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A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Posted by markjames (My Page) on
Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 13:11

"A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

As Americans head to the polls, they face a disastrous new normal: For the first time, the U.S. economy has shifted in the direction of a part-time, low-wage workforce.

The number of Americans now working part time has soared to 8.3 million�up 313,000 in the past two months alone. With economic growth declining or stagnant for quarter after quarter, many companies feel it is too risky to take on people full time.

This has created an army of "underutilized labor." America's narrow unemployment rate is 7.9%, but it is 14.6% when accounting for involuntary part-time workers. The number of Americans working full time has declined by 5.9 million since September 2007, while the number working part time has jumped by 2.6 million.

Over the same period, according to the National Employment Law Project, low-wage occupations have grown nearly three times as fast as mid-wage and higher-wage ones. Whereas lower-wage jobs were 21% of losses during the recession, they have accounted for 58% of new jobs since�and these have the highest proportion of part-time jobs. By contrast, mid-wage occupations were 60% of recession losses but have been only 22% of recovery growth. Higher-wage occupations were 19% of jobs lost and have been 20% of jobs recovered.

The lower-wage occupations that have seen the most growth include retail salespersons, food-preparation workers, laborers and freight workers, waiters and waitresses, personal- and home-care aides, office clerks and customer representatives. Over the past two years, the food service, retail and employment-services industries have added a total of 1.7 million low-wage jobs, fully 43% of America's net employment growth.

Meanwhile, the better-paying manufacturing, finance, insurance and real-estate industries have seen no growth or not enough to make up for recession losses. And steep cuts in state and local government jobs have hit mid-wage and high-wage employees hardest.

Then there is the matter of wage growth and decline. For those in lower-wage and mid-wage jobs, pay has declined over the past year by 2.1% and 2%, respectively. In higher-wage occupations, pay has increased 4.1%.

This underscores the difference between job quantity and job quality. When low-wage jobs are growing in number, mid-wage jobs are disappearing and higher-wage jobs are paying more, the result is a hollowed-out middle class.

Looking ahead, the industries expected by the Bureau of Labor Statistics to add the most jobs by 2020�health care, social assistance and retail�are notorious for low-wage and insecure work. Many don't offer even minimum wage or overtime protection.

Today's part-time workers will have it particularly rough in the future if they don't receive training to boost their skills. America will need to create 1.8 million to three million new jobs every year just to absorb the labor force's new entrants. So competition for scarce jobs will be tough, especially when technology and globalization are wiping out many middle-class jobs in manufacturing and transportation, for example.

Won't the disequilibrium be corrected when the economy gets out of its rut? Alas, the long-term nature of these trends suggests they are more structural than cyclical. From academia to retail, government to warehouse work, employers are increasingly offering part-time work or nominally full-time jobs with lower wages and fewer benefits. ObamaCare will accelerate this trend starting in 2014, as the costs of insuring full-time workers will get so high that firms will have incentives to limit their weeks to 29 hours or fewer.

America's challenge is to avoid descending totally into a low-wage, part-time economy with stagnant growth and employers pressed to shorten workers' hours or ask them to take unpaid leave. If not�and if millions of workers feel that they are falling further and further behind�the result will be a stratified society.

Social mobility in America is already much less than we have long liked to believe. And disparities in income, education and social behavior are reinforcing themselves all the more, so future mobility might be lower still. Thus many Americans' gut feeling that the American dream is fading.

According to the Pew Research Center, one-third of Americans now identify themselves as lower class or lower middle class, up from one-quarter in 2008. This isn't surprising when 23 million Americans are unemployed or underemployed. They, and everyone else in the economy, want to know: When will America once again be the land of opportunity?"

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This is a timely article as many we know are complaining that they're "not getting enough hours", or they're getting on-call/as-needed/unscheduled hours during days, hours, shifts they can't work due to transportation, child care etc.

We have many relatives lucky to get 2 or 3 4-hour shifts per week.

Here is a link that might be useful: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I had a thought rumbling around my head the last time there was a topic on part time workers.

In order to discourage companies from having a workforce of part time workers (usually in order to avoid paying benefots or full time wage rates), would it be feasible to have a higher rate of employer-paid payroll taxes for part-time employees?

I'm not sure how payroll for USians works, but here we have some employee and some employer paid deductions. For example, our Employment Insurance has premiums paid by both parties, with the employer paying 1.4 times of what the employee pays. So if an employee pays $100 in a year for premiums, the employer pays $140.

So what if there are two classes of workers, part time and full time, defined by, say a 34 hour workweek and below. If that happens, the employer's portion becomes 2 times or 3 times the employees portion. Maybe even have special exemptions so you don't catch small businesses or student employers in a trap, say businesses with less than 2 employees and full time students are not subject to the higher rates.

That's just one example, but I think it would be workable.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

People have been seen this trend for a while. Walmart is certainly one of the employers that would rather have a bunch of part-timers.

HG, good idea. Employers need some incentives to create more full time jobs.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Employers need some incentives to create more full time jobs.

or at the very least, there should be a partial compensation for the extra programs that need to be accessed by their part time employees. By having places like Walmart pay higher premiums to the government for each part-time employee, it might help offset the cost of programs like housing subsidy or food stamps.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 14:21

Actually KMart was a trend setter in "dodging" benefits back in the 70's, with employees not getting more than 32 hours a week.

A win win for the "creators"
Let us pay....


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Many supermarkets do the same thing with their cashiers and stockboys.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I suspect there will be more part time positions due to employers trying to get out of paying the penalties under Obamacare.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Local Walmart store jobs are highly sought after jobs as they pay higher than average, offer more hours than average and have more chance for promotion to higher paying positions full-time jobs etc.

Some local Grocery-Only supermarkets have the highest percentage of part-time workers and very little chance for promotion.

We've had dozens of relatives that have worked for grocery stores that often went a week or 2 without 1 scheduled, or 1 unscheduled/on-call 4 hour shift.

Businesses with a lot of on-call part-time employees tend to be overstaffed as they may literally have to call half a dozen or more workers to find one available, or capable of working a single 4 hour shift without notice.

Turnover, new hire washout and no-shows are very high in low paying part-time jobs, so you need a very large pool of workers to fill the voids.

Much demand varies substantially by the hour, day, week, time of month, time of year etc, so part-timers, temps and on-call workers fill the voids.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic


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Posted by jlhug 10 (My Page) on
Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 14:56

I suspect there will be more part time positions due to employers trying to get out of paying the penalties under Obamacare.

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Exactly.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 15:23

So why has Walmart consistently done this even before the feared ACA was even a household word? We have been supplementing them for years.

Next...


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

You are correct Ohiomom. I think there will be even more businesses heading the same direction. Just one of the unforeseen results of ACA. I'm sure we will see more.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Then let's go with HG's idea. Higher contributions by the employer for part-time employees to offset what they are trying to avoid.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 15:56

Very few jobs are left that even offer benefits let alone "employer healthcare", so it will be a pi$$ in the bucket.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

But how to get that ball rolling, esh?

How many people are willing to write their representative outlining (and demanding) that idea?

How do you get a politician to listen?

This one is not cynicism, just an honest question looking for honest answers and evaluations. I've gotten active a couple of times in writing or speaking to representatives here. It doesn't seem to do anything or if it does, the ball rolls so slowly.

Does anyone have any better ideas on how to get politicians moving or even listening?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 16:07

I don't know about Canada, but here businesses write the legislation in DC so there is a snowball's chance in hell that will happen. Business has one goal, profit and shareholders, workers be damned!

The truth is that few jobs offer any type of benefit package ie: healthcare/pension unless they are union and we know that unions are on the chopping block.

Now you have to understand that I am speaking from the shallow end of the pool, not the place that has golden parachutes :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Very few jobs are left that even offer benefits let alone "employer healthcare", so it will be a pi$$ in the bucket.

It doesn't necessarily need to be attached to something like healthcare. Like I said, I don't know as much about payroll for USians, but a "Part Time Employee" premium on every hour worked by part time employees (as defined by the above parameters) is possible. Those funds can offset common subsidies used by low income employees (like Walmart employees) and could be administered either federally or by the state (mind blank: normally I would say "provincially" but "stately" isn't right.) Is welfare/food stamps/ hosing subsidy usually administered by the state or federally? That would determine who should collect the funds.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by sweeby Gulf Coast TX (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 16:21

Sounds like a great idea HG --


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

One danger I can see in there being a penalty against part-time workers is that some people choose to work part time on purpose. I am considered part time at 35 hours a week. I cannot work a 40 hour week right now due to family issues. There are others who cannot work a full 40 hour week due to health issues. I would much rather see legislation granting benefits to the part-time employees instead of a premium paid on pay-roll. I would love to see things like mandatory paid sick leave for part time employees, health-care, etc. At the company I work for, I do indeed qualify for health care as I work more than 30 hours but I secure my insurance through my husband's employer but I know that many, many others are not so lucky.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Good point tish, and one that may have to be addressed in a similar way to the full time student. Employees on disability or temporary leave/reduced hours might also get an exeption.

In the end, there will probably be someone fall through the cracks. But it's better than the alternative... an entire company's workforce on part time hours.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

The inability, or unwillingness to work full time, overtime, nights, weekends, holidays, second/third shifts, on call, out-of-town, on-the-road etc is why many part-timers don't get ahead.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

On a positive note, substantially fewer workers are needed in many industries due to advances in productivity, automation, outsourcing, offshoring, plus low/stagnant/declining demand, so having higher numbers of part-timers is effectively a form of job/hours sharing/redistribution.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Stop and think a momment please. Businesses, first and foremost, are there to make a PROFIT for their owners and stockholders.

If we insist that they do things that we want, as good and as wonderful as they may be, the profits will be less.

At some point, the profit will become too low to go to the trouble of staying in business.

Is that what we want?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

There's the rub.

The idea is, as workers, you submit to any and all demands the employer places on you, including slave wages, part time, erratic work, no benefits, no holidays, no private life, or we will take our company and move it to China.

So what is worse...being the property of your employer who may or may not give you any working hours that week (depending on his mood) or having no work at all?

Either way, you go without housing and food.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"With economic growth declining or stagnant for quarter after quarter, many companies feel it is too risky to take on people full time."

That line, right there, is false. We all know exactly why the majority of companies don't want to take on full time, 40 hr a week employees.

"When will America once again be the land of opportunity?"

Guess.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Regarding the land of opportunity statement, like Obama stated recently -

"It doesn't matter if you are black or white, young or old, rich or poor. You can make it in America, if you're willing to try."


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Posted by markjames (My Page) on
Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 19:14

Regarding the land of opportunity statement, like Obama stated recently -

"It doesn't matter if you are black or white, young or old, rich or poor. You can make it in America, if you're willing to try."

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Funny, when I have said EXACTLY THE SAME THING, I was called a selfish, unreasonable elitist with no compassion.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 19:29

Obama also puts a lot of emphasis on "education" to enable our young people to compete in a global economy, not settling for low wage, dead end job. I think this is the best "investment" (education) we can make for the future of our country.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by sweeby Gulf Coast TX (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 20:00

"At some point, the profit will become too low to go to the trouble of staying in business. "

I don't buy that. It's the same as the argument from people who say taxing the rich at higher rates will incent them to make less money. That's not a big problem here... (Or anywhere that I can think of.)

We all need a source of income. So unless we inherit, we have the choice of working for someone else, working for ourselves, or relying on handouts. Those handouts aren't appealing, so like almost every other USian, I'd rather work for a living -- even is it's a slightly less lucrative living than it might otherwise be.

Businesses that rely on labor hire only as much labor as they need. They don't hire 'extra' just because it's cheap. Sure, there's a bit of flux, but if you need a certain number of man-hours to run a business, that's what you need. If it costs you more, it costs you more, and you need to either raise prices or make less profit. Businesses and consumers find the balance point - that's capitalism, right?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Has anyone looked at the other side of the coin? I saw a woman being interviewed who owned two Papa Johns Pizza franchises. She said she still sells her 10 dollar pizza's because she can't go up on the price because then people won't buy her pizza's. Because of the rise in cost of her supplies and added fuel costs, her profit margin has gone from 10% to 3%. She said she has no choice but to lay off workers to keep the number of employees under 50. If she was forced to pay the 2,000.00 per employee for Obamacare, she might as well shut her doors and lay off everyone. She feels as if she has been placed between a rock and a hard place. She can't expand, she can't raise her prices, and she is left with no other choices.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Obviously then there is too much pizza. Refer to your Free Market handbook. She closes her joints, less pizza in that burg (doll), price goes up, somebody opens new pizza shop using sauce made in mexico.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"She said she still sells her 10 dollar pizza's because she can't go up on the price because then people won't buy her pizza's"

Maybe that is because Papa John's pizza is flavorless, and people started buying a tasty, local pizza. Ahhh, free enterprise is painful.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Agnes, there is that side to businesses need to make a profit but there is another element to the equation that is consumers. How many consumers would be willing to pay a little more so that those involved in the business can make a living as well?

With the Papa John's scenario, if somebody really preferred that type of pizza, if the price went up to $10.50, are they really going to stop purchasing it?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

50 employees at a pizza joint?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

You're going to see this get worse, too, when the health care mandate takes effect. It won't be a matter of being cheap for alot of companies, either. It'll be a matter of survival.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

OK, here's something to think about.

How is it that businesses manage to survive... even grow and profit... in countries like Canada, Australia, the UK etc who all have universal healthcare and payroll and business taxes to support it?

How could the US be so entirely different that the economy, the free market, huge corporations right down to small businesses would fold up if they had to implement things like full time hours, healthcare, mandatory paid vacation, mandatory paid stat holidays, mandatory paid sick days...

How come we survive and you guys can't?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 21:04

Papa John Schnatter is no fan of Obamacare. The CEO of Papa Johns International has occasionally railed against the reform for months. Leading up to the election, he was a Mitt Romney supporter and fundraiser. Now that the election is over, hes doubling down on his claim that the health care reform will force his company to increase pizza prices by 10-14 cents a pie. He estimates that Obamacare will end up costing his company $5-8 million annually.

His remarks have sparked anger on the internet, one thread on social news site Reddit, titled "There are plenty of places to get cheap s***** pizza in the world- Anyone else on reddit ready to boycott Papa Johns?" has captured more than 21,000 up-votes and 4,500 comments. A host of Facebook groups with the same idea have cropped up in the past 48 hours.

Meanwhile, shares in Papa Johns International have been tumbling since last Thursday, falling from $51.70 at market close Wednesday to $49.22 on Monday, a 4.2% drop.

(snip)

Last year, Papa Johns International captured $1.218 billion in revenue. Total operating expenses were $1.131 billion. So if Schnatters math is accurate (Obamacare will cost his company $5-8 million more annually), then new regulation translates into a .4% to .7% (yes, fractions of a percent) expense increase. Its difficult to set that ratio against the proposed pie increase, given size and topping differentials, but many of their large specialty pizzas run for $16. Remarkably, a 10-14 cent increase on a $16 pizza falls in a comparable range: .6% to.9%. But the cost transference becomes less equitable if youre looking at medium pizzas, which run closer to $12, meaning a .8% to 1.15% price increase.

For the sake of argument, lets say that Papa Johns sells exactly half medium/half large specialty pizzas. Averaging the ranges for both sizes, then averaging that product yields a .86% price increase well outside the range of what Schnatter says Obamacare will cost him.

So how much would prices go up, under these 50/50 conditions, if they were to fairly reflect the increased cost of doing business onset by Obamacare? Roughly 3.4 to 4.6 cents a pie.

Here is a link that might be useful: Forbes


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

How come we survive and you guys can't?

I would imagine that part of it might be with beni's like that, no one needs the unions. That said, though, I know that small outfits like my own most likely won't survive, unless I drastically raise my rates. Of course, everyone else will have to as well, so I might be okay. But you can see what that'll do for inflation.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 21:16

A little more info on "Papa Johnny's woes"

"Papa John" Schnatter is experiencing a major public relations backlash this week after announcing that he will be forced to raise the price of pizza by 14 cents because President Obama was re-elected. Shnatter believes ObamaCare will cost his franchise owners an extra $8 million per year. Regardless of your political views, if theres one thing you do not mess with in America, its the price of our fast food. Furthermore, even if Papa John was so worried about ObamaCare hurting his business, he never needed to make such a big public stink. Today hundreds of websites and thousands of people across the nation are calling for a Papa Johns boycott which, if successful, will only hurt hard working employees in the long run. I want to be clear that I absolutely admire John Schnatters success, especially his $600 million net worth. Not trying to take political sides with this article, I just dont think anyone would have noticed the 14 cent price increase, so he should have kept quiet and continued making cheesy pizza and super cheesy commercials.

Papa John Schnatters House:

When Papa John Schnatter hosted a fundraiser for Mitt Romney earlier this year, the Republican candidate began his remarks by saying: "Who wouldve imagined pizza could build this? This is really something. Dont you love this country? What a home this is, what grounds these are, the pool, the golf course. This is a real tribute to America, to entrepreneurship." If your house impresses Mitt Romney, the ultimate one percenter, you know it must be pretty awesome. To start, John Schnatters 40,000 square foot castle is located in a wealthy country club suburb of Louisville, Kentucky. The property is spread out over a 16 acre estate and as Romney mentioned, features several swimming pools, a private lake and a golf course. The guest house alone is 6000 square feet and is valued at over $7 million according to Zillow.com! Another interesting feature is the 22 car multi-level underground garage which has its very own "valet office", car wash and a gigantic motorized turn table-driveway to help park stretch limousines.

Here is a link that might be useful: source of course


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  • Posted by sweeby Gulf Coast TX (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 21:44

So Bill - How much have your health care costs been increasing over the past 15 years? Because they've been going way up for the rest of us. That's *without* Obamacare.

Yeah, there will be an uptick for a few years as people start getting the healthcare they've been putting off. (I know I will.) But in the long run, a system where everyone has health coverage will help with costs.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Papa John's has to raise the cost by less than 10-14 cents a pizza and he thinks that is too much? Ridiculous.

It is my favorite chain (over Domino's and Pizza Hut) but we were talking the other night that we won't be buying from him again if he can't do right by his employees by giving them healthcare.

We'll go the extra distance and buy from a smaller place further down the road now.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Sweeby, there was a time when ethics, honesty, and fair play were all a part of the game... they meant something... but in too many cases, those days are over. Maybe I'm a cynic, but I see so much greed in this country today, the cup of avarice runneth over.

There was a time when a man, or woman, was paid a fair wage for an honest day's labor... and rewarded for hard work and helping the company earn profits through benefits like group insurance, profit sharing, and other bonuses.

Now, you can hardly find a decent paying job that will give you more than 38 hours per week, which allows the company to avoid giving any benefits. Or schedules are so screwy with those part time hours, people can't manage to find a second or third job that lines up.

Decent day care costs almost as much as a week's paycheck in many cases, so it's not worth exerting the effort to pay someone else to watch your kids, when you could be watching them and teaching them and raising them. It's a wasted effort in a lot of cases... as both my daughter and daughter-in-law found out.

The world of business has changed so much... more people used to have integrity, ethics... they were honest and forthright... they looked you in the eye when they spoke to you, and they meant what they said. If a promise was made, it was kept. People took pride in their work, and company owners valued good reputations, along with good employees.

That's not the world of business today. Capitalism only works decently if ethics and honesty are part of the deal... and they aren't, to a great extent.

Too many people are morally bankrupt. Some have accepted that it's perfectly okay to make fortunes by taking advantage of people, or by gaming the systems, being dishonest. And once wealthy, they can then afford to influence legislation in their favor.

And consumers... too many are apathetic and accepting of poor quality goods at high cost... many that are no longer made with pride or attention to quality, and many that the companies won't even guarantee. Too many people accept that dishonesty and a lack of integrity are just part of today's general character. Getting ripped off is nothing new, and in too many cases, nothing to complain about.

"Oh, well... that's just how it is these days." And that's okay?

And those of us without college degrees stacked to the ceiling are supposed to shut up and accept that all of this is just life today, and live off the dregs and crumbs offered as employment by today's greedy corporations, industries, and other forms of work/income?

And people wonder why crime rates are high, why people snap and go ballistic with whatever weapon is at their disposal, or just say screw it and game the system, living off welfare for as long as they can... kind of like the big boys of commerce do.

I dunno... so many of our systems are broken... and deregulating them isn't the answer. A nation needs revenue... and lowering taxes isn't the answer. So many people are in need... health care only one of those many needs... privatizing everything is definitely not the answer.

Bring back the basics... like ethics, integrity, honesty, quality, pride, value, and those kinds of things... and I think some of our issues might just fix themselves through better people.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

You know, I'm hearing all this about Papa John, and yet a huge medical company with Democrat ties, is doing something similar, but I don't hear much about them. Why is that?

Here is a link that might be useful: Stryker Corp


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Mon, Nov 12, 12 at 22:46

Put it out there like the above about "the pizza guy" and I will agree with you too Bill, I was only responding to the above posts about not being able to raise the price of some cheap a$$ franchise pizza and laying off employees that MrsK posted ... Lots of local REAL small businesses that I can support with my money, and I do. Could not find current figures, but I found one site that showed that only 2% of small businesses even have over 50 employees, but the info was several years old.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Bill, I think the reason there is more information at Papa John's is because he himself made it an issue when he vocally supported Romney. He put himself under the looking glass.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Exactly right, tish.

We are not pizza lovers but when we do, we make our own. So much better tasting than the cardboard packed in cardboard - to us anyway.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

A lot more than Stryker bill. It's due to the medical device tax included in Obamacare.

Here is a link that might be useful: list of a few


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Does anyone have any better ideas on how to get politicians moving or even listening?

Yes! Be a corporate power; a lobbyist, or a big union.

Done!


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

The pizza business and restaurant business in general has always been a brutal cut-throat business in many regions as they're over-saturated with restaurants, many of which have poor quality, or my biggest pet peeve "inconsistent quality".

Many have price wars until the weaker players are eliminated, then ramp up their prices until more competitors enter the market. Rinse/Repeat.

It's often the privately owned restaurants with higher quality products and services that go out of business as they can't price match the high volume franchises.

During bad economies such as this, we sell a lot of frozen pizzas which hurts their business as well.

You can tell business is very bad at some restaurants as they now deliver, or they've expanded their delivery range substantially.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

One of the medical device manufacturers on that list - Covidien is planning massive layoffs/closures in Upstate New York.

They're moving production to Mexico and South America.

What's happening is many regions are losing high quality jobs, but replacement jobs (if any) are lower quality jobs.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

So, if Papa would have endorsed Obama, he could offer the same benefits and be swarmed by customers?

Hmmmmmmm.

You know, I'm hearing all this about Papa John, and yet a huge medical company with Democrat ties, is doing something similar, but I don't hear much about them. Why is that?

Three guesses !


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"ObamaCare will accelerate this trend starting in 2014, as the costs of insuring full-time workers will get so high that firms will have incentives to limit their weeks to 29 hours or fewer.

In order to discourage companies from having a workforce of part time workers (usually in order to avoid paying benefots or full time wage rates), would it be feasible to have a higher rate of employer-paid payroll taxes for part-time employees?

.....


Maybe even have special exemptions so you don't catch small businesses or student employers in a trap, say businesses with less than 2 employees and full time students are not subject to the higher rates.

That's just one example, but I think it would be workable.

.....

HG, good idea. Employers need some incentives to create more full time jobs.

....

I suspect there will be more part time positions due to employers trying to get out of paying the penalties under Obamacare.

....

Business has one goal, profit and shareholders, workers be damned!

....

I would love to see things like mandatory paid sick leave for part time employees, health-care, etc.

....

Good point tish, and one that may have to be addressed in a similar way to the full time student. Employees on disability or temporary leave/reduced hours might also get an exeption.

...

Stop and think a momment please. Businesses, first and foremost, are there to make a PROFIT for their owners and stockholders.
If we insist that they do things that we want, as good and as wonderful as they may be, the profits will be less.

At some point, the profit will become too low to go to the trouble of staying in business.

Is that what we want?

....

There's the rub.

....

She said she has no choice but to lay off workers to keep the number of employees under 50. If she was forced to pay the 2,000.00 per employee for Obamacare, she might as well shut her doors and lay off everyone. She feels as if she has been placed between a rock and a hard place. She can't expand, she can't raise her prices, and she is left with no other choices.

....

You're going to see this get worse, too, when the health care mandate takes effect. It won't be a matter of being cheap for alot of companies, either. It'll be a matter of survival.

....

But you can see what that'll do for inflation.

....

Does anyone have any better ideas on how to get politicians moving or even listening?

....


They're moving production to Mexico and South America."

And the beat goes on......

Sometimes I wonder if it wouldn't just be better to keep government out of business.

You "fix" one problem and, in the process, "create" about 50 more problems. The end result will be that NOTHING gets done. A big MESS!!!!!

Socialist Paradise.

Hay


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Everybody is worried about the CEO of Papa Johns. I'm not.

The part-time people working for Papa Johns don't have insurance now - unless they buy it themselves on the individual market - which I doubt they can afford at near minimum wage.

Now, they will be able to buy it via the exchanges at the same group rate of corporate-sponsored health insurance, subsidized by the gvt/surcharge on Papa Johns who refuses to offer it.

So we have one disgruntled CEO and 30,000 people now with health insurance.

I'd sure like knowing that the guy delivering my pizza doesn't have some communicable disease, TB, the flu, or what not.

And I'd bet that some competing pizza chain will be more than happy to charge 11 cents a pizza extra and cover all their employees. Starbucks manages to do so.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

You know, I'm hearing all this about Papa John, and yet a huge medical company with Democrat ties, is doing something similar, but I don't hear much about them. Why is that?

Hmmm, I can only comment on what I know about. Put the information out there .... Details?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

What's the solution many offer for problems created by regulations, taxes and mandates? - More regulations, taxes and mandates...

Speaking of food delivery workers, only several years ago most of our food delivery people were 20-somethings. Now we have quite a few 30/40/50 somethings delivering pizzas.

Just recently one of our former drywall subs delivered Chinese food to our business and one of our roofing subs workers delivered grinders to our sister's home.

More and more males are taking more and more service industry jobs typically filled by females as well.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 10:56

More and more midlife/senior people (male and female) are taking jobs that were typically held by teens.

Congrats to your relative MarkJames for taking you up on your offer, kudos to her (and you).


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"What's the solution many offer for problems created by regulations, taxes and mandates? - More regulations, taxes and mandates..."

Yes, indeed.

And in the end, it all grinds to a big halt. We lose all our freedom and nothing gets done.

Hay


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

What's the solution many offer for problems created by regulations, taxes and mandates? - More regulations, taxes and mandates...

No, but I refuse to get rid of the ones that protect people and the environment.

We need to worker smarter not just throw just out in the name of "too much"! Of course businesses want to get rid of regulations that are "bothersome" for them. But that doesn't mean we should.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Regulation is a good thing for many large, well established businesses as it limits competition.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

More and more midlife/senior people (male and female) are taking jobs that were typically held by teens.

The other day I was at a Walmart SuperCenter watching an old guy with a really bad limp pushing a massive train of grocery carts with one of those motorized grocery cart pushers.

The store has employed substantially more older cashiers and stock people in the last few years as well.

Walmart jobs are becoming the new good job for many unskilled, low skilled and older workers.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Congrats to your relative MarkJames for taking you up on your offer, kudos to her (and you).

Thanks.

One more has completed her CNA training and is currently in orientation training. She's supposed to start working soon.

Neither has ever had a full-time job, benefits nor made more than $10 per hour, so they're quite happy.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 12:22

Healthcare is a good field to go into ... now "gently" push them towards becoming RNs :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

In Ohio.

MAUMEE -- Dana Holding Corp. says $24 million in costs due to "Obamacare" over the next six years will lead to layoffs.

The Maumee-based global auto parts manufacturer has warned employees of the repercussions of new laws and regulations associated with the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. Along with falling commercial vehicle demand and increased health care expenses, Dana CEO Roger Wood cites economic uncertainty as factors threatening their business.

In a memo to employees, Wood said "Obamacare" will create health care costs "that our customers are not willing to cover, mandating that we reduce our overhead expenses to cover them." The company says while layoffs may be on the way, they will also looks to other cost-saving measures before cutting workers.

According to the Washington Times, the company has already laid off several white collar staffers, and insiders point to more to come. Dana's current global workforce stands at over 25,000 employees.

Now, some will chastise the CEO and the board of directors, but if the company can't pass the expenses then the ONLY choice is to reduce them, or die.

If WalMart is paying attention, there's people looking for work in Maumee, OH.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 12:45

"Ceo and Board of Directors" ... I imagine they will not be laid off and/or consider a pay cut anymore than the critters in Washington would with their living wages, free healthcare, pensions and their own form of "golden parachutes" by moving into, or rather back into, the private (wallstreet) industry.

Don't want to cut into those profits and/or ask them to pay more taxes as citizens of this country.

They are the creators....


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

When one of our friends and competitors raised their prices of annual heating service by $20, they didn't even cover their costs of inflation, yet they lost many long term customers and new customer growth stagnated.

They eventually dropped their prices, increased markup substantially, eliminated helpers, increased speed and reduced quality to stop the bleeding.

Techs that used to take 1-1/2 hours to complete an annual service with a helper now are expected to complete the same service without a helper in 1 hour. You have to take numerous shortcuts to accomplish this on many jobs.

They're really pushing parts replacement and new installations as well - even when it's unnecessary.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Much of the blame is due to cheap consumers.

Many people demand low bid work, good enough products/services, the cheapest products/services etc.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"Much of the blame is due to cheap consumers."

I totally agree, Markjames. There are many, many people who have no other option and have to scrimp every single penny they can and still have no hope of treading water for long. But, there are many, many more people who do not place a high enough value on goods and services in our disposable society to be pay the true costs of goods. Too many moan about jobs being shipped overseas but are not willing to pay what would equal a living wage to those involved in the process.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Tish, you are ever so right. Of course, they end up buying poor quality products that have the half life of a gnat and end up spending more to replace the shoddy items.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"Much of the blame is due to cheap consumers."

AMEN, BROTHER!

I have been saying that for years. I'm happy to see one other person realize the truth of it.

Furniture companies import most of their products to satisfy cheap consumers.

Mom,

What is your solution? Raise the price of your product only to lose the business to another supplier? What will that accomplish?

There is no solution other than being competitive. If you've ever been in business, you know that! Answer this: Would you buy Thomas' English Muffins at Marc's for $.99 or $2.19 at GE?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

PROFIT; There's Gross Profit and Net Profit. You must make enough Gross Profit to pay salaries and pay all the other bills. You WILL eventually go out of business if you don't. well,you will unless the Government comes along and bails you out.

NET profit is what is left over after paying the bills, etc.. That's where the decisions of the owners comes in. If NET isn't big enough for the owners, they will find something better to invest their money in. Sorry about that, but that's how it works. Sometimes the Profit is just on paper according to how they keep the books.

BUT...If enough money fails to come in to pay all the bills and the employees, the benefits, time worked, and other goodies to the employees will be cut. It's just a matter of time until it happens.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

And all these people around here who pretend to favor the middle class worker faint when handed a proposal to pay a professional painter rate of $35.40 per hour in order to care for his family and remain profitable.

Big talkers, cheap spenders.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 13:49

Well lets see one of my daughters is a chocolatier and she recently raised the price of her product and can hardly keep up with orders ... she is considering a brick and mortar business in the near future. I make artisan cheese for a small family owned business, we sell to upscale restaurants, we can hardly keep up with the orders despite raising our prices recently.

So there are people who will buy "quality" over "quantity".

But then you have to remember I am part of the "left wing crazies" that believe in supporting small/local businesses/farms.

:)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 13:53

Oh and btw I don't buy english muffins ... I bake them :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Tish, you are ever so right. Of course, they end up buying poor quality products that have the half life of a gnat and end up spending more to replace the shoddy items.

Many of our customers that claim they can't afford our rates for annual service, preventive maintenance, repairs, service contracts etc end up destroying their furnaces, boiler, water heaters, fuel lines/tanks and sometimes their homes, plus they put their lives in danger.

Many of these customers have over 100K of vehicles and toys sitting on their property and/or spend thousands per year in cigarettes, beer, scratch-offs etc.

Everyone has their priorities...


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Cheap consumers? Try BROKE consumers!


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

If you can afford cigarettes ($8 plus per pack), beer, scratch-offs, take out, delivery, digital cable, broadband etc you're not broke - not even close.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I bake them :)

:0) :0)

When unable to find the proper thermocouple for a -- let's be charitable and call it 'vintage' -- stove, English muffins were something that I could make from scratch without using the oven.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Yes Jodi, many consumers are broke. My family is certainly among them so instead of paying some high price for labor on cars, DH did learn how to change his brakes this year, spark plugs, etc. When we get our tax refund he will also learn how to replace the shocks.

But, I still think too many consumers are cheap. We are used to goods produced with cheap labor and many of us are happy to accept cheap, poorly made goods to give us the impression that we have it all. Many who were disgusted about pink slime would be appalled to pay a higher place for 100% beef. Many consumers would also be loathe to see a price go up even if means their fellow man can get sick leave, or health insurance or a little more money to buy groceries for their family with. Too many goods are marketed with style defining their price but not longevity. How many times do you see a pair of jeans for $60-80 and think, why do I want to spend that on thin material that is going to give way while digging in the garden? It is a viscious cycle that feeds itself.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Mom, you and Nancy are the few who have nothing else to do but bake muffins. Cutesy answer, but your real answer is you'd buy the cheaper ones.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 16:36

Nancy actually I bake mostly foccacia these days, and no Brush you are totally wrong, I actually do "bake muffins" and from scratch LOL Mark is right about "priorities". I choose to eat locally grown/raised foods that cost a little more, and I buy my clothes at the thrift stores. You will not find "chinese" second hands cause they never make it further then the dump.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

but your real answer is you'd buy the cheaper ones

Not true -- I'd buy them locally from a baker, not a grocery store, if I were still eating white breads. Lately I've been making corn bread from corn meal ground for polenta.

Like OH, I re-purpose others' cast offs - for me, my home, and my garden. Some of my best finds for the garden have come from local alleys.

Sort of takes the wind out of your sails when your moralizing falls short of the mark, eh brush?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 19:28

"The idea is, as workers, you submit to any and all demands the employer places on you"

This story may not belong on this thread, or maybe it does, but this is a case where "employer demands" cost a man his life. And for what ... stuff !! It makes me so angry I want to scream!!

Someone should have to answer for this, but I doubt that will be the case.

Here is a link that might be useful: source of course


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

That is a terrible and tragic story, om.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Polenta, blech! ;)
I once had a salad which had polenta crutons in it. You can have my share of polenta! I have yet to try a polenta that I find tasty - blech, polenta! ;P

Brush, many many women and men, despite the full time jobs they have, plus sometimes a part timer, plus kids, plus shopping, plus day to day family and home upkeep and meal prep - are doing their own needed repairs, painting their own houses, baking their own bread etc. in order to make the ends meet with the few dollars they have.
I was kind of friendly with a woman who had nine kids. Her family ate a lot of bread because it was a cheap way to fill up. She used to make two loaves of bread every single solitary day. She was the one who showed me how to make pizza from scratch because that was the only way they ever had it. She never bought marinara in a jar, not ever - she made her own- which is incredibly easy and so much more delicious to do, but like everything else, it takes a bit of time and time is more valuable to many working families than is gold.

Don't even tell me about painting a house, I painted the outside of our home all by myself a few years ago when DH was out of town, never again by myself, EVER, but I'm not the only woman who has done so.
When I was working, my DH and I painted the inside of our homes dozens and dozens of times over the years as we relocated. And we never had fast food, ever. We had food that was sold in fast food joints but they were "slow" foods because I made them, even though I worked full time and kept up a house and shopped and cooked full meals and drove for sports etc.
I guess you could say I was a full time mother and housekeeper........only add to that a driver and chef and short order cook and personal shopper and oh - also had another job that paid actual salary and a few benefits and a retirement fund, this job took up another 9 plus hours plus transportation time, five days a week, to help pay the bills and education. The other job took another 9 hours and the pay was satisfaction that being a wife, mother homemaker brings to many women who enjoy it, as did I.
However, being a wife and homemaker pays no actual salary to pay for the cost of living a life, and most people in this country require that salary in order to pay their basic bills of living.
Many people do much more for themselves that you seem to realize. Some, because they would rather the job be done the way they want it done, others because looming future college funds for the kiddies require that they do it themselves.
Or, for that matter, the looming rent check if they are forced to live their lives from paycheck to paycheck. For some, the only way to build their savings is to do most of what needs doing all by themselves. For a great many, the only way to survive is by doing a great deal of doing is by learning how to do it themselves.

It would not surprise me a bit if I were to find that a great many women in here - and men too, do their own baking either out of preference or necessity - or because they needed to for so many years that buying processed garbage in a heat sealed bag would now never occur to them, who would want to feed that to their families?

Although it is true that the price of meat that wasn't pink slimed ended up costing more which tore up many familie's budgets, the biggest problem I had with pink slime is that I was never told that it was in the meat I was paying for. They made me PAY to eat pink slime and didn't even disclose that pink slime was part of what i was buying.
I had huge objections to the very idea. So did a lot of other customers in this country.
Costco sells great chicken which is organic and no nothings added, same thing with their hamburger. No pink slime to be found. They proudly advertised that as the story was breaking - also added that they had NEVER been willing to sell pink slimed meat to their customer base - they won me over as a customer. It does cost more, we make up for it by reducing our comsumption and eating more vegetables, which is healthier anyway.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

And what gives you the idea that I buy all those things, markjames? An overall view of your collective postings has given me some distinct impressions... and I'm not sure you'd find them all that flattering, no offense intended. I think it's just a particular mindset I can't help but notice.

I don't buy lottery tickets... I never bet unless it's a sure thing.

I no longer waste money on tobacco items... I've all but quit smoking, and that final day is fast approaching. I made up my mind, and I did it.

I don't drink... so I don't buy alcoholic beverages.

I don't order food out or eat any type of fast foods... they make physically sick. We prepare frugal meals at home using natural foods chosen for pricing and nutritional value.

And... I don't pay for cable or internet; it's part of the job package we took as caretakers of an estate.

Unfortunately, the majority of our income is lost to medical expenses, due to circumstances beyond our control. As you must recall... because I've only mentioned most of it a few hundred times... auto accident, injuries, Lupus, industrial accident, house fire, and a long list of very bad luck.

Now, if we have issues such as these, and have been forced into frugality because of circumstances beyond our control, what makes you think there aren't a lot of other people living under similar circumstances? Odds are pretty good that there are too many people not that different from us.

Your posts seem to indicate you hang out with a crowd not of your liking... so you've boxed everyone into the very same stereotypes and categories you happen to see. Those are not the only categories that exist.

Let's look at the facts for a moment... wages have stagnated while the cost of living continues to rise. Do the math.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"I've all but quit smoking, and that final day is fast approaching. I made up my mind, and I did it."

^5's


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

^5's both hands! :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

And what gives you the idea that I buy all those things, markjames?

I have no idea what you buy. My comment wasn't about you, but about many consumers that claim to be broke, yet spend thousands annually on non necessities.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Tue, Nov 13, 12 at 21:08

Jodik I don't know why you feel the need to defend yourself on a forum with, for the most part, perfect strangers. I spent a good portion of my life trying to "please" others and one day I decided that the hell with them I like who I am and owe no one any apologies for that. I cannot think of a single human being on this earth that can stand in judgement of me.

Now to the wicked tobacco, I have gone off and on with cigarettes for years ... long period of not smoking and slipping back into the habit. So congratulations on making the effort and I hope you succeed.

Mylab I happen to like cooking, but I LOVE to bake and my late husband and now my son look forward to my creations.

I did learn, reluctantly, how to change the oil in my truck ... I have to admit I do not enjoy that at all. I have painted apartments over the years, laid tile (not to the degree that Bill does), fixed simple plumbing problems, will not touch electricity.

I am a Jill of all Trades and mistress of none... :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"I buy my clothes at the thrift stores. You will not find "chinese" second hands cause they never make it further then the dump."

I buy practically all my clothes from thrift shops--and many say "made in China: on the tag. I figure it's okay to buy them since I'm not the original buyer ;). It's amazing how many designer clothes are made in China, Indonesia, Thailand, Viet Nam, Belarus, India, and the list goes on and on. I even found 2 pieces made in Canada. Fortunately, we have quality stuff. Some thrift shops I've visited in the big city are horrible, and I would worry about bringing bedbugs home. So we're lucky that way.

We hire contractors for jobs like house staining, and interior room painting. Some work is barter: service for service.

We raise all our own vegetables and some fruits, such as apples, raspberries, blackberries.

All that gardening takes time, though. I must say that I've had to drag my tiny butt away from the 'puter since I found HT. So much for seed trading, my old GW pastime, LOL.

Jodi, good luck with the smoking-- you were on the same page last winter when I first started participating on HT; I know firsthand how difficult it is.

When I separate from local government service, I will definitely be working at least one part-time job.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

will not touch electricity.

I've done simple repairs... very slowly and very carefully with the main breaker on "off".

Ugh for changing the oil, and congratulations to you for doing it.

mylab, I'm not a polenta fan either. I did like when I had it in Italy at a friend's house -- pureed. And a cousin did prepare a wonderful dish of fresh porcini mushrooms over polenta. Since I don't have a cook to make the polenta and then puree it as my friend does, I've never prepared it. Since I don't have access to fresh porcini - yum! - as my cousin does, polenta goes strictly into corn bread.

I lie - there is a wonderful receipe - farinata is what my cousin called it - which is basically a vegetable soup to which polenta is added after the ingredients are almost cooked, and stirred to cook and thicken. Again, a little too time consuming and I only prepared it twice, but it was good. Nutrienti!

Nothing is as awful as gravy!!


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Bill, I think the reason there is more information at Papa John's is because he himself made it an issue when he vocally supported Romney. He put himself under the looking glass.

So why isn't it an issue when Stryker publically supports Obama? Sorry, Tish-- it doesn't wash.

MrsKjun-- How many on that list were Democrat supporters? That's why I picked out Stryker. Everyone's pissed at Papa John because he's a republican making a statement, and here's this democrat making the very same statement, and yet no one raises an eyebrow.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

My guess would be that because most of us are familiar with Papa John's just because there are commercials, etc. Even though I have never eaten there, I know what Papa John's makes, it is relatable. I have a vague notion of Stryker just because I do medical transcription but it is not really on my radar. In the end, no matter who does it, it is concerning.

On the polenta note, I adore it, especially at this time of year cooked in the crockpot, with some pumpkin, cream, and parmesan and some fried sage leaves on top, what a wonderful dinner when coming in from the cold....


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Point taken.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

But Bill, perhaps it is Stryker that we should be more concerned about. Not because of which side of the campaign it supported but because any jobs it cuts will be harder to replace. If pizza jobs are eliminated, the workers who filled them will have an easier time finding something else they can do.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Papa John's may have to pay $250 Million spam fine.
Some nations believe in paying minimum living wages the there is the US with years of "Oh you can't raise the minimum wage it would be bad for BUSINESS. These businesses left profitable or not as more profit is always better.
Lifetime employment for a corporation is gone the way of the DODO.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Sometime look into what companies like Stryker make and what they sell their stuff for, and realize the profit margins these companies are making.

here's a quote from an article about their tax on medical equipment:

Unlike pharmas, which won a seat at the table with substantial concessions, device makers didn't play ball with the White House and Senate Finance Committee Democrats when they were negotiating the legislation in 2009. The excise tax, which will chomp up 2.3% of their revenues (regardless, device makers note, of whether or not they make a profit) starting next year, was their punishment.

Now one of the biggest device manufacturers, Stryker Corp., has tied plans to slash 5% of its global workforce - in part by shuttering two New York plants - to the tax. Stryker said it will close its West Seneca, New York plant in September, impacting 11 employees, and its Orchard Park, New York facility in December, eliminating 96 jobs there. The firm said it would provide laid-off employees with severance packages, counseling and job placement services. Stryker acquired the plants in 2010 with its purchase of Gaymar Industries, which specialized in support surface and pressure ulcer management products as well as temperature management.

Stryker said last November that it would eliminate 5% of its global workforce as part of an effort to realize $100 million in annual productivity gains to offset the hit when the excise tax takes effect in 2013.

The company got caught giving kickbacks to doctors / hospitals who use their stuff, along with a lot of other medical supply companies, but since they cooperated with the investigation, they weren't fined.

Here's an example of what they sell, and for what price: http://www.thefind.com/furniture/browse-stryker-hospital-beds

When it comes to medical supply, what gets charged to hospitals and patients makes the rip off from pharmaceutical companies look like kindergarden.

An example from my own recent experience, renting a wound pump @$250 / day. For 6 weeks. Thats a battery powered, shoulder-held pump that cost no more than $200 to manufacture. Oh, and the bandages were proprietary, costing another fortune.

In 2011, Stryker made $1.27 billion in profit off of $7.32 billion in sales. Whats that, a 16.5% profit margin?

To sum this up, cry me a river. This is just another example of US Citizens getting ripped off blind with the 'best health care system in the world'

Here is a link that might be useful: wiki article on Stryker


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by bboy USDA 8 Sunset 5 WA (My Page) on
    Wed, Nov 14, 12 at 3:19

When my girlfriend was in the hospital this year aspirin was $10/pill. But let's keep things as they are, Obamacare will be too expensive.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I don't see brushworks "moralizing" whatsoever.

Most people today purchase their bread, as opposed to baking. If consumers can buy the same brand name muffins at one particular store cheaper, they will. If people can hire a comparable painter cheaper, most will - that's what the bid process is all about.

Artisan or organic or free range, etc products (and the notion of paying more for a premium food product) haven't been fully accepted by the masses and more than likely, never will.

I wonder if it's moreso a matter of having foodie priorities; ie; enjoying good food, than anything else?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Wed, Nov 14, 12 at 7:48

Gotta go punch the time clock :) Yes lavenderlver, for me it is my priority. I like good "locally grown" food. There is such a difference in taste then what we buy at the chain grocery stores. For most of you who are gardeners, on this I believe we can agree :)

Plus I only work part time to supplement my income and baking is something that I enjoy .... fresh from the oven bread=nirvana.

Have a great day...


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Brush, many many women and men, despite the full time jobs they have, plus sometimes a part timer, plus kids, plus shopping, plus day to day family and home upkeep and meal prep - are doing their own needed repairs, painting their own houses, baking their own bread etc. in order to make the ends meet with the few dollars they have.

True. But it's few, not many, many. :)

Nancy, you are the reason most grocery stores are empty. :)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Many of our customers pay for goods services they could make, or do themselves since they place a great deal of value on their free time.

Many are also willing to pay 2/3/4X Plus for convenience.

Shortly after the start of the monthly check and food stamp cycle many grocery stores look like ghost towns mid week, but business at convenience stores is booming.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Ohiomom, I often use myself and my family situation as an example of some of the stereotypes that exist all around us. It's the only example I have personal knowledge of, and can state with accuracy that if I have these experiences, then the law of odds says there are many other people and families that deal with similar situations and circumstances. Therefore, such stereotypes thrown out there are, many times, wrong.

I don't feel the need to defend myself to anyone. I am who I am, and there's nothing anyone can say that bothers me, on a personal level. But it's not right or fair to use such stereotypes because others are involved. Do you know what I mean? I hope so.

It's an attempt to dispel stigmas given by issuing what I know to be true and factual... a living example, if you will.

I'm not looking for pity, nor do I really care that some people disparage me, personally. That part never bothers me. The part that bothers me is that I know I'm not the only one being placed into a negatively categorized box through the statements often made here, of such typical stereotypes.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

We see less and less DIY activity in some of the industries we serve due to complexity of troubleshooting, the need for specialized tools/equipment, proprietary parts, dealer only parts, non serviceable/replaceable components etc.

These issues render many things inoperable, so it's good for business.

As far as muffins are concerned, we don't eat muffins, but if we did we'd buy them. One hour of our labor could buy a whole lot of muffins...


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

We do some home repairs, depending on what the repair is. Luckily, hubby's brother is an electrician and has his gas ticket. Electricity and gas are two things I believe SHOULD be done by a licensed and experienced tradesmen.

But as for painting, flooring, drywalling, simple plumbing... those things we handle ourselves.

If it came to something like tiling for example, we could do it ourselves if we were on a tight budget but to be honest, my work would not look nearly as beautiful as the finished product of someone like Bill. I would likely hire someone to do that kind of work.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

If consumers can buy the same brand name muffins at one particular store cheaper, they will.

Quality, taste, organic production, non-GMO foods, and local production are also reasons to choose particular produce and baked goods. I'll tell the lines of people buying at the Santa Monica, Culver City, and L.A. farmers' markets that they're not living up to the expectations of those in Ohio and Connecticut.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Get used to it.

Part time jobs.

Record food stamps, even more in the last few months.
Going on 50 million people on food stamps.

I wonder how all those people are going to pay for their health insurance premiums in a few months?

Hope and Change--gotta love it.

I can't wait to see what four more years of it will bring.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

More carping from the Right, I can promise you that.

"I told you so!"

ahhh, what feelings of smug satisfaction watching the country slide into depression.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Nothing smug, no satisfaction.

Just "I told you so."

I hope everyone made good personal decisions and is prepared for what Obama is delivering to us.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

What exactly do you think the President is delivering to the US? You say that quite often but what specifically is it he is going to do?

I suspect he will broker a Grand Bargain that will involve spending cuts and revenue increases and I also believe there will be both Immigration and Tax reform in the next four years....even with a Republican House.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I have to say that I do not see any change as far as employers sacrificing their employees. That is one phenomena that greatly precedes the current president.

David, those numbers are just incredible and while I should not be surprised, they put a lump in my throat every time I hear something like that. I would like my daughter to have an insulin pump. They are $6,000. For the life of me, I cannot imagine what is so complicated about the technology that it warrants such a price tag. Our co-pay would be $1200 but I cannot fathom having such an expensive appliance on an 11 year old.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"Gotta go punch the time clock :) Yes lavenderlver, for me it is my priority. I like good "locally grown" food. There is such a difference in taste then what we buy at the chain grocery stores. For most of you who are gardeners, on this I believe we can agree :)"

No argument from me on that. Like others here, I skimp on clothes and furniture purchases so that the family can eat quality food. Keep the Tiffany diamonds and give me a slab of artisanal cheese.

My point was that we are in the minority - the masses, for the most part, eat junk! And yes, I'm a food snob.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Wed, Nov 14, 12 at 18:44

We make artisan cheeses ... and I get "cheese perks", brought home Feta today :)

So I went into work today, and was told I do not have to work Thanksgiving day, in fact we are closing for the entire weekend. Yippee I get to spend my favorite holiday with my children. Picked up my Fall farm share today ... so guess what will be accompanying ole Tom?


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

tishtoshnm, I honestly believe that people who sell a pump for $6,000 that cost them a few hundred to make can afford a few percent in their gross revenue to help cover more people.

Who might in turn buy more pumps from them.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

"My point was that we are in the minority - the masses, for the most part, eat junk! And yes, I'm a food snob."

Using what I read here as a guide, I think that most regular HT posters seem to be in the minority when it comes to DIY and/or selective eating.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

That's great news ohiomom!

I enjoy feta in a Greek salad or thinly sliced on watermelon or in spinach pie, but it's not among my favorites. Lately, I've been on a manchego kick, great with a smidge of guava paste.

Anyway, back to part time/low wages...it seems that alot of businesses and companies are utilizing part time workers to fill a position previously held by a full timer. At least that is what my full time employment seeking children are telling me ;)


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Thu, Nov 15, 12 at 7:09

This has been going on for a long time lavenderlvr, think companies like walmart and how many of their employees (as well as themselves) have been subsidized by tax payers for years. As far as "utilizing" part time vs. full time it is about way more than obamacare, it is about the bottom line.

2 cents


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Walmart is one of few that actually has a larger than industry average of full-time workers, plus one of few with opportunities for promotion.

Much of this is because of one stop shopping. Many stores aren't large enough and don't have enough steady traffic to justify a large full-time staff.

Sales in general vary substantially depending on time of day/month/year, or demand is unexpected, hence why part-timers, temps and on-call workers are used.

At peak capacity a business many need a small army of part-timers and on-call workers for a 4 hour shift, then hours later they may only need a skeleton crew of workers.

We have the same issue with truck loaders and pickers in our warehouses. Once orders have been filled and loaded, there's really nothing for most of these workers to do that isn't done by another worker.

When our overhead and competition was lower we used to carry many of these workers, plus we used to hire full-time helpers to assist our drivers with deliveries.

Many jobs performed by 2 or 3 part time workers only several years ago are now performed by a single part-time multi-tasking worker with multiple duties.

One of our relatives - a part-timer at a grocery store monitors 2 lanes with 6 self check-out stations. This eliminated a lot of cashiers and baggers.

When she's not working register, she stocks shelves, works the service desk, collect carts, works bottle/can returns and does cleanup, cleans bathrooms etc.

The store uses engineered labor standards to monitor cashier performance, so poor performers are written up, suspended, re-trained or terminated.

Another relative has worked for a convenience store chain much of her life. When she started working, they had more than twice the workers per store than they do currently, plus most workers had limited duties.

Since they now have less than half the workers, she pretty much does it all, plus she's expected to work much faster. A peak capacity she really has to hustle, plus convenience stores are busy, busy, busy.

At peak capacity you can't even find a parking space.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

It's curious that Walmart is blamed for employing people and blamed for taxpayers having to "subsidize" people.

The fact of the matter is, Walmart workers are paid what they're worth. TO WALMART.

As long as there are people that think of that employment in terms of "we're having to make up what Walmart won't pay them" this economy will never work.

Let people earn what they're WORTH.
If they can't make enough to "make it," then they'll be FORCED to improve their skills, get promotions, or get another job.

It's that simple.

If enough people did that, then there wouldn't be enough workers and Walmart would be forced to pay higher wages.

But the government subsidizing people lets the marginal workers just "get by" and believe me there are a LOT of people that are happy living the lifestyle of just "getting by" on low wages and government welfare.

Walmart isn't the problem.

Government and lack of personal responsibility is the problem.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

We know many Walmart workers that are only willing or able to work part-time due to transportation, or child care issues.

They'll never move up until they're able to work full-time, nights, weekends, overnights or transfer to another store.

The same applies to Walmart's distribution and return center.

Many of these jobs start @ $16 plus per hour, yet many people can't or won't take them due to hours.

One of my tenant's sons (19 years old) recently started at The Distribution Center @ $17 per hour, plus shift differential. He can also make substantially more money if he exceeds engineered labor/safety standards.

All our relatives that work at Walmart currently are either working full-time, or have had more than one opportunity to apply for full time positions.

Many turn down days, hours, shifts and on-call hours/shifts.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Workers themselves are to blame for much of the worker subsidization as many are only able, or willing to work part-time.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Thanks for sharing that very interesting information! There will be a large impact to the health of the families who work with a minimum wage. Apparently, one may think working at Walmart, Target, McDonalds and so forth is easy, but it isn't as simple as one might think. A number of reduced wage health results have been found which exact a physical toll on the people in such careers. You can pay for your things while taking a sick day with an installment loan.

Here is a link that might be useful: Effects of low wages on health


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

That's an interesting perspective, cheskamint. And welcome!


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

I enjoyed reading the many interesting comments on this thread and the personal circumstances behind the views expressed. But I didn't find much that would be a solution to a growing part time employment standard. Did we even define the change to be detrimental to society?

Eliminating all part time work would not be good. It is all that some have time to do. But part time work changes the dynamics of the negotiated relationship between employer and worker in a way that favors the employer. To get hours an employee must do all that an employer asks, whether it be reasonable or not. I think a lot of low-pay part time employment is little more than economic slavery.

I have heard it said that the US has a corporate tax structure that is higher than the global average. And lowering it would lead to a better economy and less of a motive for business to move off shore. I endorse a change that would also help motivate business to keep "good" jobs here as well as shift more to full time employment.

It would work like this:
Instead of a reduction in corporate tax rates, a tax credit would be created for each employee who's work was entirely domestic where total yearly compensation was over 25,000 and less than $75,000, the tax credit being a percentage of the employee's wage as in the following table:

$25,000 to 27,500 ................1%
$27,500 to 30,000 ................2%
$30,000 to 32,500 ................3%
$32,500 to 35,000 ................4%
$35,000 to 37,500 ................5%
$37,500 to 40,000 ................6%
$40,000 to 42,500 ................7%
$42,500 to 45,000 ................8%
$45,000 to 47,500 ................9%
$47,500 to 50,000 ................10%
$50,000 to 52,500 ................10%
$52,500 to 55,000 .....;..........9%
$55,000 to 57,500 ................8%
$57,500 to 60,000 ................7%
$60,000 to 62,500 ................6%
$62,500 to 65,000 ................5%
$65,000 to 67,500 ................4%
$67,500 to 70,000 ................3%
$70,000 to 72,500 ................2%
$72,500 to 75,000 ................1%

I welcome comments and opinions on the total impact this proposal might have.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

So let's say you are a manager working for Wal-hell making 50k. Suddenly you get a tax credit of 5k, which about wipes out your tax and then some if you have a family. Problem is just as suddenly Walmart cuts your pay 6k and if you don't like it there is somebody else eager to work for less than the cost of living.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

What a mess I made of my post! The tax credit I proposed goes to the corporation not the individual. My bad.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

That makes a little more sense.


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

Another issue in low wage health effects is that low wage earners are that much more likely to not have paid sick leave. According to CNN, the Bureau of Labor Statistics estimates 41.7 million Americans, fully one-third of the workforce, doesn’t have them.

Among low wage workers, it’s estimated, according to Jezebel, up to 70 percent lacks paid sick leave from employers.

The impact, according to Time, is that a lot of people go to work sick. Almost 70 percent of workers in a PublicWelfare.org study reported going to work sick, knowingly, and one-third of respondents with influenza" kind of a big deal these days " caught it from work colleagues.

Up to 76 percent of people in trades heavily dealing with the public, like food service, retail, child care and non-nursing health care jobs, go to work sick. It’s called presenteeism, and the lost productivity due to sick workers is often found to be more costly than to just offer paid sick days.

That's common in many jobs these days due to poor job security.

Many can afford to take unpaid time off, however they can't afford to have their hours cut, nor demotions, terminations etc.

Even many with paid time off aren't taking time off due to poor job security.

Study: Americans Afraid to Take Vacation Days

The devastated economy over the last ten years accounts for this reticence to take time off, CNN reported.

Americans are afraid to take too much time off for fear of being thought of as expendable. Workers are deathly afraid of losing a job that they know will be very, very difficult--if not impossible--to replace.

Stress management trainer and coach Joe Robinson told CNN that "workers are afraid to take their vacations in the layoff era. It might mark them as less 'committed' than coworkers."

"It's called defensive overworking. They work long hours and skip vacations to insulate themselves from cutbacks," Robinson added.

Other workers are afraid that when they return from time off their workload will be doubled or tripled because companies are often operating with a reduced work force.

But job security is the biggest fear that workers have in the USA today. A survey taken in Sept. found that only one in four workers felt that their job was secure

Here is a link that might be useful: Americans Afraid to Take Vacation Days


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RE: A Part-Time, Low-Wage Epidemic

My daughter has been working part-time since she had her first child about 3 years ago, and now with the second she is deciding whether or not to take an extra 3 month leave. If she does the employer wants her to quit, to avoid being "let go", with a verbal promise that she will be re-hired in January.


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