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Such evil, blatant racism here???

Posted by sjerin 10 (My Page) on
Sat, Nov 23, 13 at 16:02

I live in the heart of Slicon Valley, a true melting pot of so many cultures. Though there is a little give and take here and there, for the most part, I'd say we all get along pretty well. Perhaps I'm naive. It is alleged that four San Jose State students mercilessly race-bullied the roommate of three of them for three months.

"The young men acknowledged during police interviews that they incessantly harassed the then-17-year-old, according to the reports. But they downplayed the incidents as mere "pranks" and "jokes," denying their actions were racist."

Who raised these boys???! I feel physically sick to read this and see the stories on tv, and am so very sad that such thoughts and actions are alive and well to this day.

Here is a link that might be useful: MLK is still crying, as are most of us


Follow-Up Postings:

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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I really don't even know how to address this... these are college aged young men. I can't even imagine what sort of persons, parents, raise their kids to think this kind of behavior is acceptable.

Those are not pranks... those are racial hate crimes.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

The victim did the right thing by reporting this behavior; good thing he didn't wait longer. Something even worse may well have happened. These sadists may have lost whatever modicum of control they had.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

All those punks should be charged with race crimes and prosecuted. But, no I'm not surprised.Ever since a black man was elected president twice, many white people have a hard time believing 3/5th of a person is leading this country.

Last night eating dinner with college friends and talking about those days, I lamented how bad I feel looking back and realizing the lone black girl in our class was in a single room while the rest of us were crammed into 2, 3, 4 person rooms. Not a word was said, because the opinion of these people who identify themselves as Conservative "Christians", this was okay because what white girl would want to have her as a roomie. .

In fact I heard one of the husband's talking about how their son's college roommate brings his BLACK friends into their dorm room!! Horrors!! This is in central PA , also know as Penntucky. All these women were schoolteachers for many decades.


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It is just so sad that such blatant hatred and racism exists...these kids weren't born that way they were taught to hate.

Heard this one on the TV today.......just so darn sad.

Here is a link that might be useful: Football season cancelled due to rascism


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Let's put this in perspective. In many inner city schools bullying of white and other ethnic kids is common and readily found reported on in past HT threads. These are Black on White, Black on Brown, Brown on White, Brown on Black, and so on. All of it bigotry, much of it racism, some of just typical of schools catering to normal and sociopathic children and teenagers. It happens in schools, in social media, and is more the sign of the times than race warfare which is what a small minority of bigots would love.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

marshall is so right. My son had a scholarship to a college that was several hours away from home. The day he was to register for classes he got there early and squared away, moved into his dorm room and put all of his belongings away. His roommate came in. A young black man of good size. He grabbed my sons things from his bunk and tossed them across the room and said, " I believe I want this bunk". My son is totally non confrontational. He packed his things in his car and drove home. Luckily, he was able to get a scholarship to a different university. He only blamed one person for what happened that day. He certainly never blamed an entire race.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

That, Marshall, as well as bullying and physical abuse which is committed by white on whites.
And, whites on white gays - according to classmates of the last GOP Presidential candidate and (finally) a recollection admitted by the conservative Presidential candidate himself who, thankfully, lost the last Presidential election.
And then proceeded to refer to the bully abuse as a "prank" - the *only* one of the group which who was involved as part of the bully pack who physically abused a fellow classmate and then characterized the offense as a mere "prank".

I think it takes a certain unsettling mindset, perhaps a mindset pathological in nature, to so target a person and then go after the target with great determination - regardless of the consequences which might have been suffered previously or likely be suffered in the future by such behavior.
I don't consider such predatory behavior to fall within the parameters of normal, healthy human behavior.

This post was edited by mylab123 on Sat, Nov 23, 13 at 17:40


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Marshallz, this is a well-known and respected college. Neither I nor my kids had any kind of experience even bordering on such disgusting behavior, in our various schools, private and public. You've got to understand how cosmopolitan SJ is, though of course many people do live in pockets, unfortunately.

Mrs, your son's roommate was a brat, but I think comparing the two behaviors is apples and oranges, by far.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

A brat? He was a bully. Apples and oranges my a$$. My son would have had a semester of misery had he stayed.


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"Mrs, your son's roommate was a brat, but I think comparing the two behaviors is apples and oranges, by far."

IMO, Mrskjun wasn't comparing the behaviours, but instead the reaction, ie; "He only blamed one person for what happened that day. He certainly never blamed an entire race."


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Nov 23, 13 at 17:48

I just read an article (will see if I can find it) of a young autistic boy being bullied by his classmates ... the odd thing is there are some in this town who are defending the bullies.

One of my daughters was the victim of a bully. As much as it broke my heart, I told her unless she stood up to this girl the abuse would continue. Bullies are cowards at heart, much like any abuser.

My child stood there with tears rolling down her face and I told her "you ball up your fist and hit her as hard as you can in the belly" and I guarantee you she will leave you alone. Bullies pick on kids that "run away and hide".

So her day came and I held her younger sister from joining in the fight (she came in the house to get me) ... baby girl took off her glasses and the "fight was on". Needless to say the bully moved on, probably to an easier target.

Y'all might not agree with my methods, but as someone who has faced a bigger stronger opponent I know that the worse thing to do is show fear and weakness.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Lily, I went to a single-sex high school with only 22 classmates. One of them would make the label “dork" look like a compliment. To this day, though not one of us ever treated her by bullying or anything like it, I always regret that we also did not embrace her at that time--we were such a tight group. . She came to the 50th reunion of our class and I am glad to say the embrace finally happened. Every time I hear about bullying, I think of how close I came to acting badly, and how glad I am that she was so generous as to not shun us.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I was bullied for a time in Jr. High into my freshman year by this big kid. I stopped him by just hitting him as hard as I could in the jaw and then in the stomach. At the point all the guys wanted to see a good fight but the bully kept moving away from me and would not stand and fight. He was a good foot taller and 50 lbs heavier. I didn't care, I hated him so much for plaguing me and shaming me (and at myself for letting him do that to me.) The manager of the community center intervened at that point and saved me from myself.

OM right about learning to stand against bullying. But when a crew of bullies goes after someone, then the larger community has an obligation to interfere and mete out punishments as warranted. Using race to determine the kind or intensity of reaction is telling society a message: bullying is acceptable except when...


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

  • Posted by ohiomom 3rdrockfromthesun (My Page) on
    Sat, Nov 23, 13 at 18:26

Marshall there is something about "mob behavior" that is difficult for me to understand ... would each of these boys on their own had treated another classmate this way, or is there something that triggers this type of behavior?


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

"Mrs, your son's roommate was a brat, but I think comparing the two behaviors is apples and oranges, by far."

You've got to be kidding! Imagine it's a black student who gets there first, gets himself settled in, and is then confronted by a white student who announces "I believe I want this bunk" while throwing his room mate's property across the room.

Would you honestly dismiss this as mere "bratty" behavior? I wouldn't. I think it's thuggish and intimidating behavior. I also think it's highly unlikely a student who has earned a scholarship would turn and walk away from it simply because his room mate is a "brat."


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Mrsk, I don't know if you will find this of interest or not, but here goes:

The boy I dated while I was a senior in high school came from a very, very poor family. His grades were such that he was awarded a full four year Pell grant which covered his tuition, books, dorm room and board at one of the universities.

He, too, arrived at the dorm room early. A white jock walked in with his jock buddies behind him, picked my boyfriend up and threw him physically on the next bed too, claiming that first bed as his own.
(What is it with male bullies and the side of the dorm room they decide is better, anyway? This is not an uncommon male freshman experience)

Then the jock opened up the foot locker which had everything my boyfriend owned to his name in it and threw it all over the room, laughing with his buddies as he did.

My boyfriend went to the dean, told him what happened. The dean replied that my boyfriend would stay in the room he had been assigned or he could leave the university.

Having no other option other than quit school and lose his grant, he was forced to remain in that room with that person and the almost daily torment.

The jock was kicked out during the second semester due to being arrested twice for having drugs on him when stopped on a DUI.

It was a bitter and hollow victory, as my boyfriend suffered through those months. However, from that point on, he had a wonderful University experience, went on to grad school graduating with top honors.
The friends he made have been life long as last I spoke with him a few years ago, when I was back in town.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

mylab, I'm sure that is an experience your boyfriend will never forget, and not in any good way. My son was lucky that he already knew he had the option of going to another university with his scholarship. He did, and he was on the Presidents list, and Who's Who in American Colleges. It's just wrong, no matter who does it. It turned out that college was a wonderful experience for my son. He even performed at the half time show for the Superbowl one year.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Bullies will always pick on the weakest members of society, those who can't or won't defend themselves against such behavior, but you're right, Ohiomom... at heart, they are cowards.

We were always taught to stand up for ourselves, and even though we should never start a fight, it was acceptable to finish one, or to step in and help someone else being bullied.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

•Posted by jodik 5 (My Page) on
Sat, Nov 23, 13 at 16:26

I really don't even know how to address this... these are college aged young men. I can't even imagine what sort of persons, parents, raise their kids to think this kind of behavior is acceptable."

Oh, now you're talking about parental responsibility.

You won't even consider parental responsiblity when it comes to gang bangers shooting babies and grandmothers on their own front porches.

Sounds like racism on your part jodi.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Unfortunately, some of these bullies have parents who are bullies themselves. If called on it, perhaps they wouldn't see their child's behavior as being aberrant in any way.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I agree that some families breed bullies and see nothing "really wrong" with such behavior. I've known families where bratty children turn into bullies at home, the parent or parents unable to change the kids' behaviors at home and, of course, are powerless to protects kids and others outside the homes. Then there are the kids who are unable to cope with family dynamics and act out in passive aggressive ways at school and other public and private venues where they learn to "get away with" bullying tactics.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I think some of your don't understand that there were three roommates plus another boy ganging up on this kid. He took it, and took it, until his parents discovered a racist graphic on his whiteboard. I believe two of the boys were moved to another dorm a bit ago, and there was no other punishment meted out until now.

Why must it always be tit-for-tat on this board from certain members? Can you not agree that this behavior, in a huge university, was abominable and was meant to humiliate? The fact that they tried to pass it off to authorities as a joke speaks volumes.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

sjerin, thanks for the link and the OP.

I might understand how the students from Clovis and Bakersfield could have those attitudes, but the student from Marin County puzzles me.

I hope these three, and others with similar inclinations at San Jose State, learn that this behaviour will not be tolerated.

What is there in human dynamics that has three young males behaving worse together than they would as individuals?



I had forgotten that Tommie Smith and John Carlos attended San Jose State.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

sjerin, I do commiserate with your son and your anger at how the university mis-handled the problem. This is not a new kind of thing in youthful antics, not some funning or rites of initiation. This seems to be case of gangsterism and should have been treated that way by authorities. These same types are likely candidates for sexual assault charges in their futures. A victim is a victim, they prey on the weak and the isolated.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

No, not my son, Marshallz, but rather a student at our very diverse university. It wasn't just bullying, but rather racial bullying that harkened back to one of America's most shameful and brutal periods, (the other being the treatment of Native Americans.) This hit me in the gut as much as the Trevon Martin case did--I cannot wrap my mind around these sick attitudes, in a large city in Northern California, in 2013.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I cannot wrap my mind around these sick attitudes, in a large city in Northern California, in 2013.

The article identified two of the bullies as from smaller towns, Clovis and Bakersfield.

I'm heartened to see the response of the students at San Jose State.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Clovis and Bakersfield contain some very mean-spirited elements with a culture inherited from the oil boom era and settlers. Lay on top of that history a wave of agricultural development drawing in migrants from south of the border. There is a running joke that having to move to Bakersfield means being punished by God or the Bureau (FBI).


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I think the mistake the kid made was taking any of the behavior perpetrated against him to begin with, and reacting with silence. He should have reported it to campus officials when it began happening.

One bully can usually be handled... but more than one is a hugely unfair advantage.

Once again, October, your post makes little sense within the context of the thread in whole... and I will not engage in your personal issues... beyond mentioning that fact.

Back to the subject at hand...

Everything begins at home, in the environment we are exposed to and the stimuli we are given from the time we are infants, and the examples we are given to follow.

There are two issues in play, here... bullying, and bigotry.

The bullying is much easier to address, I think... but the racism is something that adds a deeper, more menacing tone to the problem, and isn't something that can be so easily changed within a person, or persons as the case may be.

What's surprising is where this took place... not an area known for any kind of separation, a diverse area quite "with" the times.

I think the only way to address it is by labeling it a hate crime, and prosecuting.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

"There are two issues in play, here... bullying, and bigotry.

The bullying is much easier to address, I think... but the racism is something that adds a deeper, more menacing tone to the problem, and isn't something that can be so easily changed within a person, or persons as the case may be."

So I understand that racism is one form of bigotry, but IMO a bigot might not be a racist. Sounds like you equate the two? Just asking for clarification, for future reference when trying to understand your meaning in your posts.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Bigotry means intolerance, Elvis... a lot of people use words like bigotry, or prejudice, or intolerance when talking about racism. Discrimination or bias are other connective words often used in such conversations.

But one could certainly be bigoted or prejudiced against other things, as well.

A dictionary and thesaurus will tell you more about the usage of such words, if you're interested. .


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Of course a bigot might not be a racist, but a racist is clearly a bigot.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I used to think there was far more bigotry than racism........I'm no longer so sure.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

"'m heartened to see the response of the students at San Jose State."

That is a very good point, Nancy, and I'm glad you pointed it out.

I have a friend who grew up in Delano, north of Bakersfield, who is a staunch Republican. However, I have no doubt he is as shocked at this event as I am; yes, he's just one person.

Jodi, there is an unwritten student law at universities that you don't tattle on anyone, for anything. I've had friends whose kids had intolerable (tho nothing to the degree at SJU,) dorm living situations, but would never consider speaking to the housing authorities. My friend tried to do so one time as her dd was hardly able to use her room due to the constant presence of the roommate's boyfriend, and was shot down. The administrators do not want the burden of arranging musical chairs and playing mediator--and this was a Jesuit school.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

"Bigotry means intolerance, Elvis... a lot of people use words like bigotry, or prejudice, or intolerance when talking about racism. Discrimination or bias are other connective words often used in such conversations.
But one could certainly be bigoted or prejudiced against other things, as well.

A dictionary and thesaurus will tell you more about the usage of such words, if you're interested."

No thanks; I was interested in your intent. My motive in asking was not a snarky attempt to "show you up;" as your very defensive and snarky attitude suggests, but rather, I wanted to try to make sure I understood your use of the words "bigotry" and "racism", to as to avoid getting your dander up when discussing same.

An attempt which met with failure. Ah, well....


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

That is a very good point, Nancy, and I'm glad you pointed it out.

I'm an optimist in this regard; peer pressure from fellow students may carry more weight than anything the dean could say. The protests of the student will also prompt the administration to more responsive and responsible. Bad press will not attract more donors to the school.

I wish the young man all the best.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I gave you a very straightforward answer, Elvis, and am rather surprised that all you managed to pull out of it was an imagined hostility. Perhaps the problem is that you read it with hostility, injecting that part, yourself?

If you don't want an answer, don't ask a question. I'm really not up for engaging in some sort of game, or any personal issues you or others may have.

Moving on...

Sjerin, I understand well the concept of not wanting to be labeled a rat or a tattletale by one's fellow students or members of a peer group... and I can understand that campus authority or officials may not want to deal with any issues of a personal nature between students... but when there's the possibility of physical harm or criminal activity involved, especially in campus housing facilities, isn't it the responsibility of school officials to help ensure the safety of its student body?

I think if I were placed in that student's particular position, I would have no choice but to lodge a complaint with school officials, or even local law enforcement... and I'd be rather angry if they failed to act or take it seriously.



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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

This Ohio school teacher justifies his racist rant.

He adds, "It is, however, my position that I have the right to use such language in explaining my feelings about the general state of the community in Akron. These remarks were in no way directed at the Akron School District or, to my knowledge, any person involved in the district."

Of course some defend him and hope he will return to the classroom. The some consider him an educated, professional school teacher expressing his anger.

Here is a link that might be useful: Racist Rant


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Good example of unquestionable racism. I'm not sure about the connection to the OP, though.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Sure it does. You don't have to be a punk to be racist, even a PhD can do it.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Sjerin, my DH was raised in Santa Clara, close to the University. I love that area because of the wonderful mix of people. I swear it is the home of the most polite drivers in the USA.

I'm not naive to the bad parts of San Jose but it saddens me to hear news like this generating from an area we love. We have lots of family there, where DH's Grandfather was an Orchardist who farmed the Silicon Valley. He taught Orchard Management at UCB, with an interpreter. Being an Immigrant from Italy. We have leased out the family home and remain vested in the area.

Such a story is a sad testiment of the culturally wealthy part of our State.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

"The FBI this week released the latest hate crime statistics ��" these are for all of 2012 ��" and the results will probably make you think twice. We hear so much from the radical Christian right that there’s a “War on Religion!” a “War on Christmas!,” a “War on Christians!” Well the FBI statistics don’t bear that out at all ��" at least when it comes to actual hate crimes.

In total, the FBI reports almost 7200 reported victims of hate crimes. Almost 7200 people in America were victims of hate crimes ��" and those are just the ones that got reported. For many reasons, you can bet there were a lot more.

3467 victims of racial bias, 1376 victims of sexual orientation bias, 1340 victims of religious bias, 866 victims of ethnicity/national origin bias, and 102 victims of disability bias.

Contrary to what the religious right would have you believe, almost half of all hate crimes were crimes of racial bias ��" not religious or sexual orientation.

The next largest category was sexual orientation, closely followed by religious bias, then ethnicity and disability. Here’s the FBI’s breakdown:

48.3 percent of the 5,790 single-bias incidents were racially motivated, while 19.6 percent resulted from sexual orientation bias and 19 percent from religious bias.
Of the 7,164 hate crime victims, 55.4 percent were victims of crimes against persons and 41.8 percent were victims of crimes against property. The remaining 2.8 percent were victims of crimes against society (like drug offenses, gambling, and prostitution).
39.6 percent of the victims of crimes against persons suffered simple assaults, while 37.5 percent were intimidated and 21.5 percent were victims of aggravated assault. (Law enforcement also reported 10 murders and 15 rapes as hate crimes.)
An overwhelming majority��"75.6 percent��"of the victims of crimes against property were victimized by acts of destruction, damage, and/or vandalism.
Of the 5,331 known offenders, 54.6 percent were white and 23.3 percent were black.
Hidden in those numbers of religiously-motivated bias crimes is that “62.4 percent were victims of an offender’s anti-Jewish bias,” but only 9.1 percent were anti-Christian.

No hate crime is acceptable, and one person’s victimization doesn’t “beat” another’s, but it’s also important to counter the false claims from the religious right.

The FBI report 103 hate crime incidents motivated by an anti-Christian bias, and more than ten times that, 1111, motivated by an anti-LGBT bias.

It’s important to note there seems to be a total lack of coverage by the media of the 674 hate crime incidents motivated by an anti-Jewish bias, and the largest number of bias incidents were anti-Black, totaling 1805, which included 2295 people.

One final note.

First, the FBI reports a slight decrease from 2011′s numbers, but the Anti-Defamation League issued a statement that “expressed profound disappointment at the failure of more than 25 percent of the nation’s law enforcement agencies to provide the FBI with their hate crime numbers, calling the lack of participation by many jurisdictions ‘a significant setback in the progress our nation has made in hate crime data collection over the past decade.’”

Here is a link that might be useful: Hate Crime Statistics


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Well, I'm not going to let actual data and facts get in the way of my bigotry. I know better than that!!


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

•Posted by david52 z5CO (My Page) on Wed, Nov 27, 13 at 17:08

"Well, I'm not going to let actual data and facts get in the way of my bigotry. I know better than that!!"

How about that.

I searched at the link, and didn't find answers. The article refers to "hate crime incidents reported." Looks like they were reported by various law enforcement agencies to the FBI record keepers, rather than the court system. Are we to assume that these are "he said, she said" situations, or are these numbers based upon proven cases, i.e., convictions or civil settlements?


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Hint for elvis: FBI statistics on this sort of crime is not based on 911 calls but perhaps going so far as investigations and perhaps even arrests. All robberies and assault, for example, are not he-said-she-said data whether or not the crimes were solved or prosecuted.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

  • Posted by rosie NE Georgia 7A/B (My Page) on
    Thu, Nov 28, 13 at 13:19

Of the 19% of religion-motivated hate crimes, "only 9.1 percent were anti-Christian."

Or, 0.01729% of all reported hate crimes in 2012 were against Christians.

Restated yet again, of every 1000 hate crimes investigated, 17 were considered to be anti-Christian.

Or put yet another way, there is no excuse for people who pretend there's a "war on Christianity" to justify evil behavior against others. That behavior is evil.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Thanks, marshall. What's your source for that? I'd like to look at it in more depth.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

I believe Marshallz's source might have been the Logic & Common Sense Gazette... it's a free publication with, unfortunately, a slowly flagging list of contributors and readers... though, there might be a search engine listing that would give up similar details.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Racism rears its ugly head everywhere. Dinesh D'Souza showed his character yet again and tweeted his racist statement just the other day. It was caught by the media including WaPo before he ran scared and deleted it.


Long ago, I wrote about how Trayvon Martin brings out the worst in people. The rabid hate aimed at the unarmed African American 17-year-old killed by George Zimmerman sullies the soul. The vicious internet campaign that peddled a photo of then-31-year-old rapper Game as an “up-to-date” picture of Trayvon was disgusting. But just when I thought it couldn’t get any worse, enter Dinesh D’Souza.

I won’t waste time on the bio of the acerbic conservative who has made sport of criticizing President Obama and questioning his loyalty to the United States. You can read all that you need to know here. But I’m writing about him because of a wildly offensive tweet he sent at 2:35 p.m., this afternoon.

The capture of the tweet is at the link.

Here is a link that might be useful: Wapo


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Posted by jodik 5 (My Page) on Fri, Nov 29, 13 at 11:38

"I believe Marshallz's source might have been the Logic & Common Sense Gazette... it's a free publication with, unfortunately, a slowly flagging list of contributors and readers... though, there might be a search engine listing that would give up similar details."

Just the source, please. I do actually want to see where the information came from; it would be a good site to hang onto, IMO.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

The sources you want are embedded... you have to actually go there and do a second or two of reading to get the information...


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Hey, by the way. That rapper photo said to be trayvon. Bet that was used just to make a statement regarding the very very young pictures of trayvon circulated by his family and lawyers.

I don't care to research it. But I'd be willing to bet someone's farm on it.


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

Posted by jodik 5 (My Page) on Sun, Nov 24, 13 at 9:07

Once again, October, your post makes little sense within the context of the thread in whole... "

I make perfect sense when you consider the fact that you (and your pals) won't discuss the need for/lack of parental responsibility in the ghetto. Why do you discuss it here? Your view of parental responsibility should apply to ALL parents. But, it doesn't. Says volumes about you, jodi (and all of your pals).


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RE: Such evil, blatant racism here???

There's a very good article about racism in the other currently running thread... it might do some good to read it.


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