So is anything in the finlaysonii complex fair game of just Hoya finlaysonii and aff. finlaysonii? I have some closely related species both identified and not that I could post.

Mike

Absolutely! Throw anything from the finlaysonii complex at us. I know that throws the gate wide open to some very different species, but it will be interesting to try and see the relationships.

Do you have access to a comprehensive list of this complex? I was looking around for one to stick on here, but I couldn't find one.

Here are some more pics...

Hoya finlaysonii 'Red Halo'; finlaysonii (IML 0398) (The one on the left is the same as the one pictured above.)

Hoya deykeae (IML 1185)

Hoya callistophylla (IML 0554)

All of those leaves are just gorgeous! I don't have any to share, yet anyway. lol

For now Hoya finlaysonii and the species that most resemble it are still grouped with Hoya pottsii. Stemma Journal Vol. 2 #3 lists the members of the Pottsii Complex. In time I am sure that this group will be broken down by Botanists and taxonomists.

Here are the species I have that are closest to Hoya finlaysonii plus some others that don't have the two toned flowers but that have similar leaves to finlaysonii.

Hoya finlaysonii

Another Hoya finlaysonii

Hoya clemensiorum with it's beautiful raised veins with dark purple contrasting veins on the backside of the leaves.

I had to crop this photo so it's a bit blurry. I really should take another photo of this plant because it has grown quite large. This is probably Hoya callistophylla.

Hoya sp Kapit Borneo IML 1029 is similar to finlaysonii although it does not have the two toned flowers.

David Liddle told me that he thought this IML 1346 was probably Hoya vitellinoides, this is another without the two toned flowers.

This is a new one that I am very excited about. Hoya forbesii is also lacking the two toned flowers and they don't reflex back. Check out the Apodagis photos of this species.

The back of the leaf is covered in short brownish red hairs.

I also have Hoya meredithii and deykeae that I have not photographed yet since they were potted up. Hoya meredithii is in the bottom right in this photo of a group of cuttings.

Mike

It's one of my favorite leaf-types. My callistrophylla...

Deykeae is a cherished beauty for it's blunt leaves, but boy is it a slow grower! I just moved it up to a larger pot this year and it seems to be taking off. Here's a knock-out new leaf...

Finlaysonii 'Rippled Leaf'

I assume H. sp. 'Nong Nooch' is in the same group...
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And I think 'Jennifer' is too. This single leaf really shows off the veins, but I must say it's interesting how variable the leaves are in size & shape on this one...

And my two very different clones of merredithii x crassicaulis...

I just got a cutting of true finlaysonii from GG this spring and haven't photographed it yet. But I was surprised at how much narrower the leaves were than the one I lost. I'm still waiting on new growth to see how new leaves develop. GG, is the 'Red Halo' the one it came from, or do you have another?

Denise in Omaha

It's the 'Red Halo' but I recently acquired another one, photographed next to it above. I think both of these have approximately the same size leaves and I agree they are pretty skinny, especially when new.

Hoya finlaysonii aff. IML 1752 The leaves on this plant are very long and hard. It is growing very well for me and I hope it doesn't die back when yucky winter comes.

Are there purple veins on the backside of that IML 1752? It looks very much like Hoya clemensiorum.
Thanks for posting that by the way because now I really want it, love those narrow leaves.

Denise your deykeae is really beautiful. This one is so slow and it just hates the cold and to dry out too much. I have only had mine since last summer but it has been difficult to keep happy at times.

Mike

Mike, yes it has purple veins on the back. It is very easy to grow and the leaves get very long. The leaves start out soft and then they get very hard when mature. I will take cuttings if it keeps growing as fast as it has in the past month. I think I may get a cutting of clemensiorum to see the difference. I really love your Kapit Borneo and Denise's Deykea. I have combined 2 deykeas from 2 different sources and neither have that wonderful blotchiness.

I love a parade!

Hoya finlaysonii

Same plant - different angle

Hoya deykeii (from Kartuz.com nursery)

another shot - same plant

Hoya meredethii (again, Kartuz.com)

Hoya Kalimantan IML 1168 (still rooting from the Liddle group order)

Ok, I have no idea if this one falls in the 'finlaysonii complex' (where would I find this info?) but it wants to be in the parade so here's ...

Hoya sp. âÂÂSumatraâ IML 1012 (still rooting from the Liddle order also)

Wow! I love that Sumatra! Beautiful!

Carolyn

That Sumatra cutting is amazing. It has somehow transitioned from being a typical sexy little dark veined number to looking like it just had its bridal henna done.

So, Mike, can you enlighten us? Do all the dark veined hoyas fit into this complex or just the more subdued ones?

Oh yeah and I meant to say that Denise's deykea totally schooled mine!!! How do you always grow the most wicked leaf examples? I'm thinking you must be giving them wine on the weekends or something to sweeten them up.

And I really love theplanthoarder's SUPER amazing IML 1752 leaves. It's like your plant took a look around and decided to up the anty.

You could have a species with dark contrasting veins that is not in this group but I can't think of any off the top of my head. There are Hoya finlaysonii varieties that have fairly plain leaves as well. The next closest species by appearance would be Hoya incrassata, carssicaulis etc. and they differ by having plain green leaves and they lack the two toned flowers that finlaysonii has.
Check the Stemma link I put just above my photos earlier in this thread and read the Hoya pottsii Complex info. This group has not been worked on since 1914 and because of the large number of species that are grouped together there is no real sense to make of it all. Really there should probably be a fragmentation of the complex and as it stands now this is not an officially recognized group (Hoya pottsii complex). You will also see the mention of these species belonging to the section Hoya which contains carnosa and this is historically where they have been. Christine Burton suggested two sub-sections to further break the section Hoya down and they refer to the plants sap, Lactisuccus which means milky sap and Acersuccus which means sap like the genus Acer (maple trees/maple syrup).

So if you want to find Hoya finlaysonii's closest relatives you would look for the leaf markings and the two toned flowers.
Notice the gradation of colour on the flowers below with the tips of the corollas being darker, this is the two toned flower colour I have been mentioning.

I would suggest anyone who wants to know more about these Hoya sections to read the Stemma Journal issues that are available on the Apodagis site. These are well worth the read and if you want to add to your Hoya library print them out or store them on a disk because the info is very useful and not easy to find otherwise.

Mike

Here is a link that might be useful: Stemma Journal Vol 2 #3

ELB, I love-love-love the new leaf on your fin. It's absolutely outstanding! I'm blown away when I get a new extraordinary leaf on a plant, and it seems like often, the first new leaf after rooting or the first new leaf of the new season is a knock-out.

And how is your deykeae - is it a slow grower?

Denise in Omaha

Hi Denise, yes, I think deykeae (sp? ) is a slow one - but then again, I've only had it since about January. It put out a very nice peduncle - then budded up and *poof* in 24 hours I found all the flowers on the floor! I don't know if they opened and fell of or if they blasted. I snooze, I lose!

Since then, it's just been sitting there.

I love that new leaf too, I hope it flattens out. It's curled under at the moment.

Here's H. callistophylla Borneo IML 1174 who missed the first part of the parade but wants to crash the party nonetheless.

And here it is still rooting.

They are mostly ready to pot up, I'm just waiting for my 4" hanging pots to arrive in the mail. Like GG, I'm a bit OCD on having them all in the same style/color of pot. The exception to the rule are two, one Hoya pottsii âÂÂChang Mai' that is in a plastic 5" pot with a bamboo hoop and one H. australis var. australis that is in a clay pot out under my pergola.

And speaking of hoya in the finlaysonii complex, if anyone has cuttings of Hoya Borneo Gunung Gading to trade, I will happily pimp out some of my most coveted, choice and rare begonias in trade!
(I'm referring to this one that I slobber all over myself and my keyboard when I look at it http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/hoya/msg0221484732570.html?10 )

(can I say p i m p here? hope I didn't offend, I've been hanging with a teenage son too long! Summer vaca will be over soon!)

New hoya collector here. Can someone please explain to mean what "finlaysonii complex" means? I bought one recently and it was labeled "hoya finlaysonii (finlaysonii complex)". Trying to figure out how this is different than other finlaysonii. Thanks in advance.

A species complex is in most cases a monophyletic group with a common ancestor, but there are exceptions. It may represent an early stage after speciation but may also have been separated for a long time period without evolving morphological differences. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Species_complex