain away) the degree of inequality in society." The academic parlance for this is "system justification."


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

In the words of Jaime Napier and John Jost, New York University psychologists, in the journal Psychological Science, "Liberals may be less happy than conservatives because they are less ideologically prepared to rationalize (or explain away) the degree of inequality in society." The academic parlance for this is "system justification."

Dang Nancy! You had to read the article and spoil it with reality.

-Ron-


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All I know is that the with the alarmist, paranoid inclinations that libs have, I now see why they seem angry all the time.

That is so funny - it exactly describes several of our current conservative posters!!!


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Posted by heri_cles 10 (My Page) on
Mon, Jul 9, 12 at 19:32

Hopefully all the bliss from wealthy, white, married, church goers will not be enough to elect that Mormon.

*

It won't.

Perhaps their money will.

:)


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

All I know is that the with the alarmist, paranoid inclinations that libs have, I now see why they seem angry all the time.

You may see it as anger but many others see it simply as frustration at constantly having to try to rebuke the false information that many of these threads are based on. There is a big difference.

Did you read the article? Here is how they characterized conservatives.

After all, there is an entire academic literature in the social sciences dedicated to showing conservatives as naturally authoritarian, dogmatic, intolerant of ambiguity, fearful of threat and loss, low in self-esteem and uncomfortable with complex modes of thinking.

"Liberals may be less happy than conservatives because they are less ideologically prepared to rationalize (or explain away) the degree of inequality in society." The academic parlance for this is "system justification."

...

One possibility is that extremists have the whole world figured out, and sorted into good guys and bad guys. They have the security of knowing what's wrong, and whom to fight. They are the happy warriors.

As we have mentioned many times, the boogie man of the day hence our odj's.

Fundamentalists ARE happy. Who wouldn't be living in a world where facts don't matter and real life doesn't factor in?

And none, it seems, are happier than the Tea Partiers, many of whom cling to guns and faith with great tenacity.

If that is happy then I'd much rather be considered unhappy. :)


So who on this forum is a birther, etc?

Ask your friends Elvis, Nik, Cait,...

I knew, as soon as I saw the title of the thread, that this was going to be a flamer.

Yep, that was the intention since the op is smart enough to know this would get everyone going. Now wait for the feigned innocence and / or the claim she is being attacked.

Here is a link that might be useful: One of many, many, many...birther threads


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

So will hemlines be up in the Fall?


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

It probably is true that conservatives are happier. Ignorance IS bliss , they say and they have blinders on. They aren't outraged by the inequality in America. They aren't scared about the climate change that's happening at such an alarming rate. One fact that surprised me, and I don't have a link, is conservative Christians in the Bible belt have a much higher divorce rate than liberals in the northeast. That was a news story I read last year.


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It's interesting what passes as conservative . We have become used to the notion lately that right wing extremism is conservative.
I would hardly regard myself as a conservative but It's obvious Mrs K & I don't agree about the defense of the US when it comes to drones.
It's obvious conservative no longer means We the people but you got to be personally responsible & row your own boat while voting in block. Puhlease the term was bastardized Once John Birch drew his first breath. I have yet to see conservatives on this forum I see xenophobes & money grubbers, Sanctimonious I got mine claque. The religious whiners all fled or have at least shut up.
Curious I am for strong borders & orderly immigration yet my posts about the subject don't drip with the xenophobia I've seen with the other "beware the hispanic menace posters"


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Loose lips sink postings... (Don't know what that means but it sounds right.)


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Shhhs perhaps some kegel exercise would help with that!


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RE: good to be a conservative!

When I think about exercise of any kind I lay down until the thought passes...


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Get a fitbit and you won't thinking about stopping for long.
It is a nifty little device that has encouraged me to make better use of my time.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

  • Posted by vgkg 7-Va Tidewater (My Page) on
    Tue, Jul 10, 12 at 9:14

....but it's not good enough.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

No, apparently I'm not the only one that needs it!

Your taking the time to post something completely sarcastic and nonsubstantive proved that!

;)


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Great article, MrsK! Thanks for sharing.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Yes, great...and on that I'll pass


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ahhh come on over to the dark side marshall, it feels good to be happy!!


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Happy equals goading & petulant hmm!


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In my opinion, there are too many Americans on "feel good" meds.

Kate


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Well, especially on this forum but pretty much in general (who can forget the summer of the Town Hall meetings onward?) they have struck me as being pretty darn unhappy and, why.....downright furious! since the last election.

It's all perspective.

If you decide are happier than I am Mrsk - why, bless your heart, I am happy for you!


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Hilarious.


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"An explanation for the happiness gap more congenial to liberals is that conservatives are simply inattentive to the misery of others. If they recognized the injustice in the world, they wouldn't be so cheerful...."

Here is a link that might be useful: read more


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

And there wasn't injustice in 1593 or 1652 or 1746 or 1876 or 1950 or 2008?
There will be injustice in 2074 and 3057.

You can't let the woes of the world keep you in the pits.
Charity begins at home.

You do what you can in your little corner of the world and try to make yours and your community a better place.

Trying to solve the world problem is too massive an undertaking.

Do you see injustice in your community?
Combining resources in your own community is a much more attainable solution than worring about the worlds' injustice.

I'm not meaning this as selfish or narrow just realistic.
You have to do what is attainable.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Wow... ignorance sure IS bliss... hilarious thread, right up there with the other gasoline and match threads that predictably pop up.


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My goodness, there goes that envy thing again lol. Ignorance, pills? hahahaha

And thank you mylab, I take all the blessings I can get.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Happy Happy Joy Joy.

Your life can be as happy or as miserable as you want it to be.

It depends on whether you see yourself as a victim or not.


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"It depends on whether you see yourself as a victim or not."

I have wanted to try this.

Let's see if I use it correctly.

HOOT!!


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>>Happy Happy Joy Joy

It depends on whether you see yourself as a victim or not.<<

Or just another commodity.
Oh joy, a new demi low.

Sea


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

See demi, you made at least two liberals happy for a moment. It certainly doesn't take much lol.


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Mrs K if only you could hold off on silly remarks like that. You pose pertinent questions and then insist on divvying up the answers as us versus them which has you defending another conservative regardless.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Pfft...


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Oh, it's just part of a day's work, mrskjun--making people happy!


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

ink, when people don't post on a thread, but simply show up to snark someone, and do it quite often. Could you ask them to hold off on snarky remarks like that?


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Now that everyone has passed beyond happiness and bliss to Nirvana, let me cheer for the great HOOT!!! from Frank.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Marshall, I agree. Frank made a perfectly executed HOOT! on his first try.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

To be fair to Demi, there is truth to what she said.

People who have a victim mindset are more miserable than those who don't. Not only are they more miserable, but in my experience, it is very easy to become stuck in that mindset "rut". Once they start to live in victimhood, it can progress to the point of becoming a lifestyle. They can find victimhood in places it doesn't exist.

Now, I know this forum sometimes gets touchy and takes things as personal slights so just let me say that I am NOT talking about this tit-for-tat argument in this thread.

I'm talking about people I work with in real life, even some family members.


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Oh I agree H.T - and those who see themselves somehow in a victim role a great deal of the time (or suspicious of the motives of others, I find the two often go together) has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with the person who is always feeling somehow victimized.

I have a family member like that too. It can be tiring, being around a very generally negative minded person, subtle though it might be.

My DH says she would look for the dark cloud in a silver lining.

Nobody works as hard as she does. She has to (in her own head) take care of everybody else. Nobody does it quite right if she and another person are doing a task together and you don't do it her way. And she feels somehow like she is victimized by all this self assumed, all in her own mind responsibility.

Nobody can suffer either, without her outdoing them - you have a headache? She will express great sympathy because she has head pain also - she suffers migrains! You have a sore muscle? She will give you the name of the best over the counter balm for sore muscles because she is recovering from a torn muscle so she knows that specific type of pain. You have a stomach ache? She holds your hand in understanding because she is on a special diet for extreme stomach issues.

No matter the issue, she must out shine, out do, one up, and it tends to end the conversation.


People like that - regardless of how nice and decent they might actually be or how much you might honestly love them (of course they have good and decent, loving sides)- tend to be just too judgemental, controlling and generally difficult to be around for any length of time. The atmosphere around them becomes too stressed, it feels like they suck the joy out of life.

Despite the fact that they are also sometimes fun and that you do love them very much.

But more so from a distance with short, carefully timed visits.


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Wow...the HOOTERS and the fans are here. What perfect combo


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

I have a family member like that too. It can be tiring, being around a very generally negative minded person, subtle though it might be.

I know exactly what you mean mylab, and you are correct, it can be very tiring.

I have a portion of my family that still lives on reservation and that is a good word to describe visiting them... tiring. Many of the people who leave the reservation do it for that very reason, they need to get away from the constant perceived victimhood, it's a mentally exhausting way of living, being surrounded by that all the time.

But more so from a distance with short, carefully timed visits.

Yes, absolutely. I hate to say it but in my case, it's more that I lose patience with them than anything else. there is an excuse for everything and it usually involves blaming anyone else but themselves for everything.

Having an argument with most people living on the res about their lives is a LOT like having an argument with a Tea Party American about universal healthcare.

You can argue the facts, you can show them a million examples, you can point out the baseless excuses, and you can refute the unsubstantiated lies but it will not make ANY difference. Their mind was already made up and you are only wasting your valuable time. Better to shrug your shoulders and walk away.


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Yes, our very negative family members can be very trying, I put up with my family member's negative attitude for decades, but finally she was prescribed a mild anti-depressant pill, and her attitude did a complete turn-about. I am usually very suspicious of prescribed happy pills (of various kinds) and usually urge people to get off them or take a considerably lesser dose, but after having suffered through my family member's victimhood and excuses for 4 decades, I was actually glad in her case that she started taking them.

Interesting postscript--hadn't had contact with her son in a couple decades when I got a phonecall out of the blue from him. He was practically in despair what to do about his mother--"the most negative person he had ever met in his entire life," he said. Turns out she went off the anti-depressants and fell into a deep depression. He got her back on them, and no more problems.

What I'm trying to say is that we do need to give some of these whiners and negative people a break sometimes. In many cases, their perpetual victimhood attitude may have more to do with a serious depression that needs treatment--in other words, all that whining is a symptom of their depression problem, not their poor character development or incorrect political affiliation.

Kate


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Kate, you make a good point.

However, I'm not sure that it's not just a case of using chemicals (antidepressants, etc.) to mask the conscious choice one makes of cultivating a negative attitude, blaming someone else and failure to take responsibility for one's life, and/or poor character development.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

So demi are you saying that there are no medical reasons to take anti-depressants? No people with true chemical imbalances? If you do believe there are valid medical situations, would you hazard a guess on what you think is the percent of people with true medical issues vs. those taking it as a life crutch?

And if they are taking it as a life crutch, does that matter if it actually helps them?


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Sooo...

the negative attitudes displayed by someone like, say, Rush Limbaugh could very well be just a medical issue or depression and we should give him a break?

Now that I think about it... getting that man some happy pills might be a good idea.


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Most of the states on this list seem to be rural, conservative, and Republican. :(

Do they all need to be medicated? That would explain a lot actually.

Here is a link that might be useful: Depressing states.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Posted by esh_ga z7 GA (My Page) on
Wed, Jul 11, 12 at 12:18

So demi are you saying that there are no medical reasons to take anti-depressants? No people with true chemical imbalances? If you do believe there are valid medical situations, would you hazard a guess on what you think is the percent of people with true medical issues vs. those taking it as a life crutch?

And if they are taking it as a life crutch, does that matter if it actually helps them?

*

No, I'm not saying that at all.

Of course there are chemical imbalances--but to what degree are those chemical imbalances so off that we actually require substances to function? It's individual and subjective as to "function."

Certainly drugs can help people be better parents, better employees, if they are having problems.

Conversely, I think drugs can be a cop out and easy way out to avoid dealing with life--with problems that when confronted and addressed, people can learn from and it can make them better people, better parents and better employees or whatever roles they have.

Having studied criminology, I have always been distressed about judging to what degree some people are responsible for their actions--Charles Whitman had a brain tumor, but it cannot be conclusively determined if that is why he went on the rampage at UT.

I've always felt some degree of sympathy for Jeffrey Dahmer, but not a bit for Ted Bundy. I cannot articulate why that is, but I have always felt that Dahmer did not like what he was doing but felt compelled. I felt that Bundy enjoyed it.

Does that make any difference, in the end?

I'm not sure that it does, they still committed unspeakably horrible acts.

So, does it matter if people take drugs or alcohol to deal with their problems? If it is used a crutch, does it matter?

To them, yes. To those around them, yes.

To others, I think that barring tragic circumstances (and none of us always have a way of knowing if anyone has had them or not) the generic 35 year old suburban housewife that polishes off a bottle of wine every night because the kids get on her nerves is not a particularly admirable person in that regard.

To the person that breaks up with their boyfriend or girlfriend and asks for Valium and takes it because they don't want to "hurt," I don't have a high opinion of them, either.

My opinion doesn't matter to people that would do something like that, anyway, that's okay.

But I do think that our society avoids dealing with what I consider every day life by using prescription and illicit drugs and alcohol on a regular basis. I am NOT referring to people that have been abused, or suffered terrible tragedy.


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You're right--most of those depressed states are Republican or what they call "leaning to the Republicans." Time to get them some of those happy pills that the urban/suburban Republicans are enjoying.

Rush suffering from depression? Quite possibly. If he has a borderline depression, that may be why he self-medicates with illegal drugs. On the other hand, addictive drugs will cause depression or increase its severity. So as long as he self-medicates, yes, he might well be depressed.

Does that mean we should excuse him? Hell NO! I said that depression means we "sometimes" need to give them a break--if it is a medical condition, then they don't have a lot of choice in the matter. And we probably need to help them get medical treatment rather than just denouncing them as the losers they seem to feel they are. However, he is a public figure who chooses to make big money out of his bad moods, so I definitely hold him responsible for his behavior. Besides, by "a break," I didn't mean "excuse the behavior."

Demi--where you and I go our separate ways (as usual), is that you give the impression that you think many, maybe most people CHOOSE to be depressed, whereas I think no one (or very few people) would CHOOSE to be depressed--after all, a serious enough depression can lead to suicide, and I don't think happy, well-adjusted people are picking let's do depression and suicide next Wednesday. To me, if a depressed person commits suicide on Wednesday it is because they suffer from a lot of depression that they cannot control.

I don't know exactly where the cut-off lines would be, but there is a sliding scale from "feeling blue and out of sorts today" to "I can't seem to shake this depression without exerting great effort in order to get interested in anything" to "I can't take it any more--this burden is too much--I give up." I would put the "feeling blue" category as the only one that is fairly easily controllable, and I suspect we have many more Americans moving towards my second category ("I can't seem to shake this depression...") than a lot of people are willing to admit.

Kate


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

demi, perhaps you misunderstood what I was referring to - I mean drugs like Zoloft and Wellbutrin, not drugs like a bottle of wine and a valium. I'm talking about everyday medication that depressed people take to get on with their lives, not an occasional coping strategy.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

esh and Kate, esh is right--I'm not referring to people truly suffering from depression.

I understand it all too well, not me, but my mom has suffered from depression. As in, it was a very interesting childhood. I can't identify with it, but I understand how debilitating it can be to those suffering from it and those around them.

I suppose I have had a week or so in my life where I felt that way and it was very very foreign and disconcerting.

My grief has been extensive and overwhelming for some time, but I can say without a doubt I have never been depressed about the situation, only sad.

Certainly certain drugs for people with serious depression problems are a lifesaver. So, Kate, we don't part company in that regard.

My reference was to many people that I know of, and some that I do know, that habitually take prescription drugs when they've had a "busy" day or their family gets on their nerves. As my recollection, I am the ONLY person in my grief group of ten people that did not take any prescription drugs to cope with the loss. I am also the only person that was left alone--others had family members living with them--grown children, at home children, parents, grandchildren.

I guess I've just always been a person that thinks that things happen to us to learn from them, and we should embrace those events and learn from them, not avoid thinking about them.

But I do realize that individuals are different and have different personalities, coping skills, maturity and religious convictions which can play into living a "happy life," regardless of one's circumstances.


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Kate said it well. Nobody asks to be depressed. It's not a character flaw, although it certainly can look like one at times. My story is a bit like Demi's, as my mother went through life with depression, "medicating" herself with two plus packs a day of cigarettes. Not fun for her or our family.

If anyone here has been feeling sad or depressed, and thinking it must be YOUR fault because you can't "shake" it, you are wrong. It's not your fault. Only you know what the losses you have experienced feel like to you. It doesn't matter if a friend had a similar loss and got through it just fine. We are all different. Call your family doc and go in to talk about it. If s/he suggests meds, it's not like you are committed to taking them forever. But they may be worth a try. It's nobody's business but yours.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

Well said, nik.

Kate


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Nik, could not agree more. Well said.


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I think if my father hadn't been so afraid of the stigma of depression meds, he would still be alive today. Instead, he chose to sit around depressed, atrophied and gave up his will to live. :-(


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Oh Houseful! I am so sorry about your father.

We would never in a million years expect a person with epilepsy to "will" it away. But let somebody fall into depression and it's a whole 'nother story. For some reason, it's easy to blame the victim for some supposed "weakness."

I think if more people knew that help for depression begins with the family doctor (you don't have to call a psychiatrist...if you need one, you will be referred) there would be more people who need help actually getting it.

It doesn't help that there are always friends, relatives and outsiders out there who know everything there is to know about what you "should" be doing. As if "getting over" depression that has taken hold of a life is a do it yourself project...and shame on you for not doing it! No wonder people are ashamed to seek help...

Thanks for the kind comments, Chase and Kate.


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Holy cow Batman, a thread with some congenial dialogue between posters that are usually not congenial.

My contribution is that when I was attending Cal Poly Pomona my advisor was a clinical psychologist. Cal Poly being a technical school some of the students were building biofeedback machines as that was the time when biofeedback was just being discovered.

Dr.Winterborne had six of the machines in his office and ran tests with students volunteers. Having depression was not a requirement just an interest in the idea. I spent some time using the machines between classes for interest and relaxation.

He would hook us up and lead us through a guided meditation and we would watch the gages and lights and listen to the range of sounds emanating through the machines from our bodies. Heart rate, electrical conductivity, breath rate, brainwave activity and more. It is amazing how we can control our bodies in the realm of thought beyond just motor functions. Things that are autonomous can be tapped into and affect our well being in more ways than we realize.

Later when Missy was so distraught after the death of our son I remembered those sessions and suggested she try it. It has advanced to a well thought of medical practice and is frequently used in therapy. I give credit and so does she to biofeedback bringing her out of depression to the point of being almost catatonic. It is a great alternative to medication although it can work with medication very well. If you or some one you know could benefit you may want to look into it.


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My brother hung himself in late July 1992...seven weeks after my mom passed away and nine months after my dad passed away. I don't know if it was because of grief or depression or his situation at the time...extended unemployment and relationship problems with his girlfriend...or his alcoholism. Combination of everything I supposed. I personally went into an extended period of mild depression and extreme grief. There's a difference there. Also, it's my understanding that deep depression may be caused body chemistry imbalance.

Today I can talk about my mother and father fine...but every time I mention my brother, I choke up.

-Ron-


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Ron, I'm so sorry.


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Ron, Don, Nik and others who have seen the incredible pain depression can cause to the one who is depressed and to their loved ones, my heart goes out to you. Seeing those we love in pain is so difficult and in some ways equally as painful.

Life is just so darn complicated, no easy answers , no road map, not just a matter of always making good choices and taking personal responsibility. Such is the human condition and that's OK.


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RE: It's good to be a conservative!

I am so sorry, Ron. Suicides leave family members not only with the loss of the loved one, but with the guilt of wondering if they could or should have done something different. Please remember that with the deaths of both parents, your family was dealing with off-the-charts stress in a very short period of time. You were all on overload with grief and stress with the death of your father, and just as you were beginning to get back up, you were knocked down again by the loss of your mother. (I lost my mother in the spring of 1992 also. That brought issues I am sure you also had to deal with like selling the house, letting go of the things your parents had collected over a lifetime, etc. Until those things are dealt with there is simply no downtime, no escape, and little healing. It's a time when losses just pile upon more losses you can't go around. Your only choice is to go through them.)

Give yourself some credit. You did the very best you could under extreme circumstances. No matter how many times you go over it in your mind, the fact remains that you...and everyone else who knew and loved your brother...did the very best you could with the information you had. Your brother's suicide was not your fault. If you had known what he was doing, you would have been the first one there to stop him. You did what you could, because it was all you could do. You are a person who comes through on this forum as caring very deeply about other people. Give yourself the credit you deserve for being the good and caring person you are. Accept that you are not at fault...because you are not. You never were. Nik

Here is a link that might be useful: Mayo Clinic Depression Info


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